Olivier Giroud

They're two different type of players.

Giroud is better out of the two, but there's nothing to suggest that Giroud can take that extra step to the next tier.

Diego Armando Maradona wrote:At least Carroll is more effective in the air and at using his body to dominate. With Giroud, it's like he fancies himself as an ibra type player, constantly trying to bring out the flicks and fancy passes, constantly failing at them. You can see it watching him play, he has the same misplaced sense of arrogance bendtner has.

This really. One of my main problems with Giroud is that he thinks he is better than the player he is. I don't buy the Carroll comparisons though, apart from the air department the Frenchman beats Carroll in pretty much every other aspect.

If Arsenal dont buy any striker this season, see him score more than 20 goals

Completely different types of players with different roles in their club's set-up.

It's become a cliche, but Carroll is a traditional English #9. Moreover, he's more than just West Ham's goal-scorer. He's the focal point of their attack. He's asked to receive and retain the long balls out of the back, distribute them to a surging winger or Nolan, and then get his 6'3" frame into the box.

Giroud, ont the other hand, has a more traditional poacher role, ala Mario Gomez or Miroslav Klose. Obviously, he does drop deeper to get involved in play more than either of those examples, but that's part and parcel of the way Wenger asks his entire team to play. Attacks do not run through him, and his only real, consistent role is to get on the end of the chances created by Cazorla, Wilshere and Walcott.

Giroud is certainly the silkier player, and he may have a better work ethic. However, I'm not yet convinced that one is "better" than the other. I do think Giroud (should he remain 1st-choice) will have a better statistical return for Arsenal than Carroll will for West Ham. Giroud could score 20-25 goals this season, where I think Carroll will likely be lucky to approach 20 (both in all comps). However, Carroll's role in the side makes him a far more valuable player to West Ham than Giroud's to Arsenal.

donttreadonred wrote: I do think Giroud (should he remain 1st-choice) will have a better statistical return for Arsenal than Carroll will for West Ham. Giroud could score 20-25 goals this season, where I think Carroll will likely be lucky to approach 20 (both in all comps). However, Carroll's role in the side makes him a far more valuable player to West Ham than Giroud's to Arsenal.

Thing is, "squad players" at arsenal always tended to get bloated stats especially if they are a striker. Because our carling cup and fa cup teams usually score a lot of goals in the first rounds, + the champions league group stage matches in dead rubber games or against mediocre opponents. A lot is made of girouds assists for example, fact is 2/3rds of them were in the capital one cup, fa cup, and CL group stage, against teams like Coventry, olympiakos, Swansea, Montpellier ect. Only one assist against a really decent team (Liverpool) all season. Similar strory with his goals, only 2 against decent teams (Liverpool and spurs). Tbf it was exactly the same for us with bendtner and so on. Not so much a knock on him, just pointing out the nature of these stats.

Another Giroud goal today

Ozil is the icing to Giroud's cake

I like Giroud, hes a good typical #9. I think the problem is though when Podolski gets back either Giroud or Walcott are getting droppee in my opinion. Podolskis linkup especially with Ozil now is better than Walcott, he works harder and is more of a goal threat, and he has a better goal and assist ratio than Giroud, and thats not even taking into account Podolski playing on the wing. So overall, about Giroud, I think hes a good player with a good ako7nt of room for improvement still and I think he will. Holding onto his starting spot is an important step though.

You don't drop Giroud during this hot streak, that would be murder to his confidence, and, as shown today, Ozil and Walcott fit like a custom made glove (Feo could have had a hat-trick of goals from a hat-trick of Ozil assists) Podolski will be slotted in somewhere, though, given our track record with injuries

Giroud looks to have improved, and I always say Podolski is overrated. Not sure about Walcott, hes much improved but I just dont think he can lead the line. Arsenal got more options now thats the main thing.

Giroud's flick to Walcott was class and his goal + assist were nicely taken aswell.

Lex wrote:Another Giroud goal today

Ozil is the icing to Giroud's cake

Kinky

Giroud has impressed me so far this season. The main reason for this is his improved conversion rate (22.2%). That's a significant improvement over his 10.3% conversion rate for last season. Granted, 4 games is hardly a legitimate sample size, but it does imply signs of improvement and a good run of form.

