Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread

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Post by billy_gr Wed May 06, 2015 11:20 pm

Some people just don't know how to park. I see them every day

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Post by Tomwin Lannister Wed May 06, 2015 11:21 pm

breva wrote:Guardiola is a great manager, but he is human. Going back to Barcelona, wanting to impress a little too much, throw in some hubris and you lose badly.

You're 0-0 at halftime away, in the first game of a CL tie. Park the darn bus. Come away with 1-0 and you have a good chance at home. Heck you might even hold them for another half.

He will learn from this.


No he won't, he seemingly doesn't have the self control to accept a narrow defeat. Nope, HIGH LINE EVERYBODEIH GET UP.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed May 06, 2015 11:21 pm

Leave Pep alone.
He's doing the best he can, even if he's clearly no Jupp Heynckes Laughing
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Post by DeletedUser#1 Wed May 06, 2015 11:29 pm

Do you think the scoreline would have been worse, if let's say, Carver was in Bayern's dug-out tonight ? hmm

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Post by zigra Wed May 06, 2015 11:30 pm

Think the amount of players out for Bayern is a bit overrated. Most of the players today would still start if everyone was fit.
The really big problem was not having one of Robben or an in-form Ribery and I think they also missed Alaba big time.

Think Pep did ok. Don't know what he could've done to stop that team.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed May 06, 2015 11:32 pm

zigra wrote:Think the amount of players out for Bayern is a bit overrated. Most of the players today would still start if everyone was fit.
The really big problem was not having one of Robben or an in-form Ribery and I think they also missed Alaba big time.


LOL at the dissonance between the first and second part of your post Laughing
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Post by Winter is Coming Wed May 06, 2015 11:53 pm

I agree a little, I felt just Robbery being there would've made the game more intense. Bayern at the end had no one to exploit the space we gave them.

Obviously having Alaba/Martinez/Bads would've been good too. At the end can't complain getting our revenge and have a foot in the final, unless Bayern pull a Shaktar/Porto on us.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed May 06, 2015 11:55 pm

Natalie Portman wrote:Do you think the scoreline would have been worse, if let's say, Carver was in Bayern's dug-out tonight ? hmm


I'm going to go out on a limb and say yes.
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Post by futbol Wed May 06, 2015 11:56 pm

Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread - Page 2 CEWhiNCUMAARXK8

Pepito. Sad

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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed May 06, 2015 11:57 pm

Fußball wrote:Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread - Page 2 CEWhiNCUMAARXK8

Pepito. Sad


well, conceding the tie killing 0:3 in the 94th minute is kind of bad for the mood, you have to admit Laughing
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed May 06, 2015 11:59 pm

Tomwin Lannister wrote:
breva wrote:Guardiola is a great manager, but he is human.  Going back to Barcelona, wanting to impress a little too much, throw in some  hubris and you lose badly.  

You're 0-0 at halftime away, in the first game of a CL tie.  Park the darn bus.  Come away with 1-0 and you have a good chance at home.  Heck you might even hold them for another half.  

He will learn from this.


No he won't, he seemingly doesn't have the self control to accept a narrow defeat. Nope, HIGH LINE EVERYBODEIH GET UP.


The high line isn't the problem, it was the right thing to do.

The set up was fine. It was great actually.

Where Pep *bleep* it up is his subs, or lack of hmm
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Post by zigra Thu May 07, 2015 12:10 am

Hapless_Hans wrote:
zigra wrote:Think the amount of players out for Bayern is a bit overrated. Most of the players today would still start if everyone was fit.
The really big problem was not having one of Robben or an in-form Ribery and I think they also missed Alaba big time.


LOL at the dissonance between the first and second part of your post Laughing

No you just didn't get what I wanted to say (probably because it wasn't exactly related to the posts in this forum tbh).

Bayern was absolutely missing some key players and I don't have a problem with that but what annoyed me a bit was reading from Bayern fans how they were missing just every injured player soooo much. You'd get the feeling Bayern was missing more than half of their first team but as I said imo this team wasn't lacking a great many players just some crucial ones. Get Alaba and Robben in there and the problems are solved tbh.
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Post by futbol Thu May 07, 2015 12:10 am

Hapless_Hans wrote:
Fußball wrote:Pep Fraudiola Denunciation Thread - Page 2 CEWhiNCUMAARXK8

Pepito. Sad


well, conceding the tie killing 0:3 in the 94th minute is kind of bad for the mood, you have to admit Laughing


Tie killing? Pls.

