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Post by futbol_bill on Sun Jul 22, 2018 10:27 am

No I don’t know that (nor do you) nor do I agree with anything in your post. You are the one that first posted this season was-going to be trasitional. You’re such a hypocrit!. I believe that Vallejo, Ceballos, Odriozola will be given amble time to demonstrate they belong or not. We likely will only see glimses of Vinicius. The one I’m not convinced is Llorente. As for Theo and Kova, I believe both are going. Papers this morning saying Kova is insisting on departure after talking with Lopetequi. I believe Bale will be given the opportunity, he has demanded. I believe this team could be competitive in liga and Copa if they sign a proper CF. I don’t believe this team is strong enough for CL even with a proper CF, given what likely is still available.

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Post by sportsczy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:10 am

It is going to be transitional because we need to transition new players and a new manager you nincumpoop. I cursed you out as you deserve; but decided to edit and take the harsh words out.

There is no transition allowed in terms of results however.  Name me the last manager that survived a poor year with no results?  Do you know who?  Here you go:

Alfredo Di Stefano after 1982-1983 lol.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Real_Madrid_C.F._managers

So we actually DO KNOW that Real Madrid haven't kept a manager without a trophy over the last 25 years.  Are you saying we're going to change that this season?  Based on what?


Last edited by sportsczy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:03 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Thimmy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 12:20 pm

Jose Mourinho only won the cup in his first season. Barcelona also humiliatingly defeated us by 5 to 0, we got kicked out in the round of 16 in the CL yet again, and he was sent to the stands for protesting. Even if Lopetegui doesn't manage to at least win the cup in his first season in charge, I'm sure he'll leave a better, overall impression than Jose did.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sun Jul 22, 2018 12:26 pm

To Sports' point, Mourinho was not trophyless on his first season, and that copa win came by defeating barca. It gave him credibility despite it all

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Post by sportsczy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 12:32 pm

Mourinho MAY have survived... but he did win that Cup against Barca. So he wasn't trophiless.

I'm just not convinced that a manager can survive a poor season. And if he surprisingly did, the pressure on him in his second year would be crushing.

The way to do it is for Flo to come out BEFORE the season and say this is a 2-3 year project... something like that. But he'll never make such a statement. He's a political animal above all and, saying this, he would take on all responsibility. As it stands, all the responsibility is on the manager.

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Post by vanDEEZ on Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:28 pm

So Mourinho would have been fired if he didn’t win the CDR in his first season? Eh, idk about that.
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Post by sportsczy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:32 pm

If he lost against Barca again after the debacle against them in La Liga? not outside the realm of possibility. He did get that cup though so we'll never know.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:34 pm

Mourinho would have been the ecxeception imo. he had spent a lot of times building his political clout an selling the second season as the one that will win the season.

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Post by titosantill on Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:46 pm

agree with nick there, i don't think the copa del rey saved mourinho, afterall we've fired coaches who won la liga before. and that season was still a disappointment because barcelona won the two that mattered and directly knocked us out in both. but unlike many managers mourinho had a huge bargaining chip based on the fact his inter had won the treble, and knocked barca out in the process preventing a ucl final in the bernabeau featuring them. and he had sold us successfully into the idea that his second seasons where always better.
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Post by The Madrid One on Sun Jul 22, 2018 3:12 pm

Just because we don't win trophies doesn't necessarily mean that Lopetegui would get fired, it depends on actual situation and context imo. We could play good football but for factors such as injuries, bad luck,  not having enough goal scorers, etc, come out short for example.  As for Mourinho, he was considered to be the best manager with Pep at the time and so he had enough leverage, and that Barca was historic and we were knocked out controversially from the CL so he was never going to be fired.Copa victory also meant alot and La Liga campaign was good enough. There was also the second season to expect and it was a young team. Again, you have to consider context.


Last edited by The Madrid One on Sun Jul 22, 2018 3:14 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Unique on Sun Jul 22, 2018 3:13 pm

Does Scandinavia have no football clubs then. I thought they club football in them countries

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Post by futbol_bill on Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:15 pm

I’ll defer comments re Sports until end of season! As far as I’m concerned season depends on who or if they get re Benzema’s replacement? And that’s all on Flo!
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Post by Thimmy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:29 pm

@Unique wrote:Does Scandinavia have no football clubs then. I thought they club football in them countries

Of course, we do, but the football here is more physical than technical. I support my local team in the sense that I want them to win, but the football they play is not entertaining. They were genuinely entertaining to watch when Martin Ødegaard played here, but generally speaking, the vast majority of the players are all height and strength, no technique. The league doesn't pull a ton of foreign talent, like the prem does. The most technically skillfull, Norwegian players are all below the age of 20 and play abroad.

