Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by RealGunner on Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:09 pm

He'll lose at Anfield I think. Liverpool are the only team equipped to beating City. Arsenal on a very good day maybe but that's far fetched.

Doubt he'll lose anywhere else. If he dominated at old trafford, he will not lose at places like west brom or newcastle lol

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Unique on Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:10 pm

@RealGunner wrote:He'll lose at Anfield I think. Liverpool are the only team equipped to beating City. Arsenal on a very good day maybe but that's far fetched.

Doubt he'll lose anywhere else. If he dominated at old trafford, he will not lose at places like west brom or newcastle lol
tbh I think if they have a slip up it will be at a west brom or Watford.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by RealGunner on Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:15 pm

Hope so

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:21 pm

They have come close to dropping points to shit teams a bunch of times, Last minute Sterling goals have stretched this run on about 5 seperate occasions.

They are very beatable, especially with how they have planned for last month.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by serghei_ro on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:33 pm

@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Dem awful PL teams seemed to not lack technique last season when they smashed Guardiola for 4 or 5 goals with regularity.

I understand your points but Guardiola's worst performances as a coach came last year in the PL.


Perfectly explainable why his team struggled in his first season. One, he had too many players in important positions that weren't at the required technical level to play this type of football. Two, both the manager and the players needed some time to get used to each others' methods.

Pep doesn't have a magic wand. What he does takes hundreds of hours of work, in order to build in-game relations between almost all players (including the keeper). I'm frankly surprised he's dominating to such a degree this season. Expected him to take longer, but the technical level in the Premier League is not all around great. Lots of teams with big men who still play kick and run and boot the ball up the field.

The lower technical level and the basic, ordinary tactics on display from most teams is what allowed Pep to build what looks like a historic PL side with just a year of trial and error. Physicality won't take you anywhere if the technical side and the tactical side are overwhelmingly dominated by a single team in a league, which is what is happening right now in England.

Won't be surprised if City go out in CL though. There are many teams in Europe who can exploit some of the mistakes City make. None in England though.
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:46 pm

@serghei_ro wrote:Teams from Premier League are so far showing they lack some of the weapons you need to have, in order to beat a Pep side. Most PL teams have poor technique and show an over-reliance on physicality. They just can't keep the ball under pressure, because so few teams actually pressure the attacking teams in PL. It's mostly end to end stuff, not about one team actively playing and stoping the others from playing at the same time. The culture seems to be something like 'you play, I play, and we see who wins'. This is not how you beat a Pep side. Before you play you have to make sure you stop them from playing. And this is not happening. Teams that park the bus don't defend very well, and show pretty poor skills of building counters with few men.

The only teams in PL who can apply good pressure are unable to cope with the issues this tactic creates at the back.


Ahem



Will we see a repeat this weekend? Only team capable of ending the streak IMO


Last edited by BarrileteCosmico on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by serghei_ro on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:48 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:
@serghei_ro wrote:Teams from Premier League are so far showing they lack some of the weapons you need to have, in order to beat a Pep side. Most PL teams have poor technique and show an over-reliance on physicality. They just can't keep the ball under pressure, because so few teams actually pressure the attacking teams in PL. It's mostly end to end stuff, not about one team actively playing and stoping the others from playing at the same time. The culture seems to be something like 'you play, I play, and we see who wins'. This is not how you beat a Pep side. Before you play you have to make sure you stop them from playing. And this is not happening. Teams that park the bus don't defend very well, and show pretty poor skills of building counters with few men.

The only teams in PL who can apply good pressure are unable to cope with the issues this tactic creates at the back.


Ahem



Will we see a repeat this weekend? Only team capable of ending the streak IMO


Yea, but this is a different City team. I think only Madrid, PSG, Barca and Bayern can be counted on to beat them. Any other team doing it is a big surprise for me.

No2 and No3 in Premier League parking the bus at home vs City and scoring 1 fluke goal in the process doesn't look good for Premier League tbh.
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by RealGunner on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:50 pm

Should post more often Serghei Thumbs up
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:54 pm

Of course it's a different team, but to say that no team that applies pressure can win against them is wrong IMO, they would need to be lucky but it can be done.

Not that I think it will actually happen tomorrow.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:45 pm

@serghei_ro wrote:
@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Dem awful PL teams seemed to not lack technique last season when they smashed Guardiola for 4 or 5 goals with regularity.

I understand your points but Guardiola's worst performances as a coach came last year in the PL.


Perfectly explainable why his team struggled in his first season. One, he had too many players in important positions that weren't at the required technical level to play this type of football. Two, both the manager and the players needed some time to get used to each others' methods.

Pep doesn't have a magic wand. What he does takes hundreds of hours of work, in order to build in-game relations between almost all players (including the keeper). I'm frankly surprised he's dominating to such a degree this season. Expected him to take longer, but the technical level in the Premier League is not all around great. Lots of teams with big men who still play kick and run and boot the ball up the field.

The lower technical level and the basic, ordinary tactics on display from most teams is what allowed Pep to build what looks like a historic PL side with just a year of trial and error. Physicality won't take you anywhere if the technical side and the tactical side are overwhelmingly dominated by a single team in a league, which is what is happening right now in England.

Won't be surprised if City go out in CL though. There are many teams in Europe who can exploit some of the mistakes City make. None in England though.


