World Cup: Group B discussion

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Forza on Thu May 29, 2014 5:09 am

@Tomwin Lannister wrote:
@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:De Jong is average.... Kuyt is past it as is Huntelaar and Sneijder... Also take it from me Krul is crap lol.

RVP and Robben i grant you but that's not enough.


GTFO

Milan fans have told me in unison he is the best DM in the world
Not the best in the world, but he's been a shining light in an otherwise miserable season.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by M99 on Thu May 29, 2014 6:33 am

@Tomwin Lannister wrote:
@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:De Jong is average.... Kuyt is past it as is Huntelaar and Sneijder... Also take it from me Krul is crap lol.

RVP and Robben i grant you but that's not enough.


GTFO

Milan fans have told me in unison he is the best DM in the world


Great Hater Sprucenuce is doing what he does best. De Jong is as average as Modric and Diego Costa.

Netherlands had a near perfect record in qualifying (only one draw in a match that they played after they were confirmed first) and have two world class players in Robben and Van Persie who both have proven that they can carry a team by themselves. De Jong is a very good DM but they are lacking in a good CM after Strootman got ruled out, That defence is quite scrubbish but 2010 defence was not all that good either. I think a lot of their hopes depend on Van Gaal, he is a fantastic manager and can stave of Chilie and maybe even Spain with the right tactics. Expect them to smash Australia, they will use that match to pad goal difference stats.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Footyfan on Fri May 30, 2014 5:46 am

Hunter past it? He was amazing for Schalke this season and carried the team when he played after returning from injury. Was at his absolute best.

Huntelaar is one of the best Penalty Box Strikers I have seen in the last 20 years. He can anybody in Pure Goal-Scoring ability.

Sneijder looks re-energized though I don't expect him to be at his best ever again but he might give a few amazing moments.

RVP is a p***Y for Oranje and I have no expectations.

Robben is Oranje's Best player and a Super Legend.
De Jong is still a fanatastic defensive player but he does contribute much offensively. Lens is reasonable good.

PV from Augsberg is a solid mediocre RB.

Vlaar is the leader of Defense, another mediocre player.
De Guzman, if selected is a solid player.

Kuyt is well past it and should not make it to the WC 23. Even if he does I don't see him getting any minutes

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Footyfan on Fri May 30, 2014 5:58 am

For the Younger Guys -

Janmaat - Fantastic in offense, very average in defense, has potential and is overall a decent footballer
Veltman - Serene player who sometimes reminds me of Vertonghen but did commit errors once in a while and IMO can be  a good defender but is too much of a rookie
De Vrij - Has improved considerably from being a soft guy earlier. Curbed out his mistakes and will most probably start with Vlaar in a 3 Man Backline
BMI - Biggest Dutch CB Talent around. IMO he can become a WC Defender
Rekik/Kongolo - Promising rookies
PVA - Chelsea Reject/Loanee who has speed and good attacking ability. The 5-3-2 is the ideal formation to get the best out of 2 Aggressive Wing-Back's.

Blind - Ajax Player of the year and good DM who can play LB.
Clasie - Called the Dutch "Xavi". This guys tires after 60 minutes but will be producing some magic in it. Don't be surprised if for 30-40 minutes he plays Xaviesta out of the group. The little magician can do great stuff

Depay - Huge Dutch Talent and possibly next Big Winger since Robben. Massive talent and will be World Class in 1-2 years.

Promes - Potentially really good RW.

I think overall a lot of great talents are present. If developed well this team can form a golden generation with the younger players. I am very excited about the talents.

Line-up

Cillesen
De Vrij Vlaar BMI
Janmaat De Jong Blind/Clasie PVA(Kongolo)
Sneijder
RVP Robben

Will be disappointed to see Depay miss out. I hope we play a front 3 and drop 1 mid-fielder if required. The 3 Man Back-Line will protect the defense especially with 2 Wing-backs who are average defensively and can attack.

The formation was changed to lend balance as there is Great Amazing Box to Box player like Strootman

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Footyfan on Fri May 30, 2014 5:59 am

BTW I am expecting Spain and Chile to go through and Oranje to get eliminated.

This is the weakest Dutch team ever but there are a lot of promising youngsters who can take the WC by storm.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by vivabarca38 on Sat May 31, 2014 1:04 am

Egypt Raping Chile in Chile LoL.
2-0 in 15 mins.
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Ganso on Sat May 31, 2014 1:09 am

WTF,Chile,I've been hyping them non-stop and that's what I fcking get :facepalm:
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Tomwin Lannister on Sat May 31, 2014 1:13 am

Lol pre-WC friendlies are what they are.

