Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by Donuts on Mon Aug 04, 2014 6:27 am

Verrati
Koke
Pogba
Pjanic
Kroos

pre-injury i would put Gundogan first but he's been gone for far too long.

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by The Franchise on Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:01 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:What makes you say you would rather have Pjanic and Koke than Rakitic?

Pjanic because I see alot of potential and think he is a real midfielder. He has and might still play CAM, but it hasnt corrupted him and retains the movements of a midfielder. Someone who plays for others. Simply, I think he is at least as good as Rakitic (maybe better) and is still just 24 years old with a wealth of experience.

Koke I dont like more as a player than Rakitic, but at just 22 years old and with his ability in transitions and as a presser (something you will struggle to teach anyone) thats something very intresting. Dont think he is as great with the ball as some may think but if we signed him at just 22 and with that much room to learn to go along with his already established abilities. Thats a player you can theoretically have for a decade.



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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by messixaviesta on Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:55 pm

@danyjr wrote:For me it would be in this order:

Verratti
Pogba
Gündoğan
Koke
Pjanić
Kroos

I'm a huge fan of Verratti and I think he would do well at Barcelona once Xavi leaves/retires. His technique and agility is far superior to that of Gündoğan/Koke who are often hailed as Xavi-esque players. Pogba is also a fantastic player but I prefer Verratti slightly deeper than Pogba.

I also like Verratti a lot.

Gundogan I liked a lot at his best but after such a long injury layoff I really cannot say.

Why do you rate Kroos so low?


Last edited by messixaviesta on Tue Aug 12, 2014 8:04 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by messixaviesta on Tue Aug 12, 2014 8:02 pm

@The Franchise wrote:
@messixaviesta wrote:Irrespective of price which players would you all have liked to purchase instead of Rakitic - Pjanic, Pogba, Gundogan, Verratti, Kroos, Koke, etc. or is he the best fit for us ?


Try any of the above. And thats nothing against Rakitic who I indeed do rate.


I also think all are good options. I may have gone after Verratti first of all. Anyone else you can add to that list that I missed? Kroos I like more now than I used to but he is in the enemy camp now.

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by danyjr on Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:35 pm

@messixaviesta wrote:Why do you rate Kroos so low?

It is not that I don't rate him mate. He is one of those passers that doesn't need more than a second to see a pass and deliver it with pin point accuracy. He also has an outstanding goalscoring record for a midfielder, in fact more than Barcelona's midfield combined.

But for me he lacks the profile to play in your midfield. Where exactly would he play? Is he to replace Busquets, for whom he lacks defensive capabilities. Is he to replace Xavi, for whom he lacks the control and composure the veteran offers. Is he to replace Iniesta, for whom he lacks the technique and dribbling.

What I'm trying to say is that while he has certain abilities which are eye candy to anyone, he lacks in other categories which are, in my opinion, vital to Barcelona's style of play. Despite his superior passing, I've seen him choke under pressure more often than not. As a CAM, or a CM for a counter attacking team, I'd take him any day. But I wouldn't sign him for Barcelona, and I wouldn't have signed Rakitić either, as much as I like him.

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by The Franchise on Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:28 pm

@messixaviesta wrote:
@The Franchise wrote:
@messixaviesta wrote:Irrespective of price which players would you all have liked to purchase instead of Rakitic - Pjanic, Pogba, Gundogan, Verratti, Kroos, Koke, etc. or is he the best fit for us ?


Try any of the above. And thats nothing against Rakitic who I indeed do rate.


I also think all are good options. I may have gone after Verratti first of all. Anyone else you can add to that list that I missed? Kroos I like more now than I used to but he is in the enemy camp now.

Well some of those names have some "fit" issues. I agree with danyjr assessment of Kroos and the possible problems with him fitting in. For the record, I think he could play with Iniesta and Busquets.

Anyway, while not perfect fits I would add guys like; Vidal and Ramsey.

If you asked me straight with, take Yaya or Rakitic..how can I not chose Yaya?
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by LeBéninois on Wed Aug 13, 2014 5:58 am

Gundogan is a player worth the risk imo. He will be free in 2016 which mean that Dortmund could sell him next year. If he is to leave i hope it is for Barca, if not hope he stays at Dortmund.