I underestimated you so came with my stock PL defence post as a lot of fans of other leagues irrationally hate it's somewhat shall we say negligence when it comes technique.

Good post, i enjoyed reading it.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Nishankly on Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:16 am

Got this off twitter, verify pls

Pep Guardiola as a manager has spent:
€383m at Barcelona
€195m at Bayern Munich
€459.2m at Manchester City

Total = €1.037 BILLION
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Hapless_Hans on Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:57 am

So he has spent less at Bayern than Jürgen Klopp has at Liverpool

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:00 pm

@Hapless_Hans wrote:So he has spent less at Bayern than Jürgen Klopp has at Liverpool


Laughing

When i read that i was shocked tbh, thought he spent way more at Bayern than that.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by S on Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:42 pm

He inherited a world class team though. He hardly had to change much considering most of them were in their prime.
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:46 pm

Bayern board was in charge of transfers, not Pep. Its why they transferred successfully rather than wasting money like in Barca and City. Transfers have always been his achilles heel.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by serghei_ro on Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:59 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Bayern board was in charge of transfers, not Pep. Its why they transferred successfully rather than wasting money like in Barca and City. Transfers have always been his achilles heel.


Pep's transfers have been hit or miss really. At City so far it's been more hit than miss I'd say.
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by CBarca on Mon Dec 18, 2017 6:32 pm

His transfers at City have been pretty good tbh

But yeah he's always been hit or miss at best.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Nishankly on Mon Dec 18, 2017 7:00 pm

@Hapless_Hans wrote:So he has spent less at Bayern than Jürgen Klopp has at Liverpool


What does LFC have to do with this ffs, He took over a prime team.
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:40 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Bayern board was in charge of transfers, not Pep. Its why they transferred successfully rather than wasting money like in Barca and City. Transfers have always been his achilles heel.

I don't know about that. The Thiago transfer has Pep written all over it. Same for Costa; Guardiola has always had a soft spot for pacy wingers.

As a matter of fact, I think aside from the Tasci transfer, every single signing Bayern made during Guardiola's era was done by him.

I agree about him not being that sharp with transfers, but I don't think a coach of his caliber would accept managing a club without being in charge of the signings.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Kaladin on Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:00 pm


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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Firenze on Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:11 pm

give Dyche that budget and he would be winning the league. I bet he wouldn't have had a trophy-less season, either.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Firenze on Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:11 pm

@Hapless_Hans wrote:So he has spent less at Bayern than Jürgen Klopp has at Liverpool


what was his spending like relative to other sides in the Bundesliga during his time there?
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:49 pm

@Firenze wrote:give Dyche that budget and he would be winning the league. I bet he wouldn't have had a trophy-less season, either.


Can we stop with such nonsense please, we only have to look at Milan to see spending money means *bleep* all.

I don't want to keep defending him, but the ridiculously stupid comments prevents that sadly.

As already been said in this thread if you think Dyche would have them win 16 games in a row with Delph, Otamendi, Walker, Fernandinho, Sterling, Sane as starters then you are clearly not thinking straight tbh.

The mere fact you look like a Championship side without Pogba and they dominate Spurs without Silva says everything that needs to be said tbh.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by Luca on Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:20 pm

Spending money obviously matters

Spending that much money obviously matters

It's not the end all but while others may emphasize it mole, you downplay it way too much in my opinion. There's quality all over that team and it was all purchased at a premium. Of course it matters.

Guardiola is doing an out of this world job though. Everyone knows it, he's destroying everyone. If you give a manager like this, the kind of resources he has, its a special thing to see.
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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:25 pm

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:
@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Bayern board was in charge of transfers, not Pep. Its why they transferred successfully rather than wasting money like in Barca and City. Transfers have always been his achilles heel.

I don't know about that. The Thiago transfer has Pep written all over it. Same for Costa; Guardiola has always had a soft spot for pacy wingers.

As a matter of fact, I think aside from the Tasci transfer, every single signing Bayern made during Guardiola's era was done by him.

I agree about him not being that sharp with transfers, but I don't think a coach of his caliber would accept managing a club without being in charge of the signings.
Wasn't there a story about how Pep wanted Neymar and the Bayern board went all "South Americans don't do well in Germany, let's go for Gotze instead"?

I'm sure Pep had input into transfers and he was listened to, but the board had veto and exercised it.

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Re: Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:21 am

Well, the Neymar story was an exception and here's why:

Bayern has a very clear and strict transfer policy:

1. They usually don't go north of 40m to sign a player.
2. They don't bring players directly from South America.

Guardiola, even though he was in charge of the transfers at Bayern, his targets had to satisfy those two conditions in order for Bayern to approve the deal. With Neymar, not only would he have cost them significantly more than 40m, he also was still playing at Santos at the time and had no experience playing in Europe (both conditions weren't met). So naturally, they went for Guardiola's second choice which was Goetze. But to my knowledge, they never went behind his back to sign someone against his will.

They're a well-run, extremely well-organized club. While they do give their head coach complete freedom to sign their targets, they still had to meet certain requirements in order for them to keep the club financially healthy.

And like I said, Guardiola wouldn't accept a coaching job without having guarantees to be completely in charge of the club's transfers. Case in point, the signings Bayern made under his rule had Guardiola written all over them (Thiago, Costa, Alonso, Coman, Benatia,Kimmich...).

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