Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by RealGunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:53 pm

Damn, good shout

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:56 pm

@ES wrote:The Boss (Anti-Villain)


Inb4 Reddit theories that he isn't an Anti-Villain and we argue about it for the next 10 pages.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by RealGunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:57 pm

It's a she. And they already have Laughing


But Big Boss is more of an Anti-Hero/Villain than The Boss
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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:01 pm

Oh i was thinking of Big Boss.

@RealGunner wrote:And they already have Laughing


Why does this not surprise me Laughing

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by El Gunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:01 pm

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:
@El Gunner wrote:
So are you telling me Dexter Morgan doesn't count?

Not really. He kills the bad guys who escaped the sword of justice. That makes him sort of like a modern day Batman. Plus, I think he would get murdered within seconds if he was to go up against Mikkelsen's Hannibal. He's not even the baddest and most intelligent in his own category let alone overall.

That qualifies as antihero

Dexter not one of the baddest and most intelligent? rofl He has better improvisational skills than your boy Chigurh.
Don't know about Mads' Hannibal, so couldn't say.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by ES on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:02 pm

BB is one of the hardest to judge tbh, \9Ocelot as well to an extent), he's really open to interpretation

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by Freeza on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:04 pm

An anti-hero is basically a protagonist that do unmorally things to achieve personal gain, but does some justice while doing those things.

A lot of the difference in this is that a villain is a lot black/white and an anti-hero usually the protagonist, where the villain is an antagonist.

Dexter is def an anti-hero.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:06 pm

How would you define Frank Underwood hmm

Seems to come under a lot of what Freeza said but i'm not so sure about the justice part.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:07 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Walter White is the ultimate anti-hero

Hands down the most intelligent one. If he was a character in GoT, he would kill everybody with ricin and become the lord of the seven kingdoms in a week.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by Freeza on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:09 pm

@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:How would you define Frank Underwood hmm

Seems to come under a lot of what Freeza said but i'm not so sure about the justice part.


I would say he fit perfect. He does get some good political things through (or not through, but tries) even though it's for his own personal gain, which fits the criteria. The justice part doesn't always have to be something that is happening.

Underwood fits perfectly.

The definitions are not perfectly set, from what I'm reading. But basically an anti-hero is someone in the Punisher/Batman mode and a villain is The Joker etc. it's a lot about if they have some humanity left, and why they do why they do. Villains are mostly pure evil and not much gray.

BB isn't really the most intelligent one. Wouldn't bet on him against Lex Luthor tbh hmm

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by RealGunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:13 pm

Frank Underwood seems more like a Villain than an anti-hero.


Dexter is definitely one of the most intelligent characters and a badass, however he was never deemed as an anti-hero. Always came across as the hero as he was batman with kills.

But many considers batman to be an anti-hero so there is that


Big Boss has an IQ of over 160. One of the smartest persons in the game. But then it's not really fair comparing MGS universe to comic book universe. Lex is obviously written more intelligent.


Last edited by RealGunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by El Gunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:14 pm

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:
@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Walter White is the ultimate anti-hero

Hands down the most intelligent one. If he was a character in GoT, he would kill everybody with ricin and become the lord of the seven kingdoms in a week.
pls Walter would never kill a young boy, so Olly would dispose off him quickly imo

@Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:How would you define Frank Underwood hmm

Seems to come under a lot of what Freeza said but i'm not so sure about the justice part.

Definitely an anti-hero as well. Politicians, although mostly liars and egoists, do know there always comes a time when you have to do the right thing to satisfy the public and Underwood as done a few good things in the name of 'Murica as well.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:16 pm

I'd argue most of those things were done to satisfy his own personal gain though hmm

It just so happened that they also managed to be good for the country overall or seemingly so in the stories arc.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by RealGunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:16 pm

How is Frank an anti-hero when he kills innocents without hesitation and couldn't care less about anyone, including his own wife as long as he gets what he wants?

If he was to pass a bill for a genocide of a country for his own gain, he won't hesitate for a second.
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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by McLewis on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:17 pm

For villains, think I will go with Amon Goeth from Schindler's List. Terrifying character from Ralph Fiennes. Gary Oldman as Norman Stanfield in Leon was very close 2nd as he's equally as terrifying, but has slightly more humanity.

For anti-heroes, it's Edward Norton as Derek in American History X, without a doubt. Phenomenal character. Loved him.


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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by Freeza on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:21 pm

@RealGunner wrote:How is Frank an anti-hero when he kills innocents without hesitation and couldn't care less about anyone, including his own wife as long as he gets what he wants?

If he was to pass a bill for a genocide of a country for his own gain, he won't hesitate for a second.


Maybe he was like that in the start. Season 3 really changed his character. He was very protective of his wife etc. They changed him and made him somewhat humane. He's in a very gray area though.

Villains aren't really something that exists in a realistic show, or a show that aspires to be it. But he is close. A villain is basically, from the definition, someone who does bad to do bad things

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by El Gunner on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:27 pm

@RealGunner wrote:How is Frank an anti-hero when he kills innocents without hesitation and couldn't care less about anyone, including his own wife as long as he gets what he wants?

If he was to pass a bill for a genocide of a country for his own gain, he won't hesitate for a second.

It's tricky with him I agree, what drives him are nothing but personal motivations. But then you also have to consider he is the protagonist of his story and he does eventually make right decisions sometimes in the eye of the public, doesn't matter if he makes said decisions more to satisfy his personal gain than anything else. Just think back over the seasons, there were times when Underwood had to step back, revise and rethink things and make a decision that wasn't all for him or what he wanted in the first place. He definitely has a conscience and an intelligent mind, instead of being just pure reckless and evil. His murders also have reasons behind them, and they are all because of the reason that he has a certain goal in mind, he is just hella ambitious!
Certainly doesn't qualify in the area of pure evil and against good which is considered the main traits of villains.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:32 pm

The moment that changed Frank from being an antihero to a straight-up villain was Russo's murder.

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Re: Your Favorite Villain/Antihero

Post by M99 on Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:44 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Walter White is the ultimate anti-hero


Bingo. Surprised it took this long.

Ultimate anti-hero of TV for me. All he did, he did for his family. But in the last season you could see that his unfulfilled  ego and dissatisfactory life played a huge part in turning him into who he was. But he still showed loyalty and love to his family (and Jesse who basically was his second son) until the very end, even Hank.

Light Yagami stands as the best anti hero in anime for me. You could see that his ideology was clearly working. The crime rate fell by 80% worldwide, major wars all stopped and he gained a lot of loyal followers. After his death the world reverted back to it's previous rotten stage. Yet he was a monster. This is the guy who was ready to kill his own sister to save his skin (one could argue it was a necessary sacrifice for the greater good) and killed a lot of innocents (though those people all threatened to sabotage his mission).

In gaming it's clearly Revolver Ocelot for me. He basically followed the footsteps of his mother but on the way he killed, tortured, lied, double crossed, triple crossed but he ends up saving the world. Scumbag that turns out to be savior. Kojima's best written character after Big Boss (who I still consider a hero, I have not played MGS5 yet).

Also if you consider the events of MGS4 you realize that Solidus Snake was 100% right and you only killed him because you were a puppet following the orders of the Patriot. He is definitely an anti-hero or anti-villain. Not Liquid tho. That guy is just nuts.

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