UCL QF 18/19 | Ajax Vs Juventus

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Post by Doc on Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:56 pm

@Robespierre wrote:Frankly I believe every true football fan dreams to see Ajax winning UEFA Champions League this year

Forza football

Once it ain't Barca or Jjuve, I'll be fine with whomever. Would take a year of Pool winning the CL at this point.

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Post by Warrior on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:18 pm

Why you hate Juve doc ? Genuine question


Btw i did not see the match because of job did we do well despite the result ? @rincon @S
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Post by Arquitescu on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:20 pm

Just about what I expected in this match. One would be naive to think Max once again would be anything but reactionary in the first leg as he usually seems to be despite the blazing performance in the 2nd leg in Torino v Atletico.

Might have been with a lot of faith lost in the backline as a result of Chiellini being out and adding in a mentally weak Rugani to pair with a volatile Bonucci.

Midfield was as predicted as for all of Bentancur's 'dynamism' he fails to offer really anything tangible as for what he does offer, Pjanic already covers in his multi-tasking role though Matuidi's endless runs and workmanship was welcome.

In the front line it was obvious Manduzkic was used in his usual tactical role but offers so little in attack now and has been anonymous for countless games for Juventus in CL so far and I would not be surprised if he has not scored.

Bernadeschi and Cristiano had a good game but Juventus' tentative approach had them frustrated given they are two performers who play far better with the ball constantly at their feet rather than waiting for counter-attack opportunities. Whilst Fede did perform with the ball with countless dribbles past Tagliafico his final ball was lacking and rather contemplative with the ball in the final third.

Ajax was as expected with their fearless, domineering approach though deceptively dominated and did not produce much in the final third given Juventus were rather comfortable in their defensive line versus them, only Cancelo (who provided a marvellous cross for Cristiano's goal) single-handedly cost Juventus their impressive defensive performance by getting roasted by Neres.

There on then Juventus for the few opportunities they had could have gotten either way but a near flawless performance from Ajax with ten Hag's plan clearly executed well in keeping a reactionary Juventus in the backfoot.

Allegri seems to prefer going all out in the 2nd leg compared to his attacking plans in 1st legs with Milan yet not surprised that has changed from the haunting Barcelona comeback in Nou Camp vs Milan.

Regardless of Cheillini returning, Tagliafico out and a impressive home record we saw Ajax far better in Madrid then they were in Amsterdam which tells us this is not a team to be daunted by away stadiums where their counter-attacking plan seems to be more effective against home teams trying to dominate at home.

That being said Juventus were not given a clear penalty in the 2nd half on that pull back and it was puzzling to see the referee not even give VAR a chance for that.

Aside from that Douglas was a massive bright spot coming on and destroyed Ajax's left side with countless dribbles past their RB and one fantastic run ended off with a shot glanced off the inside of the right post.

Allegri is in for some nightmare predicaments in the second leg but cannot afford to sit back and Bentancur should not be afforded any more chances.

How would Juventini rate Rugani's performance?

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Post by Firenze on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:20 pm

I'm actually eager to hear some thoughts about this Ajax team myself as I just kept tabs on the stats since I was watching United. But seems like a very good showing from them on top of utterly ruining Madrid. Legit dark horses.
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Post by rincon on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:34 pm

Rugani was the motm for sure. Did everything well, blocks, tackles, aerials, passes and breaking lines. He channeled Chiellini tonight.

What was reactionary about Allegri? he set the most coherent lineup he could with the injuries and form we had. The gameplan wasn't wrong at all, and the subs were on point. We had only 3 CBs and no Chiellini, he couldn't start them all. No Can. Recently injured Khedira... enough said. Only mistake was not playing Spinazzola but I understand how Cancelo is a logical safe choice.

Alex finally played a top match, outstanding. Cancelo on the other hand :facepalm: cost us the match with two mistakes in the same play and time after time got killed and/or gave the ball away. By a long distance our worst performer.

Bernardeschi stood out the first half doing everything right, while he got tired in the second one when Ajax dominated. Pjanic was marked incredibly tightly all game and it worked, he got nullified for the most part. Mandzukic did his role well in the first half but when Ajax went all out in the second the game passed him by and was the right sub.

Douglas Proud coming on after months and playing like it's April 2018. This is exactly the Douglas we need. I almost died when he hit the post at 85'.
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Post by rincon on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:43 pm

@Firenze wrote:I'm actually eager to hear some thoughts about this Ajax team myself as I just kept tabs on the stats since I was watching United. But seems like a very good showing from them on top of utterly ruining Madrid. Legit dark horses.

This Ajax is an excellent team. Props to whoever assembled it, to their coach, and to all their talent.

They play with ridiculous cynicism and know exactly what to do. Ziyech, Neres, Tadic works beautifully. Ziyech in the first half was a monster, then Neres in the second half. De Jong is a stud, as is De Ligt. Barca are in for a hell of player at least just based in this CL.

