Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by Freeza on Sun Apr 17, 2016 10:52 pm

Considering the position we were in when Zidane took over he definitely should get a full season to show his worth. He's earned that.

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Sun Apr 17, 2016 11:00 pm

Why should he be kept on for beating Roma and Wolfsburg in the CL and finishing third or second in the league? What's so special about that?

He needs to prove his worth like he did when he beat Barça at Camp Nou. He must beat stronger teams than Roma and Wolfsburg in the CL. He must give us something for us to believe in him. Getting knocked out the second he meets a half-decent team in the CL would be proof of his unworthiness of the job.

Beat a semi-finalist, and you'll get my vote. Even if you end up trophyless, I'd still support you as long as you reach the CL final. This is City, not Heyneckes' Bayern or Pep's Barça. He has a team strong enough to beat them and he has no excuse not to.

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by FennecFox7 on Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:48 am

DoC, all respect but you just argue sometimes for the sake of it. This team was absolute trash before he took over, and the results at this point of the season speak for themselves.

Oh yeah, let's hire yet another manager despite ours doing better, because you know, that's worked so well for us these past 5 years!

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:55 pm

Just hear me out:

How many managers, elite or not, working today would be able to reach the CL semi-final through Roma and Wolfsburg with a squad of Real Madrid's caliber?

Just think about that for a second then ask yourself this: why should we keep someone who, the second they met a half-decent team in the CL, they got knocked out?

Are you telling me that he should be kept on for beating Roma and Wolfsburg? Cause if so, I might apply for the Madrid job next season.

He needs to prove his worth by beating a semi-finalist. What he's done so far isn't enough to earn his keep.

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by Freeza on Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:58 pm

He's beat Barca in his first challenge against them. He hasn't failed in any way imo. He brought us back from the dead in the league, with a lot of help from Barca.

I don't why you can't comprehend this. Why should he be punished if he loses to City when everything else has been great. Ancelotti was worse in his firing season and people wanted him to stay. But Zidane should be let go despite having achieved something most thought was impossible in the league to this point. He is the man manager we needed and firing him wouldn't go over well with the players and we'd end up in yet another Rafa situation.

He needs to stay if we aren't to be a joke once again.

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by Doc on Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:10 pm

Ok, so let's assume we win nothing. Zidane gets dumped out on the semis and Barcelona or Atletico reign in Spain. Obviously, going by what you wrote, Zidane's tenure is not anything special and subsequently would not be renewed. Who do you have in mind DoC to manage us besides yourself of course?

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:26 pm

He didn't bring us from the dead in the league, Barça did. They drew Villarreal and lost to both Sociedad and Valencia. That's 8 points dropped. He should only get credit for the three points in Camp Nou.

As for your statement "He hasn't failed in any way":

1. He lost to Atlético at home.
2. He dropped points against Betis. Hadn't he done that, we would've been ahead of Barça now.
3. He struggled against Roma and barely beat Wolfsburg.

I don't even know why you're failing to comprehend this: I'm not demanding that he wins a trophy this year. But at least he should beat City to show that he's not only capable of barely beating weak teams in the CL.

1. If he wins either the league or the CL or both: he should be kept on.
2. If he doesn't win anything but still reaches the CL final. He should be kept on.
3. If he fails to win anything and fails to reach the final: he should be let go.

This is my opinion, and even though I respect yours, I'm not going to lower my standards and give the keys of my beloved club to someone who could barely beat Wolfsburg and failed to beat City.

@Doc: You still don't understand. I want Z to succeed as much as you do. But I just want him to prove his worth and earn his keep. The Barça win put him halfway there, now he only needs to beat City. He doesn't have to win anything. Just beat City. Pellegrini's City. That's it.

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by Doc on Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:32 pm

What if he does not beat City which is a real possibility as much as beating City? He would, going by what you are writing, not have done much to warrant a renewal. Would you want to stick with him or would you hire someone else and who that someone would be?



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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by Freeza on Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:35 pm

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:He didn't bring us from the dead in the league, Barça did. They drew Villarreal and lost to both Sociedad and Valencia. That's 8 points dropped. He should only get credit for the three points in Camp Nou.

As for your statement "He hasn't failed in any way":

1. He lost to Atlético at home.
2. He dropped points against Betis. Hadn't he done that, we would've been ahead of Barça now.
3. He struggled against Roma and barely beat Wolfsburg.

I don't even know why you're failing to comprehend this: I'm not demanding that he wins a trophy this year. But at least he should beat City to show that he's not only capable of barely beating weak teams in the CL.

