Winter Transfer rumors

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Post by Valkyrja Fri Jan 01, 2016 2:17 pm

Pogba is Barca bound. Frankly we don't need another midfielder. Our midfield is good. We don't need anyone tbh, even if CR leaves (hopefully). We need a smart coach. We'll see in the next month if Rafa is one

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Post by futbol_bill Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:50 pm

sportsczy wrote:We're trying to hijack Pogba away from Barca in the summer... but i think we'll fail.  Madrid has fallen off big time in Pogba's mind.  If Pep lands at Man City, i think they have the best shot to get Pogba away from Barca.

This changes if Zidane becomes the coach of course.  In fact, i have a feeling a lot will change in the summer:
-  Ronaldo will get sold
-  Zidane will become the coach
-  Pogba will then come to Madrid
-  We'll shift to a diamond 442 with Kroos playing deep, Pogba/Modric on the sides and one of James or Isco playing on top of the diamond.  Bale/Benzema as the strikers.
-  Carvajal would get the nod at RB without the shadow of a doubt...  although a friend of mine in footy mentioned that Madrid were looking at Candreva and making him into a RB.  Strange but whatever.  If that happened, all our CBs deserve a raise for hardship Laughing


Sports, you may be right (or maybe not), but I believe it really doesn't matter what changes are made as we still end up inferior to the Barcas and Bayerns unless Perez goes.

futbol_bill wrote:I agree with the statements about Benitez's failed tactics and also it doesn't really matter who starts. But the problem will not get better with another coaching change (with better tactics) as long as Perez continues. When and if they sell Ronaldo, he will just bring in another perceived galactico and we will continue to play a formation without the use of AMs. As long as they try the 3 forwards, that are vastly inferior to Barca's front three, we have no hope.

The time has come for Flo to recognize his short comings, either give up the presidency or hand over futbol responsibilities to competent people.

We have talent in all areas of the field, it's just that we don't play the best tactics for the talent we have, particularly in regards to AMs.

The best thing that could happen, if Perez would finally see the light of day would be to get rid of the entire BBC, thoroughly assess our needs and what tactics are best, get a coach that will best suit this change in tactics, and sign based on team needs not any more "marketing" purchases. ...... but we know none of that will happen!!


We don't really need a Pogba. What I believe we need (assuming of course that Perez goes and a decent coach comes in) is get rid of BBC and Danilo, bring in a proven CF, competent backup laterals. We don't necessarily need more midfielders nor replacements for Bale nor Ronaldo. I would like the Sporting director and new coach to assess what tactics / formation to play and what are the team needs based on that. You also have to keep in mind that we have several promising youth under our belt now (with Ceballos still to be signed) that some of them will eventually make it to the first team. Again the problem isn't talent it's wrong formation / tactics for personnel we do have, that we can't compete with Barcelona and their front three with the same tactics as them when our front three is so vastly inferior, that we need a differing tactics to overcome them.

Just take a look at our last man on the roster - Denis. Villareal who is only a couple of points behind us want him (so does Valencia) and he would be a sure starter and key player for them, yet he is deemed not good enough for us!!! What bullshit - it's a case of having players on team that don't suit the tactics or being stuck behind full time starters.
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Post by sportsczy Fri Jan 01, 2016 6:42 pm

It depends what we're looking to run Bill. I don't think you can dominate football in Europe without 3 very good CMs... not converted wingers or AMs... but honest to goodness CMs. They also need to be complementary.

Casemiro is a possibility as the deep lying mid... but he can't be on a side. Doesn't have the skill. So that would push Kroos up to one side and i don't think he has the athleticism to do it anymore. He needs to play deeper (by his own admission) so he has more space to operate (like Alonso).

The other thing is that you DON'T WANT Pogba to end up at Barca. Busquets-Pogba-Rakitic would be absolutely devastating and perfectly balanced. At least with Iniesta there, you can count on injuries and inconsistency given his recent history and age... but with those 3, you have no hope. Very young too.

Busquets
Rakitic-Pogba
Suarez-Messi-Neymar

Might as well stop playing the games.
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Post by Mr Nick09 Fri Jan 01, 2016 7:16 pm

As it is right now, i would rather have a midfield of Pogba-kroos-modric than isco/james-kroos-modric.

i thought we went over this already, our midfield currently does not make sense.
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Post by futbol_bill Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:10 pm

With BBC, I would agree, but I would hope we can get rid of BBC, use a configuration that would use the talent we already have especially AMs.

