Football Leagues TV Money

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by animal.crackers on Mon May 14, 2012 9:41 pm

Financially smart and Spain don't go together.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by izzy on Mon May 14, 2012 9:41 pm

Idrisozet wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:Not embarrassing.

SHOCKING.

I would say shocking and embarrassing.

I have always wonder why no any other team in La-Liga can challenge this 2 fat chickens...

and of course if other team are given more money, they will be able to challenge them and that means more fans for them and more TV deals

@animal.crackers wrote:
BhritanniaBhlue wrote:I'm not trying to lay all the blame on Barcadrid...I mean I've seen statistics that say upwards of 50% (as high as 65% IIRC) of the country support either one or the other....That totally sucks from Barca/Madrids POV, they command 65% of the fans (just in their own country) yet are being told to sacrifice revenue for 20+ clubs who command less than 35% of the fans?
That shouldn't mean shit.

It is a league. A union, an alliance, an assosciation. Whatever you want to call it. They should ALL be equal in each other's eyes because they are NOTHING without EACH other. If not, Real Madrid should start training for 38 Clasicos a year.

If Barcelona and Real Madrid have more fans in that country, then go and let them sell shirts and merchandise, and tickets.

As for as THIS revenue, it should be relatively equal. For whoever, and whomever.

Every club deserves an "equal" chance to better their club. No matter what. No matter how big. No matter how small.

This problem will fester until it is resolved, and La Liga will suffer for this.

See what I mean. Talking on matters they no nothing about.
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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by izzy on Mon May 14, 2012 9:43 pm

@animal.crackers wrote:Financially smart and Spain don't go together.

If you understood my post you would see it's a three way problem and not your usual, 'HERP DERP, BARCA MADRID GREEDY'.
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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by animal.crackers on Mon May 14, 2012 9:44 pm

@izzy wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:Financially smart and Spain don't go together.
If you understood my post you would see it's a three way problem and not your usual, 'HERP DERP, BARCA MADRID GREEDY'.
Shocked Holy shit.

Seems as if you're the one that didn't understand my post. Laughing

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by izzy on Mon May 14, 2012 9:46 pm

@animal.crackers wrote:
@izzy wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:Financially smart and Spain don't go together.
If you understood my post you would see it's a three way problem and not your usual, 'HERP DERP, BARCA MADRID GREEDY'.
Shocked Holy shit.

Seems as if you're the one that didn't understand my post. Laughing

This isn't just a Spanish problem as even in the EPL it has been discussed with the idea of seperate TV deals and foreign ownership. Look at Portsmouth.
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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by animal.crackers on Mon May 14, 2012 9:48 pm

@izzy wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:
BhritanniaBhlue wrote:I'm not trying to lay all the blame on Barcadrid...I mean I've seen statistics that say upwards of 50% (as high as 65% IIRC) of the country support either one or the other....That totally sucks from Barca/Madrids POV, they command 65% of the fans (just in their own country) yet are being told to sacrifice revenue for 20+ clubs who command less than 35% of the fans?
That shouldn't mean shit.

It is a league. A union, an alliance, an assosciation. Whatever you want to call it. They should ALL be equal in each other's eyes because they are NOTHING without EACH other. If not, Real Madrid should start training for 38 Clasicos a year.

If Barcelona and Real Madrid have more fans in that country, then go and let them sell shirts and merchandise, and tickets.

As for as THIS revenue, it should be relatively equal. For whoever, and whomever.

Every club deserves an "equal" chance to better their club. No matter what. No matter how big. No matter how small.

This problem will fester until it is resolved, and La Liga will suffer for this.
See what I mean. Talking on matters they no nothing about.
You're like trying to shoot fish in a barrel. You shoot but you never hit shit.

"Talking on matters they no nothing about."
PING! again.

Now tell me what I said that shows I don't know what I'm talking about Laughing. Don't they teach children these days to be specific when confronting people?

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by izzy on Mon May 14, 2012 9:53 pm

@animal.crackers wrote:You're like trying to shoot fish in a barrel. You shoot but you never hit shit.

"Talking on matters they no nothing about."
PING! again.

Now tell me what I said that shows I don't know what I'm talking about Laughing. Don't they teach children these days to be specific when confronting people?

Simple really. It's not a collective deal. It's a spereate TV deal. But I'm assuming you didn't read the reason why Spanish are clubs are actually in this current state?

