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Post by Yuri Yukuv on Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:12 am

I just can't stand the idea of him possibly being next Barca coach,I've also found his style to be extremely sexy, in fact sexiest in the world. Shoot me but I think he's a much better coach than pep, what do you think of this possibly?

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Post by Le Samourai on Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:17 am

Personally I find the idea nauseating as well.

Dunno if I agree with better than but his style is definitely more entertaining.He'll rotate, incorpoate youth,get the entire team to play at a unified pace and with a unified philosophy.

That being said.

I fully support Mourinhio because he simply put , is not someone you bet against. He says he will win CL , I take it as a fact waiting to come true. That's not something I can say for any other coach.

I hope Mou breaks out that Master plan he designed for Barca next season, that's what I want to see from him.

One final point.

Benzema after Bielsa's fitness training Shocked Shocked


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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:17 am

Pep agrees with you, he claimed Bielsa is the best coach in the world Very Happy

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:25 am

@Le Samourai wrote:Personally I find the idea nauseating as well.

Dunno if I agree with better than but his style is definitely more entertaining.He'll rotate, incorpoate youth,get the entire team to play at a unified pace and with a unified philosophy.

That being said.

I fully support Mourinhio because he simply put , is not someone you bet against. He says he will win CL , I take it as a fact waiting to come true. That's not something I can say for any other coach.

I hope Mou breaks out that Master plan he designed for Barca next season, that's what I want to see from him.

One final point.

Benzema after Bielsa's fitness training Shocked Shocked

lol, there is no master plan mate, you have seen the extent of mou's coaching.

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Post by Yuri Yukuv on Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:30 am

@Mr Nick09 wrote:
@Le Samourai wrote:Personally I find the idea nauseating as well.

Dunno if I agree with better than but his style is definitely more entertaining.He'll rotate, incorpoate youth,get the entire team to play at a unified pace and with a unified philosophy.

That being said.

I fully support Mourinhio because he simply put , is not someone you bet against. He says he will win CL , I take it as a fact waiting to come true. That's not something I can say for any other coach.

I hope Mou breaks out that Master plan he designed for Barca next season, that's what I want to see from him.

One final point.

Benzema after Bielsa's fitness training Shocked Shocked

lol, there is no master plan mate, you have seen the extent of mou's coaching.
[quote="Mr Nick09"][quote="Le Samourai"]

I don't know yanick you've been scrptical about his coaching since day 1 I feel there is still more that he can offer

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Post by Le Samourai on Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:38 am

Still think he can get everyone to press, if he refuses to strengthen the midfield and move it closer to attack then every attacker including and especially Ronaldo needs to press every day to at the very least, prevent us from getting caught on breaks.At least slow down the opposing team.

Without a radical change in style the most I can hope for is getting everyone on the same page when attacking and not just one person trying to play a kill ball and the other trying to finish. Take time pick the proper ball etc etc.

Set pieces and defensive organization.

All in all there are still ways he can impact the team.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:47 am

Asking a counter attacking coach that drops his lines all the time when he plays an attacking side, to press, attack and try to dominate the ball against those same sides? that's a tough draw mate.

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Post by Le Samourai on Fri Apr 27, 2012 4:06 am

I never said a word about "dominating" the ball.

We need to make better use of it when we do have it and to make better use of it it can't simply be failed through ball after failed through ball.

Dropping his lines is a problem because more often that not, we have 1 line of defense not two or 3.Each and every player needs to do the extra work and shelter our midfield so they have enough confidence to come out from defense and cover themselves.

Our defense needs much more shelter than it gets , even against minor La liga sides where we dominate possession.

In attack I think it's pretty clear that each of our 4 attackers have a bit of a different idea of the way the game is played. Di Maria is the most direct he will only make a pressure release pass if he is completely pinned and has nowhere else to go, Ronaldo has been willing to make them...unfortunately his first touch is the worst of the four and he often gets beaten to the ball.His passes aren't the most accurate either.Ozil is at the point where I wanna see everyone, he slows it down just enough to pick a proper pass and is willing to make pressure releasing passes instead of dagger assists. Benzema is a bit too passive.

If everyone can get closer on the spectrum to Ozil in terms of the build up play during counter attacks I think we would see a significant improvement in the construction and design and execution of these plays.


