Barclay's Premier League '14-'15 discussion V5

S wrote:It seems like Falcao is more and more looking like Another Torres.

GL visionary Gil might be right again.

CBarca wrote:Shocking that Ashley Young was allowed to stay on the field that game. Clear cut second yellow but I'm not upset with a draw. Not sure how Ashley Young got away though.

Natalie Portman wrote:

B-Mac wrote:

RealGunner wrote:Man things finally look bright for us. Koscielny back today. We have our first choice back 4 now. Ozil, Ramsey and Walcott back this week to next week. We are so nearly there to a complete squad

we are finally getting healthy too top 4 should start to take shape imo

Your best form has come because of the injuries.

these injured guys (Di Maria, Shaw, Rafael, etc) coming back will ruin the balance and winning formula LvG has found. can't wait

Natalie Portman wrote:Arsenal the only team to win both games in festive period. Here is hoping we can join them tomorrow

HEIL MEIN REDS wrote:

Natalie Portman wrote:Arsenal the only team to win both games in festive period. Here is hoping we can join them tomorrow

I have lost all the faith in the mentality of our starting XI. But I still hope for another 1-0 win

Gil wrote:Proud to say I called both Di Maria and Falcao. Obviously both great players but massively overrated for one reason or the other.

Falcao was dreadful in Ligue Un and picked up an ACL injury that few fully recover from. Wasn't shocked to see him struggle at all. Can't see United retaining him in the summer when you take into account is astronomic fee & how well both RVP and Rooney are doing.

Di Maria on the other hand was living off 1 dribble which he couldn't even finish off himself. Obviously a great player but his entire career has been marred by inconsistency. Unlike players like Ozil, Hazard, Silva, Fabregas etc although he has a higher level than any of those players bar Hazard his bottom level isn't anywhere near as good as those select players. When Di Maria has a bad game it's not only eyecatchingly noticeable but it even hampers his own team.

Obviously a fantastic player but he's been poor-average since about September apparently that's down to LVG playing him as a winger despite him spending the majority of his career there. Fantastic player but not worth anywhere near £65m, he's a level below Sanchez, Hazard, Bale and Neymar. And if you're playing him in midfield I'd prefer more composure and control there rather than his erratic, direct style. No surprise Madrid improved without him.

Yeah, so now I'm going to be branded a troll/WUM/blinkered for telling you this, but here is how it stands with Falcao;

Medical issues
ACL injuries are horrific;
-Psychologically, many players NEVER return. Underrated, massive risk.
-Risk of major injury within the next 12 months is HUGE.
-Able to start playing again with 6 months, but generally takes 12+ months to recover
-Bioelasticity of the knee is completely shattered, and this removes a player's initial burst of pace, shot power, quick turns and lateral movements (and this can NEVER recover).
-My hunch is that these issues will not be helped by playing in the 'fastest, most intense league in the world'
Couple these with his age and already creaking body and you're looking at a player that would be a shadow of his former glories

Financially
Loan fee is being reported as anywhere between £6m and £12m. Wouldn't be surprised if it was closer to £6m given that it's deadline day, but then again, you guys do love overspending, so that's up in the air. His wages over there are 200k after tax... to produce those wages here, you'd have to pay him something like £20m+ before tax (or 400k+ a week, Rooney is on 300k). When Liverpool were looking at him, the loan fee (12m) and wages package was coming out to £30-35m for one season. I don't know what you've negotiated but that is an outrageous amount of money

Footballing past
-Players in the PL peak in goalscoring terms between ages 24 and 27. I haven't done the study so idk if it's different for elite players. Falcao is 29.
-At his peak, imo, he was the best pure 9 in the world. For Porto and more importantly Atletico he proved that, his goalscoring record was probably only second to Messi and Ronaldo. A 4 goals in 5 games type of striker, unbelievable.
-At Monaco, however, the fans weren't happy with him. I can't claim to know much about Monaco and their season, but I can tell you for sure that the Monaco fans were very frustrated by his performances (something like 10 goals in 20 games, might have included penalties, can't remember).


Will he even get a game?
United already have two international thoroughbred forwards. van Persie and Rooney are proven, and have been scoring goals for fun for years. It seems unlikely that Falcao will displace either of them from the team, given that one has just been made captain, and the other is the golden boy of the Dutch coach. The option might be there to play Rooney as a number 10, but you have Di Maria, Mata, Januzaj all capable of playing there, so at least one is going to be frozen out. It seems likely that Falcao will be coming off the bench. This won't be the worst thing in the world to ease him back into the game after his injury. But do United really want to be paying an obscene amount of money to merely rehabilitate a player (that evidently wants to move to Madrid at the end of the season) and not see his best form?

