SCANDAL!

Giggity, Iniesta and Messi are one of the best dribblers in this modern era. If I had to compare with them with anyone in Real Madrid it would be Benzema and Marcelo. What Khaled doesn't show is how many games these played last season.

Did Benzema play the whole season? He didn't play until Higgy got injured and he is only gaining form now.

Marcelo didn't though and Arbeloa had his spot for a while.

Also, does Marcelo get to dribble as much as Iniesta from the backline? Tbh you've better dribblers but I wouldn't say you're miles ahead of us in the dribbling category? I still agree with Real Madrid has more dribblers. I mean besides Messi and Iniesta, who else dribbles? (not counting Sanchez now?)

omarish wrote:

harhar11 wrote:

jibers wrote:I believe we are overstating it a bit. RM are a very direct team so they are bound to get more pens anyways than Barcelona. The only true diver in that team is Scum Maria and it doesnt look like he will be starting for a while. The truth is diving isn't perceived in Spain like it is here, in Spain it is seen as clever. It is a cultural thing tbh. The whole league dives. Statistics is not evidence tbh. We could bring up all the dubious decisions Barca had in the past with the CL, but we are lacking one important thing, DECENT EVIDENCE...

Cristiano ronaldo, marcelo and now kaka is slowly but surely joining the list.

It´s true that real madrid are more direct but barca have the superior dribblers(the only dribbler in RM that is in the same "league" of iniesta,messi and now alexis sanchez is dive maria) and are the team that attacks the most in la liga and I would also belive that because of that, barca is the team that touches the ball the most inside the penalty area. So being the team that touches the ball inside the penalty area plus having superior dribbler should make it easier for barca to win a penalty..

You sure you have ever watched a Madrid game before?

Ever heard of Marcelo? Or Özil? I guess Benzema can't dribble either? And Kaka has also lost his dribbling ability?

Btw, Marcelo is the guy with the highest succesful dribbles. None is close to Messi, and maybe not Iniesta since he is a great dribbler, but if the standard for being a good dribbler is Iniesta and Messi then that standard is too high for almost every footballer out there.

Real Madrid are fine when it comes to dribbling. Our individual talent is sick.

I forgot about marcelo for some reason but ozil isn´t in the same league. Dont get me wrong, he is a good dribbler,but not in same league as the ones I mentioned or marcelo.

And please show me where I said that real madrid didn´t have any good dribblers.

My point was that barca have superior dribblers, specifically messi and iniesta, and dribblers tend to be the players that gets fouled the most. So logically barca should be the team with the most penalty, because of what I explained and because they are the team that touchs the ball the most inside the opponents penalty box..

harhar11 wrote:

omarish wrote:

harhar11 wrote:

jibers wrote:I believe we are overstating it a bit. RM are a very direct team so they are bound to get more pens anyways than Barcelona. The only true diver in that team is Scum Maria and it doesnt look like he will be starting for a while. The truth is diving isn't perceived in Spain like it is here, in Spain it is seen as clever. It is a cultural thing tbh. The whole league dives. Statistics is not evidence tbh. We could bring up all the dubious decisions Barca had in the past with the CL, but we are lacking one important thing, DECENT EVIDENCE...

Cristiano ronaldo, marcelo and now kaka is slowly but surely joining the list.

It´s true that real madrid are more direct but barca have the superior dribblers(the only dribbler in RM that is in the same "league" of iniesta,messi and now alexis sanchez is dive maria) and are the team that attacks the most in la liga and I would also belive that because of that, barca is the team that touches the ball the most inside the penalty area. So being the team that touches the ball inside the penalty area plus having superior dribbler should make it easier for barca to win a penalty..

You sure you have ever watched a Madrid game before?

Ever heard of Marcelo? Or Özil? I guess Benzema can't dribble either? And Kaka has also lost his dribbling ability?

Btw, Marcelo is the guy with the highest succesful dribbles. None is close to Messi, and maybe not Iniesta since he is a great dribbler, but if the standard for being a good dribbler is Iniesta and Messi then that standard is too high for almost every footballer out there.