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Post by futbol_bill on Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:36 pm

Blah blah blah. If you haven’t noticed Flo at this point is invincible. He has set up the cards so that there is absolutely no threat to his reign.

Lopetequi’s fate is solely in the hands of Perez. Regardless of what we fans or socios want, the decisions are solely in Flo’s hands.

This season will indeed be transitional, but how we come out of it, noone can securely predict. We of course need a better goal scorer than the Frenchman. But who we get is a matter of the market!

What I believe we can count on is
- better tactics
- better team play
- better use of entire squad
- more entertaining play

At end of day, this is a season of evaluation
- of the kids (Ceballos, Vallejo, Odriozola, Llorente, possibly Theo)
- Bale
- Isco and Asensio
- possibly the emergence of Vinicius

Given the results of the above they then will then enter the market as to what we need vs what might be available. Meanwhile they have already sown the seeds for several options for next season.
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Post by Robespierre on Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:41 pm

@vanDEEZ wrote:Understanding a language (written and verbal) is typically a lot easier than speaking it yourself. I can understand Spanish very well, but speaking I’m quite slow. Besides that point, language on the pitch is pretty easy/universal. I grew up playing with Spanish speaking players, though I wasn’t in a Spanish speaking country. Mostly all I needed was “cambio,” “toca,” and “rapido.”


It depends on languages imo. For example it's easier to speak than understanding verbally English language for me. English ppl usually eat letters (inside a sentence).. in addition to pronunciations... while for example in Italian you must say every letter and I suppose same for Spanish. And it is clear advantage
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Post by RealGunner on Sun Jul 22, 2018 5:02 pm

test
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Post by Thimmy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 5:08 pm

icles

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Post by Doc on Sun Jul 22, 2018 5:45 pm

So I thought everyone was writing in Italics in a sarcastic way, didn't realise that is the default setting now. Neat. Unique, stop harassing posters buddy, we are at peace here. Kinda.

Didn't Jose also have a very substantial contract? Firing him so early would have had the club pay a pretty big compensation package I reckon. Also, we do not have a history of transitional periods, we really do not but the club cannot continue doing that same foolishness and expect things to be different. If the club is showing legit progress under Lopetegui and still happen to be trophy-less, I don't think he should be fired. Especially if the club doesn't provide him with a proper God damn CF.

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Post by sportsczy on Sun Jul 22, 2018 6:23 pm

I agree Doc. I'm just saying that there's no history of us allowing for transitional period for a manager. So expecting it to happen is really a big gamble because... well it's never happened really.

Not sure any manager can run Madrid with the hope that he will get a free year in terms of results. That's just not the smart way to go.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Sun Jul 22, 2018 6:40 pm

BOOOM FIXED

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Post by halamadrid2 on Sun Jul 22, 2018 6:45 pm

I have to say Vinicius seems very motivated and level headed from his interviews. Says he wants to be a scoring winger (nice). Says he likes to run at players, dribbling and creating chances. For an 18 year old he seems very mature. Hope Marcelo helps him out, he'll need all the help he can get when the Spanish press start their speculation games midway through the season when he comes on instead of Asensio
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Post by The Madrid One on Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:16 pm

From the few moments i have seen of Vinicius he looks like the Benzema/Firmino type of player that can link up and play wide but maybe not be the greatest goal scoring threat, we'll see how he develops, i dont like the over promoting/marketing we have done with some of our recent youngsters.

Also, i have noticed sports be a bit pessimistic with the new manager after Zidane left and how Lopetegui will be a puppet following orders and easily be sacked if things go eerie, skewed exaggerations imo. The point is for the manager to work well with Perez and Sanchez to organize things and to do the best we can with what we have, and then based on the context of everything we will see what happens.

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Post by futbol_bill on Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:22 pm

Sports biased. Que va!!!!
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Post by titosantill on Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:02 pm

the transitional period was last season. its the way madrid is, no excuses. barcelona have fired coaches too, and we hardly hear about transition period.
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Post by titosantill on Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:04 pm

and trust me lope knows there are no such things as transition periods at madrid, he knows and understands that pressure
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Post by vanDEEZ on Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:22 pm

Transitional periods don't come from hiring/firing managers, it usually comes from players moving on. When Barca lost Xavi, and as Iniesta got older, they have certainly had to transition to a more direct style.

For us it will be similar to when Barca lost Pep/Xavi/Iniesta. Our manager left, Ronaldo left, our cornerstone players are getting old (Modric, Ramos, Marcelo, Benzema (lol), Bale) there is no way around it. It will be a transitional period whether we like it or not. It is impossible to replace like for like- particularly with Ronaldo.
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