UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Page 3 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by free_cat on Wed Feb 15, 2017 12:48 pm

Also, Umtiti is a log and definitely not good enough for us, he is just an excelent aerial player, but with tons of space, he sinks. And his ball playing is mediocre. Awful game from him.

free_cat
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Posts : 8544
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by Myesyats on Wed Feb 15, 2017 1:13 pm

Lol why are you shitting on Umtiti when he is not at fault at all. Great defender

The whole team should defend as an unit. From what I gathered midfield is the biggest problem, players are not crowding the middle of the pitch properly and quick attacks just flow through the gaps, leaving defenders helpless.

And it's not even because Iniesta & Busquets are past it & Gomes is shit. It's because Lucho's tactics are crap and when Messi plays like he did last night, it become painfully obvious (that tactically this team is a mess)

Myesyats
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Private
Posts : 8127
Join date : 2015-05-03

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by Myesyats on Wed Feb 15, 2017 1:18 pm

We need a coach like Valverde who really pays attention to tactics because even the best players in the world struggle without instructions because the game evolves and you gotta adapt.

Individual brilliance is not enough

Myesyats
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Private
Posts : 8127
Join date : 2015-05-03

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by free_cat on Wed Feb 15, 2017 1:47 pm

@Myesyats wrote:Lol why are you shitting on Umtiti when he is not at fault at all. Great defender

The whole team should defend as an unit. From what I gathered midfield is the biggest problem, players are not crowding the middle of the pitch properly and quick attacks just flow through the gaps, leaving defenders helpless.

And it's not even because Iniesta & Busquets are past it & Gomes is shit. It's because Lucho's tactics are crap and when Messi plays like he did last night, it become painfully obvious (that tactically this team is a mess)


While you are right on everything you say on your second and third paragraph, and your post above, you are just wrong on Umtiti.

I shit on him because his playing is shitable. Didn't you watch him yesterday? He was awful, starting for the foul that led to the 1-0, continuing with his awful passes, etc. Granted, everyone was bad yesterday, but him and Gomes were a bit worse.

However, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt until another coach comes, so I withdraw my comment. My bet though, is that he won't be good enough for us.

_________________
avatar
free_cat
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 8544
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by Myesyats on Wed Feb 15, 2017 1:53 pm

He's a safer bet than Mascherano surely. I believe he'll grow to be great.

Myesyats
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Private
Posts : 8127
Join date : 2015-05-03

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Wed Feb 15, 2017 3:02 pm

@free_cat wrote:
@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Free :bow:

Poch has already ruled himself out, so do you want anyone else besides Valverde?


I guess Sampaoli would be ok... but Argentine coaches are a huge gamble because they talk funny, they are very difficult to understand most of the time, and a coach works through comunication (I knoe Pochetino is argentine too but he spent 10 years here, he surely can communicate in standard spanish).

How do you know Pochettino is out? Perhaps now, but for next season?


He said he wouldn't coach Barça because of his Espanyol past.

We can always get a translator like Mourinho Smile

_________________
avatar
BarrileteCosmico
Admin
Admin

Club Supported : River Plate
Posts : 22905
Join date : 2011-06-05
Age : 28

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by windkick on Wed Feb 15, 2017 3:39 pm

Agreed with Meyestats on Umtiti and Lucho letting the entire squad down. We got out coached and out played. Individual brilliance will only go so far, and let's be honest, PSG has a pretty damn dynamic team. If we can't control the game they will run you down. Teams in Ligue 1 don't get that badly out played by them. I'm not shocked we lost to them, I'm shocked we got wrekt the way we did.

I mean everything starts in midfield, and we lost that battle. Our players just didn't click all game and were constantly leaving gaps and out of position. I blame Lucho here because he didn't spot this and instruct the players to fix this as the game went on. And also he took forever to finally make some changes with subs and try something new. Busq had just came back from an injury, and the finger can be pointed at that we don't have an adequate back up to him and might of been rushed back. Be the fact he remains he made so many bad passes.

