England National Team Watch

Carroll doesn't even play as targeteman in his club...He plays off of Suarez ....some people don't even watch players play, but judge them based on their size, facial hair, and their WAGs.

Sepi wrote:Carroll doesn't even play as targeteman in his club...He plays off of Suarez ....some people don't even watch players play, but judge them based on their size, facial hair, and their WAGs.

That doesn't mean Capello won't play him target man for Country...

Sepi wrote:Carroll doesn't even play as targeteman in his club...He plays off of Suarez ....some people don't even watch players play, but judge them based on their size, facial hair, and their WAGs.

So is Capello going to play hiom as a SS ?

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/gamecast?id=318076&cc=5901

See how deep he plays. YES, Behind Adam, and almost as high up the pitch as Right Back, Martin Kelly.

Targetman my arse

I know he didn't play as a target man but it is about what Capello will do.

Magricos wrote:

Sepi wrote:Carroll doesn't even play as targeteman in his club...He plays off of Suarez ....some people don't even watch players play, but judge them based on their size, facial hair, and their WAGs.

So is Capello going to play hiom as a SS ?

I am not aware of Capello's intentions to be honest.

Carroll has started 2 games for England under Capello in both games he played as pure +9. Against France, he was England's MOTM and he scored against Ghana.

I believe this is where he will e ventually end up, but Kenny is playing him deeper now, to develop his ball playing skills and make him a better all-rounded player, even if it means his goal limit at the moment will be limited, it'll make him a better player long-term.

I think in England set up, for now, he is a plan B off the bench.

Weirdest thing about Sturridge not being called up is he's by far the most versatile player England have.

He can play RW,LW, #10 & 9. basically all the forward positions no other England player can do that.

He's also the most in form striker in the country after Rooney & Aguero. 11 goals in his last 15 PL app. Only those two can better that.

BeautifulGame wrote:

Devil-Is-Red wrote:sepi, the difference is, those young players have quickly settled to the pressure of playing for a big club and have performed very well this season.

Carroll is just Peter Crouch with a pony tail. Plus he cost 35 mill just so he can win the ball in the air.

Jones is just another Titus Bramble ofcourse minus the sexual assualt cases

Then how comes Kenny Dalglish wanted to sign him so badly then?

The reason why United have been a bit suspect at the back this season is many reasons like a) the fact we haven't had a settled defensive line-up b) we're missing our captain Vidic, his organizational skills & the confidence he exudes to the backline are so important c) not enough defensive cover from our midfield.

But yeah, go ahead and blame our young defender who's reading of the game, timing of tackles, technique and confidence for such a young lad has been brilliant.

All this just because your butthurt I don't rate Carroll. Sensitive much?

Gil wrote:Weirdest thing about Sturridge not being called up is he's by far the most versatile player England have.

He can play RW,LW, #10 & 9. basically all the forward positions no other England player can do that.

He's also the most in form striker in the country after Rooney & Aguero. 11 goals in his last 15 PL app. Only those two can better that.

Welbeck has 5 in 8 matches.

Carroll is being called up specifically to allow Rooney to play in a more free role behind a target man, as he likes to do. I fail to see how Sturridge could occupy the same role as effectively as Carroll or why United fans are complaining about such a selection that favours their star...

Devil-Is-Red wrote:

Gil wrote:Weirdest thing about Sturridge not being called up is he's by far the most versatile player England have.

He can play RW,LW, #10 & 9. basically all the forward positions no other England player can do that.

He's also the most in form striker in the country after Rooney & Aguero. 11 goals in his last 15 PL app. Only those two can better that.

Welbeck has 5 in 8 matches.

Ba has 4 in 4

BeautifulGame wrote:

B-Mac MUFC wrote:

Sepi wrote:Take Jones for example. At fault for crouchs goal, at fault for Freis goal, shaky va Norwich and he still gets praise for those performances, While Carroll scores a winning derby goal, saves a 100% goal by beating Cahill in the air, and has 2 fantastic headers saved and cleared off the line... Yet gets abuse for not doing step-overs

Jones is 19, Carroll is 22 is the difference.... still learning and plays beyond his years in one of the best teams in Europe, mistakes will happen a long the way, still about 3-4 years away from his "prime years" and plays the way he does

The only thing Jones did by playing beyond years is making sure United defence which looked the best in Europe look vulnerable.

