Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by DeletedUser#1 on Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:18 pm

I actually agree with worms. Teams are happy to crowd the middle n give the wings to Barca because there is barely anyone in the box to attack the low crosses sent to the box. MessiacAgger tendency to drop to CM in tight games makes it even worse (Aame with us when Suarez plays as the main front man). With Falcao up front n Messi just behind him, Lio will get more time n space on the ball, teams can't willingly give the wings to Barca cuz Falcao is deadly in the box and it just gives the team more tactical flexibility.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by Brady2Moss on Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:38 pm

@worms wrote:And to the people saying Falcao won't do anything apart from score.

What does Pedro do?

What does Sanchez do?

What does Cesc do?

Falcao will offer a threat in behind the defense to give Messi more space,when oppoistion defenses play deep we will have the best header of the ball in the box as an option.He also has a high workrate.He would score at least 35 goals a season here.Teams could no longer concentrate solely on Messi.

He is technically good enough to play our passing game,as long as he keeps it simple like he does for Atletico.You are talking like he is Andy Carroll ffs Laughing

This is Barcelona FC not Messi FC.

lol I remember people (esp those who wanted Eto'o out) said the same about Ibrahimovic and Villa. No striker can truly succeed at Barca atm, esp not with Messi hogging the ball and central position most of the time.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by Brady2Moss on Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:48 pm

@worms wrote:
@BarcaKizz wrote:We need our manager back and we need to stop the experiment of 5 mids. Simple.

Also Jordi Alba is not fit for games against decent teams. He left us so exposed.

Someone was saying sell Alves? He was easily our best defender...

Alves is the past now,Alba is much younger and they both can't play together in a 4 man defense as it is too attacking.Buy a defensive RB and give Alba more freedom to attack.

The only way both fullbacks can play together is if Barca had quick defensive minded players to cover at the back. Puyol is past it, Pique needs competition and Busquets is not a defensive midfielder.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:19 pm

Funny that Busquets was a defensive midfielder for all the years we were winning, and now because we lost a couple games he aint?

Dani Alves past it? If he is past it than Alba never had it because he is trice the player Alba is and will ever will be.

Alba and Cesc are the real cancers of this team, those two are like a instant handicap for every important game we play.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by vicentec on Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:25 pm

Better days:


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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by billy_gr on Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:32 pm

@The Franchise wrote:Funny that Busquets was a defensive midfielder for all the years we were winning, and now because we lost a couple games he aint?

Dani Alves past it? If he is past it than Alba never had it because he is trice the player Alba is and will ever will be.

Pedro and Cesc are the real cancers of this team, those two are like a instant handicap for every important game we play.



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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:46 pm

Nah, Pedro aint up to his old standards and I dont think he will ever be, but he is still servicable and if we rotated correctly wouldnt be a big problem.

Alba on the other hand is a big problem because he is below our level at every aspect of the game other the occassional the overlap run.

Horrible defensively both positionally and the 1v1, even worse in the air, too busy asking for ref decisions to hustle and keep plays alive (that stuff with Di Maria in the corner was infuriating), gives the ball away because he takes too long to make a decision and on top of that, a better player is sitting on the bench watching him.
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by shinigami99 on Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:49 pm

Dani, do you mean Adriano? If so, I agree, since Adriano has more physicality and a really good shot, even though he is not as quick as Alba. Also, he has been in the team more and is more accustomed to our style.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:52 pm

Yes, Adriano is a much better player. I knew it long ago, before we even signed Alba and my opinion has only grown since we signed the Catalan.

Alba is faster, but Adriano is still one of the fastest players in La Liga, its not like he himself is struggling...then add up he has a right foot, he generally makes the right decision on the ball, he can shoot or cross with either foot and is much better defensively...if he wasnt injury prone, I would be almost as upset about him not playing over Alba as Cesc over Villa or even Tello.
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by danyjr on Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:02 pm

Alba:
  • Forgets to mark.
  • Loses physical battles.
  • Loses aerial battles.
  • Has got no clue what an offside line is.


To be completely fair, I thought he would have a relatively good future at Barcelona after watching him at Euros (still didn't rate him as good as Abidal). Shortly after, I watched him at the Olympic games and everything I thought about him was changed. A player with poor composure on the ball, taking too many touches and always playing the predictable pass without much awareness of what goes around him.

