So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by terrance511 on Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:22 pm

even new poster see through harmonica

think of all that time spent on propaganda

how sad

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by GRude on Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:24 pm

Neither Messi or Ronaldo proved themselves at the WC, both frauds. /thread
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Wed Jul 04, 2018 1:31 pm

@GRude wrote:Neither Messi or Ronaldo proved themselves at the WC, both frauds. /thread
Messi won WC14 Golden Ball as the best player, with one of the best performances in World Cup, ever. Fakenaldo is a fraud, everybody agrees with that.

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by farfan on Wed Jul 04, 2018 1:37 pm

I'd expect a guy who has proven himself in the world cup to have more KO stage goals than Marouane Fellaini. hmm
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Wed Jul 04, 2018 1:46 pm

You can expect anything you like, sheeps wont never accept logic or anything that opposes their trivial decisions and feels, even if it's well argued. They will try to find individual things to counter logic, like ko-goals, which just shows how deluded they are, because football is so much more that ko-goal statistics.

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Thimmy on Wed Jul 04, 2018 1:58 pm

@Harmonica wrote:You can expect anything you like, sheeps wont never accept logic or anything that opposes their trivial decisions and feels, even if it's well argued. They will try to find individual things to counter logic, like ko-goals, which just shows how deluded they are, because football is so much more that ko-goal statistics.


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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by farfan on Wed Jul 04, 2018 4:41 pm

@Harmonica wrote:You can expect anything you like, sheeps wont never accept logic or anything that opposes their trivial decisions and feels, even if it's well argued. They will try to find individual things to counter logic, like ko-goals, which just shows how deluded they are, because football is so much more that ko-goal statistics.


Yep, dribbling stats are more important than the decisive goals that send national teams to the next round, of which Messi scored ZERO in 4 world cups. hmm
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Tomwin Lannister on Wed Jul 04, 2018 4:45 pm

At this point, why does he even get a reaction off of GL?

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Wed Jul 04, 2018 5:16 pm

@farfan wrote:
@Harmonica wrote:You can expect anything you like, sheeps wont never accept logic or anything that opposes their trivial decisions and feels, even if it's well argued. They will try to find individual things to counter logic, like ko-goals, which just shows how deluded they are, because football is so much more that ko-goal statistics.
Yep, dribbling stats are more important than the decisive goals that send national teams to the next round, of which Messi scored ZERO in 4 world cups. hmm
Dribble can be more important, if it creates the goal that send you to next round, just like a pass leading to the goal, if it's harder to accomplish individually. Which actions is more important, dribbling from half way beating couple players and laying a tap-in? Dribbling, or scoring?

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by BarcaLearning on Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:04 pm

I just wanna say the fact that ppl expect so much from Messi at the NT compared with Ronaldo already shows just how much higher ppl rate Messi. If ppl actually really rate Ronaldo as much as Messi they would expect more or less the same thing, but they dont.
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Thimmy on Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:09 pm

@Tomwin Lannister wrote:At this point, why does he even get a reaction off of GL?


Because his nonsensical, hypocritical, shenanigans never ceases to astound people? hmm
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Thimmy on Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:11 pm

@BarcaLearning wrote:I just wanna say the fact that ppl expect so much from Messi at the NT compared with Ronaldo already shows just how much higher ppl rate Messi. If ppl actually really rate Ronaldo as much as Messi they would expect more or less the same thing, but they dont.


What exactly do they expect from Messi, that they don't expect from Ronaldo? I've expected more from Argentina than I've expected from Portugal, but it has more to do with the respective squads than it has to do with Messi or C.Ronaldo.
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:15 pm

@BarcaLearning wrote:I just wanna say the fact that ppl expect so much from Messi at the NT compared with Ronaldo already shows just how much higher ppl rate Messi. If ppl actually really rate Ronaldo as much as Messi they would expect more or less the same thing, but they dont.
That's true in a sense, that media can formulate headlines based on scoring, and sell them to sheeps with great confidence. Fakenaldo is nowadays a poacher, and media still greates the image that he's one of the best players around.

When G.Müller was a poacher won World Cup and CL being the top scorer he was Ballon d'Or #7. That's the first question I would like a media representative to explain. Laughing

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by BarcaLearning on Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:23 pm

@Thimmy wrote:
@BarcaLearning wrote:I just wanna say the fact that ppl expect so much from Messi at the NT compared with Ronaldo already shows just how much higher ppl rate Messi. If ppl actually really rate Ronaldo as much as Messi they would expect more or less the same thing, but they dont.


What exactly do they expect from Messi, that they don't expect from Ronaldo? I've expected more from Argentina than I've expected from Portugal, but it has more to do with the respective squads than it has to do with Messi or C.Ronaldo.

I seriously doubt that, honestly, ppl expect Argentina to win the WC basically because of Messi, much much more than the squad. The squad is crap and imbalanced apart from the few stars, thats it. U never hear ppl talk about Ronaldo being the greatest ever if he leads Portugal to the WC, never.
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by The Demon of Carthage on Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:35 pm

@BarcaLearning wrote:
@Thimmy wrote:
@BarcaLearning wrote:I just wanna say the fact that ppl expect so much from Messi at the NT compared with Ronaldo already shows just how much higher ppl rate Messi. If ppl actually really rate Ronaldo as much as Messi they would expect more or less the same thing, but they dont.