But if they continue with BBC (who are vastly inferior to Barca's front three), we should get sell Isco, James and Asensio, get someone like Pogba trying to beef up the midfield, but in that case you also need to replace Kroos with a more solid defender plus a good passer, someone like Busquets or Javi Martinez. But of course none of this is going to happen. So I repeat we are doomed as long as Perez persists.
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Post by Adit Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:25 pm

Pogba instead of James doesn't really make any difference as long as BBC plays. He just like James is a superstar. A 120 mill player. Good luck getting him defend for bbc. He won't, and more problems of accommodating him. No thanks. I would rather put Kovacic there if BBC is here to stay.
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Post by Adit Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:26 pm

Futbol bill

Why did Socios vote for the change of revenue for president candidate?
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Post by Valkyrja Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:27 pm

I'd rather sell Kroos than Isco, and buy a great DM. I personally don't like Kroos-Modric as the attacking midfielders. Isco is at his best as a LCM, the advanced center midfielder. He's not an AM who plays behind the striker like Ozil or James. IMO he's a must in a 433
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Post by Mr Nick09 Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:37 pm


Adit wrote:Pogba instead of James doesn't really make any difference as long as BBC plays. He just like James is a superstar. A 120 mill player. Good luck getting him defend for bbc. He won't, and more problems of accommodating him. No thanks. I would rather put Kovacic there if BBC is here to stay.


I disagree with you. For one he is a natural midfielder with athletic abilities James can only dream of. He would do perfectly fine, way better than James in terms of balance and such.

Pogba covers a lot of ground as a player, he is a box to ox ad it's valuable.
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Post by Valkyrja Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:42 pm

Buy Pogba, another galactico Laughing
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Post by Mr Nick09 Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:50 pm

What's the issue here that we have galacticos or that we have players that dont fit how we play and are galacticos?
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Post by Valkyrja Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:59 pm

Mr Nick09 wrote:What's the issue here that we have galacticos or that we have players that dont fit how we play and are galacticos?


The problem isn't necessarily the current team, the players we have at the moment. It's an internal problem, Perez' mentality. He improved since his first stint but the core it's still there. As long as Perez continues with his philosophy we'll never have a real team. Morientes said a few years ago that after the UCL win in 00 everything changed in the dressing room. Players like him were feeling inferior. That's what's happening now
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Post by Mr Nick09 Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:10 pm

Perez will go and others will come and continue to sign big players just like barca do, just like other big clubs do.

Our problem is that we dont think about what we want to be as a team first, before signing. Our obliged 1st XI looks looks comical because these guys are not supposed to play together.

Other teams like Barca know that they play 433, so they sign players accordingly. They wont sign players that dont fit their scheme and they dont double up recruits on the same position like morons.

There is nothing wrong with galacticos, but when you have BBC and James, if you want them to be the stars, then go sign two box to box high volume mids to back them up, Not Modric and Kroos. If you want to play 433, then dont sign James because he is not a winger, and he is not an interior.

We should have never signed James in the first place, it's not like he is a game changer anyway, or is so good that the team cant do without him. Just for the sake of this argument, if we had Pogba as opposed to James in the squad right now, i would argue we would have less problems finding balance just like when Di Maria was our LCM.

James right now doesnt fit anything that we do when BBC are around, and if i have to use last season again as an example, he peaked with us playing right attacking midfielder in a 442. Everything else he has done is rather forgettable as far as i am concerned.



Last edited by Mr Nick09 on Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Adit Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:12 pm

Mr Nick09 wrote:
Adit wrote:Pogba instead of James doesn't really make any difference as long as BBC plays. He just like James is a superstar. A 120 mill player. Good luck getting him defend for bbc. He won't, and more problems of accommodating him. No thanks. I would rather put Kovacic there if  BBC is here to stay.


I disagree with you. For one he is a natural midfielder with athletic abilities James can only dream of. He would do perfectly fine, way better than James in terms of balance and such.

Pogba covers a lot of ground as a player, he is a box to ox ad it's valuable.


