Carlo Ancelotti questions Benítez's sacking: "Is it really always the manager's fault at Real Madrid?"

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Carlo Ancelotti questions Benítez's sacking: "Is it really always the manager's fault at Real Madrid?" - Page 2 Empty Re: Carlo Ancelotti questions Benítez's sacking: "Is it really always the manager's fault at Real Madrid?"

Post by titosantill Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:17 pm

for me its not about "the best coach" but the best fit. its easier for me to pick out the best coach in something like basketball, because the manager has a strong influence in calling plays, compared to football, where coaches problems can be masked by the right players

for madrid, at the time, mourinho was a good fit because the players needed a kick up the ass losing to the likes of lyon in the second round. same with capello, he was a good fit at the time cos we lacked discipline. rafa was a foolish move and didn't fit any category at all. on all levels, discipline, charisma, player-relations, his just concluded season, he was the exact opposite of what the club wanted/needed. the only thing he had going for him was he is from madrid :facepalm: i don't know if klopp was the right fit either.

i really like klopp, but he seems like a "build from the ground up" kind of guy. so too simeone, and i really respect that. any half decent manager can coach certain top sides, but building with little resources i respect. it doesn't mean they would be the right fit at madrid, where players aren't looking for a cult of personality, but someone who can stare the boat just right.

i agree, based on rafa's previous work it was absolute insanity that we made such a move

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Post by chad4401 Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:23 pm

nobody knew that for sure at the time, regardless of track record my point still stands, nobody knows what gonna happen until it does, its easy to say this and that about rafa after the fact, but if flo wants to give him a chance so be it.
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Post by futbol_bill Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:30 pm

You guys are trying to figure out Flo's thought process! This is the same guy that dictates transfer policy based on marketability. The same guy that bought Bale, Beckham, and wouldn't pay Makelele becuase he was just defense! He never has been phrased for his selection thought process, his analysis or due diligence.

He clearly blew it, but again that has nothing to do with Carlo being sacked.

I am of the opinion (and by the way, i'm not the only socio with this view) that this club will not be winning anything until both Ronaldo AND Perez are gone.
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Post by titosantill Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:31 pm

carlo's sacking was reckless...he deserved to be sacked, but it was reckless. when you have top players saying publicly "this guy should stay", you can't just ignore that. and if you do, you'd have to make sure u're bringing in someone with the right personality. its moves like these that cause friction between director and personnel. i don't think rafa making any player better justifies his rubbish, especially when its only 2 players out of a 22 man squad, and 2 players who would start under any coach regardless. its not about the best coach, but the best fit. ancelotti deserved at least a year, and if he messed up sack him......but don't replace him with a clown

true nobody knows what's going to happen, it doesn't mean you get yourself involved in unnecessary risk. a janitor could work his way up and somehow get to a high position in a company and hit a profit. doesn't mean we all go out and start getting janitors to cut the budgets. rafa was never going to cut it...just look at the basis on why he was hired; if benitez was from anywhere besides madrid, florentino won't have hired him....just think about that. its not about him being worse or better than carlo, he wasn't a good fit. he'd be perfect at a smaller club
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Post by titosantill Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:35 pm

@futbol_bill, cristiano going is realistic. the biggest problem with florentino however is, we've not even heard one voice that can be a potential candidate publicly disagree with him. that tells me there may not be potential suitors for the role. i hear calderon bash him, but calderon's a crook, lol calderon's the kind of guy that will take the club out of the members hands and sell it to some guy in qatar or china. my thing is, we don't know any potential suitors. if we did and they spoke up i'd be perfectly fine with that. as it stands, we are stuck with florentino, we must understand that
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Post by Valkyrja Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:42 pm

chad4401 wrote:bill is right no matter who predicted what, carlo sacking was earned, what if rafa had us playing great? what then?

rafa overall project might have failed, but he did some good with benz and bale, finally proving that cr carrying madrid is a hoax, now everybody without a doubt have to acknowledge it, something carlo wouldn't have done, so that a lone makes sacking carlo worth it.


they did good, but the worst start of a season we've had in 6 years came at the same time CR's form dropped. Benz and Bale did sth wrong I guess.
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Post by futbol_bill Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:44 pm

You haven't heard of Eugenio Martinez Bravo and Plataforma Blanca? Perez has change the presidential eligibility rules, but there is opposition to him and it is mounting. I would go as far to say that if he had persisted with Rafa, he would have been gone next summer. Those that have been saying that if Zidane doesn't make it, it will be the end of Perez are not that far off of reality.
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Post by titosantill Mon Jan 11, 2016 10:04 pm