Real Madrid are fine when it comes to dribbling. Our individual talent is sick.

I forgot about marcelo for some reason but ozil isn´t in the same league. Dont get me wrong, he is a good dribbler,but not in same league as the ones I mentioned or marcelo.

And please show me where I said that real madrid didn´t have any good dribblers.

My point was that barca have superior dribblers, specifically messi and iniesta, and dribblers tend to be the players that gets fouled the most. So logically barca should be the team with the most penalty, because of what I explained and because they are the team that touchs the ball the most inside the opponents penalty box..

Stats atm says Messi is the 56th most fouled player at the moment. Ronaldo is leading and Di Maria is 11th at most fouled. So to me it sounds like Madrid players get fouled more often than Barca....

omarish wrote:Giggity, Iniesta and Messi are one of the best dribblers in this modern era. If I had to compare with them with anyone in Real Madrid it would be Benzema and Marcelo. What Khaled doesn't show is how many games these played last season.

Did Benzema play the whole season? He didn't play until Higgy got injured and he is only gaining form now.

Marcelo didn't though and Arbeloa had his spot for a while.

Also, does Marcelo get to dribble as much as Iniesta from the backline? Tbh you've better dribblers but I wouldn't say you're miles ahead of us in the dribbling category? I still agree with Real Madrid has more dribblers. I mean besides Messi and Iniesta, who else dribbles? (not counting Sanchez now?)

It also doesn´t show how many dribblers they try to make and fail. That´s why I don´t like to use stats..


Who else is a good dribbler in barca? well, villa is pretty decent, xavi is marvelous but he doesn´t use dribbling in the same way as the others(he dribbles to make space for himself so he can make a pass, so you wont see him get past players after players), busquets is also pretty good actually.

harhar11 wrote:

omarish wrote:Giggity, Iniesta and Messi are one of the best dribblers in this modern era. If I had to compare with them with anyone in Real Madrid it would be Benzema and Marcelo. What Khaled doesn't show is how many games these played last season.

Did Benzema play the whole season? He didn't play until Higgy got injured and he is only gaining form now.

Marcelo didn't though and Arbeloa had his spot for a while.

Also, does Marcelo get to dribble as much as Iniesta from the backline? Tbh you've better dribblers but I wouldn't say you're miles ahead of us in the dribbling category? I still agree with Real Madrid has more dribblers. I mean besides Messi and Iniesta, who else dribbles? (not counting Sanchez now?)

It also doesn´t show how many dribblers they try to make and fail. That´s why I don´t like to use stats..


Who else is a good dribbler in barca? well, villa is pretty decent, xavi is marvelous but he doesn´t use dribbling in the same way as the others(he dribbles to make space for himself so he can make a pass, so you wont see him get past players after players), busquets is also pretty good actually.

You will see I agreed with you that Barca has some fantastic dribblers. Plus they have the best dribbler in the world and perhaps history and that's Messi.

Barca > Madrid at dribbling
Madrid > Barca at getting fouls n that shit
Just so you know I watch Barca games, so I'm not pulling stuff out of my ass

omarish wrote:

Stats atm says Messi is the 56th most fouled player at the moment. Ronaldo is leading and Di Maria is 11th at most fouled. So to me it sounds like Madrid players get fouled more often than Barca....

That´s because messi tries to stay on his feet alot more while dive maria and cristiano ronaldo are well known divers who will fall down as if they were shot from the smallest of touches..

For example if we use the fouls stat from last season then you would see that busquets was the most fouled barca player last season and we all know why, don´t we?

omarish wrote:

You will see I agreed with you that Barca has some fantastic dribblers. Plus they have the best dribbler in the world and perhaps history and that's Messi.

Barca > Madrid at dribbling
Madrid > Barca at getting fouls n that shit
Just so you know I watch Barca games, so I'm not pulling stuff out of my ass

Getting the call =/= getting fouled. Busquets and di maria are expert at getting calls in their favour even when they haven´t been touched

Guys let's not read too much into this shall we?
As someone already mentioned it's not like the majority of these calls are wrong.

