So far...

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So far...

Post by Art Morte on Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:37 pm

- Brendan Rodgers has equalled the worst start for a Liverpool manager (Roy Evans also got one point) over three league games since George Patterson in 1927.

- We have scored zero league goals from open play.

- Needed an own goal by Hearts to make it to the Europa League group stage.

- Borini has been average at best.

- Reina has been even worse than last season.

- Forced Carroll out who would have liked to stay.

- We are creating diddly squat with Rodgers's fancy passing play.


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Re: So far...

Post by mr-r34 on Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:43 pm

Seriously, rodgers is getting us to play good football, if he had the funds kenny did, we would be wining games, this is all comolis and kennys fault or whoever bloody squandered the 100 mill away

The worst part is we got sunderland next, so a draw or lose at best and then united

Potentially only 1 or 2 points from the first 15.

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Re: So far...

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:46 pm

Art, I know you don't like Brendan, but that's exactly what the owners want. Shifting the blame from one person to another while they get away with murder.

We have saved 500 k/week per wages, that equals to 25 MILLION POUNDS A WEEK. That's as much as we spent this summer. In short, it balances itself out.

We didn't sign a proven goalscorer that we desperately needed on friday, because we didn't wanna up our offer from 4M to 6M.

BR has my backing....110%. He got the team selection right, his subs were positive, not his mistake Reina, Gerrard, and Suarez played like absolute clowns and he had zero options on the bench

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Re: So far...

Post by Don't call me James on Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:53 pm

Sepi fix your error. It's 25 million pounds a YEAR.

I'm not going to blame BR. His style will take time. We cannot wake up and expect the team to play perfectly. My only worry with him is squad selection. He chose the worst bench possible for this game. How can you go into this game with only Downing as your attacking option off the bench.

Sign a free agent CF for 6 months ffs.

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Re: So far...

Post by mr-r34 on Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:00 pm

BR chose downing because we had no one else, This is not his fault. only options were pacheco morgan and assadi.

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Re: So far...

Post by Don't call me James on Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:08 pm

I'm not saying it was bad that he chose Downing. I'm saying why the f*ck does he need all three of Carra, Coates, and Kelly sitting on the bench and going into a huge game with only one attacking option. At least one if not two of those guys should've been dropped for more attacking options, Assaidi & Morgan/Suso/Yesil for example.

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Re: So far...

Post by Art Morte on Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:37 pm

Schweini wrote:Art, I know you don't like Brendan, but that's exactly what the owners want. Shifting the blame from one person to another while they get away with murder.

We have saved 500 k/week per wages, that equals to 25 MILLION POUNDS A WEEK. That's as much as we spent this summer. In short, it balances itself out.

We didn't sign a proven goalscorer that we desperately needed on friday, because we didn't wanna up our offer from 4M to 6M.

BR has my backing....110%. He got the team selection right, his subs were positive, not his mistake Reina, Gerrard, and Suarez played like absolute clowns and he had zero options on the bench

- Didn't sign a proven goalscorer because Rodgers' spent about £25m on two players he wanted and had worked with before, Borini and Allen. Maybe he should have chosen better?

- Since when has the manager been left off the hook for poor performances? If it's all FSG's fault isn't Rodgers a bad manager then for bending over for them instead of telling them "look, I know football and you don't, let me do my job"?

@mr-r34 wrote:BR chose downing because we had no one else, This is not his fault. only options were pacheco morgan and assadi.

All transfer window long told publicly how Carroll didn't feature in his plans and he wanted the striker out. You do that, and you end up with Downing as your attacking impact sub. Rodgers's fault clear as a day.

Messiah "Aggerswagger" wrote:I'm not saying it was bad that he chose Downing. I'm saying why the f*ck does he need all three of Carra, Coates, and Kelly sitting on the bench and going into a huge game with only one attacking option. At least one if not two of those guys should've been dropped for more attacking options, Assaidi & Morgan/Suso/Yesil for example.

I'm not saying it was bad that he chose Downing. I'm saying why the f*ck does he insist on us playing like Barcelona when, in fact, you need a whole team of world-class players to make that work? When you've got "only" a team full of good players you will be insanely easy to defend against, as we are seeing now.
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Re: So far...

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:04 pm

Rodgers: "I definitely would not have let Carroll go, if I knew no replacement would come in. I was very confident of getting 1-2 players in on friday, but it's now done"


He's been backstabbed by Ian Ayre and FSG.

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Re: So far...

Post by Fahim89 on Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:08 pm

Schweini wrote:Rodgers: "I definitely would not have let Carroll go, if I knew no replacement would come in. I was very confident of getting 1-2 players in on friday, but it's now done"


He's been backstabbed by Ian Ayre and FSG.

