Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

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Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by RealGunner on Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:20 pm

http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/16E4B/production/_87817739_de27-2.jpg

"It will have a top speed of over 1,000km/h [620mph]," Mr BamBrogan shouts over the engine.
"We will use the pillars to even out the bumps in the terrain so people don't feel weird."
The buggy bounces over a rock and whisks past the 20 massive tubes already on site, and I find what concerns me is not the technical challenge.
I can absolutely believe the skills Hyperloop Technologies has brought in from the likes of SpaceX could crack the science, overcome the air resistance, and withstand the acceleration - it will be gentle.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-35361093

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by Don't call me James on Fri Jan 22, 2016 12:06 am

If it makes transportation over great distances cheaper then I hope so.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by free_cat on Mon Jan 25, 2016 12:42 pm

No, it's not the future. Why build a massively costly infraestructure to go at 1.000km/h when you can just use the sky at 800 km/h (more if you are willing to pay more).

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:06 am

Because between getting to the airport, going through security, etc you end up losing a ton of time. Hyperloop's appeal is that it could leave you right in the city center, like with train stations.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by free_cat on Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:32 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Because between getting to the airport, going through security, etc you end up losing a ton of time. Hyperloop's appeal is that it could leave you right in the city center, like with train stations.


Well, then build fast trains or planes that fly faster. It's quite clear we won't see this thing live and if we do it will go bankrupt. Another problem with hyperloop is that it can transport too few people.

It's probably much more cheaper to get concordes back to business instead of this project. Concordes flew at 2.100 km/h, so twice this thing and the costs are just the plane and fuel.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by Phritz on Sun Feb 07, 2016 7:25 am

This is the first generation that has not seen a new form of transport.

I can't... There's so many things wrong with this statement....

Also don't underestimate the cost of Concorde.


We'll more likely see fusion powered maglevs than hyperloop.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by Phritz on Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:46 am

A CNN report said the the biggest problem is making the travel comfortable.


hahahaha; It's as if Hyperloop is ignoring the actual engineering costs and challenge of building what is essentially a scaled up pipeline with a vacuum chamber that's 50 times more voluminous than our current largest chamber.  (I'm basing everything on a SanFran LA route). A steel tube that long would expand 300m on both ends with the temperature differences in California.

Get the basics right Hyperloop; figure out how to build a 600km long vacuum tube with all the required features (including emergency exits - in a vacuum tube Laughing) before actually spending time and money designing an entire system.

I like how their paper outlines what to do in catastrophic failures as if the solutions are already in place, like talking about emergency exits when they haven't even thought about them yet.

There's a reason why we place natural gas pipelines underground mostly; Hyperloop's papers assumes those challenges are easy enough to solve.

In the case of a large rupture... you're gonna have 15 ton capsules be hit by 100 tons of air. Yeah you don't want imagine what would happen to you sitting inside that capsule.

There are no margins for error; and that's why this system will fail as a passenger transport system.


And can someone tell me why a 600km vacuum tube would be cheaper to build; maintain and protect than a 600km high speed rail-line? Hyperloop hasn't and that's their main draw Laughing

And if you want energy efficiency; just put panels above all the rail-lines/roads; much much cheaper.

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Henry wrote:"“Stepovers, tricks, that’s not the game. The game is what Thomas Muller is doing. If I had a son right now, playing, I would say to him ‘look at them, look at [Franck] Ribery, look at Muller.’ What Ronaldo does, and Messi, they’re just freaks. Don’t try to copy those guys. You can copy from Ribery, you can copy from Thomas Muller. What he did at the World Cup, people don’t talk about it. They don’t talk about it, but they should talk about it. He plays the game the right way: he defends, he attacks, he controls the ball when he has to control it, he reverses when he has to reverse it. When he has to finish, he’ll finish. He doesn’t do stepovers, but when he has to perform, he performs. He does what the game asks him to do.”"