Alba and Sergi were both heavily out classed by Draxler and Di Maria all game. Sergi was exposed as what he is, a midfielder playing a right back that doesn't have a ton of speed but has a good ball retention skill (which was his game as a midfielder). Vidal wouldn't of been any better at defending here, but he would of at least offered more going forward and made Draxler work a bit harder on the defensive end instead of just having a free go attacking. Same with Alba, didn't matter if it were him or Digne, the result would of been the same as neither are good enough defensively to handle Di Maria when he's on like he was. So the finger can be pointed at our transfers here, for not getting adequate defensive minded back ups to our attacking minded full backs in Alba/Vidal and midfielder turned right back Sergi.

So that right there points out our bad shape in midfield and inadequate full backs. You throw in Messi trying to play deeper to help the midfield/Sergi and that takes him out of the attack, and that pretty much removes Suarez from the game and Neymar was doing the same thing he does. Everything just went wrong. Umtiti and Pique did the best they could do given the entire group ahead of them was not helping them out.

So same story as last summer, we need to fix the full back positions and get a proper CDM back up, even though i got the idea the club is going to be happy just using Gomes/Sergi as the CDM back ups for the future. Also we might of had the best trident in the front, but no one on the bench to bring something new on the wings and Paco is trash.

This team has allot of work to be done and it has to start with Lucho leaving at the end of the season. All of these issues by the way have been there all season, this game just really showed the world what most Cules have seen all this time.

_________________
Luis Suárez : "Nutmegs were my only option."
avatar
windkick
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 5933
Join date : 2011-06-05
Age : 35

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by free_cat on Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:43 pm

It would have been funny when Umtiti almost fell on his ass towards the end of the game trying to clear an aerial ball, but it wasn't because he was playing for us. It was also very unfunny when he made an unnecessary foul that led to the 1-0, and ball watched for the 3-0 and 4-0 when he should have moved forward and press the player carrying the ball. Worst defender for us by far.

_________________
avatar
free_cat
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 8544
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by danyjr on Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:54 pm

It is funny how this guy is blaming Umtiti (whom by the way, was shit) when Piqué was at clear fault on 2 goals and Sergi Roberto and Alba was getting raped all night.

How about Busquets? What did he do to protect the back four? Nothing.

All the team was shit. Stop scapegoating one player for the failure of a team.

Luis Enrique out. Bartomeu Out.
avatar
danyjr
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Boca Juniors
Posts : 4547
Join date : 2012-02-24

http://www.tikitakatoom.tk

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by free_cat on Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:35 am

@danyjr wrote:It is funny how this guy is blaming Umtiti (whom by the way, was shit) when Piqué was at clear fault on 2 goals and Sergi Roberto and Alba was getting raped all night.

How about Busquets? What did he do to protect the back four? Nothing.

All the team was shit. Stop scapegoating one player for the failure of a team.

Luis Enrique out. Bartomeu Out.


Pique "only" was at fault for Cavani's goal. A fault shared with Umtiti who should have moved forward to press Mernier.

I agree with everything you say, I just want to point out that Umtiti is way not that good. He has too much of a good press.

If you bothered to read my rant post, you'd see I'm not scapegoating anyone (except maybe Gomes and Luis Enrique).

Weren't you one of the guys who said PSG were so weak, btw?

_________________
avatar
free_cat
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 8544
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by danyjr on Fri Feb 17, 2017 9:06 pm

No, Piqué was at fault for two goals, it is just that the Cavani one was more awful as he let the Uruguayan get away from him like a schoolboy. So when you blame Umtiti for giving away a foul that lead to a goal while easily overlooking Piqué's far more disastrous incident I have to point it out.

Gomes is shit, we've known this for ages. I agree with the points you made about him. Defensively he does absolutely nothing, he doesn't even challenge for second balls. He sucks creatively in the final third too. An absolute liability. Why Rakitić was on the bench? Ask the stupid manager Laughing

The truth is Luis Enrique hasn't brought anything new to the team since the end of his first season at charge. He constantly gets outplayed tactically, he does nothing to change things when things are going downhill and he knows no tactics other than get the ball to the front three and let them conjure some sort of magic.

