Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

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Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Blue Barrett on Mon Jul 21, 2014 7:59 pm

Does anyone on here read this series? I'm about to start. Worth it? Need personal reviews if possible. Is it as good as Game of Thrones?

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by RealGunner on Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:04 pm

Think ES and Phritz are big fans of it
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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by ES on Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:04 pm

I know that Firenze and Phritz speak highly of it. The series is on my bucket list right after i finish ASOIAF hmm

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Blue Barrett on Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:18 pm

My cousin is a huge fan as well but he can be really biased when it comes to things he likes whether they're actually shit or not Laughing


Was looking for reviews from others. Should find a way to get Firenze and Phritz in here.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Firenze on Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:49 pm

Might dig up one of my old posts when I was recommending it or try to find Phritz's posts on it, too lazy to type anything too detailed out right now.

First things first, these books are HARD WORK to read, ridiculously dense, verging on pretentious at times..but if you have the patience for them, they're well worth it. Emotional roller coaster with amazing characters, battles, plot, etc. You'll have a lot of questions that won't be answered until many books later so it can be hard to keep track of everything at once.

The first book unfortunately puts a lot of people off, I quite liked it but it's not that great, it was written years before the others apparently and was originally pitched as a movie script, it can be confusing at times and like I said overall it's pretty average.

If you can make it past that and even be interested in it a little then you'll love the rest of the series which is much, much better.

Best series I've ever read but I don't read much so not sure what that's worth.  Laughing
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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by M99 on Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:51 pm

For me it is one of the best fantasy epic series ever written. The world building is on an unprecedented scale and the writing is incredibly well done. Be warned, there are 10 books in the series and all of them are huge, has an average of 1100 pages per book. There are multiple story arcs spread around all the books which intertwine throughout the series one way or the other. If you are looking for a different type of fantasy series than the usual ones then Malazan ticks that box. It is compared to A Song Of Ice And Fire and Dark Company but even those are bit of a reach. Sure it has wizards and dragons but then again it also has flying castles and a stock market. I don't think any other fantasy world has built such a world like Malazan.

There is a lot of focus on military and war throughout the series. So yeah you'll be reading a lot of climatic battles with major characters in both side of the conflict with a lot of advanced military tactics, violence, blood, gore, rape etc. Regarding the characters what I appreciated a lot was that there are not cookie cutter good guys and bad guys or a good vs evil conflict. You read about multiple characters on multiple sides of the war and all of them are morally ambiguous and often see multiple characters arcs converge, sometimes in the climatic battles which nearly all the books have. Some character deaths are as unexpected and shocking as A Song Of Ice And Fire.

If you don't have enough time then Malazan is unreadable. The series is huge which can be bit of a turn off to a lot of people. It can be challenging and confusing to read a story so many plotlines and one can easily be totally lost. Also there are too many characters and you can easily lose track of who's who and even though a lot die more new characters keep on coming. I don't mind that much but I did mind that not all of the characters arcs not seeing a proper resolution at the end and lack of developments of some of theirs plots in the end. The are still a lot of unanswered questions at the end which is due to the insane scope of the series making it impossible to conclude and explain everything.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Firenze on Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:26 pm


@M99 wrote:The are still a lot of unanswered questions at the end which is due to the insane scope of the series making it impossible to conclude and explain everything.


to be fair a lot of that stuff is being explained in his prequel trilogy atm, plus after that there will be a trilogy set after The main series with familiar characters. I thought he did a good job wrapping things up, he also had to leave a bunch of character arcs for the co-author's books (who kinda sucks lol)


Last edited by Firenze on Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Don't call me James on Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:51 pm

Shit I was looking for that post my Phritz where he recommended it. I couldn't remember the name of the series Laughing

It's definitely on my bucket list. After ASOIAF I'm definitely getting on this. Won't happen in years though Laughing

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:13 pm

I quit after book 3. I really wanted to like it, but ultimately I didn't find the characters interesting enough.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by M99 on Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:47 pm

@Firenze wrote:
@M99 wrote:The are still a lot of unanswered questions at the end which is due to the insane scope of the series making it impossible to conclude and explain everything.


to be fair a lot of that stuff is being explained in his prequel trilogy atm, plus after that there will be a trilogy set after The main series with familiar characters. I thought he did a good job wrapping things up, he also had to leave a bunch of character arcs for the co-author's books (who kinda sucks lol)


Did you read the prequel triology? How good are they?

