Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Blue on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:27 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:
@Blue wrote:Thiago never set his foot in Brazil?

That is a lie,


carry on...

Read entire comments before making such a stupid statement!!!

babun1024 wrote:
First, you still disregard his argument that Thiago never set his foot in Brazil Very Happy Second, Thiago is a lot more versatile and plays deeper than Canales. He'll definiatly see more playing time than him. we tried Canales+Granero+ Lass last year in midfield and he failed. Maybe, he needs time to develop but at the moment he isn#t ready to play deeper... Very Happy

Wink


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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by futbol_bill on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:30 pm

@shaven wrote:
@futbol_bill wrote:
I think you are underestimating the potential of Thiago. He's much better than Canales and yet only a year older. (and I'm a BIG fan of Canales).

afaik they dont play the same role, right?

Shaven, yes they do play the exact same role. With U21s, it's Javi Martinez deep and then Thaigo and Herrera or Parejo forward in midfield.

and to answer your other question from Canales thread "why is canales not playing in the european U21 championship against belarus?"

He was not selected. He played last year on U19 and then had a couple of call-ups to U21 (and looked good). His lack of playing time killed his chances to be on this club and I think the U19 (they play in July). I've been trying to find out if he is on the U19 line-up, but I haven't been able to find it. I do know that 3 from Castilla are on it, but I don't think Canales is. What a shame as he was the key player last year. I really blame Mou for screwing up his development.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by shaven on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:34 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:

Shaven, yes they do play the exact same role. With U21s, it's Javi Martinez deep and then Thaigo and Herrera or Parejo forward in midfield.

and to answer your other question from Canales thread "why is canales not playing in the european U21 championship against belarus?"

He was not selected. He played last year on U19 and then had a couple of call-ups to U21 (and looked good). His lack of playing time killed his chances to be on this club and I think the U19 (they play in July). I've been trying to find out if he is on the U19 line-up, but I haven't been able to find it. I do know that 3 from Castilla are on it, but I don't think Canales is. What a shame as he was the key player last year. I really blame Mou for screwing up his development.

ok, thought canales was more the attacking player and thiago the playmaker mostly

you mou screwed up in some aspects but hopefully he will continue and improve his remaining years in madrid

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by futbol_bill on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:34 pm

Blue -as I said read more than just the one line, it says also they never lived in Brasil. I am taking exception to the statements that these Spanish and Mexican players have Brazilian character traits. Have you any comments worth reading or do you just want to persist with these stupid posts.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by futbol_bill on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:36 pm

@shaven wrote:
@futbol_bill wrote:

Shaven, yes they do play the exact same role. With U21s, it's Javi Martinez deep and then Thaigo and Herrera or Parejo forward in midfield.

and to answer your other question from Canales thread "why is canales not playing in the european U21 championship against belarus?"

He was not selected. He played last year on U19 and then had a couple of call-ups to U21 (and looked good). His lack of playing time killed his chances to be on this club and I think the U19 (they play in July). I've been trying to find out if he is on the U19 line-up, but I haven't been able to find it. I do know that 3 from Castilla are on it, but I don't think Canales is. What a shame as he was the key player last year. I really blame Mou for screwing up his development.


ok, thought canales was more the attacking player and thiago the playmaker mostly

you mou screwed up in some aspects but hopefully he will continue and improve his remaining years in madrid

I like to think that longer term, these two are the Xavi and Iniesta on the Selecciones.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by shaven on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:39 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:

I like to think that longer term, these two are the Xavi and Iniesta on the Selecciones.

well that is where we have to wait and see.

about javi, could you say he had a good improvement from the recent years?

is he being formed as a pure DM player

so you think it will be 3 midfield canales javi and thiago.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by halamadrid2 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:43 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:

I've been trying to find out if he is on the U19 line-up, but I haven't been able to find it. I do know that 3 from Castilla are on it, but I don't think Canales is. What a shame as he was the key player last year. I really blame Mou for screwing up his development.

he is too old for it, as he is already 20

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:44 pm

Among all those kids, Thiago is the one that have the most uniqueness to him, that's why he differentiate a lot from those other kids. I think most of the other players overlap.

@bill, we hardly ever see those young players making it at the same time, since guys like Cesc will be there. Also, watch out Javi Marquez sneaking up

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:45 pm

@halamadrid2 wrote:
@futbol_bill wrote:

I've been trying to find out if he is on the U19 line-up, but I haven't been able to find it. I do know that 3 from Castilla are on it, but I don't think Canales is. What a shame as he was the key player last year. I really blame Mou for screwing up his development.

he is too old for it, as he is already 20

few players can be over the age limit, like with the u21, Mata and Javi Martinez are over the limit already

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by futbol_bill on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:46 pm

@shaven wrote:
@futbol_bill wrote:

I like to think that longer term, these two are the Xavi and Iniesta on the Selecciones.

well that is where we have to wait and see.

about javi, could you say he had a good improvement from the recent years?

is he being formed as a pure DM player

so you think it will be 3 midfield canales javi and thiago.