This news is probably worst for Goldolski. If Giroud can manage to keep up this form, he is undroppable for Arsenal. Walcott is very unlikely to be benched, and Cazorla is now Arsenal's second most creative player. There's simply nowhere for him to slot into. Cazorla is the obvious choice after being bumped to the left wing, but that would seem very harsh on him. He was one of Arsenal's best players last season and was only moved out of position because Ozil was the biggest name available and Arsenal needed to spend money on someone. Of their front four, Poldolski is the one that deserves to miss out IMO.

He's obviously a good player he's not really the problem though.

Its what is behind him.... for all Arsenal's quality if Giroud went down they would be well and truly f*cked.

If they had another PL level striker i'd make them genuine title challengers but as it is they are relying on Giroud being fit every game.

Can't see it tbh.

Once Podolski is healthy and fit again, he'll get a few 60th minute substitutions to show his worth, at which point his obviously awesome chemistry with Özil will become obvious, he'll have a tap-in or two thanks to his understanding with Özil, score his once-every-five-games screamer, and maybe set Giroud or Özil up with a nice cross, and he's back in the mix. Plus, Arsenal don't just play in the PL, they got a busy enough schedule to give minutes to all of Walcott, Carzola, Giroud and Podolski.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:He's obviously a good player he's not really the problem though.

Its what is behind him.... for all Arsenal's quality if Giroud went down they would be well and truly f*cked.

If they had another PL level striker i'd make them genuine title challengers but as it is they are relying on Giroud being fit every game.

Can't see it tbh.

Agreed. This point is precisely why I (and countless others) have criticized the Ozil signing. It's not a slight against the German. It's a criticism of Arsenal's priorities in the window (i.e. name over function).

Then again... Despite his somewhat neutered performances at ST last season, I think Poldolski could actually be a decent alternative at CF for Arsenal, especially in a substitute role when Giroud is simply ineffectual. He provides a much different presence up top than the Frenchman, and could actually open more space for Walcott and Ozil with his movement. Where Giroud can be counted on to patrol the 18-yard box, Poldolski will drift wide to receive the ball and run at defenders. It's a very different approach, but one that could serve Arsenal well in certain situations.

That said, playing Poldolski at striker doesn't turn Arsenal in title contenders. In fact, it barely keeps them in the running for top-four. They do still need another legitimate striker. (Sanogo simply has not looked ready despite his immense potential.)

I still say they needed Ozil.

For all Arsenal's technical players and nice passers they lack genuine creativity.

Cazorla needed help, in a similar vein to how all you Liverpool fans were clamouring for Coutinho to get some creative help

Ozil provides that and the missing piece in the midfield jigsaw, which has been sorely missing since Fabregas left.

They need a striker too that is obvious but it shouldn't hide the fact that Ozil signing was indeed a necessity.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:I still say they needed Ozil.

For all Arsenal's technical players and nice passers they lack genuine creativity.

Cazorla needed help, in a similar vein to how all you Liverpool fans were clamouring for Coutinho to get some creative help

Ozil provides that and the missing piece in the midfield jigsaw, which has been sorely missing since Fabregas left.

They need a striker too that is obvious but it shouldn't hide the fact that Ozil signing was indeed a necessity.

non-arsenal fan who knows arsenal

Bigger issue is that Arsenal cannot survive defensively with Walcott, Ozil and a CF.  You're only defending with 7 and that's not proper shape.  If it becomes Cazorla, Walcott, Ozil and CF, it's going to be terrible.

As we saw yday, Giroud was being the 9 and then also had to do the job for Walcott/Ozil defensively in the second half because the floodgates were opening and those guys were standing around.  

In the end, one of Ozil or Walcott is going to have to sit when Cazorla comes back.  I have a feeling Walcott becomes the backup CF.