@futbol_bill, i heard of bravo when he wanted to run the last time. and he backed down. that tells me he wasn't ready; at least not from a financial standpoint. and that was less than five years ago, i doubt he's ready now. as much as we may not like it, the financial aspects are crucial to running a club such as this. i agree with you, zidane messing up will definitely spell the end of florentino...but i would still like to know that its someone reasonable taking the reigns, and someone who at least is fiscally responsibe. the devil i know is better than the angel i don't.
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Post by chad4401 Mon Jan 11, 2016 10:55 pm

Valkyrja wrote:
chad4401 wrote:bill is right no matter who predicted what, carlo sacking was earned, what if rafa had us playing great? what then?

rafa overall project might have failed, but he did some good with benz and bale, finally proving that cr carrying madrid is a hoax, now everybody without a doubt have to acknowledge it, something carlo wouldn't have done, so that a lone makes sacking carlo worth it.


they did good, but the worst start of a season we've had in 6 years came at the same time CR's form dropped. Benz and Bale did sth wrong I guess.


cr so called form dropping magically started happening, when bale/benz are putting up number instead of serving him,  that not rafa faults, the ultimate goal scorer ain't as ultimate as you think.

the club as had bad starts under carlo and mou too, the problem was tactics and how he handled the players, end of the day he at least loosen the grip cr had on the attack, and others are stepping up and not backing down no matter how salty he acts, and that very beneficial to the team going forward, carlo would let things remained as before that why sacking him was a good idea.
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Post by titosantill Tue Jan 12, 2016 12:30 am

i don't know if i can credit rafa for "loosening the grip on cr"...for a couple of reasons; we don't know how zidane plans to use cristiano (so we don't know if any grip is loosened just yet) two cristiano was still taking all the pks and free kicks even under rafa so not much loosening there, and most importantly, cristiano was playing like utter crap against sensible sides...him playing like utter crap does not equate to rafa loosening the grip on him. cr's been playing this way for quite a bit now, doing nothing against juve and then scoring like 80 against getafe the next day (even though we had lost the league)....you give rafa too much props by saying he loosened the grip. cr's poor form loosened his own grip
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Post by titosantill Tue Jan 12, 2016 12:32 am

oh and the fact that he never substituted cristiano from any game, yet took out benzema even on nights he scored like valencai, shows he did not loosen anything.
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Post by sportsczy Tue Jan 12, 2016 1:03 am

In any case, if Zidane fails, i would suggest Jorge Sampaoli of Chile NT... or Laurent Blanc of PSG.
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Post by Pedram Tue Jan 12, 2016 3:58 pm

Sacking Carlo would've been the right move if we were going to hire Klopp.

Flo acted recklessly without thinking it through, first we should've contacted Klopp and asked him if he was interested in the job and then proceed to sack Carlo.
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Post by Turok_TTZ Tue Jan 12, 2016 5:11 pm

sportsczy wrote:In any case, if Zidane fails, i would suggest Jorge Sampaoli of Chile NT... or Laurent Blanc of PSG.

Yes to Laurent Blanc.

Questionable on Sampaoli... Main reason? Man management. I don't think he has bad people skills but he may see similar problems with Benitez in regards to being respected by the players (particularly the ones with the egos).

idiots like CR7 will probably never have heard of Sampaoli top kek. Carlo Ancelotti questions Benítez's sacking: "Is it really always the manager's fault at Real Madrid?" - Page 2 ZKJDe8w
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Post by Adit Tue Jan 12, 2016 6:13 pm

Klopp would have been a huge failure imo. No way he can get to play his running down football with this squad. Absolutely no way CR , Benzema and Bale's work rate are good enough for klopps football. Let's be honest his game is all about winning the ball back spectacularly.. If he can't do that and is asked to play the 'normal' way then he is nothing special.
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Post by Mr Nick09 Tue Jan 12, 2016 6:21 pm

Klopp will regret going to pool, he had a goldmine level of talent at dortmund, and his team went with the talent he had available. The chances that the he finds the same level of talent at pool and create a top team are very low. Top managers can only produce at high level with high level talent, specially when there is expectation.

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Post by sportsczy Tue Jan 12, 2016 6:31 pm

Mr Nick09 wrote:Klopp will regret going to pool, he had a goldmine level of talent at dortmund, and his team went with the talent he had available. The chances that the he finds the same level of talent at pool and create a top team are very low. Top managers can only produce at high level with high level talent, specially when there is expectation.


Yeah... he's going to have to attract talent to Liverpool while the glitter about him still shines. Once the glitter goes, he's doomed.
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Post by Mr Nick09 Tue Jan 12, 2016 7:21 pm

As far as im concerned he is already doomed and its just going to unwind slowly
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Post by Adit Wed Jan 13, 2016 2:40 pm

Imo more than the talent what is going to affect Klopp is lack of winter break, physicality of pl and generally more number of games.
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