Absolutely. Javi is incredible. He is like Xabi in that he plays deeper, can be the defensive MF but he is excellent on offense and passing as well. He is just incredibly calm when he has the ball, nothing rattles him at all. Herrera and Parejo are Ok, but I think Canales would fit that midfield better. I can't remember when Canlaes played a couple of games with U21 last year if both he and Thiago were on at same time.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by shaven on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:52 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:



He is just incredibly calm when he has the ball, nothing rattles him at all.

one quality i like about him. but i think he will be better higher on the pitch than deeper, like xabi as well but in liverpool

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:55 pm

was xabi playing that high in liverpool? from what i remember he was very much in a two man midfield with mascherano, ahead of him sure, but still playing as a CM just like he does for us now.


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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by halamadrid2 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:57 pm

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:
@halamadrid2 wrote:
@futbol_bill wrote:

I've been trying to find out if he is on the U19 line-up, but I haven't been able to find it. I do know that 3 from Castilla are on it, but I don't think Canales is. What a shame as he was the key player last year. I really blame Mou for screwing up his development.

he is too old for it, as he is already 20

few players can be over the age limit, like with the u21, Mata and Javi Martinez are over the limit already

thats probably only for u21, if you look at the u19 team all are either 19 or 18, canales played with them last year and now he isnt

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by buddytaller on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:58 pm

Canales was signed months before Madrid hired Mourinho, Mourinho probably only approved his stay instead of a loan back to Racing. Mourinho himself is under a lot of pressure at Madrid, you either win or you are considered a failure, he cannot afford too much experimentations.

I saw Canales as pretty special when he was as Santander, Thiago was still playing in Segunda for much of last season and the season before. I think a lot of his hype will die done when he comes a lot more into the spotlight, and every mistake of his will be scrutinized. Only then will he in my eyes be better than Canales. As far as I was concerned Canales was better than him in the last tournament they both played in.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by futbol_bill on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:58 pm

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:
@halamadrid2 wrote:
@futbol_bill wrote:

I've been trying to find out if he is on the U19 line-up, but I haven't been able to find it. I do know that 3 from Castilla are on it, but I don't think Canales is. What a shame as he was the key player last year. I really blame Mou for screwing up his development.

he is too old for it, as he is already 20

few players can be over the age limit, like with the u21, Mata and Javi Martinez are over the limit already

Nick I was writting you back to say no, but I just looked it up. The current U21s have to be born on or after Jan 1, 1988 and the U19 current team have to be born on or before Jan 1, 1992. That a 4 year gap for a 2 year difference in teams!!! It's because they set these date at beginning of qualifying.

You are right, Canales is now 20 (born Feb 16, 1991) and so is Thiago (born April 11, 1991). This is a surprise to me as I thought Thiago was a year older. Instead Thiago is younger by 2 months!!!!

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by futbol_bill on Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:03 pm

@buddytaller wrote:Canales was signed months before Madrid hired Mourinho, Mourinho probably only approved his stay instead of a loan back to Racing. Mourinho himself is under a lot of pressure at Madrid, you either win or you are considered a failure, he cannot afford too much experimentations.

I saw Canales as pretty special when he was as Santander, Thiago was still playing in Segunda for much of last season and the season before. I think a lot of his hype will die done when he comes a lot more into the spotlight, and every mistake of his will be scrutinized. Only then will he in my eyes be better than Canales. As far as I was concerned Canales was better than him in the last tournament they both played in.

Canales was signed before Mou, but it was Mou's decision or agreement to bring him to camp and Mou's decision not to lend him back to Santander (the original plan). Thiago played both with Barcelona's A tam and B team last year. By end of year Pep did not hesitate to use him when Xavi was injured. Watch him this Sunday in U21 final and then tell me you still think Canales is better than him (right now). As I said earlier I like them both and I hoping to see both play togther eventually with Javi Martinez on Selecciones.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Blue on Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:13 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:Blue -as I said read more than just the one line, it says also they never lived in Brasil. I am taking exception to the statements that these Spanish and Mexican players have Brazilian character traits. Have you any comments worth reading or do you just want to persist with these stupid posts.

stupid posts?

I am only correcting false statements regarding Thiago background. I am not sure if you are aware that Thiago spent a great length of his life in Brazil. He was part of Flamengo youth team before he left for spain. He learned a great deal of his football in Brazil,so he can be considered Brazilian imo.

Truly there is no need for the hostility and using offensive words to describe another person post. so on that note i will end this discussion.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by buddytaller on Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:25 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:
@buddytaller wrote:Canales was signed months before Madrid hired Mourinho, Mourinho probably only approved his stay instead of a loan back to Racing. Mourinho himself is under a lot of pressure at Madrid, you either win or you are considered a failure, he cannot afford too much experimentations.

