Sara carbonero depreciation thread

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Zealous on Thu May 09, 2013 5:52 pm

@Le Samourai wrote:
@Zealous wrote:Well it's very stupid. At any other job if you disclose sensitive information to people outside the company there is a very real chance you get fired.

If it turns out Iker has been leaking to press for that long I don't think I can forgive him. Undermining the stability and unity of teh team just to further personal interests is unacceptable.

The "if" is worthless. No one is ever going to conclusively prove anything. Just decide what you want to believe.

So long as there is a lack of conclusive proof I wouldn't feel right about out right wanting the guy to leave. (Because imo if you do something like that you should go) I'd side with Iker before believe the asshats on Punto Pelota. Problem is after this season Iker leaking info isn't an out of this world notion any more. I'm sort of forced to take this story semi-serious.

I hope it isn't true.

@sportsczy wrote:That's being naive. If they do it to you, then you need to protect yourself by do it as well. There's a saying: Don't hate the playa, hate the game. That's just the system.

The players need to get themselves heard and they can't do it directly. Public comments by players are not acceptable. Managers... they can get away with much more publicly. But they also need to get certain things said through the back channels.

Any player that just takes it on the chin and doesn't protect himself is... well... stupid. Iker is not stupid.

He's allegedly not been stupid for 10 years, way before Mou ever came. You really don't think this would be a big deal? Because I do.

I understand leaks during contract negotiations and transfers to get leverage. That's fair I guess but leaking team info and creating unneeded drama that might hurt the team's chances.... That's going beyond what you're saying. Also why would Iker need to "protect" himself lol he's untouchable and above the club at this point, he doesn't need press leaks to protect himself.


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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Zealous on Thu May 09, 2013 5:54 pm

@Le Samourai wrote:Z - who do you like more Littlefinger or Varys?

Game of Thrones, very fitting eco smile

More of a Tywin Lannister fan myself but out of those two Littlefinger is by far the more dangerous one and as a result more likely to "win". I like Varys more though.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Adit on Thu May 09, 2013 5:55 pm

Who is that sir lopez..what kind of credibility does he have?

and how come he says it only now ? Laughing (the same question mou fanboys asked to ridicule pepe)

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by halamadrid2 on Thu May 09, 2013 5:55 pm

its wrong to leak things period. especially if there has been a bust up simply because media will use that as a template to make up other things.

What Iker (if true) has done is cowardy wonder what the fans would think of him if he did it like Mourinho I.e just blurt it out there. I guess he won't be very popular

Moles leaking things to the press is a reason why no coach can ever last long in this club
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Zealous on Thu May 09, 2013 6:00 pm

@sportsczy wrote:So is it ok for Mou to leak that Benzema is not good enough and he wants him sold 3 years ago? He never said it directly. But he leaked it to the press because he wanted him sold and new top striker bought that winter. Is it ok that news leaked that Mou didn't like Sahin's physical makeup? Again, that didn't pop out of thin air. Mou was indirectly setting the stage for his departure.

You can't say everything publicly. But you do need your side of the story out though at times. This is the method in the football world. In fact, it's like this in almost all the sports world. There are media mouthpieces for almost all the superstars in the US.

Under normal conditions a manager is allowed to get rid of and bring in any player he chooses so long as it is within budget. That pyramid is flipped at Madrid where players have way more power than the coach.

Look I'm not siding with Mou in any of this mess. When he leaves I won't be too bummed about it. But whatever Mou has done/did I can at least know that he did it because he wanted to win and advance his legacy/legend. He's in it for himself but that at least means his main objective is winning.

The motivations of the players seem to be different.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Zealous on Thu May 09, 2013 6:05 pm

@Adit wrote:Who is that sir lopez..what kind of credibility does he have?

and how come he says it only now ? Laughing (the same question mou fanboys asked to ridicule pepe)

I have trouble believing anything those plebs on Punto Pelota say but the nature of this season and the accusation force you to at least consider it a possibility at this point. I hope it isn't true.