Benatia (Bayern): "I believe we can get to the final. If we score the first goal fast, we can win 4-0. We've shown what we can do at home."


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Post by farfan Thu May 07, 2015 12:12 am

Benatia shoud have scarified himself by fouling Neymar to keep Bayern's slim chances alive hmm
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Post by Winter is Coming Thu May 07, 2015 12:17 am

Would've gotten a red and then they have Dante in the back for return leg thats suicide now, he knows better.
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Post by zigra Thu May 07, 2015 12:43 am

They had Martinez on the bench tonight so probably he'd be able to play a whole match next week hmm
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Post by Cruijf Thu May 07, 2015 2:33 am

Hapless_Hans wrote:

Where Pep *bleep* it up is his subs, or lack of hmm


Who do you think he should've brought on? I was thinking the same thing around the 70 minute mark, as even in their dominant spells Bayern were never really threatening Barca, but there was no one for him to turn to.

I mean, the Bayern bench was Dante, Javi Martínez, Pizarro, Gaudino, Gotze, Reina, and Weiser Laughing

Bringing on Gotze was his only option and was a good move. I would've done it for Alonso instead of Muller, but even that may not have made much of a difference.

Overall I think Pep did the best he could, considering Bayern didn't have any dynamic attacking players. It was funny, there were plenty of times they had space on the break and whoever had the ball would look ahead of them and just find nothing. Without Robbery, there's no pace, no width, and no penetration. Leads to a display that we saw today, where even though it was a relatively even match, Bayern's inability to create anything meant their success hinged on keeping a clean sheet, which is rather difficult against Messi Laughing

There will always be those who say Pep was naive and should've parked the bus, and to a point I agree with them. Having said that, to be so firm in one's desire to attack is admirable, and I think us neutral's enjoyed it. And there's also the point that a midfield of Alonso, Thiago, Lahm, and Schweinsteiger may simply not have been capable of parking the bus.

At the end of the day, I wouldn't criticize Pep too much. The only coach in the world that could've gotten a result from this game would've been Mourinho, and the romantic part of me prefers the Guardiola's to the Mourinho's, even if the Guardiola's lose.
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Post by Wor Ayoze Thu May 07, 2015 2:58 am

Coachessi made this fraud look good

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Post by Hapless_Hans Thu May 07, 2015 7:12 am

Cruijf wrote:
Hapless_Hans wrote:

Where Pep *bleep* it up is his subs, or lack of hmm


Who do you think he should've brought on? I was thinking the same thing around the 70 minute mark, as even in their dominant spells Bayern were never really threatening Barca, but there was no one for him to turn to.

I mean, the Bayern bench was Dante, Javi Martínez, Pizarro, Gaudino, Gotze, Reina, and Weiser Laughing

Bringing on Gotze was his only option and was a good move. I would've done it for Alonso instead of Muller, but even that may not have made much of a difference.

Overall I think Pep did the best he could, considering Bayern didn't have any dynamic attacking players. It was funny, there were plenty of times they had space on the break and whoever had the ball would look ahead of them and just find nothing. Without Robbery, there's no pace, no width, and no penetration. Leads to a display that we saw today, where even though it was a relatively even match, Bayern's inability to create anything meant their success hinged on keeping a clean sheet, which is rather difficult against Messi Laughing

There will always be those who say Pep was naive and should've parked the bus, and to a point I agree with them. Having said that, to be so firm in one's desire to attack is admirable, and I think us neutral's enjoyed it. And there's also the point that a midfield of Alonso, Thiago, Lahm, and Schweinsteiger may simply not have been capable of parking the bus.

At the end of the day, I wouldn't criticize Pep too much. The only coach in the world that could've gotten a result from this game would've been Mourinho, and the romantic part of me prefers the Guardiola's to the Mourinho's, even if the Guardiola's lose.


I'm not critisizing Pep at all for the way we played and were set up. I think we did great for most of the game.

But Thiago was not up for this game, a no show and turnover machine, and Lewandowski clearly wasn't there anymore after 60-70 minutes, which is not surprising given his state.

Both needed to be subbed off.
Instead Pep waits until we concede and then takes off Müller, who was one of our best players and the only one to have an attacking impact.
Terrible decision.

Bring on Martinez for Thiago and Götze for Lewandowski after 70 minutes to preserve the 0:0, or bring on Götze for Thiago and Pizarro for Lewandowski if you want to go for it a bit.
Do NOT take off Müller after we concede.

