FIFA 14 discussion

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Post by Casciavit Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:16 am

Through balls especially over the top through balls are so OP. Your defenders just stand there without even moving ffs.

Also, when you try to turn your players they move so slowly its such a pain.

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Post by Onyx Sun Oct 13, 2013 11:27 am

Yeh that's a big problem on clubs. Pros can walk past the CPU players at times, because they take half an hour to turn.

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Post by RealGunner Sun Oct 13, 2013 5:59 pm

Fiorentina vs Portugal

Thanks EA
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Post by M99 Sun Oct 13, 2013 7:57 pm

Doing manager mode with Swansea.
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Post by barca 2011 Sun Oct 13, 2013 10:09 pm

RealGunner wrote:Fiorentina vs Portugal

Thanks EA
They really should give u the option of whether u want NT vs NT, club vs club, or anyway you'd like. Or if u prefer the random way it is now, then u can keep it there. I too hate when I choose Germany only to play Bayern. Or I choose Barca and have to play Spain :facepalm:
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Post by Onyx Sun Oct 13, 2013 11:12 pm

There's an option so you only face club if you're club or international if you're international.

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Post by Winter is Coming Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:43 am

Where is that option? Never mind found it.

Can someone give me some tips on defending online? I can't defend to save my life, players online dribble by me like no tomorrow and take on three of my players and I can barely get by one of theirs and they come in thru the middle like nothing were I get pushed to the side and can't cut in for them lol
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Post by M99 Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:19 pm

Fighting for Top 4 with Swansea atm. 6 points of 1st place but objective board gave me was Europa League Laughing
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Post by RealGunner Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:28 pm

didnt wanted to get promoted without the D7 trophy so lost the match on purpose : lucas :
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Post by Firenze Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:49 pm

anyone want to do a friendlies season with me sometime ( 5 games)

last trophy I need to platinum the game
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Post by Tomwin Lannister Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:39 am

LOOOOOOOOOOOOL lmfao was 3-0 down on ultimate team with my scrub team, after 20 minutes. Some horrible EA'ness in the rain

I ended up winning 4-3 with Muntari scoring the last 2 goals for me late in the game rofl

Playing him RCM in a 4-3-1-2.
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Post by Casciavit Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:46 am

Speaking of Ultimate team, I always tell myself that I won't waste any money on packs, since you rarely ever get anyone good.

But, like usual I start to question myself and ask myself what if I get an in form, I saw an IF RVP on team of the week and I wasted 15000 coins on 2 packs and my best player was a duplicate Sinclair ffs. Laughing
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Post by Firenze Fri Oct 18, 2013 12:47 pm

Casciavit wrote:Speaking of Ultimate team, I always tell myself that I won't waste any money on packs, since you rarely ever get anyone good.

But, like usual I start to question myself and ask myself what if I get an in form, I saw an IF RVP on team of the week and I wasted 15000 coins on 2 packs and my best player was a duplicate Sinclair ffs. Laughing
I'm done opening packs on UT. I used to spend real money on the game.

I've opened probably 6000 packs since UT10. I've had a few good players but we're talking probably 15 players worth over 100K. My best was a team of the year Pique. It's ridiculous. I know it's all down to luck but it's way more effective to just save and buy your team. Only then you probably won't get your dream team. Sad

but yeah I was saving for IF Totti and needed another 20k, ended up spending my coins on packs. managed to get Pirlo though so I'm pretty much back where I was. Need dat Totti looks sick
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Post by Swanhends Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:34 pm

the pressing is unbearable online...90 minutes of full court press with no one getting tired and the players running basically as fast as the ball moves :facepalm:



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Post by Onyx Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:58 pm

Yeh they need to remove the auto pressing in the next patch. Every single team does it, so it's unrealistic. It's not as if it's just Bayern/Barca, which is perfectly acceptable.