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Re: So far...

Post by Art Morte on Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:18 pm

Schweini wrote:Rodgers: "I definitely would not have let Carroll go, if I knew no replacement would come in. I was very confident of getting 1-2 players in on friday, but it's now done"


He's been backstabbed by Ian Ayre and FSG.

Rodgers added: “You don’t need to be a rocket scientist to see Andy’s been a cover player but he’s been excellent in his attitude and acceptance of where he is at.

“There’s still a wee bit of thinking time, and it’s hard to walk away from here. The ones who want to play will probably look elsewhere, irrespective of finance, because that’s their passion.”

He's trying to talk himself out of the mess now that he's realizing his marvellous Plan A is not bearing fruit. You don't publicly keep on saying "Andy's free to go, we're looking at options" unless you really want that player gone gone and gone.
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Re: So far...

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:35 pm

Art.....you have already given up on plan A ?! we've played 7 games so far ffs.

I guess you would have asked for Wenger or Redknapp sacked too after the starts Arsenal and Spurs had last year.

Do you remember our marvelous start from last season ?! Way too early to judge.

Way way way too early...but to be hones,t you didn't like Rodgers from day 1, and you love FSG because of their accounting skills. so I am not surprised Very Happy

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Re: So far...

Post by Art Morte on Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:56 pm

Fair enough, Sepi, but I'm just seeing little positives here. We are way too predictable under Rodgers and he has so far done nothing to change that, only enhancing it, really.

We'll see, but I'm not a happy hippo about this mess.
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Re: So far...

Post by RedOranje on Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:22 pm

Which section am I in again? Unbelievable, seriously. Absolutely unbelievable.

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Re: So far...

Post by Don't call me James on Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:32 pm

Red is right......shame on you guys for jumping on BR's exposed jugular. It hasn't been 4 games into the season yet. Rodgers is not to be blamed for our deadline day antics. The only reason he let go of Carroll was because he believed 1/2 replacements were coming in. The only thing we can blame BR for is his squad selection (repeating this for the millionth time). His obsession with playing Borini on the right isn't paying off, he needs to understand that. Also his bench selection is awful. I'm pissed cuz we had Carra, Coates, and Kelly all sitting on the bench, who can all do the same f*cking thing, why did we need 3 of them for this game.

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Re: So far...

Post by stevieg8 on Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:03 am

I didn't see the game today, so maybe this is coloring my view. But I like to think it means I'm not overreacting to something that occurred.

Just last week we were all excited about how good this team would be; we outclassed the champions and came within one poor moment of beating them. Granted, this excitement was predicated on expectations we had for the squad with replacements coming in, but the situation isn't that different. The truth is, maybe we won't perform as well since we'll be relying on youngsters, but maybe we're giving them the chances they need. And it's also quite possible we bring someone in when January comes around. Not signing a striker was not the end of the world or of our season; it's not ideal, but it doesn't make BR a failure.

Furthermore, we were all worried about this start to the season from the moment the fixture list came out. Is 1 point from first 5 games something to get excited over? Absolutely not. But does it mean we have no chance? Of course not. We may still get points from ManU and Sunderland, but even if we don't, this will be the hardest stretch we will go through this season, even if new signings weren't coming in in the middle of it and if everyone was fully adjusted to the new season.

If BR hasn't gotten us to the top 6 and on a decent points total by 2 months from now, I will be thoroughly surprised. Our play has looked good and looked fluid, even in the final third; the final product hasn't always been there, but that'll change as younger players come in more and the team adjusts more to the play style. The Plan A hasn't failed, it doesn't even look poor. Stop freaking out because results haven't come.

Finally, you're saying that the team is one dimensional because we can't survive bad games from Gerrard, Suarez and Borini? Are you kidding? Big game flops from FOUR of your players (adding Reina to that list) will sink any team, even if those four aren't as important as those four are. The fact that we have so many players that ALL need to have a poor showing in order to get beat by a top team is a GOOD thing, not a bad one.

Everyone take a big deep breath.
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Re: So far...

Post by Le Samourai on Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:23 am

Were less than 2 weeks into the season.

Borini will be a great long term player for the club and No one is ever going to complain about the Allen transfer in a million years because Allen is an amazing player and he's shown that and will continue to do so.

He's promoted Sterling and helped Shelvey.

Honestly I don't even want to get into what he has done because it's not time to analyze that yet. I reserve judgement until winter break because new managers need time , especially with a project as ambitious as this one.


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Re: So far...

Post by donttreadonred on Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:32 am

Oh, these changes haven't resulted in us vaulting up to the top of the table? Well let's sack the manager and get our rich, Russian sugar-daddy to fund some huge transfers... Oh, wait... I think I've wondered into the wrong section.

