Who is going to be next year's Dark Horse CL finalist?

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Post by BarrileteCosmico Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:28 pm

I fail to see how Madrid deserve to be up there with Barca/Bayern/Juve, even if they have knock out GOAT Benitez

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Post by Sri Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:30 pm

BORUSSIA!! wrote:arsenal get monaco last season and still get knocked out and there are still complaints about an unfair draw? and they wouldn't be getting bayern and barca if they can actually win their group.

their current team is nothing special and won't get fair in the CL. it could have potential to be if they actually did some spending on bringing in some quality players and they can afford to do so but they're too cheap and it's not gonna happen.

for now they're a side with a weak mentality and need a bit more quality. if any one of barca, bayern, both madrids, psg, chelsea, or juventus meets them, they would lose.

sevilla, man city, atletico. wolfsburg are all more likely to have a dark house run than arsenal.


I agree that we were lacking in mentality and we did absolutely mess up against Monaco and way at Dortmund. I was at the Signal Iduna that day and I know how it was. We also went on to finish 3rd, win another FA Cup and stay in the CL, unlike some other teams from last season. Just facts, mind you.

What I do not agree on is how special this team is, or not. Especially when you go on to talk about spending and how 'cheap' we are. Reality check, in case you have been living under a rock, the last couple of years. We were recently accused of 'trying to buy the league' and journalists and managers were asked to 'grab a calculator' to figure out 'pragmatically' what we've been spending.

We haven't splashed any money this summer, because there are genuinely few players available who will strengthen our current squad. And we spend sensibly, not 50m on a CB or a 20 year old for his potential.

Maybe we wouldn't win against Real Madrid, Barcelona or Bayern Munich. But rest assured, we will sure as hell give them a royal fight. The other names you mention are just that - names we are more than capable of matching punch for punch.

I am not sure if you are just hating or if that is a genuine opinion you have, based on your subjective assessment of Arsenal. Unfortunately, I find it very much lacking in logic and reason from where I stand. But hey, it is an online forum and you are more than welcome to your views. A good evening to you!

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Post by Sri Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:32 pm

RED wrote:Arsenal fans- the Messi of internet polls.


Unfortunately, it is also making people hate us wrongly Sad

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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:34 pm

Sevilla and Wolfsburg rofl

They will be lucky if they are not in the Europa League in the new year.
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Post by Jay29 Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:30 pm

Sevilla would probably prefer that tbh hmm

Seriously though, Sevilla are going to be at least third seeds, and if they get Zenit, PSV or even Befica from pot one they've got a good chance of getting through to the knockouts.

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Post by McLewis Fri Jul 31, 2015 9:05 pm

Love it that you think so highly of us, Viva, but pls go Laughing

I'll once again be happy if we can get out of the group stages, but a run to the final is quite improbable.
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Post by rwo power Fri Jul 31, 2015 9:08 pm

VivaStPauli wrote:Too early for Wolfsburg and BMG imho
Well, at least Gladbach know how to defeat Bayern even at the Allianz Arena, so if they survive the group stage, Bayern should hope not to run into them ^^

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Post by Hapless_Hans Fri Jul 31, 2015 9:20 pm

You can't compare league performances with CL.

Wolfsburg and Gladbach will fail with the usual mixture of being starstruck and overeager that CL newcomer teams display in their first season.
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Post by Dnmac4 Fri Jul 31, 2015 9:32 pm

srigooner wrote:
BORUSSIA!! wrote:arsenal get monaco last season and still get knocked out and there are still complaints about an unfair draw? and they wouldn't be getting bayern and barca if they can actually win their group.

their current team is nothing special and won't get fair in the CL. it could have potential to be if they actually did some spending on bringing in some quality players and they can afford to do so but they're too cheap and it's not gonna happen.

for now they're a side with a weak mentality and need a bit more quality. if any one of barca, bayern, both madrids, psg, chelsea, or juventus meets them, they would lose.

sevilla, man city, atletico. wolfsburg are all more likely to have a dark house run than arsenal.