Also what do you mean by Mou fanboys? For me at least this isn't a Team Mou vs Team Iker situation.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Pedram on Thu May 09, 2013 6:10 pm

So at Real Madrid no manager can be bigger than the players ? that's not how it's supposed to be, at least with successful teams.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Le Samourai on Thu May 09, 2013 6:15 pm

Here is my argument - take it for what you will.

In the 7 years before Mourinhio - there was no reason for Iker to do anything.

Since 2002 he's been a guaranteed starter - the only coach who even remotely thought about benching him was Capello (and I'd say he responded pretty well to that).

There was nothing to protect himself against - and nothing to personally gain....so it would really have been pointless. Last year - maybe even the last 3 - I can see it more. But I don't particularly care since Mourinhio did his utmost best to provoke this type of situation.

Littlefinger hates that he's not big enough to get respected. So all he's concerned with is himself and ladder in front of him. His only objective is to climb high enough so he can feel like he has real power.
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Mr Nick09 on Thu May 09, 2013 6:20 pm

@Pedram wrote:So at Real Madrid no manager can be bigger than the players ? that's not how it's supposed to be, at least with successful teams.
i dont think you understand it

it's not about establishing some kind of dominant position and turning the dressing into a game of thrones which mou did.

its about working with the players, authority is something natural not something you manufacture or try to enforce. look at mou he failed there.

everyone respect the coach but it all goes out of the window when the manager himself tries to undermine players like he did with iker since his first season and the whole xavi thing.


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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Adit on Thu May 09, 2013 6:20 pm

The same guy Siro Lopez of Punto Pelota was sued years back by Madrid management for publishing a false story and was asked to give proofs.


and this is the same guy who said ''pep left Barca because Bad relationship with Messi'' Laughing

I really would take his words with a pinch of salt.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Mr Nick09 on Thu May 09, 2013 6:25 pm

Journalists from punta pelota are all dross, you can believe that. i have watched that show long enough to see most of them being ridicule by some exclusive info they claimed to have.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Adit on Thu May 09, 2013 6:32 pm

@Zealous wrote:
@Adit wrote:Who is that sir lopez..what kind of credibility does he have?

and how come he says it only now ? Laughing (the same question mou fanboys asked to ridicule pepe)

I have trouble believing anything those plebs on Punto Pelota say but the nature of this season and the accusation force you to at least consider it a possibility at this point. I hope it isn't true.

Also what do you mean by Mou fanboys? For me at least this isn't a Team Mou vs Team Iker situation.

So now that we all know there are internal problems between players and Mourinho ( we knew it way before) we have to trust every BS spewed by the media?

People talks about supporting Higuain and called those fans who booed him as disgrace but the same peeps are now taking this opportunity to call Iker a disgrace based upon a BS show that is called Punto Pelota and a journalist who is as credible as jack the ripper.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by sportsczy on Thu May 09, 2013 6:38 pm

Yeah... apparently Iker is the cause of all instability in Madrid since he was called from Castilla. That shat player. Never did anything to help the club. Such a disgrace on and off the pitch :facepalm:

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by izzy on Thu May 09, 2013 6:47 pm

@sportsczy wrote:Yeah... apparently Iker is the cause of all instability in Madrid since he was called from Castilla. That shat player. Never did anything to help the club. Such a disgrace on and off the pitch :facepalm:

Ah yes, lets engage in more hyberbole. :facepalm:

Don't think anyone even said that.
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by sportsczy on Thu May 09, 2013 6:56 pm

I'm not going to call anyone out... but that's exactly what was said on the last page. Just read it Izzy. Maybe not the "Iker has never done anything for us" part. But blaming him for club instability for 10 years because a hack reporter on a hack program said so... definitely.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Adit on Thu May 09, 2013 7:01 pm

and some ones conclusion about '' oh Raul was not the mole it was casillas all the time'' made me No



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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by izzy on Thu May 09, 2013 7:02 pm

@sportsczy wrote:I'm not going to call anyone out... but that's exactly what was said on the last page. Just read it Izzy. Maybe not the "Iker has never done anything for us" part. But blaming him for club instability for 10 years because a hack reporter on a hack program said so... definitely.

