Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
no. people were having a pop at England so I put the great man in my sig. nothing to do with the EU.CBarca wrote:Out of curiosity, if you're here Unique, did you switch your prof pic to Churchill in a show of support for brexit? I don't know a whole about Churchill or English history, but didn't he fight hard for the unity of the UK? Which now looks in jeopardy with brexit occurring?
I could be completely wrong tbh, anybody is welcome to answer, I'm just kind of curious. Cuz if so I find it kind of a weird change
Unique- BOSS MAN
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
rwo power wrote:Actually, I'm pretty sure that Churchill would have strongly advised against setting up a referendum on such an important issue. After all, one of his famous quotes is "The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
this was the best one.
“Lady Nancy Astor: Winston, if you were my husband, I'd poison your tea.
Churchill: Nancy, if I were your husband, I'd drink it.”
Unique- BOSS MAN
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Still waiting to see any data indicating #Regrexit is anything other than a fantasy.BarrileteCosmico wrote:Also this is amazing:
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https://i.imgur.com/dhwPLtv.gif
DuringTheWar- First Team
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Well it has been less than a week. Give it some time. So far, only anecdotal evidence.
BarrileteCosmico- Admin
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Leave campaigners' claims before and after brexit
Immigration
The campaign claim: Immigration levels could be controlled if the UK left the EU. This would relieve pressure on public services.
The current claim: Immigration levels can't be radically reduced by leaving the EU. Fears about immigration did not influence the way people voted.
Reality Check verdict: During the campaign, some Leave campaigners sent a clear message that the referendum was about controlling immigration. Some are now being more nuanced, saying the UK's decision to leave the EU would not guarantee a significant decrease in immigration levels.
Contributions to the EU budget
The campaign claim: We send £350m a week to Brussels, which could be spent on the NHS instead.
The current claim: The claim was a mistake, and we will not be able to spend that much extra on the NHS.
Reality Check verdict: Some of those who campaigned for Leave are now distancing themselves from this claim. Some have gone as far as admitting that it had been a mistake.
Vote Leave's Gisela Stuart was among those to make the claim, saying "Every week we send £350m to Brussels. I'd rather that we control how to spend that money, and if I had that control I would spend it on the NHS."
The single market
The campaign claim: Some on the Leave side suggested the UK does not need preferential access to the single market.
The current claim: The UK should get preferential access to the single market but will not have to accept freedom of movement to get it.
Reality Check verdict: The position has shifted from claims the UK could trade under World Trade Organisation rules to one which suggests the UK will continue to have preferential access to the single market, but at the same time having some control over immigration levels.
During the campaign, some Leave campaigners said that the UK outside of the EU would not need preferential access to the single market and would just trade under World Trade Organization rules.
This was the basis of research by Economists for Brexit, who said the UK should unilaterally remove all tariffs on imports.
But writing in the Telegraph on Monday, Boris Johnson quoted German employers' organisation the BDI as saying there would continue to be free trade and access to the single market.
The BDI later denied this.
If the UK wanted to retain preferential access to the single market, many European politicians say it would have to continue to accept freedom of movement.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36641390
Immigration
The campaign claim: Immigration levels could be controlled if the UK left the EU. This would relieve pressure on public services.
The current claim: Immigration levels can't be radically reduced by leaving the EU. Fears about immigration did not influence the way people voted.
Reality Check verdict: During the campaign, some Leave campaigners sent a clear message that the referendum was about controlling immigration. Some are now being more nuanced, saying the UK's decision to leave the EU would not guarantee a significant decrease in immigration levels.
Contributions to the EU budget
The campaign claim: We send £350m a week to Brussels, which could be spent on the NHS instead.
The current claim: The claim was a mistake, and we will not be able to spend that much extra on the NHS.
Reality Check verdict: Some of those who campaigned for Leave are now distancing themselves from this claim. Some have gone as far as admitting that it had been a mistake.
Vote Leave's Gisela Stuart was among those to make the claim, saying "Every week we send £350m to Brussels. I'd rather that we control how to spend that money, and if I had that control I would spend it on the NHS."
The single market
The campaign claim: Some on the Leave side suggested the UK does not need preferential access to the single market.
