Is it all about result?

Robespierre wrote:I am glad ONLY when my team wins . I am NEVER glad if my team loses. If my team loses after having played well I can't consolate myself  , probably I can be even angrier ( nay, frustrated ) than before, because everything was useless.
Results >>> everything surely
I think it is a normal thing, probably it's not a case the only ones to have this doubt is who supports team who win basically every match , so they haven't a idea what it means to suffer for  shit leagues played by own club.

I agree. For me it goes like this:

Winning with style > Winning but awful football > Losing but playing well > Losing and playing terrible football

aka

Barcelona 10/11 > Inter 09/11 > Arsenal 07/08 > Chelsea 14/15

jibers wrote:

Robespierre wrote:I am glad ONLY when my team wins . I am NEVER glad if my team loses. If my team loses after having played well I can't consolate myself  , probably I can be even angrier ( nay, frustrated ) than before, because everything was useless.
Results >>> everything surely
I think it is a normal thing, probably it's not a case the only ones to have this doubt is who supports team who win basically every match , so they haven't a idea what it means to suffer for  shit leagues played by own club.

I agree. For me it goes like this:

Winning with style > Winning but awful football > Losing but playing well > Losing and playing terrible football

aka

Barcelona 10/11 > Inter 09/11 > Arsenal 07/08 > Chelsea 14/15

Pretty much this.. Every other thing is just toughtless hipsterism.. Some even going as far as saying they prefer to loose as long as their team played "fantastic football", like really? lolworthy stuff right there..

Just watch these poses reigning abuses on their clubs after loosing or drawing one game even if they had 90% possession & hit the bar 7 times in that game..

U can only afford the luxury of talking/discussing bout how beautifully u played when you win.. Or is this suppose to be some troll thread?

Winning first and above all..

Mourinho's Inter is one of the best teams in the last decade for sure.

It's a false dichotomy. Football (sports in general) is one of the purest meritocracies in the world. You can't win without playing well. Exceptions like Chelsea 12 and Greece 04 are just that, exceptions.

Luck will always be a factor, but only sporadically and in individual games. In winning season-long trophies, merit is the most important factor.

jibers wrote:For me it goes like this:

Winning with style > Winning but awful football > Losing but playing well > Losing and playing terrible football

aka

Barcelona 10/11 > Inter 09/11 > Arsenal 07/08 > Chelsea 14/15

El Messico wrote:It's a false dichotomy. Football (sports in general) is one of the purest meritocracies in the world. You can't win without playing well. Exceptions like Chelsea 12 and Greece 04 are just that, exceptions.

Luck will always be a factor, but only sporadically and in individual games. In winning season-long trophies, merit is the most important factor.

http://www.goallegacy.net/t34630-style-vs-results

Hapless_Hans wrote:

guest_07 wrote:my rank for this issue

tier 1:
team with result + style (beauty) = brazil, real, barca

tier 2:
team with result = greece, chelsea

tier 3:
team with style (beauty) = arsenal, dortmund

Dortmund won back to back leagues, one cup added, with a squad bought for an apple and an egg, and reached a CL final, finishing 2nd in the league, after. How are they not getting results?

And they won it BECAUSE of their style, not just on top of it.
This style vs. results thing is a flawed dichotomy.

Arsenal are consistent BECAUSE of their style, too, not despite it. If they one day manage to win something again, it will be because they will have managed to IMPROVE their style in order to do it.

Also this:

Hapless_Hans wrote:the way I see it, if you get worse results than you could get, your style is flawed.

When we lost against Chelsea in 2012 I didn't really feel like: "But hey, at least we created 30 chances, made 700 more passes and raped them in every single footballing aspect except the result. Feels great man."

So result > style.

In general style > results for me.
I watch football for entertainment and nothing could be worse than getting bored watching it. It happened quite often watching my team over the last years and for me it's worse than losing.
Hasn't changed so far and btw there are tons of fans at Ajax who think the same.
We're top of the table and people want the manager gone. Sure the results in the CL and EL are one reason, but the major problem is the horrible (boring) football.
Nothing worse than winning a game and not even caring about it because you're just happy that it's over.

However the main problem is the fact that it's boring. A team can play defensive and the game can still be intense.
And sometimes I take results over style. Like when we play Rotterdam.

If it's a competitive sport then you should play to win simple as that.

Sure you'd like to win in style, but a wins a win

Playing with a shit style doesn't guarantee victory, neither does playing good football.

So general consensus is that there should be Church of St. Mourinho

Yohan Modric wrote:Playing with a shit style doesn't guarantee victory, neither does playing good football.

I wonder what does then

futbol wrote:When we lost against Chelsea in 2012 I didn't really feel like: "But hey, at least we created 30 chances, made 700 more passes and raped them in every single footballing aspect except the result. Feels great man."

So result > style.

So what you are saying is that you believe that if Barca had played atrocious stuff, not creating chances and not passing, they'd have won the game?

It's nonsense. Barca's style has made them win 4 CLs in 10 years, just because they lost a game now and then doesn't change that it's the style that brought results.

Hapless_Hans wrote:

futbol wrote:When we lost against Chelsea in 2012 I didn't really feel like: "But hey, at least we created 30 chances, made 700 more passes and raped them in every single footballing aspect except the result. Feels great man."

So result > style.

So what you are saying is that you believe that if Barca had played atrocious stuff, not creating chances and not passing, they'd have won the game?