Schone did a great job in the second half and Van de Beek was on Pjanic often. Both were functional. The weak point of the team was Veltman at right back.
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Post by Hapless_Hans on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:48 pm

From his time at Bayern II, honestly wouldn't have thought ten Hag would go on to be quite such a good coach. Ajax looked like they played some magnificent stuff.

Also, they are good away. In Munich they were far better than when we played them in Amsterdam, and dominated them at will there :coffee: , and they were also great at the Bernabeu.

Hope so so so much they can pull it off.

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Post by rincon on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:09 pm

If the right players are fit and looking good in training I think I'd like a 4-4-2 for the return leg. Minimize the midfield damage we can get by playing it tight and pin their fullbacks back and expose them (at least Tagliafico is out of the return leg).

Something like this

Ronaldo - Mandzukic
Costa - Matuidi/Can - Pjanic - Bernardeschi
Alex Sandro - Chiellini - Bonucci - Spinazzola
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Post by adun101 on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:27 pm

All things considered, we played better than expected. They had the possession (expected) but the scoring chances were about even.

Cancelo giveth, Cancelo taketh away.

Rugani was great, I thought he was supposed to suck because he mentally soft.

I can't wait for Matuidi to be gone. He wins a lot of balls, but he kills just as many of our offensive plays.

Alex Sandro with his best performance in months, but still not great.

The VAR was a moron, that's a clear penalty and a yellow (a second one) for Tagliafico, ffs.


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Post by adun101 on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:31 pm

@Arquitescu wrote:
Midfield was as predicted as for all of Bentancur's 'dynamism' he fails to offer really anything tangible as for what he does offer, Pjanic already covers in his multi-tasking role though Matuidi's endless runs and workmanship was welcome.


Bentancur was the main creator of our goal. I liked him for most of the game. Matuidi is a scrub who hurts our offensive phase.

Rugani was good.
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Post by adun101 on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:38 pm

@rincon wrote:
They play with ridiculous cynicism


Based on this match, they don't at all. They know how to pass the ball around and they put a lot of pressure in the second half, but they created only two chances plus the goal, which was a combination of Cancelo brain fart and great individual play by Neres. Also, the their mids are very good, but they are very naive/careless, they allowed too many counterattacking chances and got shredded at the goal.
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Post by rincon on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:38 pm

Bentancur was surprisingly the best mid. Pjanic was in his own battle and matuidi was hot and cold.
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Post by rincon on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:41 pm

@adun101 wrote:
@rincon wrote:
They play with ridiculous cynicism


Based on this match, they don't at all. They know how to pass the ball around and they put a lot of pressure in the second half, but they created only two chances plus the goal, which was a combination of Cancelo brain fart and great individual play by Neres. Also, the their mids are very good, but they are very naive/careless, they allowed too many counterattacking chances and got shredded at the goal.

Cynicism as in we see 19 year old kids playing this tiki taka vs Bayern, Madrid and Juve with the confidence of a top player and laugh about it every time the play stops. Roulettes, backheels and one touch passes. That ekkelenkamp teenager got pulled from Ajax B to his CL debut tonight. No fear, no overly respectful.
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Post by Doc on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:45 pm

@Warrior wrote:Why you hate Juve doc ? Genuine question

My footballing blood never took them lol. Nothing deep or retarded like racism, just never became a fan. Great side with an equally great manager but never could get behind them with some notable exceptions obviously.

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Post by adun101 on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:54 pm

@rincon wrote:
@adun101 wrote:
@rincon wrote:
They play with ridiculous cynicism


Based on this match, they don't at all. They know how to pass the ball around and they put a lot of pressure in the second half, but they created only two chances plus the goal, which was a combination of Cancelo brain fart and great individual play by Neres. Also, the their mids are very good, but they are very naive/careless, they allowed too many counterattacking chances and got shredded at the goal.

Cynicism as in we see 19 year old kids playing this tiki taka vs Bayern, Madrid and Juve with the confidence of a top player and laugh about it every time the play stops. Roulettes, backheels and one touch passes. That ekkelenkamp teenager got pulled from Ajax B to his CL debut tonight. No fear, no overly respectful.


What you described is more bravado. From what I know, cynicism is what Juve does. Don't care about beautiful play, just do whatever it takes to get the result. Allegri even gets annoyed with the journos when they ask him why he doesn't play more aesthetically.
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Post by Arquitescu on Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:18 am

@rincon wrote:Rugani was the motm for sure. Did everything well, blocks, tackles, aerials, passes and breaking lines. He channeled Chiellini tonight.

What was reactionary about Allegri? he set the most coherent lineup he could with the injuries and form we had. The gameplan wasn't wrong at all, and the subs were on point. We had only 3 CBs and no Chiellini, he couldn't start them all. No Can. Recently injured Khedira... enough said. Only mistake was not playing Spinazzola but I understand how Cancelo is a logical safe choice.

Alex finally played a top match, outstanding. Cancelo on the other hand :facepalm: cost us the match with two mistakes in the same play and time after time got killed and/or gave the ball away. By a long distance our worst performer.

Bernardeschi stood out the first half doing everything right, while he got tired in the second one when Ajax dominated. Pjanic was marked incredibly tightly all game and it worked, he got nullified for the most part. Mandzukic did his role well in the first half but when Ajax went all out in the second the game passed him by and was the right sub.

Douglas Proud coming on after months and playing like it's April 2018. This is exactly the Douglas we need. I almost died when he hit the post at 85'.


My comment on Allegri wasn't down to his tactics as with the cards he was given he did a great job especially how it lacked balanced with key players that had him play a perfect match v Atletico, were out tonight.

My problem was with the approach itself. Ajax were brilliant tonight and the match itself was a tactical piece to behold yet Juventus took less risks than they could have given how open Ajax were defensively and invited too much pressure. Given Ajax's occasional spells of dominance I am sure you'll agree. So more a case of a missed opportunity for me and an unnecessary headache for the second leg.

But luckily it is likely a deliberate approach by Max and likely he will try to have a more daring approach to conclude the game early without a tense finish.

Thanks for the assessment on Rugani as I did not watch him too carefully but admittedly that is very surprising to hear and not so much given we all know he has the talent beneath his weak mentality.

Bernadeschi for all he sacrifices in such a system it does tire him out to the point where his attack qualities suffer within the game.

I only take out my point on Bentancur as closer inspection on highlights his performance was more subtle than I saw, and rather solid.

Allegri will have a lot to use from this performance in how to set up the second leg to which we know he can flawlessly, and squad advantages including this time.

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Post by Arquitescu on Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:36 am

Beyond that I cannot state how stupid Juventus will be if they do not replace their old guard with de Ligt. Yes he is not outstanding in any specific area but is the complete package and reminds me of Nesta when he started out in Lazio, if not his overall style.

Given his glowing praise of the club and close study of Bonucci and Cheillini, it would be a foolish waste not to invest all out on the perfect future star to slot into Juve's famous defence.

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Post by alexjanosik on Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:20 am

Completely dominant performance from ajax. Dominated the game from start to finish. Deserved a win. Best team of knockouts so far.

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Post by Myesyats on Thu Apr 11, 2019 9:40 am

Super impressed by Ajax, what a team!

and this promo :bow:


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Post by zigra on Thu Apr 11, 2019 9:50 am

We actually got this Molenation
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Post by rincon on Thu Apr 11, 2019 9:59 am

@alexjanosik wrote:Completely dominant performance from ajax. Dominated the game from start to finish. Deserved a win. Best team of knockouts so far.

It's almost like we didn't get ahead, should have had a penalty, and hit the post, in the away game.
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Post by S on Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:19 pm

Party's over folks

Make no mistake, we are going to absolutely wallop this Ajax side in the return leg. Please stop comparing us to washed up clubs like Real Madrid and Bayern. They were absolutely done for this season.

These Ajax kids are going to be taught a lesson in football. Lightning is not going to strike twice.

There should have been a penalty and sending off which nobody mentions yet I see only the talk of how amazing Ajax were but it's okay, we are going to bury the hype next week.

Meanwhile numpties whose teams have nothing to play for can continue to get over excited. You have a good 6 days until reality is going to hit you in the face.

Not only that, we will also take De Ligt off them in the summer. What a tremendous talent.
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Post by Collblanc on Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:41 pm

@S wrote:Party's over folks

Make no mistake, we are going to absolutely wallop this Ajax side in the return leg. Please stop comparing us to washed up clubs like Real Madrid and Bayern. They were absolutely done for this season.

These Ajax kids are going to be taught a lesson in football. Lightning is not going to strike twice.

There should have been a penalty and sending off which nobody mentions yet I see only the talk of how amazing Ajax were but it's okay, we are going to bury the hype next week.

Meanwhile numpties whose teams have nothing to play for can continue to get over excited. You have a good 6 days until reality is going to hit you in the face.

Not only that, we will also take De Ligt off them in the summer. What a tremendous talent.


rofl that hurts
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Post by iftikhar on Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:01 pm

@Collblanc wrote:
@S wrote:Party's over folks

Make no mistake, we are going to absolutely wallop this Ajax side in the return leg. Please stop comparing us to washed up clubs like Real Madrid and Bayern. They were absolutely done for this season.

These Ajax kids are going to be taught a lesson in football. Lightning is not going to strike twice.

There should have been a penalty and sending off which nobody mentions yet I see only the talk of how amazing Ajax were but it's okay, we are going to bury the hype next week.

Meanwhile numpties whose teams have nothing to play for can continue to get over excited. You have a good 6 days until reality is going to hit you in the face.

Not only that, we will also take De Ligt off them in the summer. What a tremendous talent.


rofl that hurts
He isn't free you know :coffee:
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Post by Sina on Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:59 pm

impressed with Frenkie's defensive work and athleticism
one time he made a bad pass and they looked in trouble he got back in time to make a clean tackle

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Post by Robespierre on Fri Apr 12, 2019 12:21 am

Do you know what's the saddest thing now ?

Ajax are gonna to sell their best players after this year.
That's the problem of the modern football.

If Ajax wait other 3 years, adding 2 -3 players  to this team .. they could win it.

And they 'd deserve it more than Juve , Real , Bayern etc
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