Juve look like surefire relegation candidates days before the season starts every season in pre-season friendlies. They're similarly useless.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by rwo power on Sat May 31, 2014 8:59 am

Hm. I just saw the full time results - looks like Chile got back at Egypt and won 3:2.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Casciavit on Sat May 31, 2014 9:02 am

Why do the hipsters hype Chile?

Is it because of Jorge Sampaoli?

Netherlands and Spain to go through :coffee:

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by futbol on Sat May 31, 2014 11:36 am

Final 23:



Torres. Proud

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Madvillain on Sat May 31, 2014 12:25 pm

@Footyfan wrote:For the Younger Guys -

Janmaat - Fantastic in offense, very average in defense, has potential and is overall a decent footballer
Veltman - Serene player who sometimes reminds me of Vertonghen but did commit errors once in a while and IMO can be  a good defender but is too much of a rookie
De Vrij - Has improved considerably from being a soft guy earlier. Curbed out his mistakes and will most probably start with Vlaar in a 3 Man Backline
BMI - Biggest Dutch CB Talent around. IMO he can become a WC Defender
Rekik/Kongolo - Promising rookies
PVA - Chelsea Reject/Loanee who has speed and good attacking ability. The 5-3-2 is the ideal formation to get the best out of 2 Aggressive Wing-Back's.

Blind - Ajax Player of the year and good DM who can play LB.
Clasie - Called the Dutch "Xavi". This guys tires after 60 minutes but will be producing some magic in it. Don't be surprised if for 30-40 minutes he plays Xaviesta out of the group. The little magician can do great stuff

Depay - Huge Dutch Talent and possibly next Big Winger since Robben. Massive talent and will be World Class in 1-2 years.

Promes - Potentially really good RW.

I think overall a lot of great talents are present. If developed well this team can form a golden generation with the younger players. I am very excited about the talents.

Line-up

Cillesen
De Vrij Vlaar BMI
Janmaat De Jong Blind/Clasie PVA(Kongolo)
Sneijder
RVP Robben

Will be disappointed to see Depay miss out. I hope we play a front 3 and drop 1 mid-fielder if required. The 3 Man Back-Line will protect the defense especially with 2 Wing-backs who are average defensively and can attack.

The formation was changed to lend balance as there is Great Amazing Box to Box player like Strootman


Clasie as the new Xavi is lol-worthy tbh, he really doesn't have that skill, ability to read the game and control the pace. He's somewhat overrated and a decent talent. I also disagree about BMI being the biggest talent. He's a defender who relies too much on his fysique and will be found out when he plays against top class attackers. He's a poor mans Sergio Ramos. Veltman has the most potential imo.

Anyway, these are the guys that will have to do it for us:

Selectie Oranje voor het WK 2014

Doel
Jasper Cillessen (Ajax)
Michel Vorm (Swansea City)
Tim Krul (Newcastle United)

Verdediging
Paul Verhaegh (FC Augsburg)
Daryl Janmaat (Feyenoord)
Joël Veltman (Ajax)
Stefan de Vrij (Feyenoord)
Ron Vlaar (Aston Villa)
Bruno Martins Indi (Feyenoord)
Terence Kongolo (Feyenoord)

Middenveld
Leroy Fer (Norwich City)
Nigel de Jong (AC Milan)
Jordy Clasie (Feyenoord)
Jonathan de Guzman (Swansea City)
Georginio Wijnaldum (PSV)
Wesley Sneijder (Galatasaray)

Aanval

Arjen Robben (Bayern München)
Robin van Persie (Manchester United)
Klaas-Jan Huntelaar (Schalke 04)
Dirk Kuyt (Fenerbahçe)
Jeremain Lens (Dynamo Kiev)
Memphis Depay (PSV)

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Art Morte on Sat May 31, 2014 1:13 pm

MadVillain, what's the atmosphere and expectations in the Netherlands regarding this World Cup?
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by BusterLfc on Sat May 31, 2014 1:41 pm

Who will be Netherlands' first choice GK?
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by rwo power on Sat May 31, 2014 2:17 pm


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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Madvillain on Sat May 31, 2014 2:51 pm

@Art Morte wrote:MadVillain, what's the atmosphere and expectations in the Netherlands regarding this World Cup?


