Ozil vs Rooney

If someone is wrong just tell him he is wrong no need to mock.

There's no rule that says work rate and a 'big heart' has to come into consideration when comparing players.

To me it doesn't really matter if a player works hard or not at AM. As long as he presses appropriately and tracks back when necessary, then there's no problem.

Having a big heart doesn't show who's better footballing wise. I highly doubt having a big heart influences whether a team buys a player or not. Having a 'big heart' certainly shouldn't determine whether one player is better than another player imo.

Besides, Rooney's not exactly a saint. Ozil's more composed than him.

Why are you guys taking that literally, thought he just meant that work rate, leadership and stuffs doesn't suppose to trump certain technique, dribbling, passing, & creativity, which in MT's opinions are the most important qualities for certain AM role in his mind, which is the key assumption on his points.

The Franchise throw almost everything in his posts except what MT looking for, which is what exactly are key qualities for AM (not player in overall) that he considered in mind that makes Rooney a better option as AM. I think only goal threat part that's being mentioned. Why AM? I still think this is started from the posts in Madrid-Man.United match where people made a combine XI of both team and put Rooney as AM in 4-2-3-1 set up which MT questioning about. Anyway people could have different idea on what AM does, even in the same set up, and hence the disagreement on key qualities that defining them, and thus the tedious discussion when comparing players when we're not on the same page on the job/role and the attributes needed for the jobs in the first place.

what are you two talking about?

if i go by what you say then Isco is better than Ozil, because technically, that kid is near flawless. first touch, dribbling, close control, Isco > Ozil. he must be a better player then.

Heck, Denilson is probably the one of the best players we have seen in laliga history.

So I guess that implies Ozil is better than Isco because he has a bigger 'heart' and works hard?

dude, i am not Dani, not falling for it

If I had to choose between Ozil and Rooney, I'd choose Ozil. It doesn't matter if Rooney works hard or supposedly has a huge heart. Not having a huge heart or not working hard doesn't stop Ozil being a better AM than Rooney.

Rooney's multiple roles of scoring 40 goals in 50 games or being a defensive winger doesn't matter either imo. Those things don't make Rooney a better AM than Ozil.

In terms of Isco vs Ozil, I pretty much implied working hard and having a huge heart doesn't mean a player is better at AM. So that must be the reason you think Isco is better than Ozil?

Anyway I think it's bewildering trying to compare them overall, so would it be easier to say 'Who would you rather have on your team, Rooney or Ozil'?

Mr Nick09 wrote:yes probably. that's just how i felt when i read through this thread. but somtime i tire of reading the same video games inspired posts over and over. It's just crap, that's what it is. It's crap. and the fact that madrid fans in this thread are making comments that makes me wanna punch them in the balls, just make me glad me moved the madrid section outta here. Do this on my board and i will run your ass out. It's not about x or y posters being smarter or what not, this is just a lack of common decency, basic footy understanding. if you dont have it, go fcking learn. funny thing is, MT is probably in character, so i dont even feel bad, so whatever bro

what board?

Disgraceful

Toffer Harley wrote:

ynwa wrote:I don't need sleep. And I have nothing against Ozil. He's a fantastic player but Rooney is tremendously underrated on this forum.

Ozil IS half the player. He has one fixed position - a position Rooney can occupy with ease. Add to the fact Rooney can also lead the line, play in the centre of the pitch and is just about superior in just about any football related skill just shows that he's on a whole new level.

actually the whole paragraph is worth highlighting. wow. that's just horrible

Let's just say Ozil was from America and wasn't German (he's actually Turkish tbf); would you really be saying the same?

Rooney IS better than Ozil. The only people arguing against that is the biased posters from Real Madrid and well, Germans. I mean, Rooney has no X-factor... REALLY? Or Rooney can't play as a "CAM" as effective as Ozil because he has no vision or passing apparently...

Anyway... rate the player for the players qualities rather than the shirt/nationality he's wearing/was born into and you'll see the difference in the two. Rooney is miles ahead.

I'm also sick of defending a manc. Especially considering you bring no argument to the table.

ynwa wrote:Let's just say Ozil was from America and wasn't German (he's actually Turkish tbf); would you really be saying the same?

Last time I checked, Mesut Özil was born in Gelsenkirchen, Germany to parents who were also born in Germany. If he isn't German, I'm not either as I was born only a handful km away from Gelsenkirchen.

ynwa wrote:Rooney IS better than Ozil. The only people arguing against that is the biased posters from Real Madrid and well, Germans. I mean, Rooney has no X-factor... REALLY? Or Rooney can't play as a "CAM" as effective as Ozil because he has no vision or passing apparently...

