why riquelme is so underrated in goallegacy?

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Post by guest_07 Mon 25 May - 8:22

MR BOND wrote:
guest_07 wrote:
MR BOND wrote: but the question is. would Liverpool have got 4th if we had riquelme this season cheers


probably, as long as you give him the role that he wanted, free role playmaker
jesus Christ would not have got us 4th this season mate. Laughing Laughing


how come you know it when you never try it

riquelme was the special one

did you know that his best goal came in 2012 when he was already 34 years old, mind you, he had so many superb goals in his entire career, & to me, scoring was his 3rd best skill

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Post by Unique Mon 25 May - 8:27

guest_07 wrote:
MR BOND wrote:
guest_07 wrote:


probably, as long as you give him the role that he wanted, free role playmaker
jesus Christ would not have got us 4th this season mate. Laughing Laughing


how come you know it when you never try it

riquelme was the special one

did you know that his best goal came in 2012 when he was already 34 years old
, mind you, he had so many superb goals in his entire career, & to me, scoring was his 3rd best skill
nope. I didn't know that.
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Post by guest_07 Mon 25 May - 8:31

MR BOND wrote:
guest_07 wrote:
MR BOND wrote:
jesus Christ would not have got us 4th this season mate. Laughing Laughing


how come you know it when you never try it

riquelme was the special one

did you know that his best goal came in 2012 when he was already 34 years old
, mind you, he had so many superb goals in his entire career, & to me, scoring was his 3rd best skill
nope. I didn't know that.



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Post by Unique Mon 25 May - 8:35

guest_07 wrote:
MR BOND wrote:
guest_07 wrote:


how come you know it when you never try it

riquelme was the special one

did you know that his best goal came in 2012 when he was already 34 years old
, mind you, he had so many superb goals in his entire career, & to me, scoring was his 3rd best skill
nope. I didn't know that.


tbf that was a cracker.
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Post by guest_07 Mon 25 May - 8:42

MR BOND wrote:
guest_07 wrote:
MR BOND wrote: nope. I didn't know that.


tbf that was a cracker.


to make it more interesting, that goal was a crucial one that sent out the 2012 club world cup champion, corinthians in libertadores qfinal, boca juniors managed to take revenge after loss to same team in 2012 libertadores final before that

(correction, that goal actually in 2013 & riquelme aged 35 years old)

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Post by Lord Awesome Mon 25 May - 10:58

titosantill wrote:smh, okay, i'm seeing names like walter samuel (flopped at madrid, though to be fair to him did well in serie a) , valeron, ayala, riquelme etc. how do you expect any of these guys to be rated? if you're a depor, valencia, or boca fan obviously you'll rate them highly and you have every right to, but when you all say "underrated" i hope you don't mean that their names should be at the top echelon of footballers.

that term is so broad, underrated in relation to what? when valeron was at his peak he was fantastic, and it left an impression for depor fans, but was it enough to garner the attention of a broader audience? and btw all those names, even on their teams (maybe besides riquelme), there are people i'd rate above them as more influential.

if you mean they are 'underrated' because as good as they are they seem largely forgotten, then yes, that may be true, and its not just them, on those teams that had those players you had guys like djalminha, roy makaay, tristan, mendieta, aimar, baraja, vicente, rufete, chivu, cordoba, and the list goes on. if you mean 'underrated' from the standpoint that they should be considered better than others who made moves at the elite level, then that i would have to disagree with....


Not better but around the same level.

I'm a bit iffy on Rufete and Djalminha being consider elite from that list tho.

But as for everyone else I feel they could be talked about in the same breath as say Pires, Ibra, Totti, and the like. I'm only judging by sheer capabilities of the players and not their trophies they may or may not have won.