I agree that we were lacking in mentality and we did absolutely mess up against Monaco and way at Dortmund. I was at the Signal Iduna that day and I know how it was. We also went on to finish 3rd, win another FA Cup and stay in the CL, unlike some other teams from last season. Just facts, mind you.

What I do not agree on is how special this team is, or not. Especially when you go on to talk about spending and how 'cheap' we are. Reality check, in case you have been living under a rock, the last couple of years. We were recently accused of 'trying to buy the league' and journalists and managers were asked to 'grab a calculator' to figure out 'pragmatically' what we've been spending.

We haven't splashed any money this summer, because there are genuinely few players available who will strengthen our current squad. And we spend sensibly, not 50m on a CB or a 20 year old for his potential.

Maybe we wouldn't win against Real Madrid, Barcelona or Bayern Munich. But rest assured, we will sure as hell give them a royal fight. The other names you mention are just that - names we are more than capable of matching punch for punch.

I am not sure if you are just hating or if that is a genuine opinion you have, based on your subjective assessment of Arsenal. Unfortunately, I find it very much lacking in logic and reason from where I stand. But hey, it is an online forum and you are more than welcome to your views. A good evening to you!


I don't see any reasonable way Arsenal would beat Atletico in a two legged affair.

Cholo ran circles around Mou and would do the same to Wenger, not to mention IMO they have a better team.
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Post by Dnmac4 Fri Jul 31, 2015 9:37 pm

And BTW the answer to this question is Atletico.

By the knockout rounds of the CL this Atletico team is going to be deadly. Cholo will have them humming by mid-season, probably too late to challenge for La Liga since Real and Barca make dropping points so hard to make up.

But this team is as stubborn as a mule in a knockout competition.

Love there purchases and more importantly who they didn't sell.

Only Spanish teams can knock them out these days.
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Post by VivaStPauli Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:12 pm

Hapless_Hans wrote:Wolfsburg and Gladbach will fail with the usual mixture of being starstruck and overeager that CL newcomer teams display in their first season.


I will put money on BMG having no such problems. Wolfsburg, yes, they will underperform. But if Gladbach go out, it will be because their squad lacks quality and/or depth, I do not see them breaking down mentally. They for some magical reason seem to lack the small club mentality many BL clubs seem to have. Maybe they're still proud from their run of form in the '70s.
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Post by El Gunner Fri Jul 31, 2015 11:18 pm

How are Chelsea dark horses can someone pls explain hmm
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Post by LeVersacci Fri Jul 31, 2015 11:50 pm

Arsenal. Think they'll surprise us this time in CL.
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Post by Kaladin Sat Aug 01, 2015 12:18 am

PSG imo
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Sat Aug 01, 2015 12:30 am

Can anyone that regularly reaches quarters be called a dark horse, really? Other than Arsenal and Valencia, of course.
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Post by Myesyats Sat Aug 01, 2015 12:38 am

El Shaarawy wrote:PSG imo

woah completely missed out on this one, not even in the pool.

good call sir

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Post by Adit Sat Aug 01, 2015 2:01 am

While Arsenal do have a chance most neutrals wont favor arsenal against Teams like PSG,Chelsea,Atletico and Juventus. Over the years they have given us the impression that they dont have necessary top class tactician nor mentality to play these kind of tough big CL games.
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Post by InteristAli Sat Aug 01, 2015 2:09 am

Sorry but I dont see how arsenal were unlucky in the champions except for 11-12 season.. every other season they had a chance of winning their group, once against dortmund(you can argue that getting them in the group stages was unlucky though), once against freaking schalke

Then last year they win their group... And they lose to a weak team, so the unlucky argument doesn't hold much. I think, as many stated, they are weak mentally because they have a pretty good team..
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Post by futbol Sat Aug 01, 2015 4:40 am

El Gunner wrote:How are Chelsea dark horses can someone pls explain hmm


Cesc Fabregas is starting in their midfield. With someone else, anyone else, they'd be among Bayern/Madrid/Barca. But not like this. hmm

El Shaarawy wrote:PSG imo



Completely forgot about them. Sad

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Post by Sri Sat Aug 01, 2015 7:50 am

Dnmac4 wrote:
srigooner wrote:But hey, it is an online forum and you are more than welcome to your views. A good evening to you!