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Post by LeSwagg James Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:23 am

Seasons destruction.. Half-time Very Happy 

FIFA 14 discussion  - Page 5 Img_2010
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Post by RealGunner Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:17 pm

How did the guy not rage quit at 5-0 lol?
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Post by LeSwagg James Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:31 pm

I don't know lol, he took the beating like a man.. I commend him for it Proud
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Post by jibers Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:48 pm

Add me ffs. I want to wreck someone.
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Post by Tomwin Lannister Mon Oct 21, 2013 11:46 pm

Somebody man up and play co-op seasons with me ffs man
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Post by Firenze Tue Oct 22, 2013 1:13 am

Tomwin Lannister wrote:Somebody man up and play co-op seasons with me ffs man
We still have to get to D1 sometime. Think we got to D2 almost unbeaten. Haven't played it since GTA came out.
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Post by punkfusion1992 Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:55 am

look if you have an xbox then im always game
id = punk182day
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Post by Onyx Tue Oct 22, 2013 10:04 pm

Good post that sums up the game:

It’s been over three weeks since the release of FIFA 14, and with the release of the second patch - which included numerous changes intended to improve balance - it's time to review just that. I can sum up my feelings on balance easily - FIFA 14 doesn't have a good balance, and it is seriously jeopardising my enjoyment of the game. In a two parter, I'm going to talk about balance in general, FIFA 14's balance, and what needs to be done to get us out of the rut we've been in for far too long.

For all of the substantial improvements EA have brought to FIFA this year, it simply hasn't summed to a better experience than what we had with FIFA 13. That isn't said to praise FIFA 13's balance - to the contrary, the balance has been poor since at least FIFA 09 - but to highlight my feelings that the quality of the balance right now is severely below poor. That sense of things contrasts greatly with that of an EA developer, Gilliard Lopes who tweeted the following prior to the second patch’s release:

“Balancing: the game is very well tuned already, but we are improving it even more based on feedback incl. headers and finesse shots”

Whether or not this represents the general feeling amongst EA developers - Gilliard's twitter page disclaims that his tweets express his opinions, not those of his employer - it's still very interesting. To me, the idea that FIFA 14 is 'very well tuned' is hard to swallow, and the patch, meant to improve it 'even more' hasn't made that much of a difference.

Before I get into the major issues with FIFA 14’s balance, there are a few things worth saying. Firstly, I play primarily online on Seasons, Co-Op Seasons, and in Clubs. What I feel about this game derives primarily from my experience of those three modes, and I respect that the game plays very differently in other environments - against friends locally, against the CPU and so on. Secondly, I’m sure some people’s opinions differ dramatically to mine - balance is a fairly subjective issue - but I have seen a lot more complaints about balance this year than usual, so hopefully I can go some way to explain that.

Finally, I’d like to ground this discussion by defining balance. Balance is variously defined by gamers, it has very different meanings for different genres of games, and there is no true definition to refer to. When I’m looking at FIFA 14’s balance, I’m looking at it from three broad perspectives - strategy, skill, and realism.

For me, strategic balance is really about three things: providing a variety of viable strategies, ensuring that no particular strategy is dominant, and hopefully crafting an experience where strategy is very much a game in itself - we should be heavily considering the way our opponent plays and attempting to outwit them with better strategy, not playing every game in a similar manner.

The skill balance is a totally different concept. It's about how much of the game is under user control - so we aren't passengers in the experience, and about ensuring that there is a good balance between risk and reward, as well as between difficulty and effectiveness. In a nutshell, achieving a good skill balance is all about ensuring that the game is "easy to play", but "hard to master".

Finally, the realism perspective is one which is crucial for a sports simulation. We are, presumably, all football fans and therefore we all have a fair bit of experience watching the game being played. When we play FIFA, we want to be noticing the very same phenomena, and it will always be difficult for us to accept things happening in the game which are blatantly unrealistic. Regardless of how well the balance may hold up in the first two respects, we play FIFA because we want a game which acts as an extension to the sport we love.