And no I never said PSG were weak. I hadn't posted on this forum for months actually (apart from a couple here and there).

_________________
avatar
danyjr
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Boca Juniors
Posts : 4547
Join date : 2012-02-24

http://www.tikitakatoom.tk

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by sportsczy on Sat Feb 18, 2017 12:53 am

Umtiti is good. So is Pique.

You can't have a wave of players coming at the CBs at full speed with little fullback help (caught up field) and ask those CBs to remain aggressive. They will play on their heels. That's why you saw them give players so much space. They were moving backwards and giving room to compensate for the speed at which PSG players were coming at them.

PSG midfielders were coming at the CBs at full speed and the fullbacks were overlapping hard. I saw both Umtiti and Pique caught in "no man's land" a lot where they didn't know what they should cover as danger was coming at them from multiple players.

_________________
avatar
sportsczy
World Class Contributor
World Class Contributor

Club Supported : Marseille
Posts : 16380
Join date : 2011-12-07

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by jibers on Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:40 am

@sportsczy wrote:Umtiti is good. So is Pique.

You can't have a wave of players coming at the CBs at full speed with little fullback help (caught up field) and ask those CBs to remain aggressive. They will play on their heels. That's why you saw them give players so much space. They were moving backwards and giving room to compensate for the speed at which PSG players were coming at them.

PSG midfielders were coming at the CBs at full speed and the fullbacks were overlapping hard. I saw both Umtiti and Pique caught in "no man's land" a lot where they didn't know what they should cover as danger was coming at them from multiple players.


Spot on and what I've been saying hut people keep parroting the same nonsense. Give a defender too much space to cover and even Maldini would look awful. PSG have rarely played such a disorganised team this season in Ligue 1 because most get compact horizontally and vertically. The structure and coaching is the number 1 player.


@danjr Busquets can't shield the back 4 if he has to step up to try and stop counters and is also numerically outnumbered. It's no individuals fault but a massive collective problem.

_________________
avatar
jibers
World Class Contributor
World Class Contributor

Club Supported : Marseille
Posts : 10079
Join date : 2011-06-06

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by messixaviesta on Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:27 am

@free_cat wrote:
They are the best 2nd in the CL group phase. Arguably the worst matchup we could get. While they are struggling now, who knows how they'll be playing in January.

IMO, this is the best PSG in years, simply because they lost Ibra, which is a huge liability when playing against elite teams. Yeah, they are not getting the best resuls in the league, but they probably just need to get rythm. In reality they are stronger than ever.

Oh, and they also got rid of David Lolz, who handed us the win last time all by himself.

PROPHETIC Sad

messixaviesta
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 4207
Join date : 2011-06-06
Age : 39

http://twitter.com/messixaviesta , http://footballbydeepak.blogs

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by messixaviesta on Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:49 am

If I were to express my thoughts about arguably our greatest embarrassment in UCL in many years in a nutshell, maybe even greater than the Bayern thrashing of 2013, it is that it was a splendid tactical victory for PSG. They seemed that much better prepared and tactically aware than us.

It's ironic that more than a year back I read comments here and elsewhere saying that MSN are pretty much invincible. That no matter what any coach tries a team with them fully fit would always win. Instead we have been reminded once again that football is a team game, that when faced with strong opposition if the team as a whole does not play well enough even the most talented players can be made to look pedestrian. For all the hoopla around MSN maybe we can now conclude that Pep Guardiola's team built around MXI gave us a more sustainable model for success. Whats more is that it made you so much prouder as a fan seeing how almost every footballing detail was looked into with great care and the team played like a symphony. In case of the current team even their greatest victories rarely produce great team play and are often won on the excellence of individuals.

messixaviesta
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 4207
Join date : 2011-06-06
Age : 39

http://twitter.com/messixaviesta , http://footballbydeepak.blogs

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by BarcaLearning on Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:06 pm

Well said MXI, dont know whats going to happen with the next manager, but we definitely need some of the structure and proper tactics instead of what we are seeing now.