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Post by S32TABLANCA on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:33 pm

I want us to dominate as much as the next guy, but if Mou can get us to press and be superefficient against Barca, then there is hope.

Still, if he continues with his odd selections and does not strengthen the midfield :facepalm:

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:36 pm

Hope for what? i am telling you, this is as far as Mourinho can go stylistically, he is a counter attacking coach. Whenever we will meet a team like Arsenal, Bayern etc... in CL, he will drop his line and play the counter.

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Post by Lord Hades on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:40 pm

whats wrong with playing the counter

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:43 pm

It's an underdog tactic, you invite teams with world class forwards to take a shot at you hoping to counter them. More risks than rewards against european elite. You should only resort to that kind of tactic when you are forced too, or when you cant compete talent wise. Letting a elite european side get a shot at swarming you with attacks is ridiculous imo

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Post by Pedram on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:43 pm

Mou can adapt himself to different styles though. remember November and October where our team played a dynamic style of passing football and counterattack.

With all due respect you make it sound like Mou is a scrub in that regard. he can do this but we need players who are capable of pulling it off. we can play passing football but not with Khedira and Xabi.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:45 pm

@Pedram wrote:Mou can adapt himself to different styles though. remember November and October where our team played a dynamic style of passing football and counterattack.

With all due respect you make it sound like Mou is a scrub in that regard. he can do this but we need players who are capable of pulling it off. we can play passing football but not with Khedira and Xabi.


We did it against midtable la liga teams and stopped when we started playing sides like Atletico or any team that was quality at possession football. I dont buy that, what we saw against Bayern is what Mourinho is, a coach that will drop his lines and just wait for the counter. We saw the same against Atletico few weeks ago, and Ronaldo bailed us out. he is a scrub in that regard.

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Post by Le Samourai on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:47 pm

The only reason we almost exclusively do this is to maximize Ronaldo's effectiveness.

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Post by Pedram on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:51 pm

@Mr Nick09 wrote:
@Pedram wrote:Mou can adapt himself to different styles though. remember November and October where our team played a dynamic style of passing football and counterattack.

With all due respect you make it sound like Mou is a scrub in that regard. he can do this but we need players who are capable of pulling it off. we can play passing football but not with Khedira and Xabi.


We did it against midtable la liga teams and stopped when we started playing sides like Atletico or any team that was quality at possession football. I dont buy that, what we saw against Bayern is what Mourinho is, a coach that will drop his lines and just wait for the counter. We saw the same against Atletico few weeks ago, and Ronaldo bailed us out. he is a scrub in that regard.

If we can do this against mid table team it means Mou knows how to play like that. why we go back to counterattack against quality sides ? well it's simple, their midfield is better than us.
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Post by Mr Nick09 on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:59 pm

@Pedram wrote:
@Mr Nick09 wrote:
@Pedram wrote:Mou can adapt himself to different styles though. remember November and October where our team played a dynamic style of passing football and counterattack.

With all due respect you make it sound like Mou is a scrub in that regard. he can do this but we need players who are capable of pulling it off. we can play passing football but not with Khedira and Xabi.


We did it against midtable la liga teams and stopped when we started playing sides like Atletico or any team that was quality at possession football. I dont buy that, what we saw against Bayern is what Mourinho is, a coach that will drop his lines and just wait for the counter. We saw the same against Atletico few weeks ago, and Ronaldo bailed us out. he is a scrub in that regard.

If we can do this against mid table team it means Mou knows how to play like that. why we go back to counterattack against quality sides ? well it's simple, their midfield is better than us.
Mourinho is a counter attacking coach, let's not fancy yourself into thinking that he will play Bielsa like football even if he signs Javi Martinez and so. Not to mention that we did for a month or so, then it disappeared. It means that it's not something that he drilled us to play like, and even then you could tell that the players were enjoying themselves and playing with more freedom. But as soon as he puts his hand on the team, when things get hard, it's all about counter, break the team in two, hoof the ball etc... Even with Alonso and Khedira we could play better possession football. Let's not act like it's all their fault, when they fit the counter style mourinho wants anyway. We as a team lack some basics concepts of pass and move, and it's not hard to see.