Now these three perspectives are distinct. A game can do well in one area but not in another. You could have a game which was well balanced strategically but in a way which had little to do with real football (the reverse isn’t so true - a truly realistic football simulation would have emergent strategic qualities). Similarly, you could have a very realistic simulation which wasn’t enjoyable to play because the player's level of control was minimal.

So that's how I'm looking at balance - and in my mind this definition is broad enough to explain all of the major issues with balance. So how does this all apply to FIFA 14? Well, for the remainder of this article I'm going to talk about strategic balance, leaving the skill and realism balance 'til part 2. I apologise to anyone who read the demo review I wrote a few weeks back: some of this will seem like repetition.

It is incredibly noticeable that, when you're playing online, most players have a very repetitive style of play and that furthermore, most players play the game in exactly the same way. FIFA 14's gameplay is balanced such that there is one general strategy which is both easier to pull off and more effective than any other. More or less, it can be summed up as: defend deep, press hard, attack fast.

In terms of attacking, it's all about the counter. Get the ball with your defenders or keeper, and fire the ball forwards to an attacker. If the pass is successful, you'll likely be in a fair bit of space with one or two attackers. From there, initiate a run via the player-run-trigger or a one-two, and try a throughball. If the throughball comes off, move towards goal. If you have more than one player goalside of the defence, pass across. If not, attempt a finesse shot.

That all sounds like an oversimplification, but it really isn't. That pretty accurately sums up a lot of the players online who do this for a large proportion of the game to great effect. It works for one simple reason - the two points in the attack which could go wrong don't go wrong nearly enough. The pass from the defence to attack is often guaranteed because there is almost always at least one attacker in so much space they won't be challenged for the ball. The throughball, or ball over the top, is not only "good enough" far too often, but is often inch perfect, beautifully rolling into the path of the attacker, not even causing them to break stride.

Two issues - passing accuracy and defensive AI - are culpable for the over-effectiveness of this strategy. Assisted passes, particularly airborne ones, are still far too accurate in FIFA, and everyone knows it. It's very hard, on this evidence, to remember that EA implemented Pro Passing in FIFA 11 to solve the very issues that are so prevalent four years later.

As for the defensive AI, it fails in its lackadaisical marking, it’s ability to cover, and it’s ability to play a decent offside trap. EA have improved the defensive AI this year, but it hasn't proven to be enough. I hope they’ll continue with it next year, and if they do, improving the AI of the actual defenders - the center backs and full backs - should be the focus. Deeper intelligence, allowing them to cope better with turnovers in possession, and greater cohesion, allowing them to work as a team to cover runs and to play an offside trap, is crucial.

In terms of defensive strategy, I said that it tends to revolve around defending deep and pressing hard, even if it does sound like a contradiction of sorts. Generally speaking, the telltale signs of this strategy are a defensive mentality and formation (like those with two defensive midfielders). With a deep, packed defence, you can rely on the defensive AI to the point where you can almost let it do the work for itself. That's where the pressing comes in - by constantly pressing the ball carrier with the midfielders, you can make it incredibly hard for your opponent to play, while not having to worry about the gaps you might be leaving behind. Simply run a player at the ball carrier at all times - you'll gain back possession in no time. Low risk - high reward.

The effectiveness of pressing is such that it becomes nearly impossible to play around and through the packed defence, and this is all about tackling mechanics. Like passing, FIFA's tackling mechanics have been a sorespot for a long time. They were justifiably complained about during the legacy defending period where players defended by holding two buttons and watching their players turn into homing missiles, and it is equally justifiable to complain about the mechanics in tactical defending with the overly automated contain function, and the flagrantly overpowered auto-tackles.