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Firenze on Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:12 pm

@M99 wrote:
@Firenze wrote:
@M99 wrote:The are still a lot of unanswered questions at the end which is due to the insane scope of the series making it impossible to conclude and explain everything.


to be fair a lot of that stuff is being explained in his prequel trilogy atm, plus after that there will be a trilogy set after The main series with familiar characters. I thought he did a good job wrapping things up, he also had to leave a bunch of character arcs for the co-author's books (who kinda sucks lol)


Did you read the prequel triology? How good are they?


only the first book is out..came out a couple years back, the second releases in a couple of months I think..yeah they're great backstory on all the events that happened way back when anomander rake was just starting to make a new for himself, features all the great and mysterious characters. As good as the main books.
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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Blue Barrett on Tue Jul 22, 2014 12:35 am

Interesting.


Also, this Dark Company you mentioned, M99, how good is that?

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by M99 on Tue Jul 22, 2014 7:02 pm

@Blue Barrett wrote:Interesting.


Also, this Dark Company you mentioned, M99, how good is that?


Actually I got confused on the name, it is The Black Company and I only read the first book of the series which was pretty great. The book follows a mercenary unit so like Malazan it is very gritty and there is a lot of focus on military.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Rossoneri Ninja on Tue Jul 22, 2014 7:15 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:I quit after book 3. I really wanted to like it, but ultimately I didn't find the characters interesting enough.


Lol you stopped before the most epic book of the series and the debut of Karsa Orlong :bow:

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Firenze on Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:25 pm

The Black Company is the authors favorite series, never read it myself but he constantly refers to how it inspired him.

Nah, if BC didn't like the series by the end of memories of ice he was right to drop it

Dat Karsa tho
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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Rossoneri Ninja on Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:08 pm

Urugal as my witness, this is the best fantasy series i've ever read.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Bellabong on Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:02 am

This is the greatest fantasy series ever written - it's a big shame it isn't for everyone though - when one talks about a book for hardcore readers this is a prime example.

Read Gardens of the Moon or Deadhouse Gates first- I've seen multiple people recommend reading Book 2 before book 1 and it's not that bad of an idea.

Erikson's comment and "justification" on the difficulty of Gardens of the Moon and getting into the series in general in the preface of a later print of GotM;

In writing Gardens, I quickly discovered that 'back story' was going to be a problem no matter how far back I went. And I realized that, unless I spoon-fed my potential readers (something I refused to do, having railed often enough at writers of fantasy epics treating us readers as if we were idiots), unless I 'simplified', unless I slipped down into the well-worn tracks of what's gone before, I was going to leave readers floundering. And not just readers, but editors, publishers, agents...

But, you know, as a reader, as a fan, I never minded floundering – at least for a little while, and sometimes for a long while. So long as other stuff carried me along, I was fine. Don't forget, I worshipped Dennis Potter. I was a fan of DeLillo's The Names and Eco's Foucault's Pendulum. The reader I had in mind was one who could and would carry the extra weight – the questions not yet answered, the mysteries, the uncertain alliances.

History has proved this out, I think. Readers either bail on the series somewhere in the first third of Gardens of the Moon, or they're still sharing the ride to this day, seven going on eight books later.

I have been asked, would I have done it any differently in hindsight? And I honestly don't have an answer to that. Oh, there are elements of style that I'd change here and there, but ... fundamentally, I'm just not sure what else I could have done. I am not and never will be a writer happy to deliver exposition that serves no other function than telling the reader about back story, history, or whatever. If my exposition doesn't have multiple functions – and I do mean multiple – then I'm not satisfied. Turns out, the more functions in it, the more complicated it gets, the more likely it will quietly shift into misdirection, into sleight of hand, and all the back story elements, while possibly there, end up buried and buried deep.

This was fast-paced writing, but it was also, bizarrely and in ways I still can't quite figure, dense writing. So, Gardens invites you to read rip-roaringly fast. But the author advises: you'd best not succumb to the temptation.