Pep did the same last week, and it was just as big a mistake.
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Post by Art Morte Thu May 07, 2015 7:14 am

Missing both Ribery and Robben did cost Munich & I don't think Pep is to blame here. Getting that away goal was - or would have been - crucial and that's where those two would have done a world of good.

My only criticism is that Götze should have started. Alonso, Lahm and Shweinsteiger as 3/4 of your midfield in 2015 is just not good enough at this stage and when that away goal was needed. Robben would have started in one of those guy's place, I reckon, so why not start Götze when Robben and Ribery weren't available?

Anyway, this one's not on Pep, imo. When you look at the starting line-ups, it's pretty clear Barca had the better players on the night and it was on their turf. In the line-ups also lies Pep's biggest challenge if he is to remain the Bayern manager: Can he maintain the team's level of the past few years when guys like Robben, Ribery, Lahm and Shweini are in their 30's now? Points in Heynckes' last season in Bundesliga were 91 for Bayern, in Pep's first year 90, this year if they win their last three games it will be 85. In Heynckes' last season Bayern beat Barca 7 - 0 in the semis. Last season they lost 5 - 0 to Real and now lost the first leg 3 - 0 to Barca. The downward trend is there and it's up to Pep to stop the slide. His success or failure in that is what will define his time as Bayern manager, not this semi-final.
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Post by free_cat Thu May 07, 2015 9:20 am

The Muller sub was bad. One has to wonder why Pep hates Gotze so much. I know Gotze hasn't been in good form, but it goes both ways. If you don't show him some kind of faith and playing time, he can't perform. He did the same with other player who were very good with us for some time, like Toure or Bojan.
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Post by zigra Thu May 07, 2015 11:51 am

Götze played more than 3000 minutes this season and apart from a couple of months at the start of the season he's been one big disappointment. Started in the last 4 games in the league aswell. Would've surprised me big time if Pep would've trusted him to start such an important game. Sorry but Götze simply needs to up his game if he wants to play in the big matches.
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Post by jibers Thu May 07, 2015 11:58 am

People really saying Pep is ovverated are truly just dumb. Ancelotti has reached 4 cl finals, Alex Ferguson (the supposed GOAT of GOATs) has reached 4 in 30+ years of management, Mourinho has reached 2 finals. The other problem here is that people are ovverating Bayern. Do you know how hard it is to reach a final and then win it? The whole treble by Juup Heynckes has distorted the view of Bayern around the world and even of Bayern management and a lot of their fans.

Bayern were fortunate to meet a Barcelona in dissaray that season with a Messi that was injured. The 7-0 result seems to be harped on about and brought up consistently. To put things in perspective, Barcelona that season at full strength were beaten by essentially Madrids reserve team convicngly before they faced Bayern. These things need to be looked at in context. Like last year BVB hammered Bayern 3-0 before they faced Madrid irrc so the Madrid result was not that much of a freak result as people make it out to be. Even the Bayern management like Paul Breitner seem to be so outspoken and arrogant, it's outrageous! Bayern are not some infallible super team ffs!

Pep could not have done more yesterday tbh. Bar the Muller sub as a few people have picked up on, and the first 10-15 minutes with the 3 man backline, Bayern played well. We can sit here and talk about systems and tactics but the fact is that Bayern had neither pace nor a direct dribbling threat, things you need to break defensive lines and play on the counter effectiveley which is what a lot of people wanted them to play. Without Robben, Ribey or even alaba through the centre or at LB they had no threat to Barcelona. It's obvious. Please tell me what Barcelona would do at this level without Messi, Neymar and Alves, or Madrid without CR, Marcelo and Benzema. Add the fact that the tie was decided by Messi's individual action and then the result is not that hard to phathom. People need to calm down a bit and realise that Messi in that form is unstoppable.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Thu May 07, 2015 12:19 pm

Not sure what subbing Muller has to do with Bayern defenders giving the ball to Messi 3 times in a row mind Laughing
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Post by farfan Thu May 07, 2015 12:30 pm

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Not sure what subbing Muller has to do with Bayern defenders giving the ball to Messi 3 times in a row mind Laughing


exactly Laughing

and it's not like Muller was setting the game on fire either .
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Post by free_cat Thu May 07, 2015 12:36 pm

Gotze was the only forward in his team who can drible a defender... and later he complained about missing 1vs1...

Another thing bayern could have done a lot more is overlap and cross, with Muller and Lewandowski as headers, they might have caused us danger.

Anyway, as you all know, I'm a big fan of Guardiola and I think he did what he could, but perhaps sometimes you need to be more pragmatic and recognize you are not at the level of the opposition team and can't play out and out.
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