Re: Summer of 2014

by Art Morte Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:38 pm

If Holland continue like they started the tournament, they'll be the Southampton of the World Cup, lots of clubs will be looking at their players who play in the Eredivisie and think about making offers. If United don't buy Shaw, they might very well buy Blind.

by Curtinho Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:42 pm

If they continue like they started the World Cup it might be the most dominant WC winner in history lol

But I will say this. De Vrij, Blind, Janmaat, Wijnaldum and Depay are all good enough for bigger clubs.

by RedOranje Sat Jun 14, 2014 11:57 pm

When a player says they want "game time" they're not referring to a nice close view of the match from the bench... they mean minutes on the field during play. While I do believe that at this point in his development Suso is right to ask for some guarantees on playing time, I do NOT believe that we can legitimately promise them to him with our current squad and plans for the summer. Either we'd be hurting the team by passing up/benching better options or we'd be lying to him. As such, with his contract running out next summer, a sale seems the most logical and likely conclusion. To sit here and use that to criticise the committee is asinine and ignorant or agenda-driven.

by Red Alert Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:10 am

Exactly. And he WOULD get minutes on the field during play. We play potentially 60+ games this season coming.

Again, he hasn't stated he wanted to play every single game week in week out. He wants to be apart of the first team. And he has the ability to do that. He also has massive massive potential.

Agenda driven? Again, this goes back to 2010. This committee hasn't improved us at all since then, we're still as clueless in the market as we have been since Rafa's last season here. Yes, there's a few exceptions such as Coutinho/Sturridge but that was in ONE window. One window of 2 good signings doesn't justify 3+ windows of terrible decisions. Again, we've been competing with the likes of Chelsea, United and City since FSG have been here. There's not much to show for it either.

They're determined to bring the best youth to help be dominant in the future, sure. Okay, whatever. I'm all for the long term success for the club. But they would have got rid of 2 our top 3 prospects at the club if this Suso deal goes through since they've been here, so I apologise if I'm not too confident in their decision making when they continue letting the best prospects leave and replace them with people that are far inferior. I'm not going to sit here and go and go into their decisions regarding the first team either, because just as bad, if not worse.

by Red Alert Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:27 am

El Cujo wrote:If they continue like they started the World Cup it might be the most dominant WC winner in history lol

But I will say this. De Vrij, Blind, Janmaat, Wijnaldum and Depay are all good enough for bigger clubs.

Ve Vrij and Indi are ready to move abroad and play consistent first team football.

Blind, I guess he's ready too. He sort of faded somewhat in Ajax second half of the season but I do think he needs to go to a bigger club to progress. I wouldn't mind him at Liverpool, simply because I think he has the ability and has that experience in Europe in which 3/4 of our team lacks. He'll also have to cover Gerrard as I'm not entirely confident in Gerrard's fitness, not at the age he is, and not at the fact that he pulled up in the England game in open play holding his groin (something he's been troubled with for years now).

Janmaat will be a solid player for a mid-table club, no better no worse. Same has to be said for Wijnaldum imo. Again, I don't know, I just can't seem to rate him. He's okay to great with PSV, but if we're targeting anyone from PSV, I would want Depay and maybe even Jetro Willems. Bakkali too, once he's ready, and hopefully Maher can find his form from his AZ days, I don't think he will though, if they keep playing him in a more defensive role. But yeah, pass from me on Wijnaldum.

by RedOranje Sun Jun 15, 2014 10:57 pm

He's not asking to be around the first team, he's asking for REGULAR GAMETIME. That means starting or coming off the bench on a consistent basis... which requires more than cup matches or injury issues. Who does he replace amongst our squad to regularly get starts or a bench spot? Who among them is he realistically likely to outperform? Coutinho? Sterling? Lallana/Shaqiri? Sturridge?