Here we are, years later now. Should I apologize for that bipolar invitation? To what extent did I shoot myself in the foot with the kind of introduction to the Malazan world as delivered in Gardens of the Moon?. And has this novel left me dancing on one foot ever since? Maybe. And sometimes, on midnight afternoons, I ask myself: what if I'd picked up that fat wooden ladle, and slopped the whole mess down the reader's throat, as some (highly successful) Fantasy writers do and have done? Would I now see my sales ranking in the bestseller's lists? Now hold on – am I suggesting that those ultra popular Fantasy writers have found their success in writing down to their readers? Hardly. Well, not all of them. But then, consider it from my point of view. It took eight years and a move to the UK for Gardens of the Moon to find a publisher. It took four more years before a US deal was finalized. The complaint? 'Too complicated, too many characters. Too ... ambitious.'

I could take the fish-eyed retrospective angle here and say how Gardens marked a departure from the usual tropes of the genre, and any departure is likely to meet resistance; but my ego's not that big. It never felt like a departure. Glen Cook's Dread Empire and Black Company novels had already broken the new ground, but I'd read all those and, wanting more, I pretty much had to write them myself (and Cam felt the same). And while my style of writing did not permit imitation (he's a terse one, is Cook), I could certainly strive for the same tone of dispirited, wry cynicism, the same ambivalence and a similar sense of atmosphere. Maybe I was aware of the swing away from Good versus Evil, but that just seemed a by-product of growing up – the real world's not like that, why persist in making Fantasy worlds so fundamentally disconnected with reality?

Well, I don't know. It's exhausting just thinking about it.

Gardens is what it is. I have no plans on revision. I don't even know where I'd start.

Better, I think, to offer the readers a quick decision on this series – right there in the first third of the first novel, than to tease them on for five or six books before they turn away in disgust, disinterest or whatever. Maybe, from a marketing position, the latter is preferred – at least in the short term. But, thank God, my publishers know a false economy when they see one.

Gardens of the Moon is an invitation, then. Stay with it, and come along for the ride. I can only promise that I have done my best to entertain. Curses and cheers, laughter and tears, it's all in here.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Dante on Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:38 pm

I am planning on reading Malazan Book of the Fallen as well. However , i will read other series between Asoiaf and this. I worried that if i delved into it straight away after Asoiaf i wouldn't appreciate it as i should , getting from one huge world to another can be quite a task and i know Malazan is a titanic read . It's epic fantasy of course , so worlds are always going to be huge , but Malazan from what i read is monstrous in it's world building , so i just have to create a bridge between these books.

Books i plan to read , the first one in the list i am currently reading , it's the debut from a new author in the genre :

The Emperor's Blades , by Brian Staveley , trilogy only the first is out
The Broken Empire , by Mark Lawrence , trilogy completed
The Red Queen's War , by Mark Lawrence * , trilogy only the first is out

*(set into the same world as the Broken Empire , don't know if it's a continuation of the same story tho)

I will read the Malazan Book of the Fallen after i finish The Winds of Winter whilst waiting for ADOS , or so i hope. If i would finish all of the above and Winds still isn't out by then .. i will probably begin the Malazan books , i already made an effort to save me these books for a better time , won't wait forever.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Bellabong on Fri Nov 07, 2014 6:22 pm

What gets me is that Erikson is churned out so much detailed and deep writing so fast. And with deep I mean deep, every one of the 3.5M words matters (unlike some other epics).

Dante just make sure when you do pick up the series that you read it in large chunks - I cant imagine how difficult it would be to follow if one only read in small periods.

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Henry wrote:"“Stepovers, tricks, that’s not the game. The game is what Thomas Muller is doing. If I had a son right now, playing, I would say to him ‘look at them, look at [Franck] Ribery, look at Muller.’ What Ronaldo does, and Messi, they’re just freaks. Don’t try to copy those guys. You can copy from Ribery, you can copy from Thomas Muller. What he did at the World Cup, people don’t talk about it. They don’t talk about it, but they should talk about it. He plays the game the right way: he defends, he attacks, he controls the ball when he has to control it, he reverses when he has to reverse it. When he has to finish, he’ll finish. He doesn’t do stepovers, but when he has to perform, he performs. He does what the game asks him to do.”"

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Dante on Sat Nov 08, 2014 4:55 pm

Thanks for the tip Phritz . Yeah i understand what you are saying .
This will be a gigantic read , one of the reasons i am excited about it. I have already made sure that , when i begin with the first book , i won't be reading anything else and i will also have plenty of time to read heavily .

Ideally , such a time would come after i have finished reading The Winds of Winter .. but who knows. This book seems like it's never coming out Laughing .