Last edited by Lord Awesome on Mon 25 May - 11:10; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Robespierre Mon 25 May - 11:08

titosantill wrote:smh, okay, i'm seeing names like walter samuel (flopped at madrid, though to be fair to him did well in serie a) , valeron, ayala, riquelme etc. how do you expect any of these guys to be rated? if you're a depor, valencia, or boca fan obviously you'll rate them highly and you have every right to, but when you all say "underrated" i hope you don't mean that their names should be at the top echelon of footballers.

that term is so broad, underrated in relation to what? when valeron was at his peak he was fantastic, and it left an impression for depor fans, but was it enough to garner the attention of a broader audience? and btw all those names, even on their teams (maybe besides riquelme), there are people i'd rate above them as more influential.

if you mean they are 'underrated' because as good as they are they seem largely forgotten, then yes, that may be true, and its not just them, on those teams that had those players you had guys like djalminha, roy makaay, tristan, mendieta, aimar, baraja, vicente, rufete, chivu, cordoba, and the list goes on. if you mean 'underrated' from the standpoint that they should be considered better than others who made moves at the elite level, then that i would have to disagree with....

btw veron for some reason is being slandered here, once again, veron and riquelme, two different positions. riquelme attacking mid, veron central mid. from an offensive standpoint, it might be best to go with riquelme, but veron i think had the better peak and i might lean towards veron's value at parma and lazio over riquelme's .....as far as the national team goes, i think riquelme had more influence than veron......difficult to argue between the two though, different positions and neither won anything major with the national team (as far as world cups and copa americas)...veron did flop in 02 tho


It is not because of Samuel if Real Madrid was a circus in 2004  with a team built  with No balance Laughing
It is not because of Samuel , it is because of Real Madrid. You ruined him, simply.
But yes , Metzelder and Gravesen were better.
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Post by guest_07 Mon 25 May - 17:55

Lord Awesome wrote:
titosantill wrote:smh, okay, i'm seeing names like walter samuel (flopped at madrid, though to be fair to him did well in serie a) , valeron, ayala, riquelme etc. how do you expect any of these guys to be rated? if you're a depor, valencia, or boca fan obviously you'll rate them highly and you have every right to, but when you all say "underrated" i hope you don't mean that their names should be at the top echelon of footballers.

that term is so broad, underrated in relation to what? when valeron was at his peak he was fantastic, and it left an impression for depor fans, but was it enough to garner the attention of a broader audience? and btw all those names, even on their teams (maybe besides riquelme), there are people i'd rate above them as more influential.

if you mean they are 'underrated' because as good as they are they seem largely forgotten, then yes, that may be true, and its not just them, on those teams that had those players you had guys like djalminha, roy makaay, tristan, mendieta, aimar, baraja, vicente, rufete, chivu, cordoba, and the list goes on. if you mean 'underrated' from the standpoint that they should be considered better than others who made moves at the elite level, then that i would have to disagree with....


Not better but around the same level.

I'm a bit iffy on Rufete and Djalminha being consider elite from that list tho.

But as for everyone else I feel they could be talked about in the same breath as say Pires, Ibra, Totti, and the like. I'm only judging by sheer capabilities of the players and not their trophies they may or may not have won.

that's is the correct thinking, player should be judge on their ability, trophies just a surplus

team won you the trophy, best player just a part of it

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Post by guest_07 Mon 25 May - 17:58

Robespierre wrote:
titosantill wrote:smh, okay, i'm seeing names like walter samuel (flopped at madrid, though to be fair to him did well in serie a) , valeron, ayala, riquelme etc. how do you expect any of these guys to be rated? if you're a depor, valencia, or boca fan obviously you'll rate them highly and you have every right to, but when you all say "underrated" i hope you don't mean that their names should be at the top echelon of footballers.

that term is so broad, underrated in relation to what? when valeron was at his peak he was fantastic, and it left an impression for depor fans, but was it enough to garner the attention of a broader audience? and btw all those names, even on their teams (maybe besides riquelme), there are people i'd rate above them as more influential.