With the exception of a ronaldo dive and one out of the box penalty the others are legit if memory serves well.

billy_gr wrote:Guys let's not read too much into this shall we?
As someone already mentioned it's not like the majority of these calls are wrong.

With the exception of a ronaldo dive and one out of the box penalty the others are legit if memory serves well.

Well, all of the 3 penalty that real madrid has had this season there has been minimal contact.

Honestly that real madrid gets penalty for every minimal contact inside the penalty area doesn´t bother me that much, after all refs are only humans, but what really gets me is that they keep on with the whole villarato theory..

edit: why did I get neg for this post? I have not insulted anyone

So now Barca do not get the ball inside penalty area as much as RM? I thought we were accused of trying to walk the ball to the goal, and not taking the shots? I guess we suck so much that we cant even get inside a penalty area and are too stupid to realize that and not shoot like CR7 whole the time.

It may be a result of the counter attacking style as Madrid get into the box with defenders hopelessly trying to stop them, hence resulting in many penalty shouts and hence penalties.

omarish wrote:Giggity, Iniesta and Messi are one of the best dribblers in this modern era. If I had to compare with them with anyone in Real Madrid it would be Benzema and Marcelo. What Khaled doesn't show is how many games these played last season.

Did Benzema play the whole season? He didn't play until Higgy got injured and he is only gaining form now.

Marcelo didn't though and Arbeloa had his spot for a while.

Also, does Marcelo get to dribble as much as Iniesta from the backline? Tbh you've better dribblers but I wouldn't say you're miles ahead of us in the dribbling category? I still agree with Real Madrid has more dribblers. I mean besides Messi and Iniesta, who else dribbles? (not counting Sanchez now?)

Omar, this is why i showed average Dribble per match..

`La Liga Stats:
Busquets played 28 matches (including 25 starts), 0.8 dribble per match.
Benzema played 33 matches (including 20 starts), 0.8 dribble per match.


Plus Messi & Iniesta are considered best dribblers nowadays, cuz they can dribble in small spaces, which is much more tough than dribbling in open spaces ( using speed, counter attacks)..

Just for reference sake

Marcelo is by far and away our best dribbler. He led last year in dribbles, dribbles per game and successful dribbles and is doing so again this year.

Marcelo so far this season averages 2 dribbles per game, Di Maria 1.8, the nest highest is way behind with 1 (several players)

You look at Barcelona and you have Messi who averages 4.5 followed by Thiago with 2.3 then you have a huge drop off to 1.3 Maxwell and then another drop off to 1 (several players)

Stats taken from La Liga only btw

If you want to look at fouls drawn for La Liga

Barcelona average 14 fouls won per game and Real Madrid 18.

Which is a considerable difference when your talking such low numbers.

Which is odd to me because Barcelona average 72% possesion with the ball per game which you would think would produce more drawn fouls in comparison to Real Madrid's 62%.

The only thing I can think of is that in playing the ball around so much and keeping it away from the opposition so well that it produces less fouls drawn and in delivering the ball so well and waiting for that better opportunity for that final ball often does bot allow for as many fouls in the box.

Where as if you look at Madrid they will often just go straight for the killer ball regardless of people in the box or opportunity to do so.

This can be seen in the fact that Real Madrid average 22 shots per game (despite our failures at Levante and Racing) compared to Barcelona's 15.
Again a very big difference when talking about such low numbers. As I mentioned we had very few shots at all against Levante and Rcaing as well. So our average was hit hard with that.

I don't think it's a scandal imho. But more a fact of play styles. When Barcelona go for the kill its usually done with such precision that it often doesn't allow for the foul to be made. While Madrid are like a toy poodle having a go at your leg, will give it a go anytime no matter the situation. Which often leads to a crowded box and more opportunities for penalties.

Just my thoughts, all stats taken from La Liga this season.

The Madrid One wrote:

shinigami99 wrote:This is the barca forum, all you madrid fans gtfo....I remembered when ragbirjosh posted in the madrid forum about how badly we dive, not ONE barca fan replied to it(because it's your forum).

