Promotion of canteras

Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Promotion of canteras

Post by futbol_bill on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:10 pm

I keep reading that we should promote Morata, Sarabia, Alex, Nacho, Caravajal, etc. I think you are not aware of how difficult such a move is. These kids are 17 and 18 year olds, playing in 3rd level soccer mostly against players their age. Although they have looked good, it's still too soon to tell if they can make it in 1st division, let alone be stars, let alone with one of the best teams in the world.

As good as Morata, Sarabia, Alex and Caravajal or even Deulofeu of Barcelona B looked with U19 team, they are not as good nor dominent as Canales or before him Boyan or Cesc Fabregas have been at that age. And we've seen with Canales even playing part of the year before in 1st division, how difficult it is to make the jump. Boyan did, but he hasn't turned out to be the super star he was forecasted to be. The only players that have done it to my memory (in recent past) are Cesc and Messi and yet it took both of them a couple of years to really show how great they would be.

Barcelona are regularly giving canteras some playing time on big club and then allowing some to be promoted but they are working from a 2nd level team were the players are playing against older players and tougher competition. Mou is doing the right thing in giving some canteras pratice time and the occasion game action, but it is still too much of a stretch IMO to expect a promotion under the age of 20 from 3rd level to 1st, particularly a top team.

Case in point is Canales. he has exhibited star qualities from age of 15 and did get dozen or so 1st division game action with a lower 1st division team. He gets promoted to Madrid and sits on bench. I'm very critical of Mou for this, but in reality it would have been much better for his development to play regularly at a lower 1st division team, or even a 2nd level team. He now is getting regualr action with a 1st level team (a higher team but stiill not a top club like Madrid) and he seems back on track with his development / maturity. Still it will likely take this year and next before he can consider coming to Madrid and even then he likely will not be a starter, at least initially. If I compare him with Thiago (of Barcelona), Canales was better than him at age 16, 17 and probably at 18. But Thiago got to play at 2nd level soccer with a half dozen call-ups to big club, then went on to excel (actually one of team leaders) with U21 team and now not only is getting semi regular starts at Barcelona, he also is making a case for himself to make national euro team. In other words, his last year, playing regularly at a higher level of competition allowed him to make a big jump in his development and for the moment he is much better than Canales. Don't misunderstand me, I a big big fan of Canales but, he is an example of how difficult it is to make the jump to 1st division particularly a top club like Madrid.
futbol_bill
futbol_bill
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Real Madrid
Posts : 4266
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Always said that you have no idea how good kids are until they prove it in one of the good leagues. That could be EPL, Bundi, La Liga, Serie A or Ligue 1. Second and third division are only stepping stones... mean very little other than you're too good to be in second and third division.

That's why i hate leaving kids in Castilla as opposed to lending them out. Once they've done all they can do in Castilla, there's no point (i.e. Morata right now).

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by futbol_bill on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:22 pm

@sportsczy wrote:Always said that you have no idea how good kids are until they prove it in one of the good leagues. That could be EPL, Bundi, La Liga, Serie A or Ligue 1. Second and third division are only stepping stones... mean very little other than you're too good to be in second and third division.

That's why i hate leaving kids in Castilla as opposed to lending them out. Once they've done all they can do in Castilla, there's no point (i.e. Morata right now).

Two comments Sportsczy:
1. we need to get Castilla back to Adelante.That supposedly is why Morata was left there. Problem seems to be defense, I don't know enough about team nor our youth organization to know why that suddenly is a problem this year.

2. Why can't we loan these young stars to 2nd division teams. I would think a lot of them would jump at such an opportunity and it would be better for the player development (until we get a team in 2nd division).
futbol_bill
futbol_bill
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Real Madrid
Posts : 4266
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:47 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:
@sportsczy wrote:Always said that you have no idea how good kids are until they prove it in one of the good leagues. That could be EPL, Bundi, La Liga, Serie A or Ligue 1. Second and third division are only stepping stones... mean very little other than you're too good to be in second and third division.

That's why i hate leaving kids in Castilla as opposed to lending them out. Once they've done all they can do in Castilla, there's no point (i.e. Morata right now).