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by windkick on Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:50 am

If they are to sell him next year, that means we can't land him. Our best bet would be to get him ala Lewa to Bayern. We make some sort of deal with him to let his contract run out and he can join us for free since his contract runs out the summer we are allowed to make transfers again. Dortmund get to keep him a year longer but get nothing for his transfer. More than likely Manure or some other team snatches up next summer while we have our ban

Or he never regains form, who knows

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by messixaviesta on Fri Aug 15, 2014 8:14 pm

@danyjr wrote:
@messixaviesta wrote:Why do you rate Kroos so low?

It is not that I don't rate him mate. He is one of those passers that doesn't need more than a second to see a pass and deliver it with pin point accuracy. He also has an outstanding goalscoring record for a midfielder, in fact more than Barcelona's midfield combined.

But for me he lacks the profile to play in your midfield. Where exactly would he play? Is he to replace Busquets, for whom he lacks defensive capabilities. Is he to replace Xavi, for whom he lacks the control and composure the veteran offers. Is he to replace Iniesta, for whom he lacks the technique and dribbling.

What I'm trying to say is that while he has certain abilities which are eye candy to anyone, he lacks in other categories which are, in my opinion, vital to Barcelona's style of play. Despite his superior passing, I've seen him choke under pressure more often than not. As a CAM, or a CM for a counter attacking team, I'd take him any day. But I wouldn't sign him for Barcelona, and I wouldn't have signed Rakitić either, as much as I like him.

Great reply. Thanks.

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by messixaviesta on Fri Aug 15, 2014 8:19 pm

@The Franchise wrote:
Anyway, while not perfect fits I would add guys like; Vidal and Ramsey.

If you asked me straight with, take Yaya or Rakitic..how can I not chose Yaya?

Would you really want Busquets and Vidal together for us in a three man midfield? From being arguably the most technically gifted and aesthetically pleasing midfield ever, do you really want to convert it into a physical one? Or do you see that as the only way forward from here?


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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by The Franchise on Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:39 am

@messixaviesta wrote:
@The Franchise wrote:
Anyway, while not perfect fits I would add guys like; Vidal and Ramsey.

If you asked me straight with, take Yaya or Rakitic..how can I not chose Yaya?

Would you really want Busquets and Vidal together for us in a three man midfield? From being arguably the most technically gifted and aesthetically pleasing midfield ever, do you really want to convert it into a physical one? Or do you see that as the only way forward from here?


Would adding Vidal instead of Rakitic really take it from being overly technical to overly physical? I dont really think so.

Would I ideally choose Vidal to play with Busquets and Iniesta? No, probably not. But you add him and subtract Rakitic you can some things and you lose some things. I think we would gain more overall.

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:46 am

I would not go anywhere close to Vidal until we see how he recovers from his injury. He has not played good football in over 8 months.

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by messixaviesta on Sun Aug 17, 2014 9:06 am

@The Franchise wrote:
@messixaviesta wrote:
@The Franchise wrote:
Anyway, while not perfect fits I would add guys like; Vidal and Ramsey.

If you asked me straight with, take Yaya or Rakitic..how can I not chose Yaya?

Would you really want Busquets and Vidal together for us in a three man midfield? From being arguably the most technically gifted and aesthetically pleasing midfield ever, do you really want to convert it into a physical one? Or do you see that as the only way forward from here?


Would adding Vidal instead of Rakitic really take it from being overly technical to overly physical? I dont really think so.

Would I ideally choose Vidal to play with Busquets and Iniesta? No, probably not. But you add him and subtract Rakitic you can some things and you lose some things. I think we would gain more overall.



Thanks dani. That does make sense but perhaps we should have looked for a more technical player who could play deep. Gundogan before his injury may have been ideal. Verratti is the other name I would strongly consider. Then again from a less of a purist point of view adding some more physicality to our midfield wouldn't hurt.


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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by BarcaKizz on Wed Aug 20, 2014 11:27 am

:bow: A player who runs. Outside Alves, when was the last time we had an "athlete" in our team...
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by billy_gr on Wed Aug 20, 2014 12:45 pm

@BarcaKizz wrote::bow: A player who runs. Outside Alves, when was the last time we had an "athlete" in our team...