In my NT I would always prefer Özil to Wayne Rooney. How many times has Rooney not turned up for England vs what Özil did for the German NT?

ynwa wrote:Anyway... rate the player for the players qualities rather than the shirt/nationality he's wearing/was born into and you'll see the difference in the two. Rooney is miles ahead.

And that's were you err. In no way, Rooney is "miles ahead". Why exactly do you have to put them into a ranking in the first place? If you'd have seen Özil at Bremen, you'd have seen how influential he was there, and he is at least as valuable for Real Madrid nowadays by orchestrating the flow of the play and setting up his colleagues to score goals.

Wayne Rooney may be as valuable for ManUtd, but that doesn't mean he needs to be better or worse than Özil. You might want to ask the question differently - would either of Real or ManUtd want to sell the respective players? The question is: Most likely not, as they are both needed for their respective clubs.

ynwa wrote:

Toffer Harley wrote:

ynwa wrote:I don't need sleep. And I have nothing against Ozil. He's a fantastic player but Rooney is tremendously underrated on this forum.

Ozil IS half the player. He has one fixed position - a position Rooney can occupy with ease. Add to the fact Rooney can also lead the line, play in the centre of the pitch and is just about superior in just about any football related skill just shows that he's on a whole new level.

actually the whole paragraph is worth highlighting. wow. that's just horrible

Let's just say Ozil was from America and wasn't German (he's actually Turkish tbf); would you really be saying the same?

Rooney IS better than Ozil. The only people arguing against that is the biased posters from Real Madrid and well, Germans. I mean, Rooney has no X-factor... REALLY? Or Rooney can't play as a "CAM" as effective as Ozil because he has no vision or passing apparently...

Anyway... rate the player for the players qualities rather than the shirt/nationality he's wearing/was born into and you'll see the difference in the two. Rooney is miles ahead.

I'm also sick of defending a manc. Especially considering you bring no argument to the table.

of course i'd say the same about özil, even if he was from mars. great assumption there, let's just play the country card...

and i didn't bring an argument to the table because your post isn't worth a propper answer. that's 5-10 mins of my life i won't get back, just to state the obvious.

but don't even discuss passing and name özil and rooney in the same breath, it's getting even more embarassing.

Last time I checked, Mesut Özil was born in Gelsenkirchen, Germany to parents who were also born in Germany. If he isn't German, I'm not either as I was born only a handful km away from Gelsenkirchen.

YNWA is speaking of his Turkish roots in which Oezil embraces through his Islamic religion, fluency in his original language along with being close to his Turkish heritage as a whole.

In my NT I would always prefer Özil to Wayne Rooney. How many times has Rooney not turned up for England vs what Özil did for the German NT?

Didn't see how Rooney literally carried England in the 2004 Euros? Or how he single-handedly got them into the 2010 World Cup? Rooney is no legend for Internationals but it doesn't mean he isn't prolific for them.

And that's were you err. In no way, Rooney is "miles ahead". Why exactly do you have to put them into a ranking in the first place? If you'd have seen Özil at Bremen, you'd have seen how influential he was there, and he is at least as valuable for Real Madrid nowadays by orchestrating the flow of the play and setting up his colleagues to score goals.

Wayne Rooney may be as valuable for ManUtd, but that doesn't mean he needs to be better or worse than Özil. You might want to ask the question differently - would either of Real or ManUtd want to sell the respective players? The question is: Most likely not, as they are both needed for their respective clubs.

Oezil's stint at Bremen is less relevant given Rooney has done near the same things in a bigger club and a higher level, as otherwise we would rate most of the accomplishments of youngsters are smaller clubs, higher than they ought to be.

Fact is, with what Rooney produces on an overall basis compared to what Oezil does, there is little argument on who is the overall superior footballer in influence and ability. Advantage has it for Oezil since he obviously is 5 years younger yet Rooney was as influential as Oezil's age for his team as well.

I'm with ynwa, I cannot believe I'm defending a Man Utd player

definitely Rooney for me...far more well rounded

I don't think anyone's said Rooney doesn't have good vision or passing, it's just Ozil has better vision and passing. He's simply a better AM than Rooney.

Yohan Modric wrote:I don't think anyone's said Rooney doesn't have good vision or passing, it's just Ozil has better vision and passing. He's simply a better AM than Rooney.

Lets put it this way...Rooneys passing is better than Ozils scoring, if you follow me

Also I would be remiss if I did not say, but it seems like the general consensus among people on the forum (including Madrid fans) is that Madrid struggle when they are given possession, and play far better on the counter

Well, where does the blame fall for that? Surely multiple people deserve a small piece of it, but if your team struggles to score when given possession, the lions share of the blame should surely fall fall on the playmaker, no?

