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Next big change in formation?

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Total Votes : 14

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Post by Adit on Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:49 pm

I always thought about it.What will be the next generation formation?

We have witnessed the change of formation from 2 striker system to a 1 striker system over the last 2 decade.

What will be the next change ?

I personally think it is going to be a Striker less formation or a False 9 formation.

Or is it a 3-4-3? or a total football with any one acting as stiker?

Discuss

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Post by Zealous on Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:02 pm

First of all I don't think this poll is detailed enough to really make the options clear.

Having said that I do see something similar to a 3-4-3 becoming popular if a team wants to have an attacking mindset.

But at the end of the day you play the formation that best suits the players you have. Football players have "evolved" over the years so formations evolved with them.

Unless the average player changes formations won't witness any radical change. (Unless a genius coach comes along and changes the game like Herrera or Michels).

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Post by Pedram on Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:27 pm

We need stability. why fix something that isn't broken ?
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Post by Guest on Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:31 pm

It will always depend on players available

But I must admit I loved the 4-3-3 under Schuster....

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Post by Adit on Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:33 pm

Yes im talking about the Normal teams.
over the last 2 decade 4-4-2 changed to more conservative and less direct 4-2-3-1.There is a big possibility the next is a striker less formation,or a total football in which players interchanging CF role consequently.

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Post by S32TABLANCA on Thu Sep 08, 2011 6:51 pm

4-2-3-1 seems to be the modern trend, I like it, its extremely dynamic. But yeah, formations dont matter as much as the players in them. While trends do exist, teams will adjust formations according to their coach and players, not the latest fashion.
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Post by H.A. on Thu Sep 08, 2011 7:47 pm

Well more and more 9's aren't even pure strikers anymore. The newer generation of players now can play in multiple positions to accommodate several formations. We're having more winger type strikers and false 9's now. I don't think we'll see Total Football but something similar to it.


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Post by estrella bernabeu on Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:18 pm

Here is a video of what a training session looks like under Mou orders

http://www.cuatro.com/deportes/futbol/real-madrid/mourinho/Mourinho-tecnico-Real_Madrid-entrenamiento-ordenes_3_1463883631.html

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Post by Babun on Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:01 pm

Having no definiate strikers and 4-2-3-1 are the ways to go Very Happy Of course you couldn't play them without a proper presonnel, that's the fun part Very Happy
I'll explain in the next post Very Happy


Last edited by babun1024 on Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:48 pm; edited 7 times in total

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Post by Jeps33178 on Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:10 pm

only time can tell honestly

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Post by Babun on Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:49 pm

Read that thread I made earlier: http://www.goallegacy.net/t7736-am-schooling-in-different-countries#216481
Very Happy

On youth development level Spain and Germany put their emphasis on versatility. To be successful in the future youth players need a lot of playing time. For this reason, Germany schooled their striker, wingers (left and right) and SS alltogether as 'attackers'. They taught them basics for all 4 positions in hope that they'll get more playing time because of their versatility= success in domestic or foreign league Very Happy
Muller, Ozil, Götze, Schürrle and many others aren't a coincidence, they were taught the tactics in their junior years.
Spain did the same but with midfielders. They wanted more playing time for their young midfielders because naturally Spaniards aren't fast or tall built ,they rely a lot on technic. Basically, winger, AMs and CM basics were taught to any midfielder. CFs are still taught separatly in Spain Very Happy Also, they can't run very fast and aren't super tall so they depend on moving the ball via short passes on the ground a lot to compensate for their weaknesses. They have to move the ball more than they move themselves Very Happy
France and Italy completely ignored that development, expect them to suck for the next 4-5 years Very Happy I don't think that there won't be suitable players from other countries. It's just that they'll produce more of the kind os 'versatile attacker' or 'allround midfielder' than other nations Very Happy

So much about available personnel. They make perfect samples for 4-2-3-1 and no definiate striker version Very Happy

Now, the current development goes into zonal marking and field control via pressing. Teams try to concentrate as many bodies as possible in midfield to take control. For that you can't play 4-4-2 anymore against top teams Very Happy Even the CF has to drop into the midfield while defending or regaining possession Very Happy
Your 4-3-3 is usually 4-5-1 while defending and 4-3-3 in attack. Farca plays even 4-6-0 from time to time Very Happy
The perfect type of players for this kind of system are your versatile Spanish midfielders Very Happy

To counter that sick midfield dominance, you need 4-2-3-1. We play it and are getting better but for now Porto and Dortmund are masters of it. The idea is you have very hard working wingers and CF who press high up front forcing mistakes. This way you annoy defenders in build up and force them to pass via high balls. If they get the ball into midfield as soon as they lose it the two CMs in the middle launch an immediate counter with a pass to the free attacker out of the 4. It sets the whole idea of midfield dominance like 4-3-3 or 4-5-1 on backfoot. Their players would need to run 40m back for defending each time they lose possesson Very Happy

Now, the problems: you need very complete CMs for 4-2-3-1 to function properly, basically two DLPs who both can defend and have insane passing range! The second problem, teams that park the bus or sit very deeply make 4-2-3-1 pretty useless. If you launch a direct pass to an attacker, he can be double teamed easily= lost possession for nothing. The other team could counter safely without much concern. Good example for it is Hoffenheim vs. Dortmund Very Happy Dortmund still can't beat them Very Happy

A possible solution for it would be implementing 4-3-3 on attack when playing such a team Very Happy Like you see, the AM from 4-2-3-1 has to be able to come deep and act as CAM in build up, less direct buildup but very precise Very Happy
If there'll be a team that could work on those weaknesses, with the right players they'd own any existing system Very Happy
For now, 4-3-3 and 4-5-1 are the way to go... Very Happy

Now, if you're smart think what Mou was doing from the start... Very Happy


Last edited by babun1024 on Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:34 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:21 pm

Top post Babun, 433 is the way to go for me as well, as we can shift to a 4231 or even be outrageous and have a 343 went we go all out.

As long as we have a great pressing game, sky is the limit.

But for it to happen, would be nice to see Ozil defending and coming deep a lot more, and be comfortable about playmaking from deep.

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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce on Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:25 pm

18 f*cking smileys in one post :bow:
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Post by Babun on Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:44 pm

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:Top post Babun, 433 is the way to go for me as well, as we can shift to a 4231 or even be outrageous and have a 343 went we go all out.

As long as we have a great pressing game, sky is the limit.

But for it to happen, would be nice to see Ozil defending and coming deep a lot more, and be comfortable about playmaking from deep.
You don't need him to defend more, you need him to pick the ball in midfield and build up the attack with patience, less direct (Brazilian style) Very Happy He'll make others work (his teammates and the opposition) Very Happy Just imagine, when he turns towards oponent's side, they're pretty much screwed, he can avoid challenges, run past them or do other crazy stuff. People back off when he turns around Very Happy
He covers enough ground as it is (10km per game), less sprints and more jogging would solve the problem Very Happy
Immaculate_Mole wrote:18 f*cking smileys in one post :bow:
In a f*cking long post Very Happy

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Post by Adit on Fri Sep 09, 2011 2:48 pm

Great post babun,your tactical payer analysis is just incredible.

As you said,its 4-3-3 and 4-5-1 the most dominant formations now,but i do think in future there will be teams with strikerless/false9/Indefinite striker formations.

Barca already plays a false 9 formation ,i think lot of teams are going to realize the importance of midfield dominance and gonna try a strikerless formation in future.

The advantage of striker less/false 9 formation is that your team will have better possession ,an extra man in midfield,Better defense,not vulnerable to counters(one of the prime reason why this barca does not concede on counters now) and your opponents cant utilize the space on midfield.

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Post by guest7 on Fri Sep 09, 2011 3:33 pm

Babun is Mou in disguise Next Level Football Icon_ninja8
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Post by SuperMAG on Fri Sep 09, 2011 3:48 pm

Actually my current favourite is to have players with no defensive expolits in defence and a good attack.

My main formation would be 4-2-3-1. With no difinite strikers + False 9.

The No striekrs will be all 4 attacking players while false 9 would be both ozil and benzema.

I think mou is already playing like this more or less. with option to change formation to 4-5-1 when need to preserve a lead like against barca.

------------------------X Fantasy begains here X-------------------

I am currently playing this on fifa.

_______________Casillas
Abate____Kompany____Boateng____Cissokho
__________Ramos____Bastian
Robben___________Ozil___________Ronaldo
______________Benzema

GK: Casillas - Adan - Jesus

RB: Abate - Arbeloa - Cajaval
CB: Kompany - Smalling
CB: Boateng - Varane
LB: Cissokho - Nacho

DM: Ramos - M,Villa - Granero
CM: Schwienstiger - Antilop - Alex

WG-R: Robben - Johnson - Sarbia
WG-L: Ronaldo - Callejon - Jessi

AMC/SS: Ozil - Canales - Sarbia

ST: Higuain - Benzema - Morata

The thing about that lineup is that it has all the players that you need.

Starting with CB's, the CB's have no weakness with kompany, boating, smalling, varane, you can make many rotations, they are all fast, tall and strong, they are all confidident players and are young with great future.

The full backs are also the same, i already said that players with no major weaknesses is the key in defensive area's. That includes the backline+midfeild. Having players like cissokho/abate are too fast to be beaten by pace, smart and tall enough to stop wingers/headers and overlaps behind defence.

Same with CM's, they are fast, technical, and have all the attributes, i know most of you guys dont think ramos is a CM meterial, but i think he can be a PERFECT CM, so we will agree to disagree here and i wont explain more. The combinattions is perfect, bastian controls the midfeild and other is box to box and a distroyer with good technical skills and shooting/heading abitly which will make him score more goals.

The attackers are called attackers in my formation, they all get into the box and the sides in a very fluid way like it is done now in our games, Robben afcource is a major upgrade over dimaria.

One of the most important aspect is the versitality of players in the squad like currently mou was looking, versitalty will increase squad dept thus it extremely important in laliga and CL, because of injuries/bans, you will have to players to back other players.

The defence backups are very versitile with smalling/boateng rotating with each other for CB area and varane as kompany backup and for the future. Smalling can also play RB perfectly and Boateng the same as LB. We also have Arbeloa, Antilop to backup wings. I didnt want any weak links in defence, even in backups, there is no way i would keep albiol even as a 5th backup.

The midfeild area, we have a rising Mvila which would be major rotating player with both midfeilders and Antilop, with 4th backup, also the Cb's can play as 3rd CB Dm.

The attack area's backup is a bit weak, which is something i can live with, it has johnson (City player) as Robben backup, mainly his style is as same as him. And canales/sarbia as ozil backup and Callejon/Jessi as another attackers. Also higuain/benzema can be played in sides. so many options there too.

The strikers Benzema (false 9) mainly used against parked bus teams, Higuain against pure counter attacking like against barca. but both will be rotating equaly. And morata as 3rd rising backup.

This is just a fantasy thing of mine so do not take it superserious.

------------------------X Fantasy begains here X-------------------

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