Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:22 pm

@CBarca wrote:He was just a useless addition. There is no shame in admitting that.

True CB but what's useless today must have been considered useful yesterday. Surely someone just didn't decide to throw money into the water. All I was trying to do is speculate on what could possibly be the reason in any of the think tank's mind to purchase him. Understudy of Busquets perhaps but even that doesn't convince. It's one of the most baffling purchases ever as far as I am concerned.

Come to think of it truth be told both purchases from Arsenal i.e. Fabregas and Song are two of the best examples of LOSE LOSE for all concerned that I have come across in football.

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:30 pm

@The Franchise wrote:
The reason was Roura, he really doesnt know what he is doing.

He did what "normal" coaches would do for a "normal" team. His logic was, we are trying to hold on to the lead, so bring on a midfielder with more defensive skills...so Busquets for Thiago.

What he doesnt get it, for us, its an unnatural combination and we arent a normal team.

On the money dani.

Firstly as you said defending a one goal lead with a double defensive pivot is something we are not expected to do even in the last five minutes of a UCL final but in a normal match even the thought is sacrilegious.

Secondly were that to be done bringing Thiago off instead of Fabregas when someone who was watching football for the first time in his life would be able to say who is playing better could only be justified if Thiago was starting on Tuesday and Fabregas was not but that's as unlikely as the sun rising in the west.

Its worth wondering why Tito didn't find himself a more capable assistant.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by The Franchise on Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:33 pm

Probably because Tito is a nice guy and appricated the fact Pep has him as his second in command and then he came and took his place.. So he thought he would do the same.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:44 pm

@The Franchise wrote:Yes there is harm.

1. Money has been wasted, it could of been used on what we need and solved an long standing issue

2. We have youth players who deserve chances, places in the squad have great value.

Also, eventually we will complain anyway, he can to play, not sit on the bench. Said so himself.

Put it all together really well. Nothing more to add I think.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:46 pm

@BarcaKizz wrote:Who believes we'll sign a CB this transfer window? Is it that definite? I mean, you'd f**ing hope so, but still, hard to have faith when they haven't addresses defensive depth since 2009.

Most unfortunately you are spot on.

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:53 pm

@The Sanchez wrote:Tbh, Tito/Roura will state we have depth in the centre of defense.
Pique, Puyol, Mascherano, Barta, Muniesa, Song, Busquests, Adriano all in the first team and have all at one stage played in this position.

Unfortunately that's exactly what they will say and it is nothing short of outright laughable.

We have so little faith in our "depth" that we make Puyol push beyond all limits of age, fatigue and injury. We have so little trust in Bartra that we played Song and even Adriano ahead of him leave alone Muniesa. We have played Song a few times with disastrous results. As for Adriano I am sure people remember the calamitous situations that got us in. If anything I'd say we seem to be losing faith in Mascherano as well given how much we are trying to play Puyol at all costs whenever it matters.

Bottomline is if filling numbers meant depth every club in the world would have it. Get all your youth players from not just Bareclona B but all levels below as well and if that is not enough hire me also as a central defender. The key is will you have ever have faith in them. For most you won't even give them five minutes and for a few others you will play them only in the so called easier games. Hence any use of the word "depth" here is extremely stupid.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:57 pm

@The Franchise wrote:Probably because Tito is a nice guy and appricated the fact Pep has him as his second in command and then he came and took his place.. So he thought he would do the same.

Which begs the question why didn't Pep find a better second in command.

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by The Franchise on Mon Mar 11, 2013 4:02 pm

@messixaviesta wrote:
@The Franchise wrote:Probably because Tito is a nice guy and appricated the fact Pep has him as his second in command and then he came and took his place.. So he thought he would do the same.

Which begs the question why didn't Pep find a better second in command.


Maybe I confused the issue. I meant, Pep had Tito as his second in charge and then Tito progressed to take the top position.

So Tito remembering that and remembering the way Pep went to bat for his staff (I recall part of Pep's contract situation being about his staff too) including Tito, he wants to do the same for his number 2, Roura.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by Onyx on Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:36 pm

@The Franchise wrote:Yes there is harm.

1. Money has been wasted, it could of been used on what we need and solved an long standing issue

2. We have youth players who deserve chances, places in the squad have great value.

Also, eventually we will complain anyway, he can to play, not sit on the bench. Said so himself.

If a suitable youth player was available, then there was no need to sign Song. I just thought Song was signed to replace Keita, which I don't see a problem with.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by CBarca on Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:42 pm

Well the problem is, other than his first season, Keita was hardly a very useful player as much as he played and as much as I like and admire the guy.