Depends who you ask really; some are more hopeful than others. Most pundits aren't expecting much from our squad this WC. I agree with them (which is also apparent when you look at my posts about Oranje). Our midfield would've been a lot better with Strootman in it and our defense simply lacks experience. They (defence) have the potential to be decent to good (and some might even be world class some day) but this WC is just too early for them. Van Gaal knows this and tries to help them out by adding another CB. Could be a masterstroke if he gets them to gel well and motivates them accordingly. I'm just afraid that there is too little time.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Art Morte on Sat May 31, 2014 5:13 pm

Okay. Well, if it's true that he's going to play 5-3-2 it might suit your squad. Extra cover in defence and chance to field both Huntelaar and Van Persie up top - or would it be Robben up there? I guess it would have to be?
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Casciavit on Sat May 31, 2014 5:31 pm

Kluivert said the defensive shape is a 5-3-2 and the attacking shape is a 3-4-3 diamond.

Robben will be playing off RVP.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by The Franchise on Sat May 31, 2014 8:37 pm

So?


Janmaat---BMI---Vlaar----De Vrij-----Blind

---------------------De Jong--------------
---------Classie----------------Sniejder

---------------------Robben-------------

----------------------RVP-----------------



Seems odd but intresting to see none the less.






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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Casciavit on Sat May 31, 2014 9:49 pm

I only saw the first half, but it was enough to see the shapes.

When the goalie has the ball its a fairly standard 3-4-3. Moving the ball up the pitch its a 3-4-1-2, and when its in the opponents half its a 3-3-3-1.

When it comes to defending they retreated in a 5-2-3, Sneijder was taking up advanced positions while defending. They only moved to a 5-3-2 shape when they were firmly in there own half.

It's quite odd, but we will see how it does in the World Cup.
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by The Franchise on Sat May 31, 2014 11:06 pm

Yeah, just watching it myself now. Basically how you put it, I like it tbh.

Every team now is trying to pressure in a 442 type formation, this 3 man backline with De Jong (with the help of De Guzman) will make it alot easier to pass out from the back.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Casciavit on Sat May 31, 2014 11:39 pm

Van Gaal played a similar style in the 90's with Ajax to combat the 4-4-2, no? Biggest difference now is that he's using wingbacks. Back then, he used wingers like Overmars and tasked the CMs to mark the oppositions wingers instead.

Speaking of Wingbacks, was really impressed by Blind tbh. Fantastic distributor, can see why De Boer moved him to CM.  

Yeah, having 5 players drop deep to build from the back was helpful. But there was way too much space between 5 and the other players. Ghana intercepted the ball quite a few times due to that.


Last edited by Casciavit on Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by M99 on Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:14 am

@Casciavit wrote:Van Gaal played a similar style in the 90's with Ajax to combat the 4-4-2, no? Biggest difference now is that he's using wingbacks. Back then, he used wingers like Overmars and tasked the CMs to mark the oppositions wingers instead.

Speaking of Wingbacks, was really impressed by Blind tbh. Fantastic distributor, can see why De Boer moved him to CM.

Yeah, having 5 players drop deep to build from the back was helpful. But there was way too much space between 5 and the other players. Nigeria intercepted the ball quite a few times due to that.


Reported for racism.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by rwo power on Sun Jun 01, 2014 11:41 am

@M99 wrote:
@Casciavit wrote:Nigeria intercepted the ball quite a few times due to that.
Reported for racism.
Nah, not racism. Just beginning loss of short-time memory.

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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by The Franchise on Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:16 pm

@Casciavit wrote:Van Gaal played a similar style in the 90's with Ajax to combat the 4-4-2, no? Biggest difference now is that he's using wingbacks. Back then, he used wingers like Overmars and tasked the CMs to mark the oppositions wingers instead.

Speaking of Wingbacks, was really impressed by Blind tbh. Fantastic distributor, can see why De Boer moved him to CM.

Yeah, having 5 players drop deep to build from the back was helpful. But there was way too much space between 5 and the other players. Nigeria intercepted the ball quite a few times due to that.


In 95' (the kids who beat Milan) it was exactly as you said, Davids and De Boer being the cm's who had the ability to do that. That is what has been tradionally great about Dutch players, especially at Ajax, in the acadamies they have to be able to play multiple roles and this gives the kids a truly complete game.

This was the line up vs Milan



100% agree on Blind, said on the Barca section. He is really impressive, two footed, tough, can run, good on the ball, can defend and can cross. Robben missed a sitter from his wonderful cross as you probably saw.

Agree about the space between the 5 and the rest, felt like Snijeder was a little inconsistent coming towards the ball, sometimes RVP came all the way back. Though gotta credit Ghana for being so good defensively, they cover ground very well.
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Re: World Cup: Group B discussion

Post by Casciavit on Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:50 pm

@rwo power wrote:
@M99 wrote:
@Casciavit wrote:Nigeria intercepted the ball quite a few times due to that.
Reported for racism.
Nah, not racism. Just beginning loss of short-time memory.


Looool rofl

*Ghana

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