The TV deal won't change the situation unless the other teams and the LFP change. They could be given 40mil each year and STILL be in the position they're in now so the preaching about, 'THE EQUAL TV DEAL WILL SAVE LA LIGA' is rubbish.
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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Swanhends on Mon May 14, 2012 9:58 pm

@animal.crackers wrote:
BhritanniaBhlue wrote:...But its certainly better than La Liga's - La Liga is so far behind in this regard its almost embarrassing
Not embarrassing.

SHOCKING.

Chill...La Liga's TV deal is "unfair", but its really not any more "unfair" than an obscenely rich owner buying one club and spending hundreds of millions from his own pocket on them

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by animal.crackers on Mon May 14, 2012 10:00 pm

@izzy wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:You're like trying to shoot fish in a barrel. You shoot but you never hit shit.

"Talking on matters they no nothing about."
PING! again.

Now tell me what I said that shows I don't know what I'm talking about Laughing. Don't they teach children these days to be specific when confronting people?
Simple really. It's not a collective deal. It's a spereate TV deal. But I'm assuming you didn't read the reason why Spanish are clubs are actually in this current state?

The TV deal won't change the situation unless the other teams and the LFP change. They could be given 40mil each year and STILL be in the position they're in now so the preaching about, 'THE EQUAL TV DEAL WILL SAVE LA LIGA' is rubbish.
Yes, yes, I know all of this.

So tell me again where my "mistake" was?

'THE EQUAL TV DEAL WILL SAVE LA LIGA' is rubbish.
La Liga will never need saving ... after all , it's only about Barcelona and Madrid Wink.

I mean , really .... who gives a shit about Sevilla or Getafe Wink?

Sevilla could do nothing with 40 mil more a year .....

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by animal.crackers on Mon May 14, 2012 10:01 pm

BhritanniaBhlue wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:
BhritanniaBhlue wrote:...But its certainly better than La Liga's - La Liga is so far behind in this regard its almost embarrassing
Not embarrassing.

SHOCKING.
Chill...La Liga's TV deal is "unfair", but its really not any more "unfair" than an obscenely rich owner buying one club and spending hundreds of millions from his own pocket on them
You consider an owner spending his OWN money into his OWN BUSINESS "unfair" because he happens to have a lot?

Holy shit, I need a smoke.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by The Messiah on Mon May 14, 2012 10:02 pm

@izzy wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:You're like trying to shoot fish in a barrel. You shoot but you never hit shit.

"Talking on matters they no nothing about."
PING! again.

Now tell me what I said that shows I don't know what I'm talking about Laughing. Don't they teach children these days to be specific when confronting people?

Simple really. It's not a collective deal. It's a spereate TV deal. But I'm assuming you didn't read the reason why Spanish are clubs are actually in this current state?

The TV deal won't change the situation unless the other teams and the LFP change. They could be given 40mil each year and STILL be in the position they're in now so the preaching about, 'THE EQUAL TV DEAL WILL SAVE LA LIGA' is rubbish.

How are you sure about that, let's put it to test.

Only if Madrid and Barca weren't that greedy, then maybe those president of those club wouldn't need to buy big out of their resources, because they will have the TV money to cover for it.


Why don't they just forget about La-Liga F.A and let individual clubs run the league.

I am sure Bayern, United, etc would all love to have their own separate TV deals.


FFP should also look at this, because it's unfair for other foreign clubs playing in cpl.

if we make our tv deals, perhaps we would be able to spend much more in transfer market, without having to go under FFP radar.

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GOLD.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Swanhends on Mon May 14, 2012 10:11 pm

@animal.crackers wrote:
BhritanniaBhlue wrote:
@animal.crackers wrote:
BhritanniaBhlue wrote:...But its certainly better than La Liga's - La Liga is so far behind in this regard its almost embarrassing
Not embarrassing.

SHOCKING.
Chill...La Liga's TV deal is "unfair", but its really not any more "unfair" than an obscenely rich owner buying one club and spending hundreds of millions from his own pocket on them
You consider an owner spending his OWN money into his OWN BUSINESS "unfair" because he happens to have a lot?

Holy shit, I need a smoke.

You consider a team earning its OWN tv deal that it negotiated ON ITS OWN to be "unfair" just because they happen to be strong brands?

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by animal.crackers on Mon May 14, 2012 10:15 pm

Who said Barcelona and Madrid were greedy?