Now remember Abidal and see if any of the above is true. But the whole La Masia starting 11 became an obsession for you and we're seeing the fruits of it now.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by CBarca on Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:18 pm

Now that I think about it.

Adriano is actually a really good defender. Like, ridiculously underrated. I can't think of many times where I said after a game "Adriano was poor this game, costed us a goal". I can think of a couple mistakes at the most and opposite of that he's made the difference for us several times.

I really, really like Adriano and the fact that Alba is starting over him is infuriating. I actually forgot we even had Adriano.

Pedro hasn't been himself but he hasn't been a cancer like Cesc has been. Fair to throw in Alba in there too.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:32 pm

The only mistakes from Adriano I remember were when he was playing centerback...hardly his fault, so yeah I agree.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by sportsczy on Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:53 pm

alba, arbeloa and cesc are the 3 players that make Spain NT very beatable nowadays. Ramos, Capdevila and villa were exponentially better in those positions obviously.

As far as Barca... Abidal could be the answer at CB imo until you buy one. It's much easier to play than FB and he's good at it... assuming he's fit.

Adriano >>>>> Alba and i don't think Adrian is great. He's decent enough though until you find someone.

Barca needs to make some good purchases over the summer.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by Ganso on Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:57 pm

The main difference between Abidal,Adriano and Alba is that Abidal is basically a CB,so whenever a team countered, it was much easier to break it down since the team always had 3 cbs and busquets to help out.

Hell,I remember that scoring against you guys was quite an achievement back in the 10-11 days
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:06 pm

Find someone else? There arent exactly hundred of quality leftbacks around.

Abidal was a fantastic player, shame what happened to him. But we arent going to find someone of his level, or better than Adriano very easily.
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by worms on Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:22 pm

@danyjr wrote:Alba:
  • Forgets to mark.
  • Loses physical battles.
  • Loses aerial battles.
  • Has got no clue what an offside line is.


To be completely fair, I thought he would have a relatively good future at Barcelona after watching him at Euros (still didn't rate him as good as Abidal). Shortly after, I watched him at the Olympic games and everything I thought about him was changed. A player with poor composure on the ball, taking too many touches and always playing the predictable pass without much awareness of what goes around him.

Now remember Abidal and see if any of the above is true. But the whole La Masia starting 11 became an obsession for you and we're seeing the fruits of it now.

Do you think it is just a coincidence that Alba was at his best for Spain playing in the Euros? A team which had a solid back four and a more defensive minded fullback on the other side(Arbeloa)? This is the luxury Alves used to have with us when we played with Abidal at LB.If you remember Alves used to play much higher up the pitch than he does now,partly due to this reason and partly due to him now losing some pace and stamina.

Dani Alves is at the moment an all round better player than Alba but remember he is seven years older than him,remember how much of a beast Alba was in the Euro knockout stages?In all three matches he dominated that wing.He will never be as good as Peak Alves but he will be a brilliant player for years to come at Barca IMO.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by danyjr on Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:56 pm

I agree, but why sacrifice a better player for an inferior one? I personally thought Filipe Luís was much more suited because a) He can defend and b) he can attack just as well as Alba, just a different style. Yes he doesn't have the bombing runs of Alba but neither did Abidal.

I personally find it very difficult to classify Alba as a LB or as a LW. He lacks the defensive discipline and physique to be called a defender, yet he lacks the trickery and versatility to be a winger. He is just somewhere in the middle and perhaps better suited for a 3-5-2 formation. His work-rate is his biggest asset and don't get me wrong, he is a good player, I just feel he isn't world class and definitely not as a LB.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by CBarca on Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:01 am

You're acting like Dani Alves is a defensive liability just because he pushes up on offense, though.

That's not the case, that's what makes Alves so good. Alves for as far forward as he gets has never been a defensive liability because his ability to get back or to force a turnover higher up the pitch (if it was on his side). In times that he might have been too far up and there was a potential counterattack, our great pressing ability would often nullify a potential counterattack before it happened.

I'd agree with you if Alves was constantly not back far enough and the right side was exposed because of it, but that's not the case.

Oh, and he's still the best RB in the world. Sell him? rofl

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by Zealous on Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:16 am

I don't want to be rude/a troll or anything but do you guys really trust your management to make good signings right now? I mean if we're going to be really harsh the last truly great signing you made was Alves and to a lesser degree Adriano.

