UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

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UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by guest7 on Sat Sep 02, 2017 7:31 am

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Sat Sep 02, 2017 9:48 am

Regardless of whether or not they're guilty of breaching FFP rules, PSG has earned my respect in terms of being ambitious beyond the imaginable.

They're looking to establish a dynasty and become a powerhouse in European football, and they understood it wouldn't happen if they kept signing second tier players.

I rarely ever agree with anything Mourinho says, but he was damn right about FFP being unfair and how it was meticulously tailored to protect the big clubs and prevent the "small" ones from becoming elites.

They say that clubs are allowed to spend heavily on acquiring players but they have to counterbalance that with legitimate sources of income, allowing them to approach break-even on their football-related business.

Marvelous! So in essence, you're going to apply the same rule for a club like Real Madrid with a turnover of a whopping 700m and a club like Darmstadt with a turnover of 41.5m?

Let's say the German club gets bought tomorrow by a filthy-rich royal family. If they have the cash to do what they want to do without going bankrupt or suffering financial ruin, why are you stopping them from buying a Neymar?

The funny thing is every single big club did this at some point to get out of mediocrity. You can't improve drastically by buying just one elite player every year. You have to make a ground-splitting overhaul and spend close to a quarter of a billion in one window, and even then it might not suffice.

PSG just so happens to be unlucky enough to have a relatively low turnover (compared to the big boys) and to make their overhaul after the establishment of the FFP.

If one of the big boys bought Neymar this summer, no one would bat an eyelash, including UEFA, because they know their turnover is high enough to dodge the rules.

There's nothing fair about FFP. It's just a modern-day type of fraudulent scheme perfectly designed to literally cripple clubs with small brands with a tight grip and make sure they don't grow enough to challenge the biggest clubs in Europe when Richie Rich buys one of them.

BTW, I'm completely against what PSG did to acquire Neymar (through Qatar). But I'll never be against a rich club splashing money for fun as long as they have the cash to do it.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Vlad the Impaler on Sat Sep 02, 2017 12:08 pm

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:
long post:
Regardless of whether or not they're guilty of breaching FFP rules, PSG has earned my respect in terms of being ambitious beyond the imaginable.

They're looking to establish a dynasty and become a powerhouse in European football, and they understood it wouldn't happen if they kept signing second tier players.

I rarely ever agree with anything Mourinho says, but he was damn right about FFP being unfair and how it was meticulously tailored to protect the big clubs and prevent the "small" ones from becoming elites.

They say that clubs are allowed to spend heavily on acquiring players but they have to counterbalance that with legitimate sources of income, allowing them to approach break-even on their football-related business.

Marvelous! So in essence, you're going to apply the same rule for a club like Real Madrid with a turnover of a whopping 700m and a club like Darmstadt with a turnover of 41.5m?

Let's say the German club gets bought tomorrow by a filthy-rich royal family. If they have the cash to do what they want to do without going bankrupt or suffering financial ruin, why are you stopping them from buying a Neymar?

The funny thing is every single big club did this at some point to get out of mediocrity. You can't improve drastically by buying just one elite player every year. You have to make a ground-splitting overhaul and spend close to a quarter of a billion in one window, and even then it might not suffice.

PSG just so happens to be unlucky enough to have a relatively low turnover (compared to the big boys) and to make their overhaul after the establishment of the FFP.

If one of the big boys bought Neymar this summer, no one would bat an eyelash, including UEFA, because they know their turnover is high enough to dodge the rules.

There's nothing fair about FFP. It's just a modern-day type of fraudulent scheme perfectly designed to literally cripple clubs with small brands with a tight grip and make sure they don't grow enough to challenge the biggest clubs in Europe when Richie Rich buys one of them.

BTW, I'm completely against what PSG did to acquire Neymar (through Qatar). But I'll never be against a rich club splashing money for fun as long as they have the cash to do it.


I totally agree with you.

I followed your posts in the past year from time to time and now I can really say that you are one of my favorite posters. Heart
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Interman on Sat Sep 02, 2017 5:26 pm

as long as they don't win the UCL, they cannot gather ve massiglobal fan base to reach Man U, Real, Barca type of reveneus. Neymar, Mbappe, etc. help, but winning the UCL trophy, 2-3 times in the span of few years, is what will take win them fans and revenues than simply signing superstars.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by titosantill on Sat Sep 02, 2017 5:42 pm

@Interman wrote:as long as they don't win the UCL, they cannot gather ve massiglobal fan base to reach Man U, Real, Barca type of reveneus. Neymar, Mbappe, etc. help, but winning the UCL trophy, 2-3 times in the span of few years, is what will take win them fans and revenues than simply signing superstars.


