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Post by Onyx on Sat Jun 01, 2013 2:33 pm

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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sat Jun 01, 2013 2:57 pm

Pes 2013 is a fantastic game but does have some AI issues.

Hopefully PES 2014 irons that out with the new engine and everything that comes with a new generation.

The fact its using the Fox Engine is a fantastic sign.
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Post by Guest on Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:06 pm

Mole went to the dark side Evil or Very Mad

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Post by FalcaoPunch on Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:25 pm

Ehh lets wait and see...again.
The graphics and movement of the players seems to rigid.
Like they can only move like this

-----_____ _____------
-------
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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:30 pm

you can hardly see players running lol

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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:50 pm

@FalcaoPunch wrote:Ehh lets wait and see...again.
The graphics and movement of the players seems to rigid.
Like they can only move like this

-----_____ _____------
-------

Don't see why it would be it wasn't in PES 2013 infact that is a strong point of the game the intelligence of movement is excellent.

Also wouldn't pay too much attention to this its just a teaser.
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Post by izzy on Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:26 pm

@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Pes 2013 is a fantastic game but does have some AI issues.

Hopefully PES 2014 irons that out with the new engine and everything that comes with a new generation.

The fact its using the Fox Engine is a fantastic sign.

Oh, you gotta tell me why.
I need to know your points. Very Happy
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Post by Tomwin Lannister on Sat Jun 01, 2013 5:19 pm

If only Pes had licenses, it would force FIFA to actuall improve their game

I love the idea of Pro Clubs. Teaming up with friends.


But I could list you about 30 problems with it, and i'm not talking about personal irritations. I mean some seriously messed up problems.

Pls improve PES, I'll never buy it, I just need FIFA to have an actual rival.

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Post by •MilanDevil• on Sat Jun 01, 2013 6:40 pm

AbraKebabra Alacalamb wrote:If only Pes had licenses, it would force FIFA to actuall improve their game

I love the idea of Pro Clubs. Teaming up with friends.


But I could list you about 30 problems with it, and i'm not talking about personal irritations. I mean some seriously messed up problems.

Pls improve PES, I'll never buy it, I just need FIFA to have an actual rival.

Just download a patch online, you could get all licenses and also any league you want. What is important is that PES has the CL and EL licensed, this is what makes master league much better than career mode imo. I get bored after 1 season in career mode because I dont feel the difference between cup finals and a regular league game.

I love PES because its superior to Fifa in tactics, game faces, much more intelligent AI, and more balanced stats for players.

Fifa is better in terms of online gaming, menus ( more colourful and interactive unlike PES which has dull menus), and currently gameplay.

In the end, I feel that both games are still far from reality, PES is more arcade while Fifa is more of a simulation. However, ever since the release of the Fox engine, I have been hyping PES because I feel that it is the one that can come closer to reality.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sat Jun 01, 2013 7:01 pm

@izzy wrote:
@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Pes 2013 is a fantastic game but does have some AI issues.

Hopefully PES 2014 irons that out with the new engine and everything that comes with a new generation.

The fact its using the Fox Engine is a fantastic sign.

Oh, you gotta tell me why.
I need to know your points. Very Happy

Gameplay wise its just so enjoyable....

As mentioned before the intelligence of players for off the ball movement is just excellent, some of the moves i have been able to pull off i can't do in Fifa.

It does depend on the individual player though, for example Ibra rarely runs in behind while Reus will constantly look to do so.

Tactically its so indepth, for example i can effectively use a Barca like high line in this with high pressure and intensive organisation.....

Not even lying about this but me and my mate had a game of Barca vs Dortmund with both us pressing high with practically all 22 players in the middle of the pitch and it was so difficult to build up plays for both of us because of it.... i remember him constantly raging about my offside trap Very Happy

You can do more than that too but its just an example of how tactically diverse it can be.

PES 2013 really just simply plays a great game of football but there are negatives....

Online/Offline modes and options pale in comparison to Fifa ( this doesn't bother me but i can see why it would some) the presentation of it all again is poor compared to Fifa as does the soundtrack and commentary.

Gameplay wise its just as good as Fifa if not better, i personally find it more enjoyable as IMO Fifa is very mechanical while PES feels the opposite.

