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Post by alexjanosik Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:21 pm

Maybe Pep's overall fitness and training regime is more suited to a season without a winter break.
Maybe his training regime is not optimal for a season with such a long winter break.Hence the sub optimal performances in the second half of the season.
I am no expert on training and physiology and am completely clueless.Maybe someone more knowledgeable like dani or free could explain if it could be a factor.

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Post by Hapless_Hans Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:33 pm

I couldn't say either.

I'd just add that this post winter break drop off isn't exclusively something that happens in the Pep era.

In fact, this winter break, when since there's a month without competitive football the thirsty fan is lapping up news and proclamations about how well the training camp went etc, and the following Wolfsburg game where we paradoxically looked as if we had not trained at all, or as if we had trained how to misplace passes and how to not know the movements of the teammates lol, reminded me a lot of the famous "best winter training camp of all times" in 2011/12.

That's what someone (I think Hoeness?) really called it publcly back then, we also went into the break with a comfortable lead in the league and all looked rosy, the superbestest of possible winter training camps followed and then we proceeded to lose the lead, and league, with surprising swiftness lol.

Maybe, if a main problem is indeed 'hunger' as we said, the winter break is bad for us if the first half season was convincing.
Because there is naturally a drop of tension, and competitive tension is so very precious in football and so hard to conjure up artificially.

It's like starting a new season, only you start the season with +12 points.
Maybe it's indeed a problem.
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Post by alexjanosik Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:52 pm

Just one point on the plan B and Pep.I find it hilarious that people still come up with the plan B nonsense regarding Pep.He has such variety to his tactics and formations.I have seen so many different variations and tactics to tackle different opponents this season.Just one condition.That all the variations and tactics fit within his idea and philosophy of football,which is the Cruyff philosophy.
When people say that he has no plan B,what they really mean is that he can park the bus and counter.
It is such a ridiculous thing to say.Parking the bus and countering is a relatively easy thing to do which is why 99% of managers out there do it and a lot manage to do it quite well.
Do people really think that a manager of Pep's genius cant figure it out and set up his team to PTB and counter?
People seem to confuse willingness and ability.
Pep isnt willing to compromise on his principles.He can easily set up his team to PTB and counter(but he rightfully wont as it is a medieval tactic if it can even be called a tactic).

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Post by Casciavit Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:18 pm

alexjanosik wrote:Just one point on the plan B and Pep.I find it hilarious that people still come up with the plan B nonsense regarding Pep.He has such variety to his tactics and formations.I have seen so many different variations and tactics to tackle different opponents this season.Just one condition.That all the variations and tactics fit within his idea and philosophy of football,which is the Cruyff philosophy.
When people say that he has no plan B,what they really mean is that he can park the bus and counter.
It is such a ridiculous thing to say.Parking the bus and countering is a relatively easy thing to do which is why 99% of managers out there do it and a lot manage to do it quite well.
Do people really think that a manager of Pep's genius cant figure it out and set up his team to PTB and counter?
People seem to confuse willingness and ability.
Pep isnt willing to compromise on his principles.He can easily set up his team to PTB and counter(but he rightfully wont as it is a medieval tactic if it can even be called a tactic).


I agree with that. I think he's much more flexible than many give him credit for. This season I've seen him field very defensive lineups and hell he's been using a pivot every now and then too.

As for Bayern's slump, I've already written about it, but for me it boils down to the injuries mostly. To play positional play at the highest level the players need to be in top mental, physical and technical form.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:27 pm

Let's add "overturned a 3-1 loss with half a starting team against a top 8 European team" on the "what have they done?" column hmm
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Post by billy_gr Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:28 pm

Bayern Proud
how wrong I was....
dat keeper though
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Post by windkick Tue Apr 21, 2015 9:48 pm

What an ass raping. Was like Germany vs Brazil
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Post by The Franchise Wed Apr 22, 2015 11:17 am

alexjanosik wrote:Maybe Pep's overall fitness and training regime is more suited to a season without a winter break.
Maybe his training regime is not optimal for a season with such a long winter break.Hence the sub optimal performances in the second half of the season.
I am no expert on training and physiology and am completely clueless.Maybe someone more knowledgeable like dani or free could explain if it could be a factor.