The current claim: The UK should get preferential access to the single market but will not have to accept freedom of movement to get it.
Reality Check verdict: The position has shifted from claims the UK could trade under World Trade Organisation rules to one which suggests the UK will continue to have preferential access to the single market, but at the same time having some control over immigration levels.
During the campaign, some Leave campaigners said that the UK outside of the EU would not need preferential access to the single market and would just trade under World Trade Organization rules.
This was the basis of research by Economists for Brexit, who said the UK should unilaterally remove all tariffs on imports.
But writing in the Telegraph on Monday, Boris Johnson quoted German employers' organisation the BDI as saying there would continue to be free trade and access to the single market.
The BDI later denied this.
If the UK wanted to retain preferential access to the single market, many European politicians say it would have to continue to accept freedom of movement.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36641390
RealGunner- Admin
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Lex wrote:Good thing no-one's talking about stopping immigration, the discussion is to stop uncontrolled, unmonitored, unchecked immigration
And the terms of which, as it has been stated time and time again, will not be up to the UK if you plan on staying in the single market and take a deal similar to Norway.
VendettaRed07- First Team
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
@RG
About the EU budget thing... Here's what the UK really pays:
Source: http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35943216
So leaving the EU would actually "only" free 161 mio GBP per week which is not needed to offset the UK subsidies that make up 115 mio GBP per week and which the current recipients have to trust they will still receive after they are no longer paid by the EU.
Hm. This reminds me - Norway currently pays about 83% per capita less to access the single market than the UK pays for full membership.
So if the UK wants entry to the single market, I doubt the EU will agree to the rebate in the first place (why should they? For the mess the UK caused they can't expect any favourable special treatment anymore) and consider the full 361 mio GBP per week as basis for the calculation, 83% of which would be 299.6 mio GBP per week.
So it is likely that the UK will have to pay 299.6 mio GBP per week just for tariff-free market access and they wouldn't get EU subsidies out of it anymore. Looks like bad business again, if you ask me.
About the EU budget thing... Here's what the UK really pays:
Source: http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35943216
So leaving the EU would actually "only" free 161 mio GBP per week which is not needed to offset the UK subsidies that make up 115 mio GBP per week and which the current recipients have to trust they will still receive after they are no longer paid by the EU.
Hm. This reminds me - Norway currently pays about 83% per capita less to access the single market than the UK pays for full membership.
So if the UK wants entry to the single market, I doubt the EU will agree to the rebate in the first place (why should they? For the mess the UK caused they can't expect any favourable special treatment anymore) and consider the full 361 mio GBP per week as basis for the calculation, 83% of which would be 299.6 mio GBP per week.
So it is likely that the UK will have to pay 299.6 mio GBP per week just for tariff-free market access and they wouldn't get EU subsidies out of it anymore. Looks like bad business again, if you ask me.
rwo power- Super Moderator
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Nigel Farage on CNN giving compliments to trump and bashing Clinton and Obama. Shocker.
Blue Barrett- World Class Contributor
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
I guess needed to let off some steam as he got dissed by Juncker today:
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
https://twitter.com/Nigel_Farage/status/747730290294980608
Kaladin- Stormblessed
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Farag tells the EU parliament that there will be no trade deals with the UK
Kaladin- Stormblessed
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
if leaving the EU is only bad for Britain why is the rest of Europe so pissed off about it.
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
@Unique
Do you know the term "divide and conquer"? With the UK out of the EU, the weight of the EU will be slightly diminished which will be favourable for superpowers like Putin's Russia, China etc. The more countries are organized in the EU, the easier they can stand up against the other big boys.
Do you know the term "divide and conquer"? With the UK out of the EU, the weight of the EU will be slightly diminished which will be favourable for superpowers like Putin's Russia, China etc. The more countries are organized in the EU, the easier they can stand up against the other big boys.
rwo power- Super Moderator
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Because it's obviously bad for everyone: the UK, the EU and the west in general. The only people that stand to gain anything from this are Russia and China.Unique wrote:if leaving the EU is only bad for Britain why is the rest of Europe so pissed off about it.