1. If he wins either the league or the CL or both: he should be kept on.
2. If he doesn't win anything but still reaches the CL final. He should be kept on.
3. If he fails to win anything and fails to reach the final: he should be let go.

This is my opinion, and even though I respect yours, I'm not going to lower my standards and give the keys of my beloved club to someone who could barely beat Wolfsburg and failed to beat City.

@Doc: You still don't understand. I want Z to succeed as much as you do. But I just want him to prove his worth and earn his keep. The Barça win put him halfway there, now he only needs to beat City. He doesn't have to win anything. Just beat City. Pellegrini's City. That's it.


Oh lord. So you really would fire a coach because he lost a game to Atletico? Because we can quite possibly be knocked out by City without losing.

Some of his failures is not winning by enough? That's hardly a failure in my book. By that measurement Ancelotti was a failure in the final also, because we won with some last minute luck.

My whole point is he should get a full season. There's no way you can consider his tenure a faillure considering the position he was put in at the start of his appointment. If he doesn't have any succes next year, he could be fired. But he has succeeded expectations so far and anything from this point on is a win in my book.

People keep complaining about us firing coaches, and now we won't let Zidane continue despite him having against all odds brought us back.
When he started our squad was in bad shape, bad morale, and lacklustre. Somehow we ended up better than any of us expected.

I don't see any alternative coach we could hire. Any appointment would result in a bad morale from our top players that love Zidane.

Do you not remember the time when we got knocked out by Lyon? Now our problem is not beating teams like Roma and Wolfsburg enough.

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by halamadrid2 on Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:42 pm

Zidane has exceeded expectations. Not by being a brilliant tacticians (he just copied Carlos tactics vs Barca) but by making the players believe again. Who would have thought ignoring Ramos' brainfarts and pampering Ronaldo's ego would create such huge reward Rolling Eyes Ronaldo has found his form again and the squad harmony is great

You dont need to be a brilliant tacticians neither can you be a reslly crap tactician. Zidane is just fine. At the end of the day he is the only coach who has gotten Ronaldo to track back for the team on more than one occasion

If he reaches the CL final he would have saved what would have otherwise been a horrendous season

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by halamadrid2 on Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:55 pm

DoC i think you are being overly pedantic. Zidane has had no preseason and had to keep playing players that were wholly out of form and out of shape to get their morals up from where they were before he took over.

It took him a few games to realise who he could trust and who he couldn't. If we had played Barca when we played Atleti and Atleti now our results would probably have been reversed. Win vs Atleti and loss vs Barca. It hurt us not having a CDM against Atleti, he has rectified that mistake, as well as finally realising what games he can trust Danilo to play as well as James and some others

Barely beating Roma and Wolfsburg is due to our complacency which has been our achilles heel over the years, NO coach will change that. There is a reason we went from 0-2 to 3-0 in just 7 days. It wasn't because Zidane brought some tactical masterplan but the players finally got into their heads that you can't win without working hard. Who could blame them we beat Roma, a team slightly better than Wolfsburg by coasting. Wolfsburg punished us and now the team is more focused imo

I am confident we will reach the CL final and that would not have been guaranteed to happen had we had other more experienced coaches. It depends on what their relationship is with the players. We all know Zidanes plan A and B so its not like he has invented something new but discrediting him because we coasted through Roma and Wolfsburg is a tad short sighted

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by Nivash on Tue Apr 19, 2016 10:57 am

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:He didn't bring us from the dead in the league, Barça did. They drew Villarreal and lost to both Sociedad and Valencia. That's 8 points dropped. He should only get credit for the three points in Camp Nou.

As for your statement "He hasn't failed in any way":

1. He lost to Atlético at home.
2. He dropped points against Betis. Hadn't he done that, we would've been ahead of Barça now.
3. He struggled against Roma and barely beat Wolfsburg.



If he isn't responsible for our successes when we succeed, he cannot also be responsible for our failure when we fail.

The resurgence in the league is down to both Barca dropping points and us winning those points. That we dropped points against Betis is just one of those things, teams drop points, sometimes against teams that they logically shouldn't drop points against. The measure of a manager isn't limited to just that. Zidane has the players believing in his vision for how they should be playing, which vision has enabled us to get to the point we are (in contention for the league and CL), a position that was considered a pipedream when he was appointed.

If we were to measure him on his tenure alone, he's got more points than Atletico and Barca, problem is that this season isn't determined by his tenure alone, and to punish him for that is completely unfair.

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

Post by Valkyrja on Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:04 pm



ARBELOA what a GOAT

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Re: Wolfsburg vs Real Madrid

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