And he's refusing to sign a new deal or extension without it. So he's not being forced out or sold off, he's setting his own exit up. You're throwing your little tantrum over nothing that's got to do with the committee at all. It's a storm in a tea cup.

He's a talented young player who's not developed as much as we expected and isn't ready to break into our matchday squad with the signings and expectations coming in so he's likely to move on. Describing him as anything more, or the situation as anything worse, is simply being intentionally melodramatic.

by Curtinho Mon Jun 16, 2014 4:45 am

Red Alert wrote:Ve Vrij and Indi are ready to move abroad and play consistent first team football.

De Vrij yes, Indi absolutely not. He's not even a consistently good player in the Eredivisie and looked completely out of place against Spain (and really has been lacking in all of his recent NT games). He has potential, but he's not there.

Blind, I guess he's ready too. He sort of faded somewhat in Ajax second half of the season but I do think he needs to go to a bigger club to progress. I wouldn't mind him at Liverpool, simply because I think he has the ability and has that experience in Europe in which 3/4 of our team lacks. He'll also have to cover Gerrard as I'm not entirely confident in Gerrard's fitness, not at the age he is, and not at the fact that he pulled up in the England game in open play holding his groin (something he's been troubled with for years now).

Blind would be a fantastic pick-up. It seemed like all of Ajax faded down the stretch after the league was all but locked up and they got destroyed in the EL. Blind has shown his quality though and after being named Eredivisie player of the year also went on to have a great performance against the WC holders and was, IMO, the second best player on the pitch beside Robben. Hard to go up from the best player in the Dutch top flight without moving to an even better league. Ajax will have to fight to keep him after the WC.

Janmaat will be a solid player for a mid-table club, no better no worse.

I'm not so sure. I haven't always been high on him, but right now he'd be Liverpool's best RB if he were signed. I think people underestimate how shallow RB is as a position on the whole. If he continues to progress and play like he has (he is still young) he could be a top RB for a long time and easily fit into a top squad.

Same has to be said for Wijnaldum imo. Again, I don't know, I just can't seem to rate him. He's okay to great with PSV, but if we're targeting anyone from PSV, I would want Depay and maybe even Jetro Willems.

I would take Depay in a heartbeat. So many shades of Robben in him, but stronger. He might not even reach those heights, but he's a dynamic talent with sky-high potential. That said Wijnaldum has the best package of talent and athleticism maybe of anyone in the Eredivisie. We've gone over this before though and I respect your opinion.

Bakkali too, once he's ready, and hopefully Maher can find his form from his AZ days, I don't think he will though, if they keep playing him in a more defensive role.

Meh...I'm not as high on these two. Bakkali still has a long way to go and is a bit overhyped because of his hat-trick. Maher has nice potential, but I would prefer a number of young Dutch midfielders over him.

by Art Morte Mon Jun 16, 2014 9:40 am

Art Morte wrote:We should just buy the best LB of the World Cup who's available

Switzerland's Ricardo Rodriguez, 21, looked pretty good, let's buy him from Wolfsburg and be done with this LB business :coffee:

by Helmer Mon Jun 16, 2014 10:26 am

yes he is good, he looked even better than when he played for Wolfsburg, less established than Moreno but i will have no Problem if we go with him instead of Moreno. He also has 3 years more left to his contract, i guess and also Wolfsburg are competing for that fourth place in BL. They narrowly missed this time with Leverkusen by only 1 Point. So it wont be so easy to get him, they are always looking to strengthen their Team, we might have to overpay for him

by Helmer Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:02 am

Ronald Koeman is finalising negotiations with Southampton to succeed Mauricio Pochettino as manager after receiving a formal offer from the club on Friday.

A contract has been drawn up and is with the lawyers of both Southampton and Koeman, with a formal announcement now imminent. Koeman returns from a holiday in Turkey on Monday and has already begun planning his backroom team in readiness to start work next week.

His brother, Erwin, is likely to be his assistant while Jan Kluitenburg, who worked with him at Feyenoord, is being lined up for the post of fitness coach.