Please don't post in this section if u dont have anything constructive to add

thankyou

Omniscient wrote:I can't believe anyone has the gall to be indignated that Messi's dives didn't result in any penalties.

It's like the boy who cried wolf, even Barcelona-biased referees start becoming dubious after the Motta incident, the Pepe incident, etc.

stop trolling please

jiopsi wrote:

Lionel Messi wrote:

jiopsi wrote:LM were you just reduced points? I saw your post were reported, also Omniscent and izzy26, but they didn't get any points from their insults?

Yeah my bar was dropped. I believe Omniscent got his bar dropped as well.

He didn't, nor did izzy.

Then explain how omni got from 100% to 50 in 2 days ?

Crimson wrote:Just for reference sake

Marcelo is by far and away our best dribbler. He led last year in dribbles, dribbles per game and successful dribbles and is doing so again this year.

Marcelo so far this season averages 2 dribbles per game, Di Maria 1.8, the nest highest is way behind with 1 (several players)

You look at Barcelona and you have Messi who averages 4.5 followed by Thiago with 2.3 then you have a huge drop off to 1.3 Maxwell and then another drop off to 1 (several players)

Stats taken from La Liga only btw

If you want to look at fouls drawn for La Liga

Barcelona average 14 fouls won per game and Real Madrid 18.

Which is a considerable difference when your talking such low numbers.

Which is odd to me because Barcelona average 72% possesion with the ball per game which you would think would produce more drawn fouls in comparison to Real Madrid's 62%.

The only thing I can think of is that in playing the ball around so much and keeping it away from the opposition so well that it produces less fouls drawn and in delivering the ball so well and waiting for that better opportunity for that final ball often does bot allow for as many fouls in the box.

Where as if you look at Madrid they will often just go straight for the killer ball regardless of people in the box or opportunity to do so.

This can be seen in the fact that Real Madrid average 22 shots per game (despite our failures at Levante and Racing) compared to Barcelona's 15.
Again a very big difference when talking about such low numbers. As I mentioned we had very few shots at all against Levante and Rcaing as well. So our average was hit hard with that.

I don't think it's a scandal imho. But more a fact of play styles. When Barcelona go for the kill its usually done with such precision that it often doesn't allow for the foul to be made. While Madrid are like a toy poodle having a go at your leg, will give it a go anytime no matter the situation. Which often leads to a crowded box and more opportunities for penalties.

Just my thoughts, all stats taken from La Liga this season.

I see marriage hasnt effected crim's humble and stat using awesomeness.......

Kudos i for one agree, ok the video evidence looks damning but i have said on millions of occasions when defending Barca.....

Ref's are human they will make mistakes but for some reason this is always forgotten and automatically there must be a conspiracy favouring team a over team b.....

Great information Crimson, and the important thing is you actually use stats as evidence for your argument, rather than actually using stats as the argument.

Taking notice I would have guessed that too, Marcelo and Di Maria are quite easily the best dribblers at Madrid, and Messi and Iniesta quite easily the best at Barca. Thiago, also, very impressive.

There's no scandal in my opinion. We're not Mourinho, but then, we are also not all like Khaled lol

Stats mtats counter attack direct play mean nothing. We just saw 3 videos that when barca player fouled he didnt get a penalty, in the same situtation madrid player got penalty. Ok referees can make mistake 1 time 2 times, but 28 vs 8 is a joke

Reason behind it is that Madrid consistently complain about referees and their decisions. Players themselves fall down like they were shot by tank. Sure barcelona also has players who falls down like a dead gazelle but difference is that their divers play in attack barca divers play in cm and defence

I assure you if Pep complained about referees every game and if Busquets played in central striker position for barca then team would get as much penalties as madrid

billionmillion wrote:Stats mtats counter attack direct play mean nothing. We just saw 3 videos that when barca player fouled he didnt get a penalty, in the same situtation madrid player got penalty. Ok referees can make mistake 1 time 2 times, but 28 vs 8 is a joke

Reason behind it is that Madrid consistently complain about referees and their decisions. Players themselves fall down like they were shot by tank. Sure barcelona also has players who falls down like a dead gazelle but difference is that their divers play in attack barca divers play in cm and defence

I assure you if Pep complained about referees every game and if Busquets played in central striker position for barca then team would get as much penalties as madrid

This is the reason. There is no Scandal, but it i like naming the topic like that, as people only remember the calls that go in our favor and forget the ones that go against us (which IMO are far more than in our favor) simply because we win most of the times and don't complain about referees.