What exactly do they expect from Messi, that they don't expect from Ronaldo? I've expected more from Argentina than I've expected from Portugal, but it has more to do with the respective squads than it has to do with Messi or C.Ronaldo.

I seriously doubt that, honestly, ppl expect Argentina to win the WC basically because of Messi, much much more than the squad. The squad is crap and imbalanced apart from the few stars, thats it. U never hear ppl talk about Ronaldo being the greatest ever if he leads Portugal to the WC, never.

He certainly woulb be a very strong contender for it.

You're telling me 5 CLs, 6 league titles, 1 euro, 5 BdOs, a WC and a gazillion other collective and individual trophies aren't enough to be a strong candidate for the best ever? Come on now.

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Perucho21 on Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:37 pm

Everyone knows his golden ball win at 2014 was the biggest joke

No KO round goals

What was memorable of him during 2014? A last minute goal against Iran?

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by farfan on Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:42 pm

@Perucho21 wrote:Everyone knows his golden ball win at 2014 was the biggest joke

No KO round goals

What was memorable of him during 2014? A last minute goal against Iran?


Both awards were a joke.

Pogba best young player? he was benched by SISSOKO at some point in the tournament. Laughing
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by breva on Thu Jul 05, 2018 4:04 am

Neither Messi or Ronaldo are a Pele or Maradona. That's a fact.
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Thu Jul 05, 2018 8:57 am

@Harmonica wrote:
@farfan wrote:
@Harmonica wrote:You can expect anything you like, sheeps wont never accept logic or anything that opposes their trivial decisions and feels, even if it's well argued. They will try to find individual things to counter logic, like ko-goals, which just shows how deluded they are, because football is so much more that ko-goal statistics.
Yep, dribbling stats are more important than the decisive goals that send national teams to the next round, of which Messi scored ZERO in 4 world cups. hmm
Dribble can be more important, if it creates the goal that send you to next round, just like a pass leading to the goal, if it's harder to accomplish individually. Which actions is more important, dribbling from half way beating couple players and laying a tap-in? Dribbling, or scoring?
Can you answer the question farfan?

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Thu Jul 05, 2018 9:00 am

@Perucho21 wrote:Everyone knows his golden ball win at 2014 was the biggest joke


That's the sheep mantra yes, they keep repeating that their ears closed. Here's few page argument consisting all relative actions:

http://www.goallegacy.net/t36526p75-most-controversial-world-cup-golden-ball-s-since-1966?highlight=golden

World Cup performance index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team. Color highlighted as golden, silver, bronze ball, or not in Top 3.

1.
Maradona 86
Messi 14

3.
Kempes 78
4.
Jairzinho 70

5.
Robben 14
Cruyff 74
7.
Forlan 10
8.
Romario 94
9.
Eusebio 66
Pele 70
Rossi 82

12.
G.Müller 70
Schillaci 90
Suker 98
15.
Ronaldo 02
Charlton 66
17.
Ronaldo 98
18.
Zidane 06

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by farfan on Thu Jul 05, 2018 10:29 am

@Harmonica wrote:
@Harmonica wrote:
@farfan wrote:
Yep, dribbling stats are more important than the decisive goals that send national teams to the next round, of which Messi scored ZERO in 4 world cups. hmm
Dribble can be more important, if it creates the goal that send you to next round, just like a pass leading to the goal, if it's harder to accomplish individually. Which actions is more important, dribbling from half way beating couple players and laying a tap-in? Dribbling, or scoring?
Can you answer the question farfan?


Well yeah, they can be more important if we're talking about vertical dribbling compared to simple tap-ins. But to figure that out we'll have to go through all the dribble stats with a fine tooth comb and unpack the details of each play. In the absence of context, goals will always be more valuable. hmm   Sneijder's goals in 2010 > Messi's dribbles in 2014.

Stats tell us that Hazard, the master of the sideways dribble and the expert in victimizing wingers in his own half is the best dribbler in Europe. hmm so excuse us if we don't take the implications of dribbling stats seriously.
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Thu Jul 05, 2018 11:15 am

@farfan wrote:
@Harmonica wrote:
@Harmonica wrote:
Dribble can be more important, if it creates the goal that send you to next round, just like a pass leading to the goal, if it's harder to accomplish individually. Which actions is more important, dribbling from half way beating couple players and laying a tap-in? Dribbling, or scoring?
Can you answer the question farfan?
Well yeah, they can be more important if we're talking about vertical dribbling compared to simple tap-ins. But to figure that out we'll have to go through all the dribble stats with a fine tooth comb and unpack the details of each play. In the absence of context, goals will always be more valuable. hmm   Sneijder's goals in 2010 > Messi's dribbles in 2014.

Stats tell us that Hazard, the master of the sideways dribble and the expert in victimizing wingers in his own half is the best dribbler in Europe. hmm so excuse us if we don't take the implications of dribbling stats seriously.
And that's exactly what I did in the thread, compared all positive actions of the players, and related that to team dynamics and oppositions. And it's not surprise when you actually compare the whole quality, rather something like ko-goals, Messi's performance in WC14 is one of the best in World Cup history. And Robben's is pretty much an exact equal of Cruyff WC74, which is pretty much ignored in the media, and thus ignored by sheeps. Because Fakenaldo, because money...


Robben 14 is a great performance, it's almost identical performance of Cruyff 74, 3 goals from the same number of great chance's, the same number of dribbles, the same importance, Robben created slightly more great chance's (less OPTA chances) but defended less, round by round Robben has slight edge, but he did play 3rd compared to the final.

This gives additional perspective why Messi 14 performance was so good, he scored more from less chance's, dribbled more, defended more, was more important and was better in the h2h game. Robben created few great chance's more (less OPTA chances), but his games were more open, and round by round Messi was relatively better in 5 rounds. Robben played relatively only better in the final round, but it was more open game with less in stake.

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by BarcaLearning on Thu Jul 05, 2018 4:44 pm

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:
@BarcaLearning wrote:
@Thimmy wrote:


What exactly do they expect from Messi, that they don't expect from Ronaldo? I've expected more from Argentina than I've expected from Portugal, but it has more to do with the respective squads than it has to do with Messi or C.Ronaldo.

I seriously doubt that, honestly, ppl expect Argentina to win the WC basically because of Messi, much much more than the squad. The squad is crap and imbalanced apart from the few stars, thats it. U never hear ppl talk about Ronaldo being the greatest ever if he leads Portugal to the WC, never.

He certainly woulb be a very strong contender for it.

You're telling me 5 CLs, 6 league titles, 1 euro, 5 BdOs, a WC and a gazillion other collective and individual trophies aren't enough to be a strong candidate for the best ever? Come on now.

I do rate Ronaldo, always have, just saying Messi is always better is all im saying. I have said before I think CR7 overall, especially in terms of his success, trophies, effectiveness, longevity, etc., is better than R9, Zidane, etc., I have no way to know since I didnt watch football when Maradona/Pele was playing, but apart from that CR7 is the second best ever perhaps (pls dont overract ppl). If Messi dont exist, he definitely would be the guy in this era. This makes it even more strange that ppl dont talk about CR7 much at all about if he can lead Portugal to a WC, reason I think being that most ppl knows Ronaldo isnt good enough to do that, espeically when compared with Messi, who at least got them to the final.
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Thimmy on Thu Jul 05, 2018 5:22 pm

I don't care much for the Messi vs C. Ronaldo arguments, in regard to who is better. I think it's well established that Messi has more overall talent, and then it's arguable whether or not C. Ronaldo uses his talent more effectively, in terms of being more decisive when it matters. At the end of the day, they have fundamentally different playing styles, different ways of approaching the game, and different qualities.

That aside, I still think it's very obvious that Argentina have a superior team to Portugal, based on individual talent. However, Portugal looks like a far more cohesive unit, and have probably been the most solid and consistent counter-attacking team in this tournament. I think their bottleneck is CR. From what I can tell, Portugal have found and identity for themselves, they have a game plan. Argentina don't. Portugal is clearly built around Cristiano, yet it's been evident for both club and country that he no longer has the stamina to perform at the required level every week. Sure, he ran his ass off against Spain, but it left him huffing and puffing on the ground, as soon as the match was finished. The team simply isn't good enough to provide enough scoring opportunities for him, and he seldom creates them for himself these days.

Although past his best, Messi is still capable of creating goalscoring chances for himself, prime Messi was the best I've ever witnessed in that respect. He's a brilliant playmaker who can set up others. However, every time he intends to go for goal, you can smell him from a mile away. He no longer possesses the exceptional ability to get away with reliably cruising past multiple defenders and go straight for goal, even when they know what he's about to do. Neither Messi, nor C. Ron seem to be quite at the level required to "carry their teams", at this point in their careers. Initially, I had higher expectations towards Messi's Argentina, purely based on the fact that they had much greater, overall talent than Portugal had. Obviously, we've all seen how little that talent matters when the individuals play without confidence in themselves, nor their coach or their team mates.
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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by Harmonica on Thu Jul 05, 2018 5:35 pm

Portugal has Euro winning team, that won it with Fakenaldo playing like shit, and even won France without him. There's no excuses, Fakenaldo is a World Cup flop, Euro flop, never proved himself in either, which makes him a national team flop too.

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Re: So Fakenaldo never proved himself in the World Cup

Post by juvealbanian on Thu Jul 05, 2018 5:46 pm

@Harmonica wrote:Portugal has Euro winning team, that won it with Fakenaldo playing like shit, and even won France without him. There's no excuses, Fakenaldo is a World Cup flop, Euro flop, never proved himself in either, which makes him a national team flop too.

At least this guy won Euro Cup and still outperformed Messi this WC with Messi having a better team at his back.
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