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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by zizzle on Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:42 am

Because progress. Do you know how many people used shit on most of the stuff that you take for granted today? People thought cars would never replace horses, and the idea of an airplane was a joke to many. So if you havnt figured it out yet this is how civilization works.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by rincon on Mon Aug 01, 2016 1:47 pm

Just "found" this section of GL Thumbs up

I don't see what is so impossible about hyperloop. Protecting a 600km track of hyperloop is no different than protecting a train track, which no one does. Screwing with a train track, or the train itself, would be just as deadly as screwing with a tube.

High speed trains also don't travel at these speeds. Most of them don't exceed (or reach) 300 km/h, maglev is around 400 km/h. With hyperloop its 800+. Reaching such a speed gets really tricky with a train because of drag, which is the whole point of the hyperloop. Half an hour between LA and San Francisco sounds fantastic, just like an hour or so between Paris and Berlin, etc.

The problem is building the tube in large scales. The low pressure throughout is tricky and expensive, but these challenges have been tackled before in other projects. Maybe it doesn't pan out, maybe it does. Its entirely possible though, just expensive and challenging, just like other great engineering breakthroughs.

If it can be built then it would (likely) be a very low energy and faster alternative to train transport. Its a worthy bet.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by Phritz on Wed Aug 03, 2016 3:05 pm

@rincon wrote:Just "found" this section of GL Thumbs up

I don't see what is so impossible about hyperloop. Protecting a 600km track of hyperloop is no different than protecting a train track, which no one does. Screwing with a train track, or the train itself, would be just as deadly as screwing with a tube.

High speed trains also don't travel at these speeds. Most of them don't exceed (or reach) 300 km/h, maglev is around 400 km/h. With hyperloop its 800+. Reaching such a speed gets really tricky with a train because of drag, which is the whole point of the hyperloop. Half an hour between LA and San Francisco sounds fantastic, just like an hour or so between Paris and Berlin, etc.

The problem is building the tube in large scales. The low pressure throughout is tricky and expensive, but these challenges have been tackled before in other projects. Maybe it doesn't pan out, maybe it does. Its entirely possible though, just expensive and challenging, just like other great engineering breakthroughs.

If it can be built then it would (likely) be a very low energy and faster alternative to train transport. Its a worthy bet.


Shooting an AP bullet at a train may headshot multiple people at worst.

Shooting an AP bullet at tube at 99 pascal - You're going kill everyone in the hyperloop.

Hyperloop isn't even a "new concept" The idea of subjecting trains to a low pressure environment is 100 years old and look how little we've progressed since then.

Rincon tell me which other projects tackled this "tricky and expensive low pressure" and actually solved it? The solution to the Space Power Facility is a concrete reinforced aluminium dome; doesn't really apply to Hyperloop.

That demonstration in May was one of the biggest farce's I've ever seen; good job you demonstrated that electrical motors work - that's tech over 100 years old.

The only issue that Hyperloop faces that has been tackled is the expansion problem although I'm not sure you want to subject people to this:

at 800km/h. You could also put the tube in a tunnel; but then you're going to want to build a tunnel that's ten times longer than anything ever built and if you compare the costs of building tunnels your 4.06 billion dollar tube (which is already fanciful since they haven't even designed the tube yet) is going to become 250 BILLION dollars on tunnel costs alone.

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Henry wrote:"“Stepovers, tricks, that’s not the game. The game is what Thomas Muller is doing. If I had a son right now, playing, I would say to him ‘look at them, look at [Franck] Ribery, look at Muller.’ What Ronaldo does, and Messi, they’re just freaks. Don’t try to copy those guys. You can copy from Ribery, you can copy from Thomas Muller. What he did at the World Cup, people don’t talk about it. They don’t talk about it, but they should talk about it. He plays the game the right way: he defends, he attacks, he controls the ball when he has to control it, he reverses when he has to reverse it. When he has to finish, he’ll finish. He doesn’t do stepovers, but when he has to perform, he performs. He does what the game asks him to do.”"