Not my strong point to be honest. I know the basics and have read various academic journals on physiology but just that.

My guess though would be whoever came up with the training plan (wouldnt be Pep, think the fitness coaches would have that responsibility) already had in mind the winter break. Unless Pep foolishly overruled his own fitness staff (cant imagine any coach would) then they would have designed everything and anyone working on that high level position surely already considered the winter break.

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Post by The Franchise Wed Apr 22, 2015 11:19 am

Porto :facepalm:

Total first half meltdown.

I dont even know what to say.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:40 pm

Goes to show though, that injuries are NOT the main issue.

Except for Badstuber instead of Dante, same team as 6 days ago, yet a completely different performance.

Full engagement, quick play, relentless counterpressing. That's how we're supposed to roll.
Sometimes as much as 4 players hounding a Porto midfielder who receives a ball.

I didn't think we'd be able to turn it on like that tbh. Great first half performance.

Dani your point about goals impacting games, the indivdual errors, stands strong after this, even if I have the feeling such lackluster and bloodless away performances are amplified by Pep's for my taste needlessly timid approach to CL away games. Maybe he's even trying to be too tactical?

I want us to be all over the opponent, even away, I think we're much better then instead of going for the slow control route.
Because paradoxically we achieve security and control better the higher up we push and the more we go for it imo.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:43 pm

The Franchise wrote:
alexjanosik wrote:Maybe Pep's overall fitness and training regime is more suited to a season without a winter break.
Maybe his training regime is not optimal for a season with such a long winter break.Hence the sub optimal performances in the second half of the season.
I am no expert on training and physiology and am completely clueless.Maybe someone more knowledgeable like dani or free could explain if it could be a factor.

Not my strong point to be honest. I know the basics and have read various academic journals on physiology but just that.

My guess though would be whoever came up with the training plan (wouldnt be Pep, think the fitness coaches would have that responsibility) already had in mind the winter break. Unless Pep foolishly overruled his own fitness staff (cant imagine any coach would) then they would have designed everything and anyone working on that high level position surely already considered the winter break.



Pretty sure this is all meticulously planned to take the winter break into account. They're professionals after all.
It's more a mental thing.
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Post by windkick Wed Apr 22, 2015 2:23 pm

They also didn't score away vs Shakhtar. I remember when Pep was with us we would also end series at home, not away. Maybe Pep isn't good at on the road, idk. That's one of the things I can think of that's similar to his Barca and Bayern teams in Europe


Last edited by windkick on Wed Apr 22, 2015 4:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by The Franchise Wed Apr 22, 2015 3:57 pm

Hapless_Hans wrote:Goes to show though, that injuries are NOT the main issue.

Except for Badstuber instead of Dante, same team as 6 days ago, yet a completely different performance.

Full engagement, quick play, relentless counterpressing. That's how we're supposed to roll.
Sometimes as much as 4 players hounding a Porto midfielder who receives a ball.

I didn't think we'd be able to turn it on like that tbh. Great first half performance.

Dani your point about goals impacting games, the indivdual errors, stands strong after this, even if I have the feeling such lackluster and bloodless away performances are amplified by Pep's for my taste needlessly timid approach to CL away games. Maybe he's even trying to be too tactical?

I want us to be all over the opponent, even away, I think we're much better then instead of going for the slow control route.
Because paradoxically we achieve security and control better the higher up we push and the more we go for it imo.

I think that the first game impacted the first half of this one. I think they were so badly outplayed that they took it personally and knew everyone was doubting them. It was like a spark of motivation for them.

The slightly worrying part was the second half, because it seemed like they knew they had won and could "relax" again. But I mean, great teams do that, Barca did. So it may not mean much and the Porto 1st leg loss gave them what they needed, a real wake up call.