I am saying this because , i really don't want to be reading the 4th or 5th book and then Winds to come out , it will disrupt me big time and i don't want this to happen . I would have to put the Malazan series down and pick up with Asoiaf again , possibly with a reread of the previous books. By the time i would be done with Winds , it's quite possible my understanding of the Malazan books will be a salad , at best. Laughing .

As far as i can see , it would be ideal for me to enjoy the Malazan books whilst waiting for the final Asoiaf book. Inevitably , it will be another long wait and the Malazan books are huge , both in quantity and quality . The perfect match . It seems appropriate to me , with plenty of uninterruptible time in between , to save myself these books for that period .

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by ES on Sat Nov 08, 2014 5:01 pm

Speaking of, i've started Gardens of Moon last week. It's pretty hard to follow, but i seem to be able to understand most of what's happening.

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Bellabong on Sun Nov 09, 2014 1:41 am

I know that feel SES. I kept having to double check that this was the first book in the series. The Bonus for someone like me is that this series is re-readable like no other series I've read.

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Henry wrote:"“Stepovers, tricks, that’s not the game. The game is what Thomas Muller is doing. If I had a son right now, playing, I would say to him ‘look at them, look at [Franck] Ribery, look at Muller.’ What Ronaldo does, and Messi, they’re just freaks. Don’t try to copy those guys. You can copy from Ribery, you can copy from Thomas Muller. What he did at the World Cup, people don’t talk about it. They don’t talk about it, but they should talk about it. He plays the game the right way: he defends, he attacks, he controls the ball when he has to control it, he reverses when he has to reverse it. When he has to finish, he’ll finish. He doesn’t do stepovers, but when he has to perform, he performs. He does what the game asks him to do.”"

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Bellabong on Wed Nov 19, 2014 7:52 am

Protip, READ THE SHORT LITTLE BITS THAT MOST PEOPLE SKIP IN FANTASY BOOKS.

Rereading GoM right now and those little chapter intros give so much info that you only realize it on rereads.

I actually got inspired to reread because this guy ignited that fire in me in such an eloquent way:

Arctic Swan wrote:I'm wondering if anyone has read from the shared series of the Malazan books? There is Steven Erikson's Malazan Book of the Fallen - derived from Napoleon's Book of the Fallen - and his four novellas, and Ian Cameron Esslemont's Novels of the Malazan Empire? Many reviews and explanations go into great detail about the plot, but that defeats the purpose because the magic of the series comes from the sense of discovery. This might be a bad analogy, but I'll compare it to the video game Dark Souls - you are not spoonfed information. The author doesn't talk to the reader, the character talks to himself, at least to some degree. It isn't written in first person, but if the character doesn't know a name of a character, a city, a creature, or whatever, you won't know either. Another character that knows the name of said creature or character will call them by name and its up to the reader to figure out that the other character was detailing the same, just unnamed.

Without talking about the plot, this is why you should read these books:

In 1982 best friends Steven Erikson and Ian Cameron Esslemont teamed up to create a campaign for a modified version of the Advanced Dungeons and Dragons system. Four years they switched to the GURPS system and as a result the depth and complexity of the world grew in scale and size, much more of a fully realized world and reality. You might be thinking that this makes comparable to the Forgotten Realm universe, created by Ed Greenwood. Well, you'd be dead wrong. Both authors have degrees in archaeology and anthropology, and its apparent they used their knowledge and experience in creating and developing this unique world.

For those that aren't completely sure about the defenition of the two, let me explain why this is so important. Archaeology is the study of human activity and people, usally by recovering environmental data and material culture - an example of material culture is studying an artifact to discover its relationship to its culture - that has been left behind by said peoples and cultures. Artifacts and architecture are most well known examples of things they archaeologists study, as well as biofacts - an excavated and important object that has left by a previous human; an example would a seed to find out what type of food might have been grown or other items that can help realize what the humans might have worn or buildt with.

Anthropology is closely related in some aspects, while differing in others. While archaeology might not be defined as academic - not primarily defined as practical or useful - anthropology is. It is the academic study of the humanity. It concerns the understanding of humanity's experience throughout the ages, dealing with everything about ourselves both physical, social and cultural and how those all have evolved from their origins to now and all the time between. One of the primary focuses is to discover where we came from and how our evolution shapes and influences ourselves and our social relationships and cultures - what we do, how we act, and how we think.