if you mean they are 'underrated' because as good as they are they seem largely forgotten, then yes, that may be true, and its not just them, on those teams that had those players you had guys like djalminha, roy makaay, tristan, mendieta, aimar, baraja, vicente, rufete, chivu, cordoba, and the list goes on. if you mean 'underrated' from the standpoint that they should be considered better than others who made moves at the elite level, then that i would have to disagree with....

btw veron for some reason is being slandered here, once again, veron and riquelme, two different positions. riquelme attacking mid, veron central mid. from an offensive standpoint, it might be best to go with riquelme, but veron i think had the better peak and i might lean towards veron's value at parma and lazio over riquelme's .....as far as the national team goes, i think riquelme had more influence than veron......difficult to argue between the two though, different positions and neither won anything major with the national team (as far as world cups and copa americas)...veron did flop in 02 tho


It is not because of Samuel if Real Madrid was a circus in 2004  with a team built  with No balance Laughing
It is not because of Samuel , it is because of Real Madrid. You ruined him, simply.
But yes , Metzelder and Gravesen were better.

walter samuel was not called "the wall" without reason

however real succeed in breaking that wall, pity

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Post by titosantill Mon 25 May - 18:14

@lordawesome, i agree with those people being on a similar level to pires, ibra, totti et al (i might rank totti above them, but i won't put him on the upper echelon) . @robespierre, we take full responsibility for samuel, it was a tough time for anyone to join madrid, that team needed a disciplinarian, hence capello....lol gravesen, woodgate, pavon, diogo, memories

if you judge players solely on ability, recoba might be the best player of all time, whilst he definitely has more talent and abilities than a lot of players, there are way too many guys i'd pick before even considering recoba, if i'm building a team, hence why we look at a player's value to a team in terms of him bringing success (not necessarily just taking titles at face value, considering there are scrubs who were lucky to be on certain championship teams)
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Post by guest_07 Mon 25 May - 18:23

titosantill wrote:@lordawesome, i agree with those people being on a similar level to pires, ibra, totti et al (i might rank totti above them, but i won't put him on the upper echelon) . @robespierre, we take full responsibility for samuel, it was a tough time for anyone to join madrid, that team needed a disciplinarian, hence capello....lol gravesen, woodgate, pavon, diogo, memories

if you judge players solely on ability, recoba might be the best player of all time, whilst he definitely has more talent and abilities than a lot of players, there are way too many guys i'd pick before even considering recoba, if i'm building a team, hence why we look at a player's value to a team in terms of him bringing success (not necessarily just taking titles at face value, considering there are scrubs who were lucky to be on certain championship teams)


but to me, riquelme was more consistent than recoba, & by the way, riquelme always stand out above recoba every time they met

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Post by titosantill Mon 25 May - 18:43

exactly, which is one of the reasons there are other people i'd consider on my team. the recoba example wasn't necessarily a comparison but rather an example to show one can have the talent and ability, but what we crave is to see that exhibited consistently and at the highest level of the sport
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Post by guest_07 Mon 25 May - 18:56

titosantill wrote:exactly, which is one of the reasons there are other people i'd consider on my team. the recoba example wasn't necessarily a comparison but rather an example to show one can have  the talent and ability, but what we crave is to see that exhibited consistently and at the highest level of the sport


what make me sad when i talk about riquelme as one of the best playmaker in football history, others called me hipster & delusion

very good player can't almost produce superb performance every time against the very best

the special one would

riquelme was one of them

to him, to beat the very best, is not necessary by playing with big team, any team can, not just beat the very best, but beat with style, that is awesome

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Post by guest_07 Wed 27 May - 13:44

riquelme stat AS KEY PLAYER in MAIN KNOCKOUT TOURNAMENT:

1) 20 y.o. = boca juniors = 1998 world cup u20 = WON IT

2) 22 y.o. = boca juniors = 2000 libertadores cup = WON IT

3) 23 y.o. = boca juniors = 2001 libertadores cup = WON IT

4) 26 y.o. = villarreal = 2004 uefa cup = semifinalist

5) 27 y.o. = villarreal = 2005 uefa cup = quarterfinalist

6) 28 y.o. = villarreal = 2006 champions league = semifinalist
= argentina = 2006 world cup = quarterfinalist