But when he does play?
United so far have looked massively disjointed going forwards, with there being a clear break up in play between the midfield and the attack (as well as in other areas). Is Falcao going to help that? Not at all. Build up play is the weakest part of his game. Radamel puts the ball into the net, everything else is the concern of his team-mates. Diego Costa served his apprenticeship being the bitch supply man for Falcao. Work rate, pressing, link up play, none of that makes up any part of Radamel's game. Rooney and van Persie are already mighty fine, clinical strikers. Falcao (at his peak, which is certainly not given) would provide a small upgrade on either of them. Does he solve the massive hole between United's midfield and attack? No.

Conclusion
United are getting a player that's possibly a ticking time bomb, with a massively compromised knee, who will probably be sitting on the bench, who does not solve any problems for them, who is already showing signs of massive decline (from a peak as one of the world's best), and want to pay a massive amount of money for him.

tl;dr Falcao will be one of the biggest flops in PL history.

Don't call me James wrote:He's not forgotten, he was injured.

RealGunner wrote:What's this Di Maria nonsense?

He has played 30 minutes in a month and a half. He has been out with an injury. Before that he had 3 goals and 6 assists in 10 apps. Contributed 7 goals in his first 10 matches and he has been found out

srigooner wrote:Gil is just precious. G(i)L won't be the same w/o him

Gil wrote:Proud to say I called both Di Maria and Falcao.

Wor Ayoze wrote:

srigooner wrote:Gil is just precious. G(i)L won't be the same w/o him

Yes it will be way better without him

farfan wrote:this guy called it too

Yeah, so now I'm going to be branded a troll/WUM/blinkered for telling you this, but here is how it stands with Falcao;

Medical issues
ACL injuries are horrific;
-Psychologically, many players NEVER return. Underrated, massive risk.
-Risk of major injury within the next 12 months is HUGE.
-Able to start playing again with 6 months, but generally takes 12+ months to recover
-Bioelasticity of the knee is completely shattered, and this removes a player's initial burst of pace, shot power, quick turns and lateral movements (and this can NEVER recover).
-My hunch is that these issues will not be helped by playing in the 'fastest, most intense league in the world'
Couple these with his age and already creaking body and you're looking at a player that would be a shadow of his former glories

Financially
Loan fee is being reported as anywhere between £6m and £12m. Wouldn't be surprised if it was closer to £6m given that it's deadline day, but then again, you guys do love overspending, so that's up in the air. His wages over there are 200k after tax... to produce those wages here, you'd have to pay him something like £20m+ before tax (or 400k+ a week, Rooney is on 300k). When Liverpool were looking at him, the loan fee (12m) and wages package was coming out to £30-35m for one season. I don't know what you've negotiated but that is an outrageous amount of money

Footballing past
-Players in the PL peak in goalscoring terms between ages 24 and 27. I haven't done the study so idk if it's different for elite players. Falcao is 29.
-At his peak, imo, he was the best pure 9 in the world. For Porto and more importantly Atletico he proved that, his goalscoring record was probably only second to Messi and Ronaldo. A 4 goals in 5 games type of striker, unbelievable.
-At Monaco, however, the fans weren't happy with him. I can't claim to know much about Monaco and their season, but I can tell you for sure that the Monaco fans were very frustrated by his performances (something like 10 goals in 20 games, might have included penalties, can't remember).


Will he even get a game?
United already have two international thoroughbred forwards. van Persie and Rooney are proven, and have been scoring goals for fun for years. It seems unlikely that Falcao will displace either of them from the team, given that one has just been made captain, and the other is the golden boy of the Dutch coach. The option might be there to play Rooney as a number 10, but you have Di Maria, Mata, Januzaj all capable of playing there, so at least one is going to be frozen out. It seems likely that Falcao will be coming off the bench. This won't be the worst thing in the world to ease him back into the game after his injury. But do United really want to be paying an obscene amount of money to merely rehabilitate a player (that evidently wants to move to Madrid at the end of the season) and not see his best form?

But when he does play?
United so far have looked massively disjointed going forwards, with there being a clear break up in play between the midfield and the attack (as well as in other areas). Is Falcao going to help that? Not at all. Build up play is the weakest part of his game. Radamel puts the ball into the net, everything else is the concern of his team-mates. Diego Costa served his apprenticeship being the bitch supply man for Falcao. Work rate, pressing, link up play, none of that makes up any part of Radamel's game. Rooney and van Persie are already mighty fine, clinical strikers. Falcao (at his peak, which is certainly not given) would provide a small upgrade on either of them. Does he solve the massive hole between United's midfield and attack? No.

Conclusion
United are getting a player that's possibly a ticking time bomb, with a massively compromised knee, who will probably be sitting on the bench, who does not solve any problems for them, who is already showing signs of massive decline (from a peak as one of the world's best), and want to pay a massive amount of money for him.

tl;dr Falcao will be one of the biggest flops in PL history.

Build up play is the weakest part of his game. Radamel puts the ball into the net, everything else is the concern of his team-mates.