Sorry if that took long to explain, but emphasis is important here. These books are set in a completely original and unique world, not our own universe. This isn't a big deal in fantasy novels or games; its pretty much garunteed. However, a lot are stale because they base themselves on cliches which might've been revolutionary when the first authors of the genre invented them, be it Tolkien, Lewis, or Peake. Another reason is that along with the fantastical and improbable or impossible setting the characters are written unrealistic, or there isn't a sense of their kind and places having history and culture. Because of their knowledge, whenever I read these Malazan books it feels like I'm seeing through the both the authors' and the characters' eyes, as well as smelling what the characters' smell and see what they see. I feel like I'm breathing in that world, feeling their culture and history all around me.

There are so many instances the authors point out dirt mounds, old roads grown over by nature, and many more examples. What makes this idea unique is they manage, by making the world so realized, that each of these has a past or story, ones that the authors might actually know and have fully developed in their heads and how they chronologicaly fit into that world. There are cities built over old, lost cities, ruins over ruins, and this concept never manages to feel like like the fantasy cliche of a ruin under a city for they build these areas by following the rules of archaeology and anthropology. For those who didn't like the longwinded and heavy prose of Tolkien's Lord of the Rings - talking about the history of a place they pass or come across - don't be turned off because they manage to stay away from that problem. All this mainly deals with the archaeology experience they have, but now on to anthropology.

This is where they put all other creations and their races and cultures' to shame. The series is made up of plentiful amount of different races, all has complex as our own and some larger in scope, with plenty of variation between them as well as remaining unique compared to other fantasy races and beings. The other thing to mention about these races is their personalities and philosophies. The authors are unapologetic when it comes to realism. The peoples found throughout the series act in a way believable to their cirmumstances, war and violence are detailed but unglorified, there's political intrigues, backstabbers, and everything that makes people evil and stupid. Nowhere is there to be found a race and culture pure like the elves of Middle-Earth. They might think they are, but alas pride and arrogance are one of those evils that abound in humanity. And lastly, characters die both unexpectedly and expectedly, not following a pattern but what would really happen in such an instance.

Yes, your favorite character is most likely going to die. Get over it.

The series is compared to such great reads and George R. R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire books, Glen !@#$'s The Black Company - which arguably could be the Malazan and Martin's books inspirations in terms of mood and nitty, gritty, realism - as well as Stephen R. Donaldson's Thomas Convenant novels - where the hero is definitely and truly flawed, like we all are. It doesn't matter what you say is better, it really comes down to whats your favorite type of tea argument. There are main commonalities are realism, but other such things are different, like a key thing that you find in Martin's books is how he goes to extreme detail on the banners, flags, sigils, ect. For those curious, when it comes to tea I prefer Earl Grey only because Jean Luc Picard does.

Oh, and for those tired of cliches in how magic works in the genre, this is another reason to read. All I will say is that Warrens are - in my humble opinion - the single greatest concept to the idea of magic in the genre in the last decade or two. That is probably going to be scoffed at off the bat, but when other layers of ideas - the Ascendants, the Deck of Dragons, the Tiles of the Holds - it makes the argument much more easy to agree with. Which you'd be right to do so. Doesn't mean I'll tell you what those three concepts are, that would ruin the magic when you read the series.

Thanks for indulging in reading this topic. I need to stop before I actually spoil things. There is two warning I have, however. Some of the biggest fans I know aren't afraid to acknolwedge that the first book published, Gardens of the Moon, isn't of the highest quality when compared to to the others. The reason for this is Erikson wrote it in 1991-92, but it published in 1999 and his style and skill developed over that expanse. Another warning is some might be put off by the two author's style or theme of "convergence". While the books are filled with exciting cirmustances, when compared to the "endgame" of each book, the other parts are slow - but only when compared to the end. This is because they follow the idea of the plotlines heading for a joint conclusion, so the tension rises throughout the entire book until the climax that unfolds over around anywhere from 100 to 200 plus pages - to quote Stephen R. Donaldson:

"Steven Erikson is an extraordinary writer. I read Gardens of the Moon with great pleasure. And now that I have read it, I would be hard pressed to decide what I enjoyed more: the richly and ominously magical world of Malaz and Genabackis; the large cast of sympathetically-rendered characters; or the way the story accumulates to a climax that hits like machinegun fire. My advice to anyone who might listen to me is, Treat yourself to Gardens of the Moon. And my entirely selfish advice to Steven Erikson is, write faster."