I saw Canales as pretty special when he was as Santander, Thiago was still playing in Segunda for much of last season and the season before. I think a lot of his hype will die done when he comes a lot more into the spotlight, and every mistake of his will be scrutinized. Only then will he in my eyes be better than Canales. As far as I was concerned Canales was better than him in the last tournament they both played in.

Canales was signed before Mou, but it was Mou's decision or agreement to bring him to camp and Mou's decision not to lend him back to Santander (the original plan). Thiago played both with Barcelona's A tam and B team last year. By end of year Pep did not hesitate to use him when Xavi was injured. Watch him this Sunday in U21 final and then tell me you still think Canales is better than him (right now). As I said earlier I like them both and I hoping to see both play togther eventually with Javi Martinez on Selecciones.


He only started a handful of matches for Barcelona last season, most of them came after Barcelona had already won the league, Pep is just as guilty as Mourinho of not using youth products last season, and it's not going to get better, he has opted to purchase expensive talents from other teams rather than rely on his youth products, he promoted Fontas last season but he was benched when the team was having a defensive crisis, Pep preferred to play Macherano and Busquet over him and Milito. The reason is simple, Barcelona can no longer afford to experiment in the name of developing talent, they just like Madrid are under enormous pressure to win and not winning is considered an outright failure.


Again I saw them both at the U19 tournament and the least I could conclude was that Thiago was not better than Canales, I saw Canales rip la liga defenders apart when he was at Santander on regular basis, I can confidently say that, that Canales is better than Thiago.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by S32TABLANCA on Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:41 pm

There is a simple reason why Mou allowed Canales to come, then made that comment regarding him and Ozil. That is because Ozil was not at all expected to become the huge player he did, so he assumed that Ozil and Canales would rotate until Kaka came back to full fitness. We all know what happened: Canales apparently stopped working hard, he got injured, Ozil exploded, Kaka continued to suck.

I do believe that Canales can be as good or better than Thiago (they DO play different roles, Sergio is more of an attacking player while Thiago is more a playmaker), but he needs to develop and play well.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:46 pm

I talked with Shaven about it earlier, when Valdano bought Canales, i think he is the one who made the decision to keep him, and Mourinho went along with it, so not to send double signals from the management.

The difference between canales and thiago, is not only the way they play, their position, their way of conceptualizing the game, but their maturity level. The way they handle pressure is nothing alike. And playing a season in primera didnt help canales in that regard, Thiago is more mature than he is. It might have to do with the position he plays, he has to grow up faster than the rest since he is the one conducting the game for his team.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by S32TABLANCA on Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:37 pm

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:I talked with Shaven about it earlier, when Valdano bought Canales, i think he is the one who made the decision to keep him, and Mourinho went along with it, so not to send double signals from the management.

The difference between canales and thiago, is not only the way they play, their position, their way of conceptualizing the game, but their maturity level. The way they handle pressure is nothing alike. And playing a season in primera didnt help canales in that regard, Thiago is more mature than he is. It might have to do with the position he plays, he has to grow up faster than the rest since he is the one conducting the game for his team.

Gotta remember we're talking about teens here, it could be just a personality thing. Im sure if Canales gets playing time and trust from a coach, be it Mou or Garrido or whoever, and improves his confidence, he will develop into the great player we believed he would become. Thiago and Canales would make a great partnership for Spain.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:42 pm

PLaying time always help, but for example you have a kid like capel or muniain, both talented, they have been playing for god knows how long, but it's all in the head. maturity to me is the one stopping point for young players to succeed fast. Sometimes you will hear that those youngins are overconfident, that's one you are after. If balo wasnt such a d*ck, he wouldnt be very good. He just believes in himself like crazy. Same with Thiago, and you see that when they play.

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by S32TABLANCA on Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:45 pm

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:PLaying time always help, but for example you have a kid like capel or muniain, both talented, they have been playing for god knows how long, but it's all in the head. maturity to me is the one stopping point for young players to succeed fast. Sometimes you will hear that those youngins are overconfident, that's one you are after. If balo wasnt such a d*ck, he wouldnt be very good. He just believes in himself like crazy. Same with Thiago, and you see that when they play.

Well, the 'Benz hanging out with Ronaldo & Co' seemed to work for his confidence, so maybe we should get Canales and Balotelli to become friends. I wonder if he's heared of him. Very Happy

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:50 pm

are you sure Balotelli can even find spain on a map? Razz

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Babun on Sat Jun 25, 2011 12:45 am

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:are you sure Balotelli can even find spain on a map? Razz
Nick, are you sure about the Balotelli point? Very Happy

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Re: Transfer Preview: Thiago Alcantara

Post by Mr Nick09 on Sat Jun 25, 2011 12:48 am

lol no ofc, i was just thinking about him not being able to dress, what else cant he do?

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