On the Porto point of view, its a similar story. Amazing at home, awful away. I dont know why the contrast is so dramatic, even with totally different players this year compared to years ago. But the issue remains the same.

About Pep's being too tactical, its not the first time he has been accused of that. I think that Inter - Barca first leg those years ago really effected Pep. Because he knows it was totally his fault and he got it so wrong on that day and Barca couldnt recover from it. Maybe its actually coincidence, but at since then I think away legs alter his thinking on CL games. I feel he did the same last year against Madrid, I would say he even lost his nerve and went with a team which he fooled himself into thinking it was "safer" when it was that same old situation that safety is doing what you do best, not over-thinking the situation.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:14 pm

The Franchise wrote:
I think that the first game impacted the first half of this one. I think they were so badly outplayed that they took it personally and knew everyone was doubting them. It was like a spark of motivation for them.

No doubt. Last year we had uninspired draws (1:1 at Machester), or even the 0:1 away at Real, which still could be somewhat euphemized.
This first leg, together with the medical staff affair and the ensuing press storm, gave a real back to the wall feeling.

Thing is though, I don't want us to have to rely on something like that, and push our luck.
Anything like this first leg 1:3 away against a team in the semis and we're out, they're not going to bend over like Porto did.

The Franchise wrote:
The slightly worrying part was the second half, because it seemed like they knew they had won and could "relax" again. But I mean, great teams do that, Barca did. So it may not mean much and the Porto 1st leg loss gave them what they needed, a real wake up call.

That's always astonishing to me, just how much momentum, concentration and tension are important for our game.
Football as a whole, but seemingly especially our game.

The 2:3 against City at home last season - textbook example.
2 goals in ten minutes, like a hot knife through butter, playing fantastic, City have no chance. Then we relax (after 15 minutes lol), City fight back and we have lost momentum and can't get it back. You lose momentum, you then lose challenges.

Almost feels like the momentum alone determines whether we are the better or the worse team - had Porto scored a second after 80 minutes god knows how insecure and bad we might have become.

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About Pep's being too tactical, its not the first time he has been accused of that. I think that Inter - Barca first leg those years ago really effected Pep. Because he knows it was totally his fault and he got it so wrong on that day and Barca couldnt recover from it. Maybe its actually coincidence, but at since then I think away legs alter his thinking on CL games. I feel he did the same last year against Madrid, I would say he even lost his nerve and went with a team which he fooled himself into thinking it was "safer" when it was that same old situation that safety is doing what you do best, not over-thinking the situation.


Yes I agree. We are not safer when the signal is "safety". Which is connected with the momentum thing.

(was very clear under van Gaal - he always brought on Tymoschtschuk as a defensive midfielder when he wanted to defend a lead last 15 minutes - sounds logical, but the result usually was a total breakdown in confidence and momentum lol)

As for Pep, he's definitely sometimes overdoing it, trying to be too perfect.
And in our away games, I think in a way he's too respectful and defensive.

But I think what we cannot forget is, that he's actually still a young and inexperienced coach.
Bayern is, in a way, his first job, away from home.
I've never seen a coach of ours so miserably nervous before important games lol, I always want to hug him and tell him it's not THAT important.
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Post by Winter is Coming Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:10 pm

Bayern Munich boss Pep Guardiola charged by UEFA after wearing '#JusticiaParaTopo' t-shirt for journalist who died at World Cup

smh
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Post by alexjanosik Fri May 01, 2015 5:56 pm

So Bayern just got a new kit deal from Adidas.60 mil per season for the next 15 years.
It is still considerably less than United's deal especially considering that Adidas owns 8% of Bayern.I think Bayern were handicapped by the fact that their current deal still had 5 years to go.It was a paltry 25 mil per year.With the new deal,Bayern get an additional 175 over the next 5 years.So it is kind of a win win for both parties.Bayern get a better deal and Adidas resign Bayern for 15 years in a deal considerably less than that of United's.