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Post by the xcx on Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:04 pm

The style Bielsa uses isint as revolutionary as some of you might think, you can see a coaches with same view somewhere in premire or second division league. When I was 10-11 year old, I had coach who had similar views like Bielsa. Cant say that was successful or made us better than before. Hes a sort of coach who is suited for mid tier clubs, but a WC or anything close to it, is a pure hype.
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Post by Onyx on Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:06 pm

We win CL next season, Mourinho leaves, Pep arrives. :vagi:
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Post by S32TABLANCA on Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:42 pm

Its true, this is what Mou does. Yet as I said before, who knows, he might decide to play a nicer brand of football if we improve our midfield.

Be honest with me Nick. Did you honestly expect us to go to Barca and Bayern and try to dominate their midfield? Their midfield which is light years ahead of us?

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Post by Le Samourai on Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:52 pm

Well.

I honestly think we all felt that Sahin would give us that capability at the start of the season.

Grossly disappointing the role and the playing time he has gotten.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:03 am

@S32TABLANCA wrote:Its true, this is what Mou does. Yet as I said before, who knows, he might decide to play a nicer brand of football if we improve our midfield.

Be honest with me Nick. Did you honestly expect us to go to Barca and Bayern and try to dominate their midfield? Their midfield which is light years ahead of us?

No i didnt, because i have known for a long while that we were incapable of it. I mean, i have seen Real Betis styling on us, i reasonably couldnt expect that. I knew Mourinho would drop the lines and wait for quick attacks.

Putting barca aside, are our midfielders that inferior to Bayern's? This is a caricature that people have been making ever since we lost to them. They have decided that both Alonso and Khedira are crap (i might have call them that myself Razz), that they are slow etc.. which in part is true, but dont tell the whole story.

When Betis styled on us, i never saw such strong reaction. Villarreal abused us as well, but we were busy blaming Benzema. Valencia rolled on our midfield, and we were left scratching our heads. Are Tino-Parejo-Topal that superior to our midfielders?

We just lack the kind of organization and disciplined passing those teams have. We have a difficult time building from deep, we hoof it, play it long and quick forward to get a counter chance. And when our midfield is under pressure like against Rayo few months back, we are left clueless. What that tells you is that we lack that kind of aspect to our game. That's actually why Marcelo is so valuable and looks so good for us, he has that ability to drive the ball forward and to break the lines with his runs.

Never mind that Alonso is slow, if players were dropping deep to help us move the ball forward with patient build up, he would always have a passing option available to lay off the ball to. But no, the instructions are to play the long ball forward wide to Ronaldo or Di Maria to attack fast, to launch all men forwards at the same time and then we wonder why our team is broken up in two.

As for Sahin, i dont think he will magically give us that capacity as Josh does. He will be able to avoid danger a lot easier than Alonso of course, and he can get into much more dangerous situations so that's a plus. But for the style, it has to be a team effort, not a single player changing the way we play. Just like we wont achieve cleaner, more efficient passing football by playing a 433 with Alonso and Sahin. It's a team idea that we need to work on.


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Post by Le Samourai on Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:30 am

Reality depresses me.

Spoiler:
Off to watch Brazil vs Italy 1982 to remind myself why Mourinhio is neccesary

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Post by stunt on Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:35 am

Mou choses the tactics that benefit the team the most. We are very well suited for counter attacking. And since we can't handle high possession teams because our midfield sucks, defending and playing on the counter is the best option. With a good enough midfield we don't have to play on the counter.

But the problem is getting a midfield that good. It's not that easy. A midfield that can handle Bayern? Possible. A midfield that can handle Barca? Almost impossible. Unless we are as good at passing as them, we will have to defend. And they are really good at passing.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:45 am

No, Mourinho chose his players to make his tactics work best. If Mourinho wanted to put together a side that will handle high level of possession and be efficient, he wouldnt have signed Khedira, Di Maria, he certainly wouldnt have said he "doesnt know where to play [Sahin]". But he cant play that way so that's that.

When Pellegrini was at the club, he insisted for us not to sell players like Sneijder but no one listened to him. He was left with Kaka who doesnt fit the football he plays. He was thinking about signing someone like Silva or Cazorla to have him play with Sneijder in the midfield. Even in the summer, we stopped our contacts with Silva when Mou arrived because he thought Di Maria fit his way of counter best.

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