It does take a while to get used to though, this isn't a pick up and play game this is mainly due to the almost universal manual controls ( although you can make certain parts assisted) and the advanced defensive controls for pressing, containing, tackling and intercepting all needing a different command to do.... it can be frustrating at first but without it then it wouldn't be the same experience in the long run IMO.

Tom as for the licenses....

Spoiler:
PES 2014 City_k10

PES 2014 Spurs_10

PES 2014 Nufc_k10

There is many more where that came from, PES still has a lot of work to do as just competing with Fifa on the gameplay front isn't enough but for the first time in years PES 2013 got its bread and butter right.

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Post by Onyx on Sat Jun 01, 2013 7:09 pm

FIFA's gameplay isn't realistic.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sat Jun 01, 2013 7:14 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:FIFA's gameplay isn't realistic.

I agree, honestly while Fifa looks realistic graphically and PES looks arcadey.

They play the opposite for me, at least the latest versions do.

PES 2013 is very realistic to me, a lot of times playing it then watching a live game later on i feel this could happen in PES and vice versa.

While Fifa seems very arcadey at least to me in its gameplay which is what i meant when i was talking about the gameplay feeling very mechanic.
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Post by Tomwin Lannister on Sat Jun 01, 2013 7:26 pm

Nah I know you can get licenses, but the fact is if they were already built in I reckon PES would get more of a fan base.

At the end of the day, without direct sales competition, FIFA will do nothing except add in a new movement here and there


Pro Clubs, which is a very popular game mode is so broken, and they give no indication of wanting to improve or fix it.

They focus solely on UT because it makes the money, and with nobody pushing them, they have very little need to put serious thought into the game.


There are some videos of mistakes on Pro Clubs that I could add that would make you cry. And passing realistically? Forget about it, no matter how careful you are, it will go wrong.


PES needs to push FIFA, and doing that without having all the licenses built in is very unlikely.

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Post by Onyx on Sat Jun 01, 2013 7:47 pm

Ultimate Team's gameplay is apparently different to normal. Players have certain boosts and overall the gameplay is quicker. It's all about pace.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sat Jun 01, 2013 8:31 pm

What do you propose they do Tom?

Of course they continue to improve the gameplay and hopefully do the things i mentioned like more easy on the eye menus, better sound track and commentary and better game modes for both offline/online.

But they will only take them so far because they can't sponsor shit and market it like EA can they just dont have that type of cashflow.

Honestly the best way is word of mouth, but that will take some time.

The latest PES is a very good game IMO and i enjoy it a lot but most people i speak to haven't even touched the thing because they were burnt by previous iterations.

Problem is they went so long with such a shoddy product that people lost trust.

The new engine might be something to help this though, if they come with something that really attracts the mass market graphically they could get people to take a plunge.

I'll continue to buy it if the quality keeps improving like it has the last couple of years but i'm not sure enough people will to beat or close to Fifa in the sales.


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Post by The Lizard King on Sat Jun 01, 2013 9:58 pm

Wrote a blog article yesterday about PES vs FIFA. Nothing great, but if you guys wanna check it out, here it is

http://genericsheepemporium.blogspot.ca/2013/06/fifa-13-vs-pes-13-perspective-of-purist.html

Feedback welcome, as always.

On Topic : Genuinely looking forward to the new PES engine. And honestly, PES procuring rights to the Champions League and EL is definitely a competitive advantage they should build on. Rights aren't easy, or cheap, but that's an excellent start.

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Post by izzy on Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:02 pm

OK Mole, I read your points and I see where your coming from (I have the game as well, I hate it but it is better) 1 question though:

"Is this game only classified as good because the embarrassing current-gen series that was Pro Evo, starting from 6 to 2013? (Pro 6 on the 360 NOT PS2)
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:05 pm

No i actually really enjoy it on its own merits irrelevant of the embarrassing games that proceeded it.

Still not as good as the PS2 days but its a step in the right direction IMO.
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Post by Tomwin Lannister on Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:11 pm

Like I've said, Pro Clubs is my favourite thing by a mile and the only reason I buy FIFA, so unless Pro Evo were to make a great online version of that then i'm with FIFA. But the problem is, unlike Ultimate team which caters to greedy *bleep* idiots, Clubs doesn't make FIFA any money.