He didn't need replacing, really. Most of his job in the last couple seasons was just taking minutes from Thiago Laughing and I know that sounds harsh, but it's true.

@The Franchise wrote:
@messixaviesta wrote:
@The Franchise wrote:Probably because Tito is a nice guy and appricated the fact Pep has him as his second in command and then he came and took his place.. So he thought he would do the same.

Which begs the question why didn't Pep find a better second in command.


Maybe I confused the issue. I meant, Pep had Tito as his second in charge and then Tito progressed to take the top position.

So Tito remembering that and remembering the way Pep went to bat for his staff (I recall part of Pep's contract situation being about his staff too) including Tito, he wants to do the same for his number 2, Roura.

That explains there being an assistant coach, but it does not explain why the assistant coach has such a level of incompetence.

We've seen here with Tito at least that he was a more than capable manager himself- he could have filled in for Pep (if Pep had been out like Tito has) almost seamlessly.

Roura on the other hand...

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by The Franchise on Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:53 pm

Indeed, which I why I am quite critical. Yes, he didnt ask to be put in this position, he isnt up to it.

But I ask, shouldnt a number 2 be able to take over for the boss? I mean, coaches can get suspensions too, coaches may miss a game here or there...shouldnt the number 2 be qualified?
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by CBarca on Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:12 am

Well I think that's the thing we're all in support of now.

We've seen the disastrous effects of an incompetent #2 first hand.

How the hell Roura got into that place is beyond me.

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:44 am

Hey JD do you have a link to the Alves interview? I found the original source in Spanish (or maybe it's another interview) but you have to pay to access the full one. From the part that's available it seems very interesting and many of his comments are spot on (like the lack of intensity when pressing).

http://www.elmundo.es/elmundodeporte/2013/03/11/futbol/1363000126.html

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:32 pm

@The Franchise wrote:
Maybe I confused the issue. I meant, Pep had Tito as his second in charge and then Tito progressed to take the top position.

So Tito remembering that and remembering the way Pep went to bat for his staff (I recall part of Pep's contract situation being about his staff too) including Tito, he wants to do the same for his number 2, Roura.

Actually my comment was confusing. What I meant to ask was who hired Roura, Pep or Tito, and whoever did why didn't they find someone more capable?
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:34 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Hey JD do you have a link to the Alves interview? I found the original source in Spanish (or maybe it's another interview) but you have to pay to access the full one. From the part that's available it seems very interesting and many of his comments are spot on (like the lack of intensity when pressing).

http://www.elmundo.es/elmundodeporte/2013/03/11/futbol/1363000126.html

Sorry alfred I only saw it on TV.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by The Franchise on Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:23 pm

@messixaviesta wrote:
@The Franchise wrote:
Maybe I confused the issue. I meant, Pep had Tito as his second in charge and then Tito progressed to take the top position.

So Tito remembering that and remembering the way Pep went to bat for his staff (I recall part of Pep's contract situation being about his staff too) including Tito, he wants to do the same for his number 2, Roura.

Actually my comment was confusing. What I meant to ask was who hired Roura, Pep or Tito, and whoever did why didn't they find someone more capable?

I see.

Roura was hired as a scout, he was responsible for veiwing the oppanant and giving his opinion on tendancies, gameplans, strengths and weaknesses. He might of been excellent at this for all we know.

As a second in charge I dont know, I simply assume he was chosen because they continued the policy of hiring within and everyone taking a step up on role, perhaps someone felt he had earnt it and paid his dues. I have nothing against that, if he showed that ability then I have no problem with giving him a step up and seeing if he could translate that to the number 2 position.

Clearly that is not the case, its a error, which is acceptable, clubs make errors, companies make errors in hiring, it is what it is. I do wonder if he was interviewed though, was his thought and ideas directly related to our team (instead of the opponants) to our team known?

I get the impression no, I get the impression he never had to prove how insight he was in terms of our team. That is just me guessing, purely based on what he has done since he been in charge. I find it hard to accept they were aware of his limitations and still hired him.
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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:17 pm

Wonderfully well explained dani. So that should mean that clubs and their managers consider replacing their number 2 when he is not good enough as is the case here.

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by free_cat on Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:03 pm

Jordi Roura is one of Tito's best friends. That's the reason why he was hired as second coach and why he was trusted once Tito left. Don't look further than that.

From what I've heard from an ex Barça player who played with him, Roura is a guy who has great knoweledge of football, but is quite lazy. So he might do a good job as a scout and when he has a boss that pushes him, but perhaps he is not done to be the boss himself.

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Re: Barcelona vs Deportivo | Sat March 9th | La Liga Matchday 27

Post by messixaviesta on Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:15 pm

cat, thanks for sharing some very interesting information.
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