It's nonsense. Barca's style has made them win 4 CLs in 10 years, just because they lost a game now and then doesn't change that it's the style that brought results.

Huh? Where did I say that? "We've lost despite playing well" does in no shape or form logically imply: "We would have won if we played badly." You're logic's broken, pls reboot your brain.

Pirloisjesus wrote:

Yohan Modric wrote:Playing with a shit style doesn't guarantee victory, neither does playing good football.

I wonder what does then

Nothing.

Teams just need to stay consistent with whatever approach they take. There's no right or wrong way to play.

I think debate isn't about style vs result its about playing well vs result. Style can be anything for example parking bus is style catenaccio is also style.

futbol wrote:

Hapless_Hans wrote:

futbol wrote:When we lost against Chelsea in 2012 I didn't really feel like: "But hey, at least we created 30 chances, made 700 more passes and raped them in every single footballing aspect except the result. Feels great man."

So result > style.

So what you are saying is that you believe that if Barca had played atrocious stuff, not creating chances and not passing, they'd have won the game?

It's nonsense. Barca's style has made them win 4 CLs in 10 years, just because they lost a game now and then doesn't change that it's the style that brought results.

Huh? Where did I say that? "We've lost despite playing well" does in no shape or form logically imply: "We would have won if we played badly." You're logic's broken, pls reboot your brain.

If you didn't say that, then why do you conclude it with 'result > style' ?
So all your saying is "good result > bad result"?
With that I agree

Hapless_Hans wrote:If only Mole would apply this wisdom to his own "All players are overrated especially so if they haven't impressed me in a CL semi yet" attitude

Never said that though, just that to me it's the only level of football nowadays that i deem very high and thus if you prove it there then your status as an elite player is undeniable.

Hapless_Hans wrote:

futbol wrote:

Hapless_Hans wrote:


So what you are saying is that you believe that if Barca had played atrocious stuff, not creating chances and not passing, they'd have won the game?

It's nonsense. Barca's style has made them win 4 CLs in 10 years, just because they lost a game now and then doesn't change that it's the style that brought results.

Huh? Where did I say that? "We've lost despite playing well" does in no shape or form logically imply: "We would have won if we played badly." You're logic's broken, pls reboot your brain.

If you didn't say that, then why do you conclude it with 'result > style' ?
So all your saying is "good result > bad result"?
With that I agree

I don't understand your problem. Because the OP asked whether results matter more than playing well.

Situation A: Barca vs. Chelsea 2012: Played well, you can't dominate a team any more actually. But result was shit. So here we have a situation where: style superb, result shit.

Situation B: Barca vs. Real Madrid 2014/2015: Didn't play that well but got the result (championship decider): style not so good (hoofball to Suarez ended up deciding the game), result superb.

Guess which Barca fans enjoyed more. Superb style with shit result or not so great style but getting the result. Hence: Result > style.

Again: What's your problem?

Barca fan in talking about whether results matter

You win every week ffs, how would you know.... guess what? you wouldn't.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Barca fan in talking about whether results matter

You win every week ffs, how would you know.... guess what? you wouldn't.

If we won every week we'd win sextuples every single season. So that's a false statement obviously.

Obviously Barca wins a lot, more than most teams. That doesn't make Barca fans incapable to differentiate between style and results.

Until you experience bad times which you never have and never will yes it does.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Until you experience bad times which you never have and never will yes it does.

"Bad times" is relative. Just 1 1/2 seasons ago we were getting schooled by Atletico in 2 different competitions and lost a Cup final against our arch rivals while having to endure Neymar playing on the right wing so Fabregas could be shoehorned into the team.

Of course that's still luxury problems compared to a Newcastle fans' suffering but are we really going down this route now? We're getting into "you shouldn't be complaining for not getting a pay rise in 1st world countries as long as people in Africa are starving" territory then.

futbol wrote:
I don't understand your problem. Because the OP asked whether results matter more than playing well.

Situation A: Barca vs. Chelsea 2012: Played well, you can't dominate a team any more actually. But result was shit. So here we have a situation where: style superb, result shit.

Situation B: Barca vs. Real Madrid 2014/2015: Didn't play that well but got the result (championship decider): style not so good (hoofball to Suarez ended up deciding the game), result superb.

Guess which Barca fans enjoyed more. Superb style with shit result or not so great style but getting the result. Hence: Result > style.

Again: What's your problem?

My problem is not with you prefering a scrappy win over a defeat including some eyepleasing combinations.
I would too, of course. So yes, results matter most.

The OP asked whether results are 'all that matter', I just think this is setting the discussion up the wrong way.

A result is a result as it 'results' from things that happened before and determine it.
95% of the time these things are 'playing well', 'good football', whatever you want to call it. Or at least, playing better than the opponent.

So the whole discussion is misguided if it pins 'style vs results'. Which was the part of your post I objected to insofar as I understood it as being part of this misguided discussion.

Then I don't really understand what the question is.

Here is the OP:

Pirloisjesus wrote:Came across this wonderful article
http://www.espnfc.com/blog/marcotti-musings/62/post/2708448/why-playing-well-matter-more-than-results

Whats ur take on this? Do results matter more than playing well?

The OP is literally asking: "Do results matter more than playing well?"

To which the answer is yes. No question.

It's the wrong question. Good results come from playing well. Generally.