Seriously. This is disgusting guys...

We're not tweaking the team. We're tearing down the last few years of work and rebuilding from the ground up. It takes time. What's worse is that we're doing it on a smaller budget than last season. FFS our 20 million pound signing from last season is now a bench player/backup LB... We're still paying for previous mistakes. Mistakes the current management (barring Ayre) aren't responsible for. Honestly, I think Borini, Allen and Sahin will all come good for the club. Allen has already shown he's worth every penny, and Borini has shown flashes of what we bought him for. Sahin has the quality. We've seen it at BVB if not Real Madrid. He also hasn't played significant minutes in over a year. Let's give him more that 70 minutes before we jump on him.

Rodgers was seriously back-stabbed by someone in management on the last day of the transfer window. He was promised we would add to the squad, but we fell all over ourselves on the Dempsey deal and failed to bring in a backup CF. Rodgers identified his targets and made good on moving out players. Management didn't hold up their end. It sucks. Now let's move on. Maybe we can sign a bosman as cover for the season, or at least until January. (If there isn't a discussion on Michael Owen yet, perhaps there should be.)

What is positive is that the style isn't to blame for this result. Several uncharacteristically bad performances are the culprits here. We weren't out-coached, and we weren't outplayed as a team. The start certainly looks bad, but it's not representative of what this team is capable of. We, as supporters, have a very specific job to do. We have to SUPPORT the club through this transition. If we fail to do so, we are throwing away one of the things that makes Liverpool a great club regardless of our league standing.

Gentlemen, this is not a short story or the back page of a newspaper. This is a novel. Do you really want to judge it based solely on the first chapter?

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Re: So far...

Post by Don't call me James on Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:53 am

Well said Dontreaddyreddy Thumbs up

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Re: So far...

Post by Art Morte on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:59 am

Great that you guys remain positive and hopefully you lot get proven right, but I also think it is over optimistic to say "everything is just fine".
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Re: So far...

Post by donttreadonred on Mon Sep 03, 2012 3:27 pm

Everything is certainly not "just fine". I was angry beyond words on Friday, and quite depressed Saturday. However, this change was never likely to be easy. Due to financial constraints (and apparently policy too), we weren't able to make as much progress as we would like towards the "ideal" personnel in the squad. That really sucks, and it's put us in a precarious situation. That said, it can be managed, and I believe we have a manager that is strong enough in will and in his convictions that he can deal with it. Nothing that I have seen or read on BR would suggest he will crumple under this situation. Moreover, I believe he will fight to the end for this club. He may not succeed, but I believe he's willing to give everything in trying to improve LFC.

What scares me are the supporters that are "on the fence" in their support. I understand that not everyone likes BR as much as I do, but we cannot afford not to support him. He is the LFC manager, and he holds the clubs future in his hands. It's time to get over any personal questions about him and get behind him.

The hard truth of the matter is that we don't have the draw we once did. The atmosphere of the support and the style of play are our two biggest draws. We simply can't afford to lose either at the moment. Just remember what Borini said of his choice to come to LFC:
"The fans played a big part. When I was with Italy at Euro 2012 I was talking to Mario Balotelli about England, and he told me that Liverpool had the most exciting fans to play in front of. He described it as a beautiful experience."

It's time to support the club. Calling for further change at this point will only have an irrevocable, negative effect on the club. The motto is "You'll Never Walk Alone", not "You'll Never Walk Alone If You Immediately Succeed". Have patience... We have to lay a foundation for years to come. Sometimes you have to suck before you can succeed.

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Re: So far...

Post by BeautifulGame on Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:38 am

we played what 3 league games and Rodgers is useless :coffee:

We finished eight last season and faced league champions and 3 placed team in our last 2 games.Yep its disappointing that we lost to Arsenal but we have to be realistic.We are adopting to a completely new style so it will take time for players to adopt.Hardly unexpected results or something to moan about imo.

Even in the Arsenal game we comfortably dominated them in the first have and conceded only due to an individual error(from Gerrard).We just played 48 before in EL so its natural that we struggled in the 2nd half.


And in the meantime we outplayed the league champions , BR is giving the likes of Sterling and Shelvy run in the team , Our midfield looks really good and will improve with time and return of Lucas.


For me so far the real issue so far has been the lack of understanding in the final 3rd btw players.That will only come with time and the more they play together.

P.S

As for Kenny and Carroll no offense but we scored the same no. of points from these fixtures under Kenny and with the 35mil striker playing.

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Re: So far...