I don't see any reasonable way Arsenal would beat Atletico in a two legged affair.

Cholo ran circles around Mou and would do the same to Wenger, not to mention IMO they have a better team.

Already have a reply to your post in my previous one. That said, I do massively respect what Atletico have been doing the last few years.


Adit wrote:While Arsenal do have a chance most neutrals wont favor arsenal against Teams like PSG,Chelsea,Atletico and Juventus. Over the years they have given us the impression that they dont have necessary top class tactician nor mentality to play these kind of tough big CL games.

InteristAli wrote:Sorry but I dont see how arsenal were unlucky in the champions except for 11-12 season.. every other season they had a chance of winning their group, once against dortmund(you can argue that getting them in the group stages was unlucky though), once against freaking schalke

Then last year they win their group... And they lose to a weak team, so the unlucky argument doesn't hold much. I think, as many stated, they are weak mentally because they have a pretty good team..

More than tactics, I'd say it was a mixture of lack of experience and mentality. We did beat Barcelona, Bayern and AC Milan in one leg each, but lacked the consistency to do it over two - especially since we jacked up the first leg in most cases. This was also the case against Monaco. The one time we took a lead to Camp Nou, we spectacularly blew it up with our 'captain' getting a very dodgy red for dissent and Lord Bendtner coming on and hammering row Z.

I don't believe in luck - you make your own luck and all that. However, some, if not all the fault, were also a consequence of the circumstances we found ourselves in. Our poor performance over the years in CL have rightly seen us being pushed down to Pot 2; we deserve that.

As to why I insist that things are different now and mentality was a thing of the past:

Stability in the squad. It is the second year in a row that we have kept this team together and added where we were deficient. These guys know each other better and they also have won things together. Winning big games away at City and Old Trafford, or coming from behind to break our trophy drought at Wembley - these are but small indicators of a stronger mentality. I don't expect us to self-destruct, the way our young teams used to do in 2007-08 or 2010-11 when we were challenging for top honours. Not to forget, these guys are all a year older and hopefully, a bit wiser for that.

Maybe it is still a psychological/mental barrier. We will see if/how these guys break it this year. If they do, then rest assured, we will be a tough team to reckon with in Europe. If they don't, there are enough tried and tested pitchforks ready for the witchhunt. Thumbs up


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Post by Kaladin Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:49 am

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Can anyone that regularly reaches quarters be called a dark horse, really? Other than Arsenal and Valencia, of course.


Maybe, but i just assumed that teams that don't make semis regularly can be labelled dark horses. Besides, do you think they have what it takes to be able to exceed their annual pit stop at quarters? Its possible, but there are other teams that have more chances of making semis imo
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Post by McAgger Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:54 am

Sevilla
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Post by Robespierre Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:54 am

futbol wrote:
El Gunner wrote:How are Chelsea dark horses can someone pls explain hmm


Cesc Fabregas is starting in their midfield. With someone else, anyone else, they'd be among Bayern/Madrid/Barca. But not like this. hmm



Laughing
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Post by Robespierre Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:56 am

Who voted Lazio ? I think they will lose even the play off and anyway if they'll get in , they will be knocked out hmm

Spoiler:
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Post by M99 Sat Aug 01, 2015 11:28 am

Robespierre wrote:Who voted Lazio ? I think they will lose even the play off and anyway if they'll get in , they will be knocked out hmm

Spoiler:


M99 wrote:Lazio imo. Messi will lead Barca to another CL win and be the best player of the tournament with Felipe Anderson being a distant second.

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Post by RED Sat Aug 01, 2015 12:20 pm

On that list, I'm going with either Chelsea or Atletico.

Voted for Atletico
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