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Russia are not a super power. they have the biggest country in the world and every thing they need to rule the world but they don't have the brains.rwo power wrote:@Unique
Do you know the term "divide and conquer"? With the UK out of the EU, the weight of the EU will be slightly diminished which will be favourable for superpowers like Putin's Russia, China etc. The more countries are organized in the EU, the easier they can stand up against the other big boys.
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
But don't you think that makes Russia even more problematic? The Baltic states fear that Russia could invade them like they did with the Ukraine, and it is pretty much only their closeness to Europe in the EU that gives them a certain sense of security. If the EU disintegrates more, it looks more than likely that Putin will continue to expand his modern tsardom further.
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
ES wrote:https://twitter.com/Nigel_Farage/status/747730290294980608
What an absolute *bleep* he really only went there to gloat in their faces
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Unique wrote:if leaving the EU is only bad for Britain why is the rest of Europe so pissed off about it.
Because it's bad for the entire world, and we're pissed off England chose to piss into everyone's champagne just because they had an off day.
England you utter twats.
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
we had a off dayVivaStPauli wrote:Unique wrote:if leaving the EU is only bad for Britain why is the rest of Europe so pissed off about it.
Because it's bad for the entire world, and we're pissed off England chose to piss into everyone's champagne just because they had an off day.
England you utter twats.
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
A passing moment of retardation, if you will. I refuse to believe that over 50% of Britain are imbeciles.
VivaStPauli- Fan Favorite
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
yes he did. but I bet he felt good saying thatBlue Barrett wrote:ES wrote:https://twitter.com/Nigel_Farage/status/747730290294980608
What an absolute *bleep* he really only went there to gloat in their faces
Unique- BOSS MAN
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
how long have you lived in BritainVivaStPauli wrote:A passing moment of retardation, if you will. I refuse to believe that over 50% of Britain are imbeciles.
Unique- BOSS MAN
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Well, let's say it was a couple of off-weeks with this idiotic campaign where both camps threw around lies, insults and managed to split England apart in several layers.
And all of this was just the attempt of an egomaniac to fortify his power in his party, while another fascistic racist sociopath jumped into the fray to cause as much mayhem as he could to gloat and grab more power for himself.
Oh and don't forget the media mogul Murdoch who just wanted to kick the guys at Brussels into the parts where it hurts most as they patently ignore him and don't jump on his whims.
You don't think any of the culprits would have spared even one thought about what the people really wanted - they just agitated them until they reiterated the party-lines and voted without really thinking about the ramifications.
Too bad that the gamble misfired badly, and now practically everybody is worse off, except for the sociopath who obviously delights in the suffering of the people and basks in the feeling that he had the power to ruin practically everything.
So yeah, you could probably best call it an off-season...
And all of this was just the attempt of an egomaniac to fortify his power in his party, while another fascistic racist sociopath jumped into the fray to cause as much mayhem as he could to gloat and grab more power for himself.
Oh and don't forget the media mogul Murdoch who just wanted to kick the guys at Brussels into the parts where it hurts most as they patently ignore him and don't jump on his whims.
You don't think any of the culprits would have spared even one thought about what the people really wanted - they just agitated them until they reiterated the party-lines and voted without really thinking about the ramifications.
Too bad that the gamble misfired badly, and now practically everybody is worse off, except for the sociopath who obviously delights in the suffering of the people and basks in the feeling that he had the power to ruin practically everything.
So yeah, you could probably best call it an off-season...
rwo power- Super Moderator
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
who is this sociopath racist you speak of
Unique- BOSS MAN
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
Who else but this callous demagogue?Unique wrote:who is this sociopath racist you speak of
http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/06/28/watch-the-european-parliament-boo-nigel-farage-while-he-defends-the-brexit/
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/28/nigel-farage-european-parliament-petty-rant-ukip
rwo power- Super Moderator
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Re: Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?
ES wrote:https://twitter.com/Nigel_Farage/status/747730290294980608
I was laughing throughout the whole video, particularly over this line:
"Now, I know that virtually none of you have ever done a proper job in your lives or worked in business or trade or indeed ever created a job"
He's trying to convince other countries to keep trading with his country and yet he tells them that
This dude is a legend, incredibly stupid, but a legend nonetheless. He would kill as a stand-up comic
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