VivaStPauli wrote:Once Podolski is healthy and fit again, he'll get a few 60th minute substitutions to show his worth, at which point his obviously awesome chemistry with Özil will become obvious, he'll have a tap-in or two thanks to his understanding with Özil, score his once-every-five-games screamer, and maybe set Giroud or Özil up with a nice cross, and he's back in the mix. Plus, Arsenal don't just play in the PL, they got a busy enough schedule to give minutes to all of Walcott, Carzola, Giroud and Podolski.

Honestly Podolski would do that even if Ozil wasn't at Arsenal. I get the point you're trying to make about his chemistry with Ozil though.


Having several good players competing for starting spots is a problem we've been wanting to have for a while as well. We also have multiple competitions so players will get their chances

You can't play a line with 3 strikers though (except if you're Madrid and you think it's miraculously going to work out lol)... that's what Podolski, Walcott and Giroud would be.  So i don't see that being used very often at all.  And there's no way Podolski ever benched Giroud unless Giroud flops badly...  Arsenal need that presence both on the offense and defense + he's really producing.

I think Podolski is the rotation guy, unfortunately for him.  Every squad needs a striker on the bench and he's the only one other than the starters.

Giru, Ozil, Walcott and Santi cant defend going backwards collectively, its too weak. But what they can do, is defend going forward. Pressing.

Arsenal have always defended much better pressing, but they never sustain it over any period of time. Even in the period of 1 game they arent consistent with it, let alone months and years.

Then again, I think with Mertersacker being so important, he brings the rest of the line back with him and therefore the entire team. And it makes sense, high line with Mert isnt smart unless your well drilled and Arsenal just havent been.

So yeah, I see the issue there.

No DM too Dani... Ramsey is the best defensively of all the mids right now. Wilshere-Ramsey is very light in terms of physical presence.

Great on Arsenal for getting Ozil. But there holes remain the same.

Agree, said so in the Ramsey thread too.

I want to see more and more, vs better teams, but I think it will continue to be a problem.

I already seen Wilshere asked to be that guy for England, its doesnt work, Eriksen run them/him ragged in the Denmark game like 1-2 years ago, when Wilshere was actually fit, let alone now.

sportsczy wrote:No DM too Dani...  Ramsey is the best defensively of all the mids right now.  Wilshere-Ramsey is very light in terms of physical presence.

Great on Arsenal for getting Ozil.  But there holes remain the same.

I don't think physical presence is the problem.... Arsenal's midfield bossed Spurs midfield which is full of physical freaks.

The problem is tactical sense and making sure the gaps between midfield and defence are as small as possible, i think its something that can be coached into them but its true its not there yet.

Not sure any DM would fix that, without compromising something.

will be topscorer this season

sportsczy wrote:No DM too Dani...  Ramsey is the best defensively of all the mids right now.  Wilshere-Ramsey is very light in terms of physical presence.

Great on Arsenal for getting Ozil.  But there holes remain the same.

Wow and you were saying this to me not so long ago in the Oezil thread.

S wrote:This looks more of a signing to appease the fans for me.He'll drastically improve the team for sure but Arsenal should have planned better in the market and prioritized areas which needed strengthening.

Inb4 people say i dont watch Arsenal,they're going to experience defensive problems again especially in the Champions League.

S wrote:

sportsczy wrote:ummmm.... no.  They were playing Podolski on the left who barely defends (has bad work rate).  Ozil is no worse.  What this does is put Ozil behind Giroud as a 10, Cazorla can play on the left where he's played very well and Walcott can stay right.

It has zero effect on them defensively and improves the attack dramatically.

They dont have a high quality DM.That should've been the priority.

sportsczy wrote:Arsenal hasn't played a DM in a long, long time (years). They play with 2 CMs that have ball recovery skills (2 of Ramsey, Arteta, Wilshere and Flamini).

The defense has been very solid recently as they conceded the least goals in EPL in the 2nd half of last year and have been good defensively this year too.

Their defensive issues was mainly very poor CB play in the past... Silvestre, Squilacci, Djourou and Vermaelen. With Per/Koscielny, that's taken care of.

The biggest area of need to me was to upgrade the keeper. That's where Arsenal is weak atm.

Seems like you just wanted to disagree with me for the sake of it