7) 29 y.o. = boca juniors = 2007 libertadores cup = WON IT
= argentina = 2007 copa america = FINALIST

Cool 30 y.o. = boca juniors = 2008 libertadores cup = semifinalist
= argentina = 2008 olympic football = WON IT

9) 31 y.o. = boca juniors = 2009 libertadores cup = round 16

10) 34 y.o. = boca juniors = 2012 libertadores cup = FINALIST

11) 35 y.o. = boca juniors = 2013 libertadores cup = quarterfinalist

stat:
5 times champion
2 times finalist
3 times semifinalist
3 times quarterfinalist
1 time round 16

NEVER PLAYED AS KEY PLAYER IN THE TEAM THAT LOSS IN THE FIRST STAGE OF MAIN KNOCKOUT TOURNAMENT

meanwhile, one of his rival:

a) xavi hernandez
1) lost in group stage in 2001 cl (barca)
2) lost in group stage in 2014 wc (spain)


Last edited by guest_07 on Wed 27 May - 13:50; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Freeza Wed 27 May - 13:46

Important trophies won = 0
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Post by guest_07 Wed 27 May - 13:47

Freeza wrote:Important trophies won = 0


1 player can win you trophy, freeza logic

LOL

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Post by Freeza Wed 27 May - 13:50

guest_07 wrote:
Freeza wrote:Important trophies won = 0


1 player can win you trophy, freeza logic

LOL


If that's not your point. Then why are you posting which he did win?
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Post by guest_07 Wed 27 May - 13:52

Freeza wrote:
guest_07 wrote:
Freeza wrote:Important trophies won = 0


1 player can win you trophy, freeza logic

LOL


If that's not your point. Then why are you posting which he did win?


ok, i'm sorry, i'm wrong here

peace

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Post by BarrileteCosmico Wed 27 May - 13:54

Freeza wrote:Important trophies won = 0
Uhh... he won 3 libertadores. That is insane.
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Post by guest_07 Wed 27 May - 13:56

BarrileteCosmico wrote:
Freeza wrote:Important trophies won = 0
Uhh... he won 3 libertadores. That is insane.


how to convince non-south american people?

the chance is close to zero (my speculation)

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Post by guest_07 Wed 27 May - 15:50

i just saw "Banega and Bale vs Riquelme" thread but the thread already locked

this is a handicap match, not fair!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

tbh, what a wonderful idea, creativity at the highest level, first time i seen "vs" thread that include tag team vs 1, lol

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Post by billy_gr Thu 28 May - 0:55

Just playing along here:
Xavi wasn't a key player in 2001
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Post by Robespierre Thu 28 May - 10:55

Seriously I agree with Guest about Riquelme underrated on GL. hmm
Maybe because I know a good number of Riquelme fans who helped me to aprpeciate him
tbh I rate him as one of best players seen as insight into the game and creativeness . Pure class.
Seriously , BC, how many Argentinian trequartistas were of his level in last 15 years ? hmm
Besides his career is not so bad as some think . Best Boca Juniors player ever , hs World Cup was very good , Villareal experience was great, Barcellona .. I said before , when a South American meets Van Gaal...he is done.

Probably his main limit was about the fact you had to build the team around him so as to get his best, even more than the dynamisn probably

"Running, anybody can run, to play football is more complicated " ( J.R.R. )
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Post by guest_07 Thu 28 May - 16:11

billy_gr wrote:Just playing along here:
Xavi wasn't a key player in 2001


thanks for the enlightenment, billy_gr

his fan should know more than non one

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Post by zigra Thu 28 May - 16:46

Wtf is going on in this thread drunken
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Post by RealGunner Thu 28 May - 16:49

Guest_07, do you think Riquelme in WC2006 was more important than Messi in 2014?
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