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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by BarcaKizz on Wed Aug 20, 2014 1:49 pm

@billy_gr wrote:
@BarcaKizz wrote::bow: A player who runs. Outside Alves, when was the last time we had an "athlete" in our team...


Sanchez


Good point, though unfortunately without collective pressing his incredible work rate was wasted. Also midfield running is much more important, so its nice to have Rakitic.
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by CBarca on Wed Aug 20, 2014 6:08 pm

@BarcaKizz wrote:
@billy_gr wrote:
@BarcaKizz wrote::bow: A player who runs. Outside Alves, when was the last time we had an "athlete" in our team...


Sanchez


Good point, though unfortunately without collective pressing his incredible work rate was wasted. Also midfield running is much more important, so its nice to have Rakitic.


Agreed, which-going back to that earlier talk about Vidal-is why Vidal would be a great addition to our team. Unfortunately, we can't get Vidal, but Rakitic is similar in the sense that he is an athlete and physical (and let's not forget he's simply bigger) without sacrificing TOO much technical skill.

For that reason alone I am happy with Rakitic. We will see how he does this year though. I've liked what I've seen so far.
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by The Franchise on Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:58 pm

I think Rakitic would be amazing as a "third midfielder", a change of pace player who can add something else (more goalscoring, some physicality) either as a starter or coming from the bench.

But without Xavi (we have him for now obviously) we will lack a play maker. Iniesta needs to be removed from such duties as we seen with Cesc, or it limits his game.
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by BarcaKizz on Thu Aug 21, 2014 6:11 am

Rakitic is impressing me so far with his playmaking, but I guess worth noting that Cesc would also look good against Club Leon. Its a good point with the transfer ban. We have Xavi for now, but its a while to bank on Xavi's fitness and Rakitic playing that role.

We have Samper...who is very legit, but definitely would be handy to consider a playmaker. Thiago... ;(
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by billy_gr on Thu Aug 21, 2014 7:49 am

Just for the sake of it, check Rakitic's pass on the second goal against Leon
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by The Franchise on Thu Aug 21, 2014 11:07 am

T'was an amazing pass.

But yeah, I am a believer in Samper's game and I am starting to be annoyed by how little the last 2 coaches have used the B team/La Masia.

Under Pep we used any old scrub from the B's no matter how bad, now we dont use anyone.
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by billy_gr on Thu Aug 21, 2014 12:16 pm

I have some significant expectations from Samper and Munir based on the friendlies... let's see
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by futbol on Fri Sep 05, 2014 12:30 pm

Refreshing to see a player with an engine and some physicality in the middle of the park. Doesn't have the vision of Xavi for open spaces but that shouldn't matter with a front 3 of Neymar, Messi and Suarez who are all capable of dropping and creating themselves + Iniesta. The defensive work he adds to the team will outweigh his inferior playmaking (note: "inferior" compared to Xavi, not "bad").

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by Harmonica on Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:14 pm

La Liga 13-14

Rakitic - Xavi

Assists 10 - 2
Key Passes 78 - 47
Through balls 8 - 11

Tackles 55 - 26
Interceptions 62 - 9
Clearances 29 - 15
Blocked shots 6 - 0

Rakitic is exactly what Barca needs.
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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by Donuts on Fri Sep 05, 2014 7:53 pm

I feel like we are too hung up on prime Xavi, his mobility really costed us the past season...
I constantly criticize Dani Alves for his lack of defence and still stick to that but Xavi who is the midfielder on the right side also didn't help too much to cover,
and not that Xavi didn't try just his age caught up to him
Rakitic lately has been everywhere in the pitch and quickly too which is nice.

but harmonica, the assist stat doesn't show it all

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Re: Ivan Rakitić: Croatian Maestro

Post by futbol on Fri Sep 05, 2014 8:50 pm

His defensive work is outstanding. He is everywhere indeed. His playmaking isn't as outstanding as I had hoped though. At the moment he's taking the safe sidepass to Alves on the right a tad too often.

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Maybe he'll get more comfortable with time. I have no big problem if it stays like this either as long as he contributes so much defensively. Iniesta, Messi, Nerman and Suarez should provide enough creativity.

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