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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by rincon on Wed Aug 03, 2016 3:47 pm

Making a bomb to derail a train is easier than getting armor piercing rounds and rifles for most people. Blowing up a segment of a highspeed train is gonna absolutely destroy it. In the end the risk is there.

No one has tackled and solved it, doesn't mean no one will in the future. Every big scientific and engineering challenge is uncharted territory, its always "more than we have done", longer, more expensive, bigger, tougher, more sophisticated.

I'm an engineer myself, with a masters in solid state chemistry, and doing a phd in materials engineering. The things we have done and are doing always seem a bit like science fiction, until we do it. The answer is never easy or it wouldn't be groundbreaking otherwise, but people are good at figuring it out.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by Phritz on Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:29 pm

Oh I never said it can't be done. It's just not commercially or economically viable because Hyperloop massively underestimates how big the problems are that they are facing.

Rincon do me a favour and read the Hyperloop alpha before you try and make Chemical Engineering relevant to Aerospace Engineering.

Then use your basic physics knowledge to pick out things like a turbine providing thrust... at 99pa.

Goddard; father of american rocketry tried to tackle the problem 100 years ago. The fact that we don't even have a working model 100 years later should tell you enough about the actual practicality. Just because a software billionaire rolls around and actually does throw money at it doesn't change anything.

This is coming from the same guy who thinks the most efficient mode of long range transport would a a VTOL supersonic electrical jet. High school physics/basic thermodynamics debunks that.

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Henry wrote:"“Stepovers, tricks, that’s not the game. The game is what Thomas Muller is doing. If I had a son right now, playing, I would say to him ‘look at them, look at [Franck] Ribery, look at Muller.’ What Ronaldo does, and Messi, they’re just freaks. Don’t try to copy those guys. You can copy from Ribery, you can copy from Thomas Muller. What he did at the World Cup, people don’t talk about it. They don’t talk about it, but they should talk about it. He plays the game the right way: he defends, he attacks, he controls the ball when he has to control it, he reverses when he has to reverse it. When he has to finish, he’ll finish. He doesn’t do stepovers, but when he has to perform, he performs. He does what the game asks him to do.”"


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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by rincon on Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:59 pm

I have the hyperloop alpha, and nothing in that document is irrelevant to my education (Chemical or Materials engineering).

The only "foreign concept" for a chemical engineer in the alpha is figures 15 through 20 showing the stress on the pylons holding the tube. A concept that's basic enough, and is also entirely covered in materials engineering.

The most in depth piece of science in the document are the thermodynamic cycles describing the capsules. That is the backbone of chemical engineering. Thermodynamics and transport (fliud dynamics, heat transfer, mass transport). The rest is on the suspension and power (power conversion in this manner is mainly physical-chemistry and materials science).

The aerodynamics in there are mostly broad ideas and basis for proof-of-concept measurements, nothing alien.

The international space station exists, the large hadron collider exists, people are driven to solve these challenges. The idea of a flying machine was hundreds of years old before we made the airplanes, same for space travel.

I have no doubt that with enough willpower and talent behind something like this it will eventually be useful. The commercial solar cells we use today were developed decades ago, it took a while for them to become cost effective but in the end we are using them.

I can't be asked to get out of bed to do something repetitive and mundane, but working on new systems and trying to solve tough scientific challenges motivates me like nothing else. A lot of people in the field are like this about solving these problems.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by free_cat on Thu Aug 04, 2016 1:21 pm

Hyperloop it's probably not impossible. It's just silly because it's way not cost effective (and also probably unsafe).

Here some good videos explaining why it's silly:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIVJvpNyjdc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNFesa01llk

Simply planes are just a much better option.

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

Post by StrugaRock on Tue Nov 08, 2016 1:27 am

Everybody here talks about hyperloop, while where I live we are yet to have a decent public transport

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Re: Is Hyperloop the future of high-speed travel?

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