Box to ox lmao


Btw I don't think so. He will provide the balance on the ball and probably a better defensive pressure but you are vastly under estimating the demand of that position.

If you played football you will know that covering for a teammate who never defends is the thing that makes you angry. At times you will get fed up and begin to shout at him. Pogba will come with a 120 mill price tag, a superstar. He will have hard time comprehending why he is running all the time defensively and not offensively. Let's not forget that Di Maria's main job was defending, not supporting attack or creating chances but defending. Running alot back and forth. He sacrificed his own game for that. That is something very difficult to expect from Pogba.. He is an ambitious kid who is probably looking at balondor podium not some one who wants to spend his 80% of the energy defending.


Last edited by Adit on Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:16 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by Valkyrja Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:13 pm

Tbh if all our players had Arbeloa's or Marcelo's mentality for example, we'd have won much more trophies in the last years. In fact there's more than half a team I wouldn't give a shit about if they left.
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Post by Mr Nick09 Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:22 pm

Adit wrote:
Mr Nick09 wrote:
Adit wrote:Pogba instead of James doesn't really make any difference as long as BBC plays. He just like James is a superstar. A 120 mill player. Good luck getting him defend for bbc. He won't, and more problems of accommodating him. No thanks. I would rather put Kovacic there if  BBC is here to stay.


I disagree with you. For one he is a natural midfielder with athletic abilities James can only dream of. He would do perfectly fine, way better than James in terms of balance and such.

Pogba covers a lot of ground as a player, he is a box to ox ad it's valuable.


Box to ox lmao


Btw I don't think so. He will provide the balance on the ball and probably a better defensive pressure but you are vastly understanding the demand of that position.

If you played football you will know that covering for a teammate who never defends is the thing that makes you angry. At times you will get fed up and begin to shout at him. Pogba will come with a 120 mill price tag, a superstar. He will have hard time comprehending why he is running all the time defensively and not offensively. Let's not forget that Di Maria's main job was defending, not supporting attack or creating chances but defending. Running alot back and forth. He sacrificed his own game for that. That is something very difficult to expect from Pogba.. He is an ambitious kid who is probably looking at balondor podium not some one who wants to spend his 80% of the energy defending.
I am sorry i did not know that being a footballer like you was the first requirement to have an opinion. Ill have a game next week and maybe illl reach your level... ffs dont be a clown Adit

You have your own theories about what Di Maria's job was and what Pogba's job is. Fine, i dont agree wth much of what you wrote but let's leave it at that.

The way i see it, Di Maria was the last player that we had at LCM who 1) was athletically able to play that role, 2) actually played the position with freedom to go up and down, knowing he would always fulfill his position's requirement in transition (specially defense).

My argument is simply to say, Pogba 1) has the physical ability of isco+james+their ancestors 2)actually plays the role on a weekly basis and does very well doing it.

I am not calling him a savior, or the only one that can play it, or the only one that can bring balance to the team. I made a simple argument that Pogba would make 5x more sense in this team than James. You agree, you disagree, it doesnt matter mr pro baller
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Post by Adit Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:37 pm

As if footballers like watching a superstar walks and defend for v him... They hate it.

Your theory is entirely flawed. Because it assumes that physic and ability transforms to intentions. It doesn't. You can bring a much better defensive box to box theoretically and it still won't make much difference as long as the player don't decide to sacrifice his game.


Lol at Pogba playing that role actually at Juventus. Juventus defends with entire men. Their defensive effort and our defensive effort isn't even comparable and Pogba have shown squat that he can play catching 2 players at the same time. Like seriously... How is it even comparable to Di Maria defending that entire flank?03:14:52
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Post by The Madrid One Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:36 pm

Various interesting things have been said in this thread; it's indeed interesting just how messed up Perez's transfer decisions/team composition has been.

About Barca, not only do they have a deeply engrained playing philosophy that reflects on how they operate, they also have a quite significative nemesis to learn from and thus they are arguably less likely to stoop down to absolutely terrible transfer dynamics. Really, does a club out there run at that kind of distinct level as they do?

About Pogba, are we really going after him? Definitely food for thought.

As for next season, it'd be great if we could get rid of CR7 and give Zidane an opportunity to run a team without the guy's presence.

