Re: Neymar Watch

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:08 pm

Muppet wrote:Total flat track bully. The champion of meaningless international goals. I'm not even fit but I'd score 15 or 20 in his position for Barca.

Neymar vs top teams (RM, Atletico, Valencia, Sevilla, Villareal, PSG, MC) this season:

19 apps
1507 min
14 Goals
3 Assists

Seems legit.

by Bankz Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:10 pm

Muppet wrote:Total flat track bully. The champion of meaningless international goals. I'm not even fit but I'd score 15 or 20 in his position for Barca.

for a guy that's scored 10 goals in 12 international competitive games? lol, and how many does hazard and messi have in competitive games internationally. more so, 42 goals and 24 assists in 61 games in downright insane.
well, off course, keep hating!!!!

by Mr Nick09 Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:12 pm

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:
Muppet wrote:Total flat track bully. The champion of meaningless international goals. I'm not even fit but I'd score 15 or 20 in his position for Barca.

Neymar vs top teams (RM, Atletico, Valencia, Sevilla, Villareal, PSG, MC) this season:

19 apps
1507 min
14 Goals
3 Assists

Seems legit.

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:13 pm

I just copied and paste it from the Barca section to quell the flat track bully nonsense.

Tbh though none of those teams are a big team :coffee:

Also not sure the meme fits hmm

by Bankz Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:14 pm

including 6 assists and 3 goals and 4 assists in 5 games at u-23 level. lol. plus @GLS if u add in Bilbao and espanyol that's 18 goals in 23 big games this season.. beat that!!!

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:16 pm

I think Espanyol is pushing it Laughing

But yeah he clearly scores when it counts, his record in Clasico's is quite good so far too.

by Muppet Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:17 pm

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:I just copied and paste it from the Barca section to quell the flat track bully nonsense.

Tbh though none of those teams are a big team

Also not sure the meme fits

Only the Madrid sides are in Barca's class so it doesn't dispel anything.

by sree999 Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:17 pm

dosent nerman have a very good conversion rate ?

can anyone post MSN conversion rate ?

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:18 pm

Muppet wrote:
Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:I just copied and paste it from the Barca section to quell the flat track bully nonsense.

Tbh though none of those teams are a big team

Also not sure the meme fits

Only the Madrid sides are in Barca's class so it doesn't dispel anything.

So only goals against Madrid sides and Bayern count?

Seems legit.

by Muppet Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:19 pm

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:
Muppet wrote:
Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:I just copied and paste it from the Barca section to quell the flat track bully nonsense.

Tbh though none of those teams are a big team

Also not sure the meme fits

Only the Madrid sides are in Barca's class so it doesn't dispel anything.

So only goals against Madrid sides and Bayern count?

Seems legit.

Straw man engage eh. :coffee:

by Ganso Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:26 pm

trolling is finally back to GL banana

by El Messico Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:50 pm

Harmonica wrote:
Adit wrote:Neymar with shit finishing is still only 15 goals behind messi despite playing second fiddle to messi and taking no penssi's....looking at the whole picture it is more impressive than what messi did so far this season.
That's paradoxal, as if you're shit finisher you must have many chance's to score many goals in relation.

Messi is marked every game, most marked player in history of the game, and most of his shots are usually blocked by defenders because it's number one priority against Barcelona. He doesn't get that many great chances anymore, he mostly has to create them himself from the midfield, where as Neymar is just waiting usually in open space. Also Neymar missed the only pen he shot this season, that's 0% conversion ratio.

Messi actually shouldn't have the goals he had this season, being the play-maker and controller of the team, he's breaking his dribbling and assists records and still providing over 50 goals. That's prime Messi for you.

If Messi was finishing like Neymar he would have about 20-30 goals this season.

Example of the team dynamic this season, Messi the 7th attacker

Don't have up-to-date stats for now, but whoscored released an infographic that showed that by the end of February, Messi was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga. In 2013/14 also, he was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga.

I also saw a stat this week that showed that Neymar had a 33% shot conversion rate, which I'm guessing is better than Messi's.

by BarrileteCosmico Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:52 pm

Fußball wrote:

Oh Nerman my Nerman.

Norman please forgive Messi for screwing up the clear cut chance you created, he is not worthy Molenation

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:56 pm

Norman is a rich mans Nerman tbh.

by Harmonica Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:56 pm

El Messico wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
Adit wrote:Neymar with shit finishing is still only 15 goals behind messi despite playing second fiddle to messi and taking no penssi's....looking at the whole picture it is more impressive than what messi did so far this season.
That's paradoxal, as if you're shit finisher you must have many chance's to score many goals in relation.