No.

I read the last page.

Zealous and Hala are not blaming him for club instability. They are simply saying that if the report is true that he has been leaking information about the locker for the past 10 years then they have every right to be annoyed by that.
They never once said that it is all his fault for the instability of the club for the past 10 years. Not once.
They expect the leader and face of our club to know what things to say to the media and what to keep in-house and only between the players and manager.

I for one agree with that premise, but I 100% believe that Iker would never act so shady.
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by halamadrid2 on Thu May 09, 2013 7:10 pm

izzy is right. I would never accuse iker of wrong doing without proof but I said hypothetically if he was found to have done it then I find that a disgrace

It is a well known fact that this club have had moles throughout the years and you can't even deny that so I wouldn't put it past any of our old guards past/present to be the culpable ones
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Zealous on Thu May 09, 2013 9:00 pm

Not once did I say I believed the asshats at Punto Pelota or that I wanted Iker gone lol Just stating it's a serious accusation and that considering this season one is sort of forced to at least consider it a possibility.

I don't actually believe it but the implications are so high you can't help but hope that it isn't true. Raul used to leak information as well. This is why I'm not 100% at ease about it like some.

So please calma with the call outs eco smile

@Sam

Your point about Littlefinger is amusing but I don't see how it's relevant. If you're trying to make a parallel between him and Jose I don't think it holds water. Jose is just a guy who wants to win and on his terms. His biggest problem is that he expects obedience/loyalty instead of commanding it but there every time a squad and management has been behind him he has achieved success (Inter and Porto). At Chelsea when Roman started choosing which players he should buy things went south and here when Casillas and Ramos started clashing with him things went sour.

Critique Jose for what he is, no need to bring fictional characters into this lol

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by sportsczy on Thu May 09, 2013 9:35 pm

And btw guys, Iker has been benched and Mou is trying to discredit him since forever. Once you're benched, you're no longer the captain.

If Mou would have benched Iker and then kept his mouth shut, then this wouldn't have escalated. But he keeps antagonizing him privately and publicly. As a result, Iker views this as a war now and people are picking sides. If i'm Iker, i don't play nice and i don't play pretty... i play this game to win. And winning means forcing Mou out and kicking out anyone affiliated with him.

The other players just need to stay clear of this or, at worse, back Iker if they want to stay at Madrid past this year. Mou is not the winning side in this. What Pepe did was self-preservation of his Madrid career...


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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by halamadrid2 on Thu May 09, 2013 9:40 pm

And to think Mourinho is pondering wether to stay or not Proud My goddness if he doesn't leave this is going to turn mighty ugly
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Mr Nick09 on Thu May 09, 2013 9:49 pm

that one little disease that is mourinho, this is what he created.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by halamadrid2 on Thu May 09, 2013 9:54 pm

so there won't be a press conference before the Espanyol. looks like damage control arrived a tad too late

Edit: I wonder if we will throw Mou up in the air if we win Copa rofl
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Doc on Thu May 09, 2013 9:57 pm

Might end up throwing Casillas in the air...
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by sportsczy on Thu May 09, 2013 10:01 pm

I really don't understand why Mou did this. It was obvious as day that if you attacked and went to war against Iker Casillas in Madrid or Spain, you were creating massive problems ofr everyone including yourself. Why in the world would you do that? There weren't other things that needed your attention? Was Iker that terrible in goal?

I mean ffs, spend some time worrying about the midfield, RB and right wing lol.

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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

Post by Le Samourai on Thu May 09, 2013 10:06 pm

Things escalated early on this season - there was immense pressure - it wouldn't ave been surprising to see Mou fired at Christmas (most coaches would have been). Right now Iker and him are the big problems, but alot more went into the season than that.

Perhaps it was just an attempt to make everyone forget their minor squabbles.
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Re: Sara carbonero depreciation thread

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