With that I come to a close. Once again, thanks.

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Henry wrote:"“Stepovers, tricks, that’s not the game. The game is what Thomas Muller is doing. If I had a son right now, playing, I would say to him ‘look at them, look at [Franck] Ribery, look at Muller.’ What Ronaldo does, and Messi, they’re just freaks. Don’t try to copy those guys. You can copy from Ribery, you can copy from Thomas Muller. What he did at the World Cup, people don’t talk about it. They don’t talk about it, but they should talk about it. He plays the game the right way: he defends, he attacks, he controls the ball when he has to control it, he reverses when he has to reverse it. When he has to finish, he’ll finish. He doesn’t do stepovers, but when he has to perform, he performs. He does what the game asks him to do.”"

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by ES on Mon Nov 24, 2014 8:05 pm

So, i'm halfway through book 1

Spoiler:
I've been stumbling a lot lately, haven't been reading consistently recently too. I want to research on Warrens and Ascendants but i will get spoiled. Are Warrens a place or wells inside the user from which he can draw magic? And just wtf are Ascendants? Are they the people gods choose to control in their games? I am at the point where Tattersail just finished her meeting with Tayschrenn, Adjunct Lorn and Toc The Younger

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

Post by Bellabong on Wed Dec 03, 2014 5:15 am

El Shaarawy wrote:So, i'm halfway through book 1

Spoiler:
I've been stumbling a lot lately, haven't been reading consistently recently too. I want to research on Warrens and Ascendants but i will get spoiled. Are Warrens a place or wells inside the user from which he can draw magic? And just wtf are Ascendants? Are they the people gods choose to control in their games? I am at the point where Tattersail just finished her meeting with Tayschrenn, Adjunct Lorn and Toc The Younger

Before you open the spoiler I'll extract this from the tl;dr I posted

Oh, and for those tired of cliches in how magic works in the genre, this is another reason to read. All I will say is that Warrens are - in my humble opinion - the single greatest concept to the idea of magic in the genre in the last decade or two. That is probably going to be scoffed at off the bat, but when other layers of ideas - the Ascendants, the Deck of Dragons, the Tiles of the Holds - it makes the argument much more easy to agree with. Which you'd be right to do so. Doesn't mean I'll tell you what those three concepts are, that would ruin the magic when you read the series.

feel free to open it up if you understand - but it's ok to not "understand" something right away in MBotF - the narratives are ver POV so if the character the current arc is focusing on doesn't understand how something works then you wont either. One of my favorite moments in the books was reading through the "life" story of a character and then making the sudden realization of OH SH**, I'm reading the backstory of X. This guy is a downright badass.

Very simple explanation of Warrens & Ascendants:
I guess the ELI5 of Warrens is to think of them as Elemental Dimensions. If you're familiar with  Faerun (The world of the Forgotten Realms DnD Campaign setting) they'd be better described as planes of existence. [Warren] Magic is done by a mage opening a "portal" to the Warren of their affinity and drawing the magical energy through that portal to do magic.

Ascendants are basically immortals (but can still be killed by magic). They can become "gods" if enough people have "faith" in them.


I'm on my 3rd read-through (Memories of Ice) and I absolutely love this quote:

We humans do not understand compassion. In each moment of our lives, we betray it. Aye, we know of its worth, yet in knowing we then attach to it a value, we guard the giving of it, believing it must be earned. T'lan Imass. Compassion is priceless in the truest sense of the word. It must be given freely. In abundance.


Last edited by Phritz on Fri Jan 02, 2015 3:50 am; edited 1 time in total

_________________
What happened to Phritz?


Henry wrote:"“Stepovers, tricks, that’s not the game. The game is what Thomas Muller is doing. If I had a son right now, playing, I would say to him ‘look at them, look at [Franck] Ribery, look at Muller.’ What Ronaldo does, and Messi, they’re just freaks. Don’t try to copy those guys. You can copy from Ribery, you can copy from Thomas Muller. What he did at the World Cup, people don’t talk about it. They don’t talk about it, but they should talk about it. He plays the game the right way: he defends, he attacks, he controls the ball when he has to control it, he reverses when he has to reverse it. When he has to finish, he’ll finish. He doesn’t do stepovers, but when he has to perform, he performs. He does what the game asks him to do.”"

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Re: Malazan Book of The Fallen, anyone?

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