Messi is marked every game, most marked player in history of the game, and most of his shots are usually blocked by defenders because it's number one priority against Barcelona. He doesn't get that many great chances anymore, he mostly has to create them himself from the midfield, where as Neymar is just waiting usually in open space. Also Neymar missed the only pen he shot this season, that's 0% conversion ratio.

Messi actually shouldn't have the goals he had this season, being the play-maker and controller of the team, he's breaking his dribbling and assists records and still providing over 50 goals. That's prime Messi for you.

If Messi was finishing like Neymar he would have about 20-30 goals this season.

Example of the team dynamic this season, Messi the 7th attacker

Don't have up-to-date stats for now, but whoscored released an infographic that showed that by the end of February, Messi was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga. In 2013/14 also, he was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga.

I also saw a stat this week that showed that Neymar had a 33% shot conversion rate, which I'm guessing is better than Messi's.

That however isn't paradoxal as Messi creates most of his own chances, where as forward average is about 80%, Messi has less than 50% directly assisted goals. Neymar in often even fails to get shot in, which is why they aren't even registered. It's harder to dribble from midfield to get shot in against defender wall being marked all the time, than waiting service in the defender line and open spaces and so on...

by El Messico Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:59 pm

Harmonica wrote:
El Messico wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
That's paradoxal, as if you're shit finisher you must have many chance's to score many goals in relation.

Messi is marked every game, most marked player in history of the game, and most of his shots are usually blocked by defenders because it's number one priority against Barcelona. He doesn't get that many great chances anymore, he mostly has to create them himself from the midfield, where as Neymar is just waiting usually in open space. Also Neymar missed the only pen he shot this season, that's 0% conversion ratio.

Messi actually shouldn't have the goals he had this season, being the play-maker and controller of the team, he's breaking his dribbling and assists records and still providing over 50 goals. That's prime Messi for you.

If Messi was finishing like Neymar he would have about 20-30 goals this season.

Example of the team dynamic this season, Messi the 7th attacker

Don't have up-to-date stats for now, but whoscored released an infographic that showed that by the end of February, Messi was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga. In 2013/14 also, he was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga.

I also saw a stat this week that showed that Neymar had a 33% shot conversion rate, which I'm guessing is better than Messi's.
That however isn't paradoxal as Messi creates most of his own chances, where as forward average is about 80%, Messi has less than 50% directly assisted goals. Neymar in most chances even fails to get shot in, which is why they aren't even registered. It's harder to dribble from midfield to get shot in against defender wall, than waiting service in the defender line and so on...

That doesn't matter, as this discussion has been about shit finishing. Messi is still missing the most clear-cut chances, which is a result of poor finishing.

If Neymar can't get a shot away, that means it probably wasn't a clear chance to begin with. Every Messi through pass is not a clear chance.

by BarrileteCosmico Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:02 pm

How does whoscored go about defining what is a clear cut chance and what isn't?

by El Messico Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:04 pm

Apparently I can't post external links because I'm a new member so could somebody go to reddit/d10s/all clips by category/missed chances and link it here?

It shows all the chances Messi missed this season, up until the Celta game.

http://www.reddit.com/r/D10S/comments/2vrv4l/all_clips_by_category/cokckfe

BarrileteCosmico wrote:How does whoscored go about defining what is a clear cut chance and what isn't?

Not too sure to be honest, probably 1v1s, or opportunities inside the box with a lot of time on the ball?

by Harmonica Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:04 pm

El Messico wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
El Messico wrote:

Don't have up-to-date stats for now, but whoscored released an infographic that showed that by the end of February, Messi was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga. In 2013/14 also, he was the player who missed the most clear-cut chances in La Liga.

I also saw a stat this week that showed that Neymar had a 33% shot conversion rate, which I'm guessing is better than Messi's.
That however isn't paradoxal as Messi creates most of his own chances, where as forward average is about 80%, Messi has less than 50% directly assisted goals. Neymar in most chances even fails to get shot in, which is why they aren't even registered. It's harder to dribble from midfield to get shot in against defender wall, than waiting service in the defender line and so on...

That doesn't matter, as this discussion has been about shit finishing. Messi is still missing the most clear-cut chances, which is a result of poor finishing.

If Neymar can't get a shot away, that means it probably wasn't a clear chance to begin with. Every Messi through pass is not a clear chance.

Messi is doing everything else on the field, Neymar isn't, his purpose is scoring goals this season. Neymar isn't using his energy/form in related stuff, he's concentrating on goal scoring, and thus he should be doing a lot better. If you have to dribble from the midfield and create clear cut chance to yourself, and miss it, is better finishing than waiting service in open space and missing it, because you had less overall energy/form to score it in relation.

by El Messico Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:08 pm

Harmonica wrote:
El Messico wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
That however isn't paradoxal as Messi creates most of his own chances, where as forward average is about 80%, Messi has less than 50% directly assisted goals. Neymar in most chances even fails to get shot in, which is why they aren't even registered. It's harder to dribble from midfield to get shot in against defender wall, than waiting service in the defender line and so on...