Regarding Ibra as Free Cat said, but I still dont quite understand why hes so ineffective vs the top teams in the CL? I mean I didnt watched him when he was in Serie A for example, where defenses are strong, but he still bossed it. The same thing for his national team although the quality of his teammates are understandable. I know hes too static and makes it easier to defend him, but cant quite pinpoint it.
avatar
BarcaLearning
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 4792
Join date : 2011-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by sportsczy on Tue Feb 21, 2017 12:44 am

You're tactically boxed in with Ibra as your CF.  His work rate isn't very good at all and he doesn't defend.  So PSG could never play a high line and press with Ibra in the lineup.  As great as he was/is, he causes his teams to become tactically limited.

Also, he just chokes a lot in big CL games.  I remember huge misses against Real Madrid and City last season.  Cavani being in awful form and choking too before this season was also a problem.

With Draxler and Di Maria on the sides and Cavani down the middle, you have a lot of athleticism.  Also, Kurzawa and Auerier/Meunier are also far more athletic than Jallet/VDW and Maxwell.  Heck, Rabiot is 100x more athletic than Motta.

Instead of being a team of names, PSG is now a team of young and athletic stars/ stars-in-the-making players.  Just a better makeup.  Emery is having troubles tactically in Ligue 1, however, as the league is known for athleticism.  I think they'll turn the corner there too soon in league.  He just needs to implement a tactic that isn't as reliant on causing high turnovers.  Ligue 1 teams are too conservative mostly to make that work.

_________________
avatar
sportsczy
World Class Contributor
World Class Contributor

Club Supported : Marseille
Posts : 16380
Join date : 2011-12-07

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by free_cat on Tue Feb 21, 2017 8:48 am

Umtiti being log even against Leganes. Laughing Dude can't even pass.

_________________
avatar
free_cat
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 8544
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by Harmonica on Tue Feb 21, 2017 3:10 pm

@free_cat wrote:Umtiti being log even against Leganes. Laughing Dude can't even pass.
Barca with Umtiti in Liga 13/13 wins.
Barca without Umtiti in Liga 2/10 wins.

Maybe focus the Eye of Mordor somewhere else?


_________________
- Come with me. Save yourself. You don't owe Argentine people any more. You've given them everything.
- Not everything. Not yet.
avatar
Harmonica
World Class Contributor
World Class Contributor

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 11028
Join date : 2011-06-07

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by BarcaLearning on Tue Feb 21, 2017 3:46 pm

@sportsczy wrote:You're tactically boxed in with Ibra as your CF.  His work rate isn't very good at all and he doesn't defend.  So PSG could never play a high line and press with Ibra in the lineup.  As great as he was/is, he causes his teams to become tactically limited.

Also, he just chokes a lot in big CL games.  I remember huge misses against Real Madrid and City last season.  Cavani being in awful form and choking too before this season was also a problem.

With Draxler and Di Maria on the sides and Cavani down the middle, you have a lot of athleticism.  Also, Kurzawa and Auerier/Meunier are also far more athletic than Jallet/VDW and Maxwell.  Heck, Rabiot is 100x more athletic than Motta.

Instead of being a team of names, PSG is now a team of young and athletic stars/ stars-in-the-making players.  Just a better makeup.  Emery is having troubles tactically in Ligue 1, however, as the league is known for athleticism.  I think they'll turn the corner there too soon in league.  He just needs to implement a tactic that isn't as reliant on causing high turnovers.  Ligue 1 teams are too conservative mostly to make that work.


Thanks for the explanation Sport, although still not sure how much the performances from PSG are down to Emery or more down to the new players as u mentioned, we will see how much credit he should get as time goes.
avatar
BarcaLearning
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 4792
Join date : 2011-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by matpol on Tue Feb 21, 2017 4:39 pm

@free_cat wrote:Umtiti being log even against Leganes. Laughing Dude can't even pass.