If your scenario did come true Sports, our backup midfield options would likely be Casemiro, Kovacic, Isco, looks good to me, only starting technical donkey would be Bale. I would think (hope) Zidane would know how to treat his creative players well and also feel the responsibility to step in and drive the club away from the bad places that im sure he is aware of.
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Post by futbol_bill Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:40 pm

Do you really think Benz will still be here once he is convicted?

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Post by Valkyrja Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:43 pm

'd never give Isco for Pogba. I want technical players, not athletic freaks anymore
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Post by sportsczy Sat Jan 02, 2016 4:23 am

futbol_bill wrote:Do you really think Benz will still be here once he is convicted?


Word is he is not being convicted... too little in terms of outcome for the justice system to invest into prosecuting him.
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Post by sportsczy Sat Jan 02, 2016 5:25 am

Having Pogba here if CR stays would be a waste...  i agree with that.  He'd have to spend more time trying to cover Marcelo and CR then actually doing what he does best, which is make a difference in the midfield so that the attack receives the ball with the defense already on its heels.

But i don't think CR stays...  so under that premise, he would be a huge upgrade imo.
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Post by futbol_bill Sat Jan 02, 2016 3:34 pm

Adit wrote:Futbol bill

Why did Socios vote for the change of revenue for president candidate?


Adit, I haven't a clue as to what you are talking about. Perez is a multi millionaire and certainly not dependent on any revenue from Real Madrid. As to socio votes!, I'm afraid you just don't know what a socio is. We get ONE vote, as to who is the president. There are 80,000 of us and like any election, somewhere between 50% to 75% actually cast that one vote. Think of it as a club membership. All decisions are made by president and board of directors.
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Post by halamadrid2 Sat Jan 02, 2016 5:10 pm

The absolute last thing we need is a 70+ signing. Guys like Özil, Varane and AdM came to us for peanuts compared to what they gave us. Guys like James and Bale come with alot of expectations to score bucket loads of goals and be the front face of our team. It is hard to carry such pressure and do well at the same time. Again with our defenders, both Carvajal and Marcelo came for peanuts then we buy two 30 mill players to i dont know displace them and they fail pretty comically

There is no continuity in our team. Every year we have to buy a big name player even if that means the player playing in that position will be displaced for the flavour of the months who probably believes in his own bs hype

Pogba would be the same. Always playing close to goal to try and score because defending like ADM did wont give you exposure and wont be appreciated until you leave

What we need is to offload James and one of BBC then play a 442 with Isco and Kova on either wing so that we can actually get our passing game going instead of bypassing the brilliant passers we have in favour of hoofing
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Post by Mr Nick09 Sat Jan 02, 2016 5:23 pm

Dont misunderstand mr please i never said qe should sign Pogba, my argument was simply that the way our midfield is doesnt make sense. And someone like pogba instead of james, would make a lot more sense in our current team.

Now how the team should be built moving forward is an infinite debate because lots of smart people here are going to have smart arguments about how we should play. If we disagree it's because we like different things.

To me we are still missing that anchor in midfield, we gave Kroos a big contract and he is not likely to go anywhere and will be unchallenged unlessbsome coach just says fck it and brings in hisbown guy. Although good luck with that seeing how Benitez got linched tryong to install casemiro deep...
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Post by Mr Nick09 Mon Jan 04, 2016 7:56 am

Oh and by the way, this valencia game was actually very interesting with regard to the argument i was making in this thread about leveraging someone like Pogba in midfield as opposed to a isco/james. Kovacic was playing the position, and he did very well all things considered, until the red...

When i see what Pogba does for juve, regardless of their team's result in that same spot, it's hard for me to imagine that he would help us more in these type of games than someone like james for example.

Valencia had Andre Gomes playing that spot for them and boy did he bully everything in his way. He is 3/3 ny the way, in terms of midfield dominance vs us since last season (with super Ancelotti coaching iirc). He has been consistently putting a clinic against our mid, he is just too big too strong too fast too good with the ball vs what we have in mid, namely Modric and Kroos. He shredded them today again and i wished he was in our team for about 90 minutes and some. it was embarrassing, We have nothing like him, this is what i am complaining about.

It's one thing to want our mid to look like prime barca with skillful dudes all over but 1) they had legends, 2) they had a system. we have 1) no legend, 2) no system.

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