I mean every team has hits and misses in the transfer market but you guys haven't had a hit yet in a while. That's the real issue at Barca. Their management seems to have an agenda beyond winning football matches. Pep left after saying he felt exhausted. Valdes is now likely to leave despite being the starting GK in one of the best teams in the world. I don't want to preach gloom and doom since you guys will win the league which is not a bad thing at all, but I don't think Barca are being run very well despite on field success.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:30 am

Filipe Luís is a great name to use, nearly all of us on here said he would get him.

He is far better than Alba and more importantly, defensively sound.

We lost Abidal, surely common sense says replace him with someone at least partially similar.
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:33 am

@Zealous wrote:I don't want to be rude/a troll or anything but do you guys really trust your management to make good signings right now? I mean if we're going to be really harsh the last truly great signing you made was Alves and to a lesser degree Adriano.

I mean every team has hits and misses in the transfer market but you guys haven't had a hit yet in a while. That's the real issue at Barca. Their management seems to have an agenda beyond winning football matches. Pep left after saying he felt exhausted. Valdes is now likely to leave despite being the starting GK in one of the best teams in the world. I don't want to preach gloom and doom since you guys will win the league which is not a bad thing at all, but I don't think Barca are being run very well despite on field success.

No, of course not. Our transfers are hit and miss overall from 08-09 to now, like if you go back and count them out (I dont this), its almost exactly one good, one bad, one meh.

Thats not the real issue, I disagree with that, but I dont have faith in them making the right deals no, of course not.
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:35 am

If Dani Alves going forward is a problem (it isnt, we require him to do so, how many times he broke forward to escape press yesturday I lost count) because two offensive fullbacks then you know what the answer is?

Whoever the other guy is, sent his ass to the bench.

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by Donuts on Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:47 am

Our wingbacks are not the the main problem so not sure why there is a big discussion over it.
truth is as much as we love Puyol him getting older is not helping.
This summer we need to buy
A new keeper -- De Gea? Ter Stegen?
A new center back -- Barta? Hummels? Dede?
A new winger who can play the inside forward role. -- Nerman seems to be our only interest.
A new manager considering our current situation -- ??

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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Sanchez on Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:29 am

You simply cannot play two wingbacks every game in the season. Alba and Alves have been both playing as wingbacks when they have been partnered together. As Dani said if we were looking to replace Abidal then surely get someone who is at least similar type to Abidal. Alba isn't that player. Felipe Luiz and even Enrique would have been better options.

Tbh we only have 40m or so and we don't like going overboard... Getting a keeper, decent centreback, winger and manager will definately go over the 40m budget. Everyday of the week especially if were looking to get Neymar who will definately cost 40m if not more...
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by The Franchise on Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:56 am

@Donuts wrote:Our wingbacks are not the the main problem so not sure why there is a big discussion over it.
truth is as much as we love Puyol him getting older is not helping.
This summer we need to buy
A new keeper -- De Gea? Ter Stegen?
A new center back -- Barta? Hummels? Dede?
A new winger who can play the inside forward role. -- Nerman seems to be our only interest.
A new manager considering our current situation -- ??

Well the only reason for the discussion is because Alba sucks so bad and we sorely miss a more controlled and measured leftback in the mold of Abidal, or even an Adriano. I think we suffer because of it.

But more importantly, this discussion is taking place because Dani Alves again is getting criticised for no apperent reason.

As for your 4 points, I agree with the first 3. Coach I am not sure, I felt we should of thought about it as soon as Tito went down..but I think he did well enough before it so we should wait and see if he can return.

I dont like any of those defenders though, and im tired of us prioritising defenders with ability on the ball over actual defence. I dont like Hummels and dont think he would be that good. I would rather someone in the mold on Mangala, we need more athletic ability all over the pitch...especially the back and the front.
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Re: Copa del Rey | SF (Second leg) | FC Barcelona vs Real Madrid

Post by Donuts on Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:31 am

I do not think tito did a very well job before his illness.
we had a record starting la liga season but honestly that achievement could be completely random considering the teams we played and we never looked decent when we played Madrid, which other then Milan they are the only world class club we played.
our tactics have been odd idk if we should blame our players or tito.. maybe both?

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