Koeman’s first task will be to stabilise the playing squad. Rickie Lambert has already joined Liverpool and there have been offers from Liverpool for Adam Lallana and Dejan Lovren, and from Manchester United for Luke Shaw.

The three players all want to leave but Southampton are so far resisting these offers and want Koeman to have the opportunity to speak with their players after the World Cup.

Telegraph Sport revealed that Koeman has been identified as the ideal successor to Pochettino at the start of June, with the Dutchman impressing club officials, notably technical director Les Reed and chairman Ralph Krueger, during a meeting in Southampton. Other candidates were considered but Koeman has always been first choice and the clear frontunner.

Koeman is currently out of work after leaving Feyenoord last month and is seen as a good fit with Southampton’s philosophy of promoting young talent from their academy and adopting an attacking playing style.

In a 14-year managerial career, Koeman has won Dutch titles with Ajax and PSV Eindhoven as well as the Cope del Rey at Valencia. As a player, he is best known in England for the controversial free-kick that effectively ended England’s chances of qualifying for the 1994

World Cup but he also won the European Cup with both Ajax and Barcelona, as well as the 1988 European Championships with Holland.

His Feyenoord team have finished second, third and second during the past three years in Holland’s Eredivisie and were the league’s leading scorers last season.

Southampton are adamant that they have no need to sell their best players but they must realign their finances and are expected to recoup more money than they spend this summer in transfer fees. The club have £22 million still outstanding to pay on players from previous transfer windows, as well as a training ground bill that has risen to £30 million and been financed by loans from owner Katarina Liebherr.

Southampton would only actually have received around £15 million from Liverpool’s initial bid for Lallana, with the remainder of the proposed deal made up of various performance-related clauses.

Bournemouth would also be entitled to a 25 per cent sell-on fee, meaning that Southampton saw no value in the deal.

They would also want at least £30 million for Shaw, who may yet emerge as a definite target of Chelsea. Shaw is a fan of Chelsea but they have been deterred by such a high fee for a left-back and have approached Atletico Madrid for Filipe Luís.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/southampton/10901340/Dutch-legend-Ronald-Koeman-formally-offered-Southampton-managers-job.html

:coffee:

by Art Morte Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:46 am

HEIL MEIN REDS wrote:yes he is good, he looked even better than when he played for Wolfsburg, less established than Moreno but i will have no Problem if we go with him instead of Moreno. He also has 3 years more left to his contract, i guess and also Wolfsburg are competing for that fourth place in BL. They narrowly missed this time with Leverkusen by only 1 Point. So it wont be so easy to get him, they are always looking to strengthen their Team, we might have to overpay for him

What's the latest rumours about Moreno's price tag? I remember something like £20m. Should at least be worth a try to table an offer for Rodriguez that's less than that - if we had the slightest of interest.

by Curtinho Mon Jun 16, 2014 2:52 pm

Been begging for Rodriguez for a while. He's world class, and only 21. He could be the best left-back in the world in the future (hell, he's in contention right now), and may end up with the best season + WC of any fullback by the end of July. That said I doubt Liverpool get him or have even tried. Plus doesn't Wolfsburg have a rich owner with high aspirations? I thought I read somewhere that he has already stated there's no way Rodriguez leaves this summer because he's under contract.

by Curtinho Mon Jun 16, 2014 7:50 pm

Also apparently Liverpool have placed a 27m bid for Alexis Sanchez. What I wouldn't give for Liverpool to acquire him. Most ridiculous front 3 in football.

by RedOranje Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:06 pm

Art Morte wrote:
HEIL MEIN REDS wrote:yes he is good, he looked even better than when he played for Wolfsburg, less established than Moreno but i will have no Problem if we go with him instead of Moreno. He also has 3 years more left to his contract, i guess and also Wolfsburg are competing for that fourth place in BL. They narrowly missed this time with Leverkusen by only 1 Point. So it wont be so easy to get him, they are always looking to strengthen their Team, we might have to overpay for him

What's the latest rumours about Moreno's price tag? I remember something like £20m. Should at least be worth a try to table an offer for Rodriguez that's less than that - if we had the slightest of interest.