So what does it say about Ozil that Madrid have so much trouble when they are given possession?

Doesn't reflect well on him IMO

Yeh but it's not a midfielders job to score. Rooney's a forward imo.

Also it's not Ozil's fault we're poor in possession. It's Mourinho's, who doesn't know how to play possession effectively. The few times we do play well in possession, Ozil and Modric are at the heart of pretty much everything.

Do you judge Ozil's scoring on his Real Madrid matches ? He can't score more because he has to assist Ronaldo. He already has 5 goals in the WC qualifiers, scored 5 in Euro qualifiers. For Germany he scores much more than for RM + He is a midfielder, Rooney is a forward.

likeastar wrote:Do you judge Ozil's scoring on his Real Madrid matches ? He can't score more because he has to assist Ronaldo. He already has 5 goals in the WC qualifiers, scored 5 in Euro qualifiers. For Germany he scores much more than for RM + He is a midfielder, Rooney is a forward.

give me a break

people in this thread acting like Rooney is Falcao and Ozil is Xavi

Rooney's definitely not Falcao and Ozil isn't Xavi. Rooney offers more than Falcao.

Rooney offers more than Ozil, however I don't think offering more makes a player better than another player.

Yohan Modric wrote:Rooney's definitely not Falcao and Ozil isn't Xavi. Rooney offers more than Falcao.

Rooney offers more than Ozil, however I don't think offering more makes a player better than another player.

That was sarcasm. What I meant was that some people are trying to make it out like Ozil and Rooney are completely different players (Rooney is a forward!! Ozil is a midfielder!!) - its just splitting hairs to deflect from the topic

Both play between the lines, and both largely serve as links between midfield and attack. The main difference is that one is more of a distributer, and ones more a goalscorer

Were not comparing apples to oranges here.

Yohan Modric wrote:If I had to choose between Ozil and Rooney, I'd choose Ozil. It doesn't matter if Rooney works hard or supposedly has a huge heart. Not having a huge heart or not working hard doesn't stop Ozil being a better AM than Rooney.

Rooney's multiple roles of scoring 40 goals in 50 games or being a defensive winger doesn't matter either imo. Those things don't make Rooney a better AM than Ozil.

In terms of Isco vs Ozil, I pretty much implied working hard and having a huge heart doesn't mean a player is better at AM. So that must be the reason you think Isco is better than Ozil?

It's pretty obvious you've never played competitive sports in your life.

I have and I'll always take the talentless guy who works the hardest over the lazy talented guy.

Here's the thing though, neither Ozil or Rooney are lazy and both are very talented.

Concerning this debate I think Rooney is better overall because he brings a lot to the table, but there are things Ozil does that Rooney simply cannot imo.

So Rooney for me but Ozil has more upside as of now.

Swanhends wrote:

Yohan Modric wrote:Rooney's definitely not Falcao and Ozil isn't Xavi. Rooney offers more than Falcao.

Rooney offers more than Ozil, however I don't think offering more makes a player better than another player.

That was sarcasm. What I meant was that some people are trying to make it out like Ozil and Rooney are completely different players (Rooney is a forward!! Ozil is a midfielder!!) - its just splitting hairs to deflect from the topic

Both play between the lines, and both largely serve as links between midfield and attack. The main difference is that one is more of a distributer, and ones more a goalscorer

Were not comparing apples to oranges here.

True, however I think Rooney's naturally a forward, while Ozil is naturally a midfielder.

However when both do play at AM, I'd go with Ozil, since he suits the position better.

Zealous wrote:

Yohan Modric wrote:If I had to choose between Ozil and Rooney, I'd choose Ozil. It doesn't matter if Rooney works hard or supposedly has a huge heart. Not having a huge heart or not working hard doesn't stop Ozil being a better AM than Rooney.

Rooney's multiple roles of scoring 40 goals in 50 games or being a defensive winger doesn't matter either imo. Those things don't make Rooney a better AM than Ozil.

In terms of Isco vs Ozil, I pretty much implied working hard and having a huge heart doesn't mean a player is better at AM. So that must be the reason you think Isco is better than Ozil?

It's pretty obvious you've never played competitive sports in your life.

I have and I'll always take the talentless guy who works the hardest over the lazy talented guy.

Here's the thing though, neither Ozil or Rooney are lazy and both are very talented.

By 'it doesn't matter if he works hard', I didn't mean being lazy was acceptable. I just think for the AM spot you don't really need to work super hard.