Result?

Here's just a handful of hundreds of shit things about it.

Pace is king, you have to use defenders who have no positioning, less strength and pace than attackers, no touch , no sense of awareness NOTHING against people with Messi stats and Walcott pace.

Goalkeepers often to the most retarded things.

To try and couner pacewhores, 95% of the population have 7 or 8 people back in defense at all times.

The game mechanics on Clubs is terrible, no matter how good you think you are, playing with the ANYs in any way except hoof counter attacking is impossible unless you're against a really shit bunch of players.

Counter attacks are too effective, combined with pace they are unstoppable if pulled off correctly.

The reff is a *bleep* moron. My friend 2 days ago had the ball in their 3rd, he ran past a player and got blocked. The reff ran up to him and gave him a straight red, despite being the one on the ball and recieving a foul.

This is not a once in a lifetime event, it's fairly common to get screwed over.

Defending corners is impossible, 5 foot 2 players can still beat you in the air. You can only control 1 person and therefore you need the CPU to mark, they don't mark up for shit. Resulting in free headers.

The game is bugged, it took them 7 months to fix the 'black glove' achievement. Which requires you to play in the snow. They forgot to add snow to pro clubs up until not long ago. And THEN, you still don't 100% get the achievement for playing in the snow, it's still semi-bugged. I unlocked the gloves playing in the sunshine...

There are two boots that are glitch-locked in the Pro club edit menu. They forgot to put them in a 'boot pack' unlock. They are there, it says you need to unlock them to wear them. But there is no unlock rofl And yes they're on other game modes.



As for just plain EA lazy asshole-ness.

No kit customisation, you get random inhuman looking players with idiotic names all the time, there is no real sense of getting anywhere.

If you press X after a cup game to get past the tournament tree screen (Which is wrong in itsself) your pro gets knocked back a couple of levels. You need to press O instead. rofl


I might continue later.


THIS IS WHY FIFA NEED COMPETITION.

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Post by izzy on Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:12 pm

Well, I hope your're right Mole and they seriously need to come out the blocks flying with this new engine they have.
They can not have a repeat of Pro Evo 6 on the 360. That was horrible.

I've bought every release of the game since the PS1 and even though I hate the series, if they don't get back to their PS2 days, Fifa will keep releasing the same game with just new features. We need Pro to push Fifa.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:56 pm

@The Lizard King wrote:Wrote a blog article yesterday about PES vs FIFA. Nothing great, but if you guys wanna check it out, here it is

http://genericsheepemporium.blogspot.ca/2013/06/fifa-13-vs-pes-13-perspective-of-purist.html

Feedback welcome, as always.

On Topic : Genuinely looking forward to the new PES engine. And honestly, PES procuring rights to the Champions League and EL is definitely a competitive advantage they should build on. Rights aren't easy, or cheap, but that's an excellent start.

I agree with this 100%, great stuff.

Unfortunately for Konami though, presentation and features are massively important to selling a game even if the gameplay and graphics are superior in certain aspects.

Anyway as you say, eager to see what Fifa and PES both bring to the table.

I might even buy both if they are enticing enough.
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Post by Onyx on Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:04 pm

I wonder why FIFA/PES can't just make the gameplay/presentation etc exactly like it is in real life in one go.

I know they need to have a new feature every year...
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Post by •MilanDevil• on Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:11 pm

I think they could make the games realistic if they really wanted, these are just the intros of PES 3 and 4. However, if they do make it realistic now then the fans wont buy new editions, but I believe they could make up for that by creating DLCs regularly.



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Post by izzy on Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:24 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:I wonder why FIFA/PES can't just make the gameplay/presentation etc exactly like it is in real life in one go.

I know they need to have a new feature every year...

Are you serious?
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Post by Onyx on Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:33 pm

Thing is both FIFA/PES implement all these little 'first touch', 'improved dribbling', 'new moves' etc etc features every year, when all they have to do is watch real life football games and make the game exactly like that. Then there'd be no need for all those features.

It's like both EA/Konami are creating their games based on what they think football is, instead of actually watching football.

It's the 2012/2013 version of both games and they aren't as realistic as they should be.
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