Sergi Scruberto vs Atletico Copa - red card
Sergi Sruberto vs PSG - raped by Draxler
Sergi Scruberto vs Leganes - at fault on goal, raped by some scrub

Still, Umtiti is your scapegoat because he isn't from La Masia as Scruberto.
avatar
matpol
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 1321
Join date : 2011-06-18

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Tue Feb 21, 2017 4:41 pm

Free is obsessed with Umtiti's passing but I never seem to see him complain about his defending hmm

_________________
avatar
BarrileteCosmico
Admin
Admin

Club Supported : River Plate
Posts : 22905
Join date : 2011-06-05
Age : 28

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by danyjr on Tue Feb 21, 2017 6:36 pm

@matpol wrote:
@free_cat wrote:Umtiti being log even against Leganes. Laughing Dude can't even pass.


Sergi Scruberto vs Atletico Copa - red card
Sergi Scruberto vs PSG - raped by Draxler
Sergi Scruberto vs Leganes - at fault on goal, raped by some scrub

Still, Umtiti is your scapegoat because he isn't from La Masia as Scruberto.

Sergi Scruberto vs Manchester City - at fault on goal, misplaced pass

_________________
avatar
danyjr
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Boca Juniors
Posts : 4547
Join date : 2012-02-24

http://www.tikitakatoom.tk

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by BarcaLearning on Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:36 am

Funny how around the begining of the season when he played a few good games, everyone thought he was goat eco smile
avatar
BarcaLearning
First Team
First Team

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 4792
Join date : 2011-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by free_cat on Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:46 pm

I thought we all agreed that Sergi Roberto was a temporary RB until we got a better one?

Umtiti's defending is nothing extraordinary, he was also poor vs Leganes and in the Copa game. The fact that we've won 13 games in the league with him, only mean's he's played against fodder. As it was shown vs PSG.

_________________
avatar
free_cat
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 8544
Join date : 2011-06-05

Back to top Go down

Re: UCL R16 - Paris St Germain [Leg 1/2 Discussion]

Post by windkick on Thu Feb 23, 2017 6:51 am

IDk man, I don't think Umtiti is a god or even great, but I also don't think he's nearly as terrible as your making him out to be. I think for a guy that just turned 23 and is halfway into his first season at a huge club he is doing just fine. Most CB's don't peak until mid-late 20's anyway, so I bet that by next season he will improve even further. I think a big reason that he has been under attack is because the midfields formation is leaving wayy too many gaps with the fullbacks constantly caught out of position or just plain bad at defending. Making Pique/Umtiti/Ter Stegen work way harder than they should if the alignment of the team was better and tighter.

All in all the two CB's we should sell in the summer are Mathieu and Masch. We can easily get rid of those 2 and replace them with 1 solid CB. Pique and Umtiti are fine imo and aren't the issue.

Sergi I don't mind as a back up RB, but we definitely need a legit RB to actually come in to the team.  Either that or make Vidal the back up RB as he offers more in attack and just use Sergi as a back up CDM next season. Sergi was by far the worse player of the back 4 against PSG, dude's just not fast enough, and good enough at defending on the wing and looked nervous and scared to make mistakes. He is a midfielder playing out of position and it shows.

I think we need to get Busq's invovled more. I read an article about how he used to get a ton of more touches and be a vital piece until Lucho arrived and made the build up go up the flanks and not down the center, thus drastically reducing Busq's role. IF used right, Busq's is a HUGE component, but Lucho can't seem to figure out how to get our midfield to work. I remember even last year we were getting ran down by teams like Celta, it was wild, and here we are a year later and Lucho still hasn't learn and if anything it looks like the team is gradually regressing and not progressing. Seems since like midway last season we just fell off a gear and haven't been able to get back to our best and instead just getting by more so on our great players doing something rather than Lucho actually improving things.

_________________
Luis Suárez : "Nutmegs were my only option."
avatar
windkick
Fan Favorite
Fan Favorite

Club Supported : Barcelona
Posts : 5933
Join date : 2011-06-05
Age : 35

Back to top Go down

Page 3 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum