The Title Decider I - Manchester United Vs Liverpool

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Post by Lucifer on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:09 pm

@RealGunner wrote:16c over here. Unheard of in Feb.


Man no wonder you all guys look like freaking movie stars with that goat cool weather. Winters >>>>>

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Post by Arquitescu on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:13 pm

Without a doubt one of our worst if not the worst performance of the season.

Whilst its not under Klopp's direct control his love for terrifically average players is wearing our chances for the title down each week.

Henderson who's game is now based on not exposing his own limits in a system beyond his depth.

Milner for all I love him and his versatility is being deployed in set pieces, positions of the pitch and key areas of the game where he has none idea to do so.

Matip despite McAgger hyping him as usual (surprise) always looks unsure and takes away the balance from the backline.

Salah for all his goals is usually phased out in big games when he cannot use his pace as it never made sense to me how so many things go through a player with a relatively limited scope of the game to use his assets.

Throughout the game not one final pass was made through, not a single clear cut chance, no communication bar with the fullbacks only bringing up the ball higher to the pitch and up all against a completely ravaged Man United severely disproportionate by their various changes in the first half alone.

We have a stunningly average midfield and a front line that has been so to say, figured out and no matter how many forwards we threw in (the finished Sturridge and laughable Origi) it never made a difference for once again there was no balance it was a rather FIFA move to expect more forwards thrown in to provide more chances despite the midfield completely stifled.

Huge missed chance.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:15 pm

@Arquitescu wrote:
Salah for all his goals is usually phased out in big games when he cannot use his pace as it never made sense to me how so many things go through a player with a relatively limited scope of the game to use his assets.


Ouch. stay safe Arq, when pool fans come for you

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Post by Arquitescu on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:19 pm

I like Salah but before Liverpool he was a terrifyingly frustrating player and although he has evolved his once brain-dead footballing awareness into an acute sense of what is happening within the box, his game is built around his pace to which is slowly being cut wider and wider as fullbacks know how to exploit his relative one footedness. I do not see how he can evolve for us.

Clutch as he has been for us at times against better defenders and tactics so far he has been underwhelming though nowhere near one of our problems and should not be faulted for today.

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Post by RealGunner on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:21 pm

Right.

This clearly wasn't a title decider.

On to the next one in few weeks.
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Post by Jay29 on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:25 pm

@Arquitescu wrote:I like Salah but before Liverpool he was a terrifyingly frustrating player and although he has evolved his once brain-dead footballing awareness into an acute sense of what is happening within the box, his game is built around his pace to which is slowly being cut wider and wider as fullbacks know how to exploit his relative one footedness. I do not see how he can evolve for us.

Clutch as he has been for us at times against better defenders and tactics so far he has been underwhelming though nowhere near one of our problems and should not be faulted for today.

I remember earlier in the season Klopp playing Salah as an outright 9 to circumvent this issue, but I don't recall him doing that much recently. He seemed unhappy with what Salah was offering today, in any case.

I just wonder if Liverpool would be better off playing a front two of Firmino and Salah. At the moment the front three isn't performing to a high enough standard that you can justify a three-man midfield, where the "third" man is the Jordan Henderson.
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Post by Vlad the Impaler on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:26 pm

Liverpool should’ve done better today. We were very vulnerable because of the injuries. Also, we could’ve done better, even though we had many average players on the pitch.

I was surprised to see that our fullbacks were running more and faster than Liverpool’s players in the 2nd half. Determination saved us.

Fabinho and Wijnaldum were quite good though, but they can’t win a game just by themselves. Mane lost too many balls. Poor game from both sides, but I can understand why United couldn’t do more while Liverpool doesn’t really have any excuses in the position of a title challenger.


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Post by alexjanosik on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:27 pm

Very poor game of football. Dont think I saw 5 passes strung together. United were the better side though that's not saying much. Liverpool desperately need a creative midfielder in there.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:31 pm

@Jay29 wrote:
@Arquitescu wrote:I like Salah but before Liverpool he was a terrifyingly frustrating player and although he has evolved his once brain-dead footballing awareness into an acute sense of what is happening within the box, his game is built around his pace to which is slowly being cut wider and wider as fullbacks know how to exploit his relative one footedness. I do not see how he can evolve for us.

Clutch as he has been for us at times against better defenders and tactics so far he has been underwhelming though nowhere near one of our problems and should not be faulted for today.

I remember earlier in the season Klopp playing Salah as an outright 9 to circumvent this issue, but I don't recall him doing that much recently. He seemed unhappy with what Salah was offering today, in any case.

I just wonder if Liverpool would be better off playing a front two of Firmino and Salah. At the moment the front three isn't performing to a high enough standard that you can justify a three-man midfield, where the "third" man is the Jordan Henderson.
THis is most likely what Klopp was anticipating trying to sign Fekir. He wanted a n10 to make sure his attack does not become stale. Shaqiri is not as good as Fekir though,

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:31 pm

@RealGunner wrote:Is 0-0 a good result for Liverpool?

Will still be a point ahead of City so maybe.
Getting a point at Old Trafford is a good result for Liverpool, especially under the way that United have been playing recently.

Getting a point at Old Trafford when United had multiple opportunities to finish them off should feel like a win.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:33 pm

@Mr Nick09 wrote:Salah is looking like a one season wonder, he needs to step up. Worse first touch than Lloris
This was very frustrating to watch. Salah lost so many opportunities to his first touch.

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Post by Glory on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:35 pm

Lpool registered one shot on target today. ONE. That when playing against a midfield that had 2 scrub academy products of ours. No excuse whatsoever for Klopp who intentionally fked domestic cup competitions like they are nothing to solely finish on PL (and ofc CL).
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Post by Arquitescu on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:37 pm

@Jay29 wrote:
@Arquitescu wrote:I like Salah but before Liverpool he was a terrifyingly frustrating player and although he has evolved his once brain-dead footballing awareness into an acute sense of what is happening within the box, his game is built around his pace to which is slowly being cut wider and wider as fullbacks know how to exploit his relative one footedness. I do not see how he can evolve for us.

Clutch as he has been for us at times against better defenders and tactics so far he has been underwhelming though nowhere near one of our problems and should not be faulted for today.

I remember earlier in the season Klopp playing Salah as an outright 9 to circumvent this issue, but I don't recall him doing that much recently. He seemed unhappy with what Salah was offering today, in any case.

I just wonder if Liverpool would be better off playing a front two of Firmino and Salah. At the moment the front three isn't performing to a high enough standard that you can justify a three-man midfield, where the "third" man is the Jordan Henderson.


Problem is there just isn't any reference point in the box.

Our front three whilst they combine well, cannot produce much if they do not given they do not lead the line well at all and when separated as they were today, expecting individual pieces of brilliance from three men who are not natural goalscorers then what you have left is the midfield creating chances yet as I am sure you would not, we have the creative presence of a doorknob within the engine room.

Such combinations work when we have ample possession of the ball to which today and most teams we do not given no one is there to dictate the tempo or bypass simple lines through the middle of the pitch.

Hence why being cynical on the title run is not just through the No PL in the PL era but the glaring faults that have been overlooked as a result of a lot of lucky wins from terrible performances.

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Post by RealGunner on Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:59 pm


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Post by Firenze on Sun Feb 24, 2019 5:07 pm

lmaooo

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Sun Feb 24, 2019 5:09 pm

With regards to the title race:
Watching City, which I avoid to do usually, I'm reminded how ridiculously stacked Pep's City is.
It's ridiculous how much money they spent, it's ridiculous how deep their squad is.

The City team is as stacked with top players as the next 4 teams in the league put together.
3 elite AMs in De Bruyne, Silva, B.Silva, a Sancho-level talent in Foden on the bench,  2 top wingers in Sane and Sterling with Mahrez on the bench, 2 elite CMs in Fernandinho and Gündogan, hundreds of millions of £££ spent on defenders, Laporte, Kompany, Stones and Otamendi, Mendy and Walker as fullbacks.
One elite striker in Aguero and another top striker talent in Jesus as backup who never even gets to start these days.

It's fucking ridiculous and if Pep fails to win the PL and/or the CL this season, with every single other European top team having a worse squad at the moment, some like us or Juve even significantly worse, this would be one of the biggest failures I've witnessed.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sun Feb 24, 2019 5:13 pm

Mourinho was right all along

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Sun Feb 24, 2019 5:14 pm

@Hapless_Hans wrote:With regards to the title race:
Watching City, which I avoid to do usually, I'm reminded how ridiculously stacked Pep's City is.
It's ridiculous how much money they spent, it's ridiculous how deep their squad is.

The City team is as stacked with top players as the next 4 teams in the league put together.
3 elite AMs in De Bruyne, Silva, B.Silva, a Sancho-level talent in Foden on the bench,  2 top wingers in Sane and Sterling with Mahrez on the bench, 2 elite CMs in Fernandinho and Gündogan, hundreds of millions of £££ spent on defenders, Laporte, Kompany, Stones and Otamendi, Mendy and Walker as fullbacks.
One elite striker in Aguero and another top striker talent in Jesus as backup who never even gets to start these days.

It's fucking ridiculous and if Pep fails to win the PL and/or the CL this season, with every single other European top team having a worse squad at the moment, some like us or Juve even significantly worse, this would be one of the biggest failures I've witnessed.


And yet when they had a few key injuries recently they lost a lot of points. For all their depth it doesn't seem to have done them much good.


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Post by RealGunner on Sun Feb 24, 2019 5:51 pm


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Post by Hapless_Hans on Sun Feb 24, 2019 6:05 pm

@RealGunner wrote:


Footage of the same situation from the vantage point of the moderator


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Post by iftikhar on Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:26 pm

I think in isolation this game isn't the debacle or the one Klopp to be blamed for. However, it's the culmination tactical and strategic lapses made over the season.

The lack of rotation hasn't only left the regular players jaded it has also left whatever depth we have failing to get into the groove. Then there's the question of squad strengthening if you are serious about winning the league. Klopp clearly don't think much of Clyne, Moreno, Lallana, Sturridge and Origi. That leaves just Lovren (injured), Matip (always getting injured), Milner, Henderson and Shaqiri as viable backups.
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Post by Unique on Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:26 pm

the simple fact is the liverpool players have folded under the pressure. the liverpool attack has shown over the past 3 years that they are as good as any front 3 in the world so talent is not the problem. its clear to see the confidence has gone not sure why players like drinkwater and vardy held the nerve and our players cant but after the loss to city the liverpool players lost all belief.

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Post by iftikhar on Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:35 am

@Unique wrote:the simple fact is the liverpool players have folded under the pressure. the liverpool attack has shown over the past 3 years that they are as good as any front 3 in the world so talent is not the problem. its clear to see the confidence has gone not sure why players like drinkwater and vardy held the nerve and our players cant but after the loss to city the liverpool players lost all belief.
NO, they didn't. It's fatigue, NOT pressure. You only need to review the earlier part of the season to see that.
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Post by Unique on Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:43 pm

@iftikhar wrote:
@Unique wrote:the simple fact is the liverpool players have folded under the pressure. the liverpool attack has shown over the past 3 years that they are as good as any front 3 in the world so talent is not the problem. its clear to see the confidence has gone not sure why players like drinkwater and vardy held the nerve and our players cant but after the loss to city the liverpool players lost all belief.
NO, they didn't. It's fatigue, NOT pressure. You only need to review the earlier part of the season to see that.
this time last year they were flying and showing no sign of fatigue and I thought pissing the cups away was supposed to help out with tired legs. If one of them were not on form you could say he’s tired but the complete attack are poor and have been since the city loss. Trust me the pressure got to them that’s why passes are being over hit. They are snatching at shots and in some cases are hiding on the pitch hoping someone else can pull something out the bag.

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Post by CBarca on Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:42 pm

I mean, the fact of the matter is that we can't tell if it's fatigue or folding under the pressure

Probably a little bit of both

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Post by iftikhar on Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:59 am

@CBarca wrote:I mean, the fact of the matter is that we can't tell if it's fatigue or folding under the pressure

Probably a little bit of both
Come on mate. You have seen/heard/read that 11 players played without break unless they were sick/injured. If they were ever substituted, that would have been after 85th min.
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