BarcaKizz wrote:Great information Crimson, and the important thing is you actually use stats as evidence for your argument, rather than actually using stats as the argument.

Taking notice I would have guessed that too, Marcelo and Di Maria are quite easily the best dribblers at Madrid, and Messi and Iniesta quite easily the best at Barca. Thiago, also, very impressive.

There's no scandal in my opinion. We're not Mourinho, but then, we are also not all like Khaled lol

haha Kizz, i just copied MD's title

i don't believe in conspiracy either.. i posted this topic, to prove that Barca (like all teams) suffer from referee mistakes... its part of football..

billionmillion wrote:Stats mtats counter attack direct play mean nothing. We just saw 3 videos that when barca player fouled he didnt get a penalty, in the same situtation madrid player got penalty. Ok referees can make mistake 1 time 2 times, but 28 vs 8 is a joke

Reason behind it is that Madrid consistently complain about referees and their decisions. Players themselves fall down like they were shot by tank. Sure barcelona also has players who falls down like a dead gazelle but difference is that their divers play in attack barca divers play in cm and defence

I assure you if Pep complained about referees every game and if Busquets played in central striker position for barca then team would get as much penalties as madrid

That is easily the reason why they get the more penalties..

Crimson wrote:Just for reference sake

Marcelo is by far and away our best dribbler. He led last year in dribbles, dribbles per game and successful dribbles and is doing so again this year.

Marcelo so far this season averages 2 dribbles per game, Di Maria 1.8, the nest highest is way behind with 1 (several players)

You look at Barcelona and you have Messi who averages 4.5 followed by Thiago with 2.3 then you have a huge drop off to 1.3 Maxwell and then another drop off to 1 (several players)

Stats taken from La Liga only btw

If you want to look at fouls drawn for La Liga

Barcelona average 14 fouls won per game and Real Madrid 18.

Which is a considerable difference when your talking such low numbers.

Which is odd to me because Barcelona average 72% possesion with the ball per game which you would think would produce more drawn fouls in comparison to Real Madrid's 62%.

The only thing I can think of is that in playing the ball around so much and keeping it away from the opposition so well that it produces less fouls drawn and in delivering the ball so well and waiting for that better opportunity for that final ball often does bot allow for as many fouls in the box.

Where as if you look at Madrid they will often just go straight for the killer ball regardless of people in the box or opportunity to do so.

This can be seen in the fact that Real Madrid average 22 shots per game (despite our failures at Levante and Racing) compared to Barcelona's 15.
Again a very big difference when talking about such low numbers. As I mentioned we had very few shots at all against Levante and Rcaing as well. So our average was hit hard with that.

I don't think it's a scandal imho. But more a fact of play styles. When Barcelona go for the kill its usually done with such precision that it often doesn't allow for the foul to be made. While Madrid are like a toy poodle having a go at your leg, will give it a go anytime no matter the situation. Which often leads to a crowded box and more opportunities for penalties.

Just my thoughts, all stats taken from La Liga this season.

Those stat, as every other stats, can be misleading. For example in the 1-1 draw or in the first leg of the semi-final, real madrid had as many shots as barca but when they showed from where the shots were taken for both teams. Then you would see that almost all the shots taken by real madrid had very little chance of being a goal because they were taken from far away while almost every barca shots were taken by a distance that had a realistic chance of being a goal.

Theres no scandal nor conspiracy lol, but some not so intelligent cules like to make it so.

The xcx wrote:Theres no scandal nor conspiracy lol, but some not so intelligent cules like to make it so.

Perhaps if you actually read the thread you will understand he wasn't trying to say that... in fact its only like 2 posts above yours.