Post by nh01 on Wed Sep 05, 2012 5:34 am

At least most of the media attention will be on AVB majority of the time and at least you got some difficult fixtures out of the way! Would have preferred to have played City or United earlier again so we could get them out of the way and get some decent form going once they were out of the way
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Re: So far...

Post by Red Alert on Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:01 am

To be honest, I don't see us playing any different to Dalglish. Now, not saying Kenny shouldn't have been sacked, nor am I saying he should of stayed (I have mixed feelings about the sacking) but I really don't see any significant changes.

We keep going wide when we attack (even though none of our players can header), we still play Suarez as the furthest striker (who is A LOT better as inside forward) on the pitch and play a striker out wide, and we still give way too much authority in the midfield for Gerrard.

We're useless when it comes to corners and we can't score AT ALL.

Saying that, I'm in the belief Rodgers will turn this around.

Sterling and Joe Allen have been our best two players so far in the season.

Our players need to press more; and Rodgers needs to do more rotation.

Patience.

Oh, and loaning out Carroll (and I'm not even a fan) was just stupid stupid stupid. Mad
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Re: So far...

Post by Guest on Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:09 pm

ynwa wrote:To be honest, I don't see us playing any different to Dalglish. Now, not saying Kenny shouldn't have been sacked, nor am I saying he should of stayed (I have mixed feelings about the sacking) but I really don't see any significant changes.

We keep going wide when we attack (even though none of our players can header), we still play Suarez as the furthest striker (who is A LOT better as inside forward) on the pitch and play a striker out wide, and we still give way too much authority in the midfield for Gerrard.

We're useless when it comes to corners and we can't score AT ALL.

Saying that, I'm in the belief Rodgers will turn this around.

Sterling and Joe Allen have been our best two players so far in the season.

Our players need to press more; and Rodgers needs to do more rotation.

Patience.

Oh, and loaning out Carroll (and I'm not even a fan) was just stupid stupid stupid. Mad


Are you for real ?

We barely pressed under Kenny, and that was one of my biggest issue.

We press hell a lot more. Just see how many times Borini and Sterling win possession back in opposition half.

and we've scored a goal from a corner already :I'munoriginal:

Rodgers' revolution will take time, but he's got the right ideas. he knows the true basics of football and I trust him in the market. I am firmly behind him.

and how can BR rotate more when we have got 16 Senior players on our books Very Happy ?

Having said that, I think we'll play youth mostly in EL and CC, and be eliminated from both fairly quickly.

I don't care much about where we finish this year, as long as we show progress and more understanding of BR's system as the season goes on. More young players are blooded, and the team gets better as the season is going.

Damage done in the last couple of years isn't a quick fix.

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Re: So far...

Post by AnJl on Thu Sep 06, 2012 7:02 am

I mentioned this in the Arsenal section, thought I would post it here too:

This is a Liverpool team that bar Suarez (that also is 50 - 50) and Allen, they are adapting to a very different style, compared to what they have been doing for a considerable amount of time. Possession football isnt something that can be implemented straight away, not like other football styles. They werent up to scratch, you can see that clearly, yet they were able to control the game for a good amount of time and on another day, Suarez would have put atleast one of this shots away and Sterling would have gotten a penalty. (Btw, Mert was very very lucky that his shove on Suarez was not picked up by Webb.)

I am starting to become a big fan of Rodgers and I am quite pleased that someone like him is at the helm. I was watching the Being Liverpool promo and I have nothing but respect and awe for this man, the dressing down he gave to Sterling would have had me standing up and applauding. I found it so ridiculous, SO F*CKING RIDICULOUS at some of the comments made on the promo, saying things like:

'Great way to lose respect of your players, give one of the young players a dressing down then release it in public for the whole world to see. Will make Sterling feel great, I'm sure.'

' Sterling didn't show any respect to the old pro's on the Arsenal or Man City team either and he's dead right, iff you're good enough you're old enough. Rodgers is just posing and talking sh1te he's good at that but hasn't proved he's a good manager just yet.'

:facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall: :facepalm: :brickwall:

If the owners had given Rodgers half of what they gave Kenny, I bet Kenny would have gotten better and more suitable signings.

Btw, I dont get the hate against Enrique after the Arsenal game. I think he did quite well for the club and if anything, should atleast be given a shot in the Spanish National team.

All in all, you guys just have to be a little patient with him, that is all, because I know and I know for sure, if he is given the chance, he will make full use of it, and the moment it clicks, Liverpool will be a force to be reckoned with.

If Everton can keep faith in the manager, if Juventus can keep faith in their manager, if Manchester United could keep faith in their manager, if ARSENAL can keep faith in their manager, what is stopping you guys from trusting Rodgers?

Think about it.

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