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by rwo power on Tue May 15, 2012 2:14 am

BhritanniaBhlue wrote:You consider a team earning its OWN tv deal that it negotiated ON ITS OWN to be "unfair" just because they happen to be strong brands?
Well, considering that this leads to worse exposure of the other clubs in the same league, them having much fewer money and then taking up unreasonable debts to buy players in the attempt to stay at least a little competitive and then possibly going bust as they a bankrupt or in the case that they don't buy going down in the second league for not being competitive enough, this makes the league itself more and more unattractive aside of the big two. If you look at the audience numbers, you can see, that only the matches of Barcelona and Real really sell out, while the average audience of the other teams is very pityful.

Moreover, even though Real and Barca (and so far the other clubs) still get protection from the government and banks (they are allowed not to pay back tax debt until 2020), the current Spanish economy is so problematic, that there is pressure from other European governments that Spain should reclaim the tax debt ASAP or the country might not get the full extent of the financial help from Europe.

So far the Spanish government tries to protect the football clubs as they are a flagship of Spanish sport, but the question is if they are not maybe sacrificed if things get really ugly due to the continually worsening state debt.

As things stand, especially the smaller clubs would likely collapse within very short time if they'd be forced to repay their tax debts. (There was a very interesting documentary on the Spanish state debt and the problems in with the Spanish football might run due to that recently on TV that analyzed that situation - and I can tell you, the outlook is pretty dire.)

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Blue Barrett on Tue May 15, 2012 2:22 am

LOL you know what's funny? When Roman bought Chelsea and spent a bucket load and we were winning the league, City fans were among those saying we were "buying titles". I remember it like its yesterday LOL. I remember City fans fuming hilariously after we bought SWP. Laughing

Its just funny to see City fans doing the "defending" now. Laughing

Crazy little world, innit?

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Swanhends on Tue May 15, 2012 10:03 am

@rwo power wrote:
BhritanniaBhlue wrote:You consider a team earning its OWN tv deal that it negotiated ON ITS OWN to be "unfair" just because they happen to be strong brands?
Well, considering that this leads to worse exposure of the other clubs in the same league, them having much fewer money and then taking up unreasonable debts to buy players in the attempt to stay at least a little competitive and then possibly going bust as they a bankrupt or in the case that they don't buy going down in the second league for not being competitive enough, this makes the league itself more and more unattractive aside of the big two. If you look at the audience numbers, you can see, that only the matches of Barcelona and Real really sell out, while the average audience of the other teams is very pityful.

Moreover, even though Real and Barca (and so far the other clubs) still get protection from the government and banks (they are allowed not to pay back tax debt until 2020), the current Spanish economy is so problematic, that there is pressure from other European governments that Spain should reclaim the tax debt ASAP or the country might not get the full extent of the financial help from Europe.

So far the Spanish government tries to protect the football clubs as they are a flagship of Spanish sport, but the question is if they are not maybe sacrificed if things get really ugly due to the continually worsening state debt.

As things stand, especially the smaller clubs would likely collapse within very short time if they'd be forced to repay their tax debts. (There was a very interesting documentary on the Spanish state debt and the problems in with the Spanish football might run due to that recently on TV that analyzed that situation - and I can tell you, the outlook is pretty dire.)

I was saying that sarcastically to prove a point Very Happy

Check my earlier posts in the thread, I'm clearly not a fan of La Ligas current TV revenue deal

I just thought it was stupid that animalcrackers was acting like the TV deal was an affront to football.....while la liga's tv deal is bad, its not anymore unfair to the rest of the league than it is/was for a multi-billionaire to buy Man City and spend billions from his own pocket on them...

How fair was it for Wigan that suddenly one club was bought by an obscenely rich guy and had a seemingly endless supply of billions to spend? Answer: No more fair than it is for Levante to have a TV deal that makes 1/10th the amount of money that Barcadrids make, surely...Just look at your quote, for example:

rwo wrote:Well, considering that this leads to worse exposure of the other clubs in the same league, them having much fewer money and then taking up unreasonable debts to buy players in the attempt to stay at least a little competitive and then possibly going bust

All of those things are true. But you could just as easily be talking about Man City's takeover as La Liga's TV revenue deal, which is why I think animalcrackers was coming off as a bit hypocritical with how zealous he was being in regards to La Ligas TV deal (calling it shocking and what not)

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Doc on Tue May 15, 2012 10:22 am

How does one make 48 million Euros (Everton) and still be broke? Same question applies to Aston Villa as well.