I've yet to see any notable report suggesting anything other than the £18m (16m + add-ons) that was part of the very first reports that came out on it. That's about 20m euros but I've no idea where you're pulling £20m, honestly. Could you provide a link or something?

by Red Alert Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:08 am

He said "something like" so around 20 dude. He didn't say it was exactly 20m pounds... settle.

RedOranje wrote:He's not asking to be around the first team, he's asking for REGULAR GAMETIME. That means starting or coming off the bench on a consistent basis... which requires more than cup matches or injury issues. Who does he replace amongst our squad to regularly get starts or a bench spot? Who among them is he realistically likely to outperform? Coutinho? Sterling? Lallana/Shaqiri? Sturridge?

And he's refusing to sign a new deal or extension without it. So he's not being forced out or sold off, he's setting his own exit up. You're throwing your little tantrum over nothing that's got to do with the committee at all. It's a storm in a tea cup.

He's a talented young player who's not developed as much as we expected and isn't ready to break into our matchday squad with the signings and expectations coming in so he's likely to move on. Describing him as anything more, or the situation as anything worse, is simply being intentionally melodramatic.

He'd still GET regular game time whichever way you look at it ffs.

We needed him in the second half of last season ffs. Half our team couldn't run in the last month or so because there was no rotation. He WILL get game time by staying here. He's at a similar level to Coutinho when he first broke though here; maybe even better / more experienced. He also already has an understanding with Luisito in the final third - who is still pretty much seen as the player to go through for us whichever way you look at it.

You're either overrating our bench/squad players or you seriously underrate Suso. Which one is it? Laughing

"Not developed as much as we expected" are you kidding me? Based on what evidence is he stalled his progress as a player? I seem to recall Rodgers praising him (and Borini as well) when they were both on loan.

HEIL MEIN REDS wrote:[

Southampton receiving 15m out of the deal doesn't mean we're only paying 15m to bring him in... we'll still pay 25m to sign him. I thought we moved on anyway? Someone please tell me we moved on. :facepalm:

El Cujo wrote:Blind would be a fantastic pick-up.

Liverpool and Dortmund are trying to sign him according to the press in Holland.

(Major note: Not sure if they're just reporting whatever they read from the metro/dailyfail otherwise I'll take it with a pinch of salt.)

If we DO infact sign him, we better not use him as a left back. We'll just be wasting him there.

by Helmer Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:44 am

yes we have moved on :coffee:

by Curtinho Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:17 pm

Red Alert wrote:
El Cujo wrote:Blind would be a fantastic pick-up.

Liverpool and Dortmund are trying to sign him according to the press in Holland.

(Major note: Not sure if they're just reporting whatever they read from the metro/dailyfail otherwise I'll take it with a pinch of salt.)

If we DO infact sign him, we better not use him as a left back. We'll just be wasting him there.

I don't think it would be a waste really. He still represents a great option at left back (look at him with the Dutch NT right now. He still plays at LB for Ajax at times too. The thing is that he is even better as a deep lying midfielder. With that said Liverpool's attacking style will allow him to make full use of his skills on the left or as a midfielder IMO.

by Red Alert Wed Jun 18, 2014 8:07 am

El Cujo wrote:
Red Alert wrote:
El Cujo wrote:Blind would be a fantastic pick-up.

Liverpool and Dortmund are trying to sign him according to the press in Holland.

(Major note: Not sure if they're just reporting whatever they read from the metro/dailyfail otherwise I'll take it with a pinch of salt.)

If we DO infact sign him, we better not use him as a left back. We'll just be wasting him there.