That doesn't matter, as this discussion has been about shit finishing. Messi is still missing the most clear-cut chances, which is a result of poor finishing.

If Neymar can't get a shot away, that means it probably wasn't a clear chance to begin with. Every Messi through pass is not a clear chance.
Messi is doing everything else on the field, Neymar isn't, his purpose is scoring goals this season. Neymar isn't using his energy/form in related stuff, he's concentrating on goal scoring, and thus he should be doing a lot better. If you have to dribble from the midfield and create clear cut chance to yourself, and miss it, is better finishing than waiting service in open space and missing it, because you had more overall energy/form to score it in relation.

But if you look at the reddit link I was talking about, a lot of the chances Messi is missing do not involve him running from midfield and dribbling to create. Moreover, Messi averages 8 km a game whereas Neymar is averaging more like 10-11.5 km. Not too sure who is supposed to be more tired scratch

by BarrileteCosmico Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:13 pm

Harmonica wrote:
Messi is doing everything else on the field, Neymar isn't, his purpose is scoring goals this season. Neymar isn't using his energy/form in related stuff, he's concentrating on goal scoring, and thus he should be doing a lot better. If you have to dribble from the midfield and create clear cut chance to yourself, and miss it, is better finishing than waiting service in open space and missing it, because you had less overall energy/form to score it in relation.

Betweeen the three forwards Neymar is the one who tracks back the most

by Harmonica Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:14 pm

El Messico wrote:Apparently I can't post external links because I'm a new member so could somebody go to reddit/d10s/all clips by category/missed chances and link it here?

It shows all the chances Messi missed this season, up until the Celta game.

http://www.reddit.com/r/D10S/comments/2vrv4l/all_clips_by_category/cokckfe

BarrileteCosmico wrote:How does whoscored go about defining what is a clear cut chance and what isn't?

Not too sure to be honest, probably 1v1s, or opportunities inside the box with a lot of time on the ball?

So that's the same amount of chance's that I posted only Messi creating for Neymar this season, about 1/3 of all of Neymar's misses, and it still contains stuff like I pointed previously, and Messi still has scored 50% more. It isn't even remotely close in finishing department

Neymar Watch - Page 24 DesertedLimpFly

That isn't a great chance, he faces whole opposition from the halfway line, it ends as a great chance because of him.

Messi creates his chance's mostly himself, he's mostly part of the build up, there isn't similar player on the planet.

by Harmonica Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:22 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
Messi is doing everything else on the field, Neymar isn't, his purpose is scoring goals this season. Neymar isn't using his energy/form in related stuff, he's concentrating on goal scoring, and thus he should be doing a lot better. If you have to dribble from the midfield and create clear cut chance to yourself, and miss it, is better finishing than waiting service in open space and missing it, because you had less overall energy/form to score it in relation.

Betweeen the three forwards Neymar is the one who tracks back the most

Pedro tracks back also, doesn't mean shit.

Balls won back this season: Messi 132, Neymar 117 (9 to 12 games left!!!)

by Harmonica Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:34 pm

El Messico wrote:
Harmonica wrote:
El Messico wrote:

That doesn't matter, as this discussion has been about shit finishing. Messi is still missing the most clear-cut chances, which is a result of poor finishing.

If Neymar can't get a shot away, that means it probably wasn't a clear chance to begin with. Every Messi through pass is not a clear chance.
Messi is doing everything else on the field, Neymar isn't, his purpose is scoring goals this season. Neymar isn't using his energy/form in related stuff, he's concentrating on goal scoring, and thus he should be doing a lot better. If you have to dribble from the midfield and create clear cut chance to yourself, and miss it, is better finishing than waiting service in open space and missing it, because you had more overall energy/form to score it in relation.

But if you look at the reddit link I was talking about, a lot of the chances Messi is missing do not involve him running from midfield and dribbling to create. Moreover, Messi averages 8 km a game whereas Neymar is averaging more like 10-11.5 km. Not too sure who is supposed to be more tired

Umm, I'm sure Messi has ran more overall in this season than Neymar, he has played 30% more. And he's dribbled twice the players and marking, scoring 50% more goals, creating 4 times the goals for others.

It's completely pointless comparison.

by Muppet Sun Apr 26, 2015 9:13 pm

This thread is nuts. Neymar has Messi and to a lesser extent Suarez to thank for his inflated stats this season. He's far inferior to both. Anyone who can't see that is just bloody clueless.

by Bankz Mon Apr 27, 2015 3:22 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:How does whoscored go about defining what is a clear cut chance and what isn't?

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