yes they can. how many ucl titles did united win before they became global? prior to 1999, they had their first ucl in the george best era. and before that 99 final they were already a global franchise. in terms of worldwide popularity, they were more global than we were even though the ucl in 99 was their first ucl in years. the appeal of david beckham was a major influence, NOT winning the ucl 2-3 times in the span of a few years, which they did not do in the 90s

btw i agree with the bulk of demon's post, i cannot get upset about a team with ambition, i'd rather the ambition than passiveness, and many would too....just ask arsenal. if uefa are really serious then they'll need to institute a salary cap/transfer cap, but they can't cos you'll need football associations around the continent and big clubs to agree to it, which won't happen. and that should tell uefa who really answers to who.

uefa needs the powerhouse financial sides more than ever. catering to the needs of roma, ajax et al, hardly serves any purpose
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Warrior on Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:10 pm

In fact, we realize UEFA barely has any power Laughing
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Doc on Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:19 pm

The Investigatory Chamber of the UEFA Club Financial Control Body has opened a formal investigation into Paris Saint-Germain as part of its ongoing monitoring of clubs under Financial Fair Play (FFP) regulations.

The investigation will focus on the compliance of the club with the break-even requirement, particularly in light of its recent transfer activity.

Even if there is actual wrong doing (think the only one was simply pissing off Barcelona), pretty sure it isn't difficult for PSG to reach the break even requirement. Really do not see UEFA finding anything in this. FFP was a farce from the start anyway...

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by sportsczy on Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:23 pm

They just ruffled the feathers of the European football aristocracy and UEFA has to stroke their egos...

It's disgusting.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by guest7 on Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:45 pm

Personally I like what UEFA is doing because it stops inflation. But I'd rather they do more to stop inflation, like put a price limit or something. Because it's retarded prices being thrown around and it's unfair to smaller clubs!
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Harmonica on Sat Sep 02, 2017 7:06 pm

Lock these baguette stuffers up.

But I'm sure Nasser has sent money to Uefa also to deal this.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by titosantill on Sat Sep 02, 2017 7:45 pm

@guest7 wrote:Personally I like what UEFA is doing because it stops inflation. But I'd rather they do more to stop inflation, like put a price limit or something. Because it's retarded prices being thrown around and it's unfair to smaller clubs!


they can't put a price limit, they don't have that kind of power. think about how hard it is for la liga to agree on tv rights; they sway to the tune of real and barcelona on big financial matters; now imagine that on a larger scale , u think real utd psg city chelsea will succumb to any demands by uefa regarding transfer caps? uefa is just trying to act tough for no reason

fact is, nobody follows the ucl because of the likes of ajax, roma et al, hell they hardly are even consistent contestants in the ucl, they've probably played more europa games than ucl in the last ten or so years. and even with parity, the likes of grasshopper rosenburg won't do squat. even europa isn't all that which is why they instituted that the winner gets entry into the ucl

majority of the football associations in europe would have to agree for it to work. and the small clubs you have pity for.....you think monaco aren't excited about getting a 160 million euro check? or they aren't happy about that 80 million we gave them for james? small clubs actually like that they can sell players for huge amounts to build other parts of their club. i bet porto and benfica (selling coentrao for 30 mill) will be against a cap of any sort
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by titosantill on Sat Sep 02, 2017 7:48 pm

uefa aren't economists, its not their job to tackle inflation lol
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by guest7 on Sat Sep 02, 2017 8:08 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBA_salary_cap

NBA has a salary cap, I think a price cap would be nice too.

You can read more on it on the link I posted tito. It's my opinion but you can have yours, personally football would be much better with a price and salary cap.
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Doc on Sat Sep 02, 2017 9:48 pm

For starters, it is ridiculously easier for the NBA to have a salary cap as all but 1 team plays in the States. For UEFA to even get that off the ground, countries' FA has to agree to it (not even gonna attempt to get into the whole "if it is actually legal to have a salary cap" in Europe). Sovereign nations that have their own agenda. It's basically impossible at this stage...or any.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by guest7 on Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:45 pm

Then I'm sorry for PSG, this is the only way to stop inflation. What PSG has done to the market is hurting all the clubs big time. Madrid even refusing to participate in this market when inflated prices are being thrown around. Tells you how bad it is right now.
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:08 am

@Vlad the Impaler wrote:
@The Demon of Carthage wrote:
long post:
Regardless of whether or not they're guilty of breaching FFP rules, PSG has earned my respect in terms of being ambitious beyond the imaginable.

They're looking to establish a dynasty and become a powerhouse in European football, and they understood it wouldn't happen if they kept signing second tier players.

I rarely ever agree with anything Mourinho says, but he was damn right about FFP being unfair and how it was meticulously tailored to protect the big clubs and prevent the "small" ones from becoming elites.

They say that clubs are allowed to spend heavily on acquiring players but they have to counterbalance that with legitimate sources of income, allowing them to approach break-even on their football-related business.

Marvelous! So in essence, you're going to apply the same rule for a club like Real Madrid with a turnover of a whopping 700m and a club like Darmstadt with a turnover of 41.5m?

Let's say the German club gets bought tomorrow by a filthy-rich royal family. If they have the cash to do what they want to do without going bankrupt or suffering financial ruin, why are you stopping them from buying a Neymar?

The funny thing is every single big club did this at some point to get out of mediocrity. You can't improve drastically by buying just one elite player every year. You have to make a ground-splitting overhaul and spend close to a quarter of a billion in one window, and even then it might not suffice.

PSG just so happens to be unlucky enough to have a relatively low turnover (compared to the big boys) and to make their overhaul after the establishment of the FFP.

If one of the big boys bought Neymar this summer, no one would bat an eyelash, including UEFA, because they know their turnover is high enough to dodge the rules.

There's nothing fair about FFP. It's just a modern-day type of fraudulent scheme perfectly designed to literally cripple clubs with small brands with a tight grip and make sure they don't grow enough to challenge the biggest clubs in Europe when Richie Rich buys one of them.

BTW, I'm completely against what PSG did to acquire Neymar (through Qatar). But I'll never be against a rich club splashing money for fun as long as they have the cash to do it.


I totally agree with you.

I followed your posts in the past year from time to time and now I can really say that you are one of my favorite posters. Heart

You're too kind, Vlad. Thank you Smile .

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by sportsczy on Sun Sep 03, 2017 6:43 pm

lol at some Madrid fans saying another club is causing "inflation". That's the absolute height of hypocrisy.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by vanDEEZ on Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:02 pm

RM broke the world transfer fee by less than 40%. PSG broke the world record transfer fee by over 100% in less than a year.

Quite a difference in rapid inflation.
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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Doc on Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:15 pm

Denying Madrid didn't have a hand in transfer fees being raised is like denying PSG literally didn't cause an inflation in prices with that one purchase. Both clubs have been very guilty.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by sportsczy on Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:35 pm

Madrid have done it for 50 years lol. And Madrid raising transfer record... over their own transfer records for the past 20 years Laughing Don't make me bring out the data because it will fleece any arguments.

PSG go for it... woe be to them. How dare they look to compete. They should be thrown out of Europe. Nobody should dare challenge the elite at their own game.

The crazy part is that Man U and City made informal requests to see if Neymar would be willing to sign with them at the same price. And let;s not pretend that Madrid wouldn't have dropped the 220 mil in a heartbeat if Neymar coming to Madrid was even remotely possible.

The hypocrisy is absolutely shameful.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Doc on Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:41 pm

Madrid so have not done it for 50 years. The majority of the most expensive signings that have occurred in said 50 years were by Italian clubs. Madrid really joined the show when Flo became president and selling off the training ground.

Also, you forgot how much bad press Madrid got for their signings or something? The investigation into their sale of the stadium? Buying Ronaldo for such an obscene amount of money when the world economy was definitely not the finest, especially in Spain? What exactly you thought was gonna happen?

The majority of us probably have no issues in PSG spending power especially me. Do what you gotta do but I'm not gonna pretend their actions have not caused the transfer game to change further.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by sportsczy on Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:50 pm

Bad press and a UEFA investigation are COMPLETELY different things.  And this isn't a case of public officials circumventing public monies to give funds to a club (which is what Spain did with the land deal).  This is an investor group putting equity, not debt... equity, into a club.  As a matter of practice, Ligue 1 also forces clubs to put into their bank account either the full amount of ALL the wages for the clubs for the lifetime of the contracts or show that they club revenue from commercial sources can cover any cash deficiency... they passed that part too. The penalties are beyond harsh in Ligue 1 if you don't do this properly too. Like get booted completely out of the pro ranks, which is what happened to Evian, Bastia, etc.

For some strange reason, investors aren't allowed to help grow a football club by investing their own money. It's considered "immoral".

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by Doc on Mon Sep 04, 2017 12:02 am

UEFA can go suck an egg at this point. Also, my comment was more about the fan perspective than the governing body's perspective. They are other issues they can investigate than PSG spending their own money.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by sportsczy on Mon Sep 04, 2017 12:11 am

No I get it. When there's massive disparity in spending power and no salary cap = fans from clubs who can't keep up get upset.

If you want a level playing field, a salary cap is the only way. But that can never happen in football as you mentioned.

The model isn't going to change anytime soon. I personally think it's healthy to have new clubs compete with traditional elite ones by bringing in massive investment. Otherwise, football is getting quite boring in terms of competitiveness at the top.

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Re: UEFA opens an investigation into PSG

Post by BarrileteCosmico on Mon Sep 04, 2017 12:40 am

Even if UEFA instituted a salary cap it would just mean the best talent would move to the Qatari/Chinese/whatever league instead. I think FFP had the right idea about it, which is to make sure that clubs spend within their means so no club bankruptcies happen, but it was never meant to regulate player prices.

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