I don't think it would be a waste really. He still represents a great option at left back (look at him with the Dutch NT right now. He still plays at LB for Ajax at times too. The thing is that he is even better as a deep lying midfielder. With that said Liverpool's attacking style will allow him to make full use of his skills on the left or as a midfielder IMO.

I never said he can't play there, I stated he'd be wasted.

Gerrard represents a great option at right back, should we be playing Stevie G at RB?

by Curtinho Wed Jun 18, 2014 2:19 pm

Red Alert wrote:I never said he can't play there, I stated he'd be wasted.

Gerrard represents a great option at right back, should we be playing Stevie G at RB?

I guess I just don't agree that he'd be wasted. He'd have his moments at midfield as well. I don't think that the Netherlands felt he was wasted on the left in their game against Spain. Wink

With that said, I know none of these things are reliable but:

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/482978/Liverpool-eye-Wolfsburg-s-Ricardo-Rodriguez-after-talks-over-Alberto-Moreno-stall

Brendan Rodgers had Rodriguez watched numerous times last season - when he scored five times and grabbed nine assist - and contemplated making an offer in January.

...

It now remains to be seen whether the reported interest in Rodriguez and Blind is genuine or simply a negotiating tactic to get Sevilla back to the table to talk about Moreno.

If it's just a negotiating tactic that's silly. I'd take both Rodriguez and Blind over Moreno AINEC.

by RedOranje Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:21 am

Well crap, I guess we HAVEN'T learned our lesson.

Liverpool will make a third attempt to land England midfielder Adam Lallana following the World Cup in Brazil.
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-hoping-third-time-lucky-7291245

by McAgger Fri Jun 20, 2014 3:26 am

Damn it

Was getting excited about Shaqiri

by RedOranje Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:37 am

Imagine the next time we try to negotiate hard with a club over a player...

"We'll walk away if you don't decrease your asking price from that ridiculous sum."

"HAHAHAHAHA... We'll talk again when you up your bid at the end of the month."

by iftikhar Fri Jun 20, 2014 7:58 am

RedOranje wrote:Imagine the next time we try to negotiate hard with a club over a player...

"We'll walk away if you don't decrease your asking price from that ridiculous sum."

"HAHAHAHAHA... We'll talk again when you up your bid at the end of the month."

Yeah, this is just silly. They are acting like we are after a 'Suarez-Class' one-of-a-kind player.

by Red Alert Fri Jun 20, 2014 10:27 am

FFS.

by Curtinho Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:25 pm

I'm ignoring the Lallana stuff from now on because it just makes me too bothered. Seems like such a silly saga. I understand that he's proven to be a good player in the EPL, but FFS we have players of his caliber already and we should be looking for better. I understand he's versatile, but so are many players out there with higher ceilings and more proven results. That's the last I'll say on that.

I know we are all lamenting the rumours of Suarez leaving, and there are already rumours of us going after Sanchez alone, but this came out today:

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/483719/Liverpool-to-land-Alexis-Sanchez-AND-30m-in-Luis-Suarez-swap-deal

If we were to have to part with Suarez this summer (I don't think we will, honestly, I think he will honour the team with at least one season in the CL), but if we were I think this is close to the best deal we could realistically get for him. I don't see a player of Sanchez's caliber being realistically available, and him + 30 - 40m for Suarez would be making the best of a bad situation. Plus I think Sanchez would absolutely thrive at Liverpool, and the extra cash would only help us bolster the rest of the squad.

Still, I just hope the interest in Sanchez goes somewhere (ideally not at the expense of Suarez). James Rodriguez is a guy I brought up a lot earlier in the year because I think he's one of the most dynamic, talented young players in the world and he's carrying that Colombian team right now, but his pricetag would be well out of our reach I think.

by McAgger Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:49 pm

Is Sanchez worth 70m?

Yeah Barca can shove it. That deal is never happening

by Sponsored content