The major issue with auto-tackles is that they are far, far too accurate. Consider how often you actually see an auto-tackle miss, consider how often the auto-tackle causes a foul, consider how often an auto-tackle actually causes you to get beaten - practically never, right? That’s the issue in a nutshell. FIFA’s defenders auto-tackle at a sizable radius and with impossibly good reaction speeds. They will quite regularly snap the ball away from you as if they absolutely knew what you were about to do, and where the ball was about to go. What this leads to is a situation where tackling is almost all about proximity, and where people are hugely encouraged to run straight towards the ballcarrier without a great deal of thought.

Personally, even though we had a significant defensive revamp with FIFA 12 and Tactical Defending, I’d be hoping for another with FIFA 15. The tackling is one problem with defending which could probably be solved within the current paradigm, but there are many more issues in terms of how we control the defence that deserve a look in too (I will follow this comment up in future - been meaning to do so for ages).

The most important thing about the effectiveness of the attacking and defensive strategies (counterattacking & defending deep + pressing hard) is how well they complement each other. The very fact that you can attack so successfully with just two or three players, and that you can go from defensive to attack without needing to go through the midfield, means that attacking is no harder if you're defending with seven men than it would be otherwise. Best of all, the more your opponent pushes forwards to try and pin you back, the easier it becomes to counter them. In comparison to real life, in precisely the situation where one team would be dominating possession because the other was struggling to get it away, those defense-to-attack pinpoint passes make all the difference.

The sheer dominance of this way of playing makes for a game which simply isn’t that enjoyable to play and certainly isn’t that realistic. It’s incredibly tedious to play a game where you know exactly what your opponent is going to do, but one where you can’t actually do much to prevent it. A few times a match, any half decent player will be able to produce a golden chance if they construct every attack around two passes. It's a hit & hope approach where the hope can be replaced with confidence.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying everyone plays like this, nor that anyone plays like this 100% of the time - but it is an increasingly large number of people doing it for an increasingly large proportion of each match. When you think about it, that’s really sad, because FIFA's current balance reduces the hugely tactical game that is football to a shallow farce. It's sadder still that the dominant strategy is one that rarely produces good football. FIFA has been oriented around end-to-end counter and pressure since FIFA 09, and it's now surely time for a change.

It won't be easy. The strategic balance issues are underpinned by major gameplay mechanics like tackling, passing, and defensive AI, and so tweaks simply won't cut it. But that doesn't change the fact that strategic balance should be a top gameplay priority for EA going forward. Instead of making changes and hoping things fall into place, EA have got to start designing changes with the absolute intent of shifting the balance towards more thoughtful football - the first step towards this is recognising that there is a problem in the first place.
http://news.futhead.com/posts/xaors-cave/26000-xaors-cave-lets-talk-balance-part-1

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Post by Tomwin Lannister Tue Oct 22, 2013 10:26 pm

Was 3-0 up against Jibs, he made it 3-2 because I was getting raped on the wings as Juve vs Barca

Made HT change to 4-2-3-1 then seen the game out.
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Post by Thimmy Tue Oct 22, 2013 11:37 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:Good post that sums up the game:

It’s been over three weeks since the release of FIFA 14, and with the release of the second patch - which included numerous changes intended to improve balance - it's time to review just that. I can sum up my feelings on balance easily - FIFA 14 doesn't have a good balance, and it is seriously jeopardising my enjoyment of the game. In a two parter, I'm going to talk about balance in general, FIFA 14's balance, and what needs to be done to get us out of the rut we've been in for far too long.

For all of the substantial improvements EA have brought to FIFA this year, it simply hasn't summed to a better experience than what we had with FIFA 13. That isn't said to praise FIFA 13's balance - to the contrary, the balance has been poor since at least FIFA 09 - but to highlight my feelings that the quality of the balance right now is severely below poor.
http://news.futhead.com/posts/xaors-cave/26000-xaors-cave-lets-talk-balance-part-1
He summed it all up perfectly.
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Post by danyjr Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:04 am

Fantastic write up.

PS: I actually know the person who's written that article, we used to be FIFA buddies. Proud
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