Also, a better collective deal would help La Liga in general only if the majority of the clubs' presidents/chairmen knew how to utilise it. Sadly, I don't see that happening any time. The funny thing about that collective deal is that it needs both Real Madrid and Barcelona to spear head it.


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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by rwo power on Tue May 15, 2012 10:23 am

@bhends

Well, as you might imagine (I'm a Bundesliga afficionado after all), I'm no fan in general of artificially skewed finances, be it via sugar daddies or the La Liga TV deal. If you look at the BL, it shows that here even a club that was almost bankrupt (Dortmund in 2005) can return to winning ways within a few years via healthy housekeeping and a strategic longterm plan built on youngsters and good scouting plus a passionate coach and patient management. I think it is a bit saddening to see that there are clubs that try to buy such successes by short-term infusions of lots of money.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Swanhends on Tue May 15, 2012 10:24 am

@Doc wrote:How does one make 48 million Euros (Everton) and still be broke? Same question applies to Aston Villa as well.

Also, a better collective deal would help La Liga in general only if the majority of the clubs' presidents/chairmen knew how to utilise it. Sadly, I don't see that happening any time. The funny thing about that collective deal is that it needs both Real Madrid and Barcelona to spear head it.


Are everton and villa broke?

I know they obviously don't have any money for transfers, but I just thought that was because they had shit owners who took and all the money the clubs made instead of re-investing it

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by S on Tue May 15, 2012 10:27 am

BhrittaniaBhlue wrote:Inb4 someone mentions Serie A....Serie A's deal isn't perfect either

Serie A TV deal is being evenly distributed from this season onwards based on the league standings.

top Italian clubs would suffer as this is there main source of revenue.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Doc on Tue May 15, 2012 10:27 am

Broke as in lack of transfer funds and not broke as in HM Revenue & Customs coming to seize assets sort of stuff.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Swanhends on Tue May 15, 2012 10:30 am

Surag wrote:
BhrittaniaBhlue wrote:Inb4 someone mentions Serie A....Serie A's deal isn't perfect either

Serie A TV deal is being evenly distributed from this season onwards based on the league standings.

top Italian clubs would suffer as this is there main source of revenue.

Source? I thought they just signed a deal in like June 2011? And I definitely remember that deal was 80% of the total TV revenue to be split among the big 5 clubs, with the remaining 20% to be split among the rest....not exactly fair either

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Adit on Tue May 15, 2012 10:31 am

Surag wrote:
BhrittaniaBhlue wrote:Inb4 someone mentions Serie A....Serie A's deal isn't perfect either

Serie A TV deal is being evenly distributed from this season onwards based on the league standings.

top Italian clubs would suffer as this is there main source of revenue.

serie A deal isnt actually a collective deal.

its 30 : 30 : 40

40 collectively

30 Live matches

30% --on a mysterious "best supported clubs" tag.. which only serie A federation know how to define it Laughing

its only a partial collective deal.


Last edited by Adit on Tue May 15, 2012 10:43 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by rwo power on Tue May 15, 2012 10:38 am

So it looks as if the German deal is the second fairest after England. Here the money is split mainly according to league position, but the last club still gets half the money of the first club.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by Adit on Tue May 15, 2012 10:40 am

@rwo power wrote:So it looks as if the German deal is the second fairest after England. Here the money is split mainly according to league position, but the last club still gets half the money of the first club.

Yes.

Only England,Budi and French league has an actual collective deal.

Serie A deal in effect is actually more similar to that of La liga deal than a collective deal as shown by their TV revenue of each club.

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Re: Football Leagues TV Money

Post by S on Tue May 15, 2012 10:42 am

I read it on Swiss Ramble a few weeks ago actually..Top Clubs would receive much lesser TV revenue than what they used to but it would still slightly favor them.Not so much parity as compared to Bundesliga and PL though.

Years of protest at this lack of a level playing field finally led to a new collective agreement being implemented at the beginning of the 2010/11 season. There is a complicated distribution formula, which still favours the bigger clubs, though the result is a clear reduction at the top end. Under the new regulations, 40% will be divided equally among the Serie A clubs; 30% is based on past results (5% last season, 15% last 5 years, 10% from 1946 to the sixth season before last); and 30% is based on the population of the club’s city (5%) and the number of fans (25%).

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