Two comments Sportsczy:
1. we need to get Castilla back to Adelante.That supposedly is why Morata was left there. Problem seems to be defense, I don't know enough about team nor our youth organization to know why that suddenly is a problem this year.

2. Why can't we loan these young stars to 2nd division teams. I would think a lot of them would jump at such an opportunity and it would be better for the player development (until we get a team in 2nd division).

2nd division is still very far from any of the top leagues. You really want to loan the kids out and have a trial by fire... at 19-20, you need to know if they can handle playing physically and psychologically at the top level. No need for the pressures that go with a Madrid; but somewhere they can get their feet wet. I personally know plenty of clubs in France that would love to have Carvajal, Alex, Morata, etc.

I've Zidane is trying to get a loan system together with Madrid and a french club actually. He's getting a lot of resistance in Madrid from what i've heard. But he's pretty adamant...

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by futbol_bill on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:50 pm

But Sportsczy, these posters are taking about promoting these guys that are only 17 or 18!!!!!!!!! I even read today Jesse Rodriquez, I think he still 16.
futbol_bill
futbol_bill
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Real Madrid
Posts : 4266
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by S32TABLANCA on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:51 pm

I agree completely. The thing is, though, when we do these buy back deals we have the reputation/habit of screwing them up completely. I dont even want to mention the names you all know Im talking about. Probably, the best way is to get Castilla to Segunda (proving a very hard task already!) then loan the prospects to Getafe or wherever after giving them a good chance in the first team. Who knows, me might discover another Raul. I guess we did the right thing with Sarabia, but we can see how his departure affected Castilla. TBH I would have preferred if he stayed, got Castilla to Segunda while being the backup to Ozil or instead of Callejon. But I recognise what the club did. As for Morata, apparently he isnt doing as well, but I think he should be played in a pure 9 role to develop properly.

Canales is a different case completely. He was actually top league proven before we screwed with his development.

_________________

Promotion of canteras Tumblr_m4prdaDM0W1qb2udno1_250

VIVA MALTA
S32TABLANCA
S32TABLANCA
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Sao Paulo
Posts : 3318
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by S32TABLANCA on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:52 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:But Sportsczy, these posters are taking about promoting these guys that are only 17 or 18!!!!!!!!! I even read today Jesse Rodriquez, I think he still 16.

I dont think Ive ever seen anyone advocating Jese being in the first team, that would be quite absurd. scratch
S32TABLANCA
S32TABLANCA
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Sao Paulo
Posts : 3318
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by futbol_bill on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:56 pm

Saetablanca wrote:
@futbol_bill wrote:But Sportsczy, these posters are taking about promoting these guys that are only 17 or 18!!!!!!!!! I even read today Jesse Rodriquez, I think he still 16.

I dont think Ive ever seen anyone advocating Jese being in the first team, that would be quite absurd. scratch

This from Marca thread.

@SuperMAG wrote:jessi rodreges, i think he will become a great rotation player.
futbol_bill
futbol_bill
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Real Madrid
Posts : 4266
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:57 pm

Age is not really a factor... it's being ready. For example, you have Niang playing striker for Caen in Ligue 1 and he's 16 (4 goals in 15 appearances). He's also skipped several youth NT levels and is playing in the U-21 squad (although he just got dropped down to U-20 as Lacazette, Riviere and Sunu all got healthy). Once a player dominates a level, you move him up.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by Mr Nick09 on Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:07 pm

At this point i think most understand that promotion is not that simple. It takes a lot of maturity for those kids to handle the promotion and make something happen for themselves, and playing down in div 3, does not make things better for them.


_________________
Madridista naci.. Vikingo sere y Merengue Moriré
Mr Nick09
Mr Nick09
Forum Legend
Forum Legend

Club Supported : Real Madrid
Posts : 30470
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by Magricos on Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:01 am

Jese is 18.

Magricos
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Sao Paulo
Posts : 1909
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by SuperMAG on Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:16 am

lol and i didnt say imediatly lol, i said after he should have been loaned at the begining of the season for next 2 seasons.

SuperMAG
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Sao Paulo
Posts : 1651
Join date : 2011-08-18

Back to top Go down

Promotion of canteras Empty Re: Promotion of canteras

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum