Italy OUT of the WC

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by titosantill on Sat Nov 11, 2017 3:16 pm

lol who really cares if italy doesn't make it. they're not filled with prime vieris del pieros tottis and the likes on their team anymore. same with netherlands. outside of the fact they are big footballing countries, there's really nothing or nobody i would have really looked forward to watching on those sides at this point. italy was at the last world cup and outside of suarez biting chiellini, they were barely noticed. they've needed to rebuild since like 06

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Luca on Sat Nov 11, 2017 4:14 pm

@titosantill wrote:lol who really cares if italy doesn't make it. they're not filled with prime vieris del pieros tottis and the likes on their team anymore. same with netherlands. outside of the fact they are big footballing countries, there's really nothing or nobody i would have really looked forward to watching on those sides at this point. italy was at the last world cup and outside of suarez biting chiellini, they were barely noticed. they've needed to rebuild since like 06


We have to drift away from thee superlatives that paint Italy as a team unworthy of a World Cup. Yes, a weaker generation of players compared to previous ones and yes, a bang average manager to pair up with but are Italy not a top 32 nation in the world? It's ludicrous

However, on current form its a sad state

I've never seen such a collection of ridiculous opinions as Italy being on the brink of elimination

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Robespierre on Sat Nov 11, 2017 4:31 pm

Italy has just missed a qualification in its history , and it was in '52 (hard to find who saw this ) , so it's hard to say who cares for it. It represents an event for football , as if a big team 'd relegate in Serie B for first time. Noone probably imagined to watch this.
Then I 'm the first one to say current Italian players are overrated, just when there is a young player there are the new Buffon  , the new Nesta, the new Del Piero   , the new Pirlo etc when we talk about good players at best. Been to discuss with Belotti "close to Higuain" here and for me it's heresy ( I am Inter fan but that doesn't prevent me to be unbiased  ) , or my Immobile post on his thread confirms what I think about him ( not really surprised he was useless against Sweden ) . Verratti is not worthy of half Modric etc
Said that, it is good NT , worthy to play a good World Cup on normal conditions.
I think Sweden will go forward anyway , it reminds me Helsinborgs-Inter CL playoff 2000 . So my prediction is 0-0 on 2nd leg with Insigne to miss penalty kick to 90' .
This Italy is not capable to win 2-0 or 3-1 , no ideas and pressure. The worst mix to perform it.


@urbaNRoots wrote:I would much rather see Sweden in the World Cup than the boring ass Italy and Netherlands. I would say the same for England but at least they provide the banter.


Reason ? Does Sweden play exciting football?
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by titosantill on Sat Nov 11, 2017 4:45 pm

@luca, the closest thing we have to a meritocracy in society is sports. there is a way to make a tournament, you play who your put up against and the winner goes through, if italy can't get past that task they have no business going through, despite what the rankings are

but forget the rankings, there's nobody out there i look forward to seeing. the goalie is the most popular player on the team, and he's damn near 64 years old. the football association needs to visit the drawing board when a goalie is the team's most popular player. when khan was germany's (they made the wc final, but they where meh)

i used to like watching bobo play, even if italy didn't put in a good shift, you still wanted to see guys like bobo, guys like baggio. italy needs to address a bunch of issues, and this is the time for it. nobody's looking forward to seeing another set of buffon heroics or chiellini covering every blade of grass
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Luca on Sat Nov 11, 2017 5:15 pm

@titosantill wrote:@luca, the closest thing we have to a meritocracy in society is sports. there is a way to make a tournament, you play who your put up against and the winner goes through, if italy can't get past that task they have no business going through, despite what the rankings are

but forget the rankings, there's nobody out there i look forward to seeing. the goalie is the most popular player on the team, and he's damn near 64 years old. the football association needs to visit the drawing board when a goalie is the team's most popular player. when khan was germany's (they made the wc final, but they where meh)

i used to like watching bobo play, even if italy didn't put in a good shift, you still wanted to see guys like bobo, guys like baggio. italy needs to address a bunch of issues, and this is the time for it. nobody's looking forward to seeing another set of buffon heroics or chiellini covering every blade of grass


I get that tito, in fact I even agree with you. If they don't go through they obviously don't deserve it. It won't be some sort of great injustice, it will be the result of a poor team with a poor manager not squeaking through. Even if Italy manage to qualify, the expectations are super low for this group right now.

What I'm saying though, is that there are many teams that will be at the World Cup who many people won't be "looking forward" to watch, but they'll watch because its the goddamn World Cup, everyone watches it and wants to be there

In my mind, Italy are already out so I've made my peace with it, I just hope they play without fear on Monday and maybe they can make something happen but there seems to be no belief in this team, from the players, the fans, everyone

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Unique on Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:38 pm

Italy will beat Sweden 2-0 on Monday :coffee:

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Myesyats on Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:43 pm

@Unique wrote:Italy will beat Sweden 2-0 on Monday :coffee:

Wouldn't count on that. IMO Sweden will go through. Wanna take this to the betting thread? :coffee:

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Unique on Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:56 pm

@Myesyats wrote:
@Unique wrote:Italy will beat Sweden 2-0 on Monday :coffee:

Wouldn't count on that. IMO Sweden will go through. Wanna take this to the betting thread? :coffee:
name your terms eco smile

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Tomwin Lannister on Sat Nov 11, 2017 8:04 pm

Hopefully Italy don't qualify. The country needs a kick up it's ass (no homo) and maybe just maybe they'll get their act together in 4-8 years time.

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Kaladin on Sat Nov 11, 2017 8:14 pm

@Tomwin Lannister wrote:Hopefully Italy don't qualify. The country needs a kick up it's ass (no homo) and maybe just maybe they'll get their act together in 4-8 years time.


Completely agree

The FIGC are living like its 1990, the Lega don't care about the product (Serie A) or how its presented, there's a reason the media rights are like a fraction of the PL's (100m to PL's 1billion?) i look at Serie A and see terrible pitches, unrefined interfaces, compare Sky how they overload you with match info, player profiles, graphics of players, tidbit infos during the match, comparisons etc to Serie A lol, they just got the scoreline in the top left and thats it lmao

Dont get me started on the backwards thinking clubs, even Milan ffs, only Juve are evolving with the content its pushing out to its viewers, meanwhile, our social media account:



This is Vince-level out of touch with reality, you see Man City pushing content on youtube on players on things the fans want to see, meanwhile, not even Chievo fans know whats up with Chievo's twitter account lol.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Luca on Sat Nov 11, 2017 8:44 pm

There's no benefit from not qualifying to the World Cup brothers. Italy can win the next three in a row and today it would still be an epic failure

But now we have to let the chips fall where they may, qualification is still possible and in our hands as it is with Sweden

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Myesyats on Sat Nov 11, 2017 8:46 pm

@Unique wrote:
@Myesyats wrote:
@Unique wrote:Italy will beat Sweden 2-0 on Monday :coffee:

Wouldn't count on that. IMO Sweden will go through. Wanna take this to the betting thread? :coffee:
name your terms eco smile

1 month sig? I'll post it in the betting thread and make a note that it's already taken by you to make it official Very Happy

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Unique on Sat Nov 11, 2017 8:47 pm

@Myesyats wrote:
@Unique wrote:
@Myesyats wrote:
Wouldn't count on that. IMO Sweden will go through. Wanna take this to the betting thread? :coffee:
name your terms eco smile

1 month sig? I'll post it in the betting thread and make a note that it's already taken by you to make it official Very Happy
Thumbs up

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Warrior on Sat Nov 11, 2017 9:10 pm

Italy NT is an institution in world football, so is Argentina or Netherlands (since less time). A world cup without them is less prestigious from my neutral point of view.

But not everybody cares about that. Some prefer to see more underdog teams, some prefer the classics, it's a matter of preference.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Robespierre on Sat Nov 11, 2017 9:52 pm

No pls Italy has nothing to do with Netherlands, it is as if Germany or Brazil miss a WC. Same, infact they are the 3 NTs with more qualifications.

Anyway who thinks for a change ( as Germany in 2000 )  if Italy misses WC will be deluded.

I know my chicken . Whenever Italy got a WC fiasco, the reaction was the autarky. In '66 , after North Korea-Italy,Serie A closed to foreign players ( now it's not possible. Inter was forced to delete the Beckanbauer and Eusebio contracts for it ) , after 2002 FIGC chose for the limits to extra-EU player ( it might happen again ).

Even now it's again started the mantra " it is because of many foreign players " ..... etc ... moreover if I consider FIGC president is Tavecchio , I fear new autarkic measure, that is counterproductive for Serie A.
And expecially it is a false problem .

We 'd need of a deep structural reform , but Italy can't do it.

Sincerely Italy to miss WC is shame not just for prestige but even because, they 'd be top 8 NTs in the world. If coached decently.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by RealGunner on Sat Nov 11, 2017 9:56 pm

Couldn't have said it any better.

Netherlands shouldn't be mentioned. Robben was the last star player and he retired. They are now playing with babel as his replacement. A nothing team. Iran are twice the team than them.

Italy brings prestige and star players to the world cup. Would be terrible if they don't make it. But Sweden will go through on merit so can't take anything away from them.

I am 100% sure Italy will do it at home. Too many good players to not pull it off.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Firenze on Sat Nov 11, 2017 10:03 pm

Everyone loves an Underdog story, an Underdog making the WC is cool and all until they start playing and getting battered or playing like West Brom and grinding out 0-0's hoping to luck through groups. Italy are shite atm but they're more likely to turn up at the big stage.

The WC is a spectacle for most people.  Not seeing them would be like going to watch The Avengers expecting to see Captain America but you get Captain Britain instead, some jobber who appeared in like one comic back in the day. I hope they make it.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Doc on Sat Nov 11, 2017 10:05 pm

Prestige, sure but what star players Italy have now. An aging Buffon? Isco's pet Verrati? A striker literally named Immobile? This ain't the Italy that was star studded, this is a side that sheepishly lost to Sweden that, let's be honest, only Hala knows the players and I feel he does get confused himself.

Italy not being there, and I say this with no fear or favour, would have no effect on the World Cup's value. Also, it's Italy, they'll be fine. Also also, it's just 1-0. Pretty sure it is within their own capabilities that they can overturn it.

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by urbaNRoots on Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:06 pm

@Robespierre wrote:
@urbaNRoots wrote:I would much rather see Sweden in the World Cup than the boring ass Italy and Netherlands. I would say the same for England but at least they provide the banter.

Reason ? Does Sweden play exciting football?

They play more exciting football than this Italy team, that's for sure. I watched Italy against Albania twice and then against Spain, that team has no place in a World Cup. I would rather watch a young team full of energy and the excitement of Swedish fans have a go at a World Cup than Italy somehow making their way past the group stage, get all hyped up and then get smashed by the first opponent and still hear all the complaints about how Italy failed (despite doing okay).

I guess I'm not a traditionalist, if I see the German NT bore me, I would want them to sit this one out and get their shit together for the next one instead of a sympathy qualification.

Also Swedish girls.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Luca on Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:17 pm

@Doc wrote:Prestige, sure but what star players Italy have now. An aging Buffon? Isco's pet Verrati? A striker literally named Immobile? This ain't the Italy that was star studded, this is a side that sheepishly lost to Sweden that, let's be honest, only Hala knows the players and I feel he does get confused himself.

Italy not being there, and I say this with no fear or favour, would have no effect on the World Cup's value. Also, it's Italy, they'll be fine. Also also, it's just 1-0. Pretty sure it is within their own capabilities that they can overturn it.


You really don't think Italy have a personnel worthy of the World Cup?

Are we talking about making the World Cup or winning the World Cup because this argument has been copy and pasted in several different forms by several different posters since the Sweden match and I just don't understand it. I don't think I've seen anyone boast about the qualify of this Italian team in comparison with previous editions, nor has anyone compared Ventura with previous managers. I don't think anyone will list Italy anywhere near favourites for the World Cup, should they qualify and no, they don't have a player like Messi or Ronaldo, but isn't that a stretch from not being worthy of the World Cup?



With all due respect, this isn't a group that Italy is unworthy of making, even on current form.

Italy have had worse teams, for me 2010 was quite poor and even 2016 in the Euros, Conte had a worse group too and just got more out of them, beating Belgium, Spain and losing to penalties to Germany, even beat Sweden with Pelle and Eder as the forwards. Say what you may about Immobile and Belotti but they are quite good to be honest, just not world class players.

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Tomwin Lannister on Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:17 pm

@ES I've been saying it for ages. Comparing Sky Sports presentation to Serie A stuff and it's hilarious.

As a neutral, if i'm looking to follow football the presentation alone turns me far, far away from Serie A.

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by sportsczy on Sun Nov 12, 2017 1:17 am

The point he's making Luca is the Italy won't be a contender... probably right. But I always feel like teams such as Italy should be in the WC because it makes the WC better even if they aren't in great shape right now.

At least they have players I genuinely want to see while a lot of teams literally are just taking space.

That said, you have to earn your spot on the pitch. This isn't a beauty contest. So either Italy earns it or doesn't.

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Warrior on Sun Nov 12, 2017 1:23 am

Netherlands might be considered a nothing team, they've been shit for 3 years not 30. It's still a international football institution that struggles at qualify for WC 2018, same as Italy or Argentina.

Now you can twist it around or be offended, but my point wasn't about making a podium of who's the most prestigious half-flopping NTs.

GERMANY, ITALY, FRANCE, SPAIN, NETHERLANDS, ENGLAND
BRAZIL, ARGENTINA
MEXICO

Those are the teams that i'd like to see in every World Cup, for an abstract reason (not based on performance) i see them as pillar nations in football... it's ok to disagree.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Luca on Sun Nov 12, 2017 2:23 am

@sportsczy wrote:The point he's making Luca is the Italy won't be a contender... probably right. But I always feel like teams such as Italy should be in the WC because it makes the WC better even if they aren't in great shape right now.

At least they have players I genuinely want to see while a lot of teams literally are just taking space.

That said, you have to earn your spot on the pitch. This isn't a beauty contest. So either Italy earns it or doesn't.


Oh, if that's the case, its absolutely right. The world would end if Ventura won a World Cup with this team, there is no one living capable of such a feat. Maybe firenze on playstation 4 but that's about it

I just mean they still have enough merit to qualify for a world cup, should they beat Sweden, no one should think contrary but I digress because that's a big ask as it currently stands

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Sun Nov 12, 2017 2:35 am

How many times have we seen a big team struggle to qualify and then do very well in a tournament?

Happens all the *bleep* time, i'd rather that happen then see some new countries who ultimately are boring AF.

In fairness though, i don't particularly consider Sweden that but in general i think it's better these big nations qualify.

It would have been utter shite if Argentina didn't qualify for example.

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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

Post by Warrior on Sun Nov 12, 2017 3:06 am

Agreed 1000% i wish i could be this concise in my words.

Sweden deserves respect, i'd take them in World Cup ahead of Switzland, Greece or any of the 2 Irelands. Just not to the detriment of Italy.
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Re: Italy OUT of the WC

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