The reason I am posting this is because our deal is soon up for renewal.How much can we get?
Can we get a better deal than United's?I think it is certainly possible.Most of the cards are in our favor.Nike wont want to lose another top 3 team to Adidas after losing United.
We have the current face of football and Adidas poster boy.
Dont think Adidas like having Messi in Nike colors.
We have the future face of football and Nike poster boy in Neymar who is also arguably the most marketable player in the game.Nike wont like seeing Neymar in Adidas colors.
We are one of the top 3 football brands.Am sure we can get a bidding war going.
How much can we realistically get?Can we get somewhere in the vicinity of United's deal or can we get a better one?

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Post by BarrileteCosmico Fri May 01, 2015 10:04 pm

This is a chart from 2012 so it's not updated, but it looks like we have 3 more years on the current deal:

Edit: found a more updated comparison:

http://www.tsmplug.com/top-10/most-expensive-kit-sponsorship-deals-in-football/

I see no reason why we shouldn't have all major brands bid come 2018
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Post by alexjanosik Wed May 06, 2015 9:56 pm

The knives are already out for Pep.I saw a thread on the General section.Apparently he is not even good enough for the Milan job.
Pep playing the game the only way it is supposed to be played and losing makes him a fraud.
But apparently parking the bus at home against 10 man PSG and getting knocked out makes Mourinho a genius.

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Post by Winter is Coming Wed May 06, 2015 10:28 pm

Its just banter lol I think many on this forum still rate Pep. Obviously not the best result, but felt if he had Robbery, game would've been more intense from both sides.

I said it before those two would be solely missed, but people kept saying this side its still strong, they are, but lack creativity and players who can win 1 v 1. Muller is more of a striker then winger.
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Post by Casciavit Wed May 06, 2015 11:25 pm

alexjanosik wrote:The knives are already out for Pep.I saw a thread on the General section.Apparently he is not even good enough for the Milan job.
Pep playing the game the only way it is supposed to be played and losing makes him a fraud.
But apparently parking the bus at home against 10 man PSG and getting knocked out makes Mourinho a genius.


Pep isn't actually getting much blame tbh.

From what I've been reading seems like the narrative is that, you can't stop Messi when he's in this type of form.
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Post by windkick Thu May 07, 2015 5:27 am

So last two games of season won't be played?
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Post by MaraVilla Thu May 07, 2015 7:14 am

windkick wrote:So last two games of season won't be played?


think they're going on a 2 week strike or something.
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Post by Donuts Thu May 07, 2015 9:27 am

not looking good for messi / neymar / bravo's national tournament really

hope this gets resolved fast.
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Post by windkick Thu May 07, 2015 2:07 pm

Yea, a 2 week strike and copa america players are gone for the last two games and copa final
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Post by messixaviesta Thu May 07, 2015 6:15 pm

alexjanosik wrote:The knives are already out for Pep.I saw a thread on the General section.Apparently he is not even good enough for the Milan job.
Pep playing the game the only way it is supposed to be played and losing makes him a fraud.
But apparently parking the bus at home against 10 man PSG and getting knocked out makes Mourinho a genius.

I think both are to blame, maybe Mourinho more. I have written my thoughts about where Pep stands in the match thread. Mourinho can make even the most vibrant team depressingly negative and it sometimes backfires. Pep though tries to impose his own style too soon and throws caution to the wind one too many times, for which I honestly cannot praise him. Beautiful football is great but how much does it matter if it comes without results. How much respect did Arsenal get in eight trophy less seasons? You can say Pep wasn't trophy less at Bayern but he was in a one team league. I don't think his team would have won the league in Spain or England. For me his tenure at Bayern which should end very soon is largely a failure I am sorry to say. Being hammered two years in a row by the only top quality teams you meet isn't anything to dance about I feel.




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Post by BarrileteCosmico Thu May 07, 2015 6:46 pm

The general section is always a prisoner of the moment. Today Pep is a flop, tomorrow the greatest there ever was.
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