They already conceded more goals in one game against this year than they did in whole group stage last year.Just because he tries to become a Beckenbaur doesnt mask how poor he defended whenever opposition attacked United this season

if you haven't noticed United are in the midst of a style of play change, we play much higher and much more pressing then we ever have....we have been a counter attack team for years, we are now trying to become a possession pressing team....these are growing pains, and getting the personnel to adapt to the new style, players who traditionally lay deeper (carrick, fletcher) are now asked to play higher and do a lot more work in the oppositions end...just wait till a technically superior player like Cleverley get's back and we retain the ball better.....right now we give the ball away to much in the midfield and we hang the defense to dry, it will take time. defense is taking a lot of the heat for the shots and chances, but really its the midfield not taking care of the ball.

Gil wrote:

BeautifulGame wrote:

B-Mac MUFC wrote:

Sepi wrote:Take Jones for example. At fault for crouchs goal, at fault for Freis goal, shaky va Norwich and he still gets praise for those performances, While Carroll scores a winning derby goal, saves a 100% goal by beating Cahill in the air, and has 2 fantastic headers saved and cleared off the line... Yet gets abuse for not doing step-overs

Jones is 19, Carroll is 22 is the difference.... still learning and plays beyond his years in one of the best teams in Europe, mistakes will happen a long the way, still about 3-4 years away from his "prime years" and plays the way he does

The only thing Jones did by playing beyond years is making sure United defence which looked the best in Europe look vulnerable.

They already conceded more goals in one game against this year than they did in whole group stage last year.Just because he tries to become a Beckenbaur doesnt mask how poor he defended whenever opposition attacked United this season

Glad I'm not the only one who noticed this. Phil Jones will be an immense defender in the future and is very very good on the ball but his defending is extremely overrated. His positioning is beyond awful and it's been exposed by the likes of Norwich, Chelsea, Basel etc in recent weeks. His recovery pace is excellent though and teams haven't been taking their chances against United so he's still the media darling for now.

I honestly think Suarez will eat him for breakfast when United go to Anfield in a few weeks time.

Vidic will be back when we play liverpool, it will be Ferdinand and Vidic, so there will be no breakfast for Suarez, Vidic will be the one eating the breakfast

B-Mac MUFC wrote:
Vidic will be back when we play liverpool, it will be Ferdinand and Vidic, so there will be no breakfast for Suarez, Vidic will be the one eating the breakfast

So you think Fergie's masterplan will be to put to large, aerially strong but very slow CBs up against a player who's biggest strength is his movement? Brilliant!

I'm simply growing impatient with the utter apathy towards a players circumstances that he faces and how it is compared with others.

Why cannot people see that Sturridge and Carroll are actually 2 completely different players? Why cannot they see the difference in the circumstance, conditions, situation instead of ultimate criticism towards on another?

People here simply do not know enough about what Carroll's ability is here aside from Newcastle and Liverpool fans, simply because they have not seen him play enough like we have. There is so much periphery and ignorance in judgment between both sets as most tend to wear a certain google in which their opinion is not flexible enough to change their view.

Not everything is black and white, not everything is ultimate. Football viewers these days are so quick to base their judgment solely based on their limited view and observation on a certain individual, manager or a team and never really calculate the circumstance and incidence behind it.

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
Then how comes Kenny Dalglish wanted to sign him so badly then?

Isnt Kenny Dalglish the same manager who bought Carroll for 35 mil? Then why refer to his judgement someone who spent 35million a Peter crouch with pony tail?

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
The reason why United have been a bit suspect at the back this season is many reasons like a) the fact we haven't had a settled defensive line-up b) we're missing our captain Vidic, his organizational skills & the confidence he exudes to the backline are so important c) not enough defensive cover from our midfield.

Oh yep Carroll has similar reasons too. a) We havent had a settled attacking line up since Carroll was injured most of the time. b) We too are missing our Captain who is best creative player to supply to our forwards c) Not enough chances created yet because the team hasnt gelled yet

Yet these reasons didnt stop Carroll being another Peter crouch so why would those excuses stop of Jones being another Titus Bramble.Dont u know we should judge players only in black and white.

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
But yeah, go ahead and blame our young defender who's reading of the game, timing of tackles, technique and confidence for such a young lad has been brilliant.

Such a brilliant positioning then where was he when Basel scored their second on counter attack? Or what was he exactly doing playing stupid passes inside penalty boxes that lead to equalizer for someone with such great reading of the game?

When a young forward who already scored winners against Arsenal City Liverpool Everton and Sunderland ( two huge derbies ) despite not even completing a full PL season yet can be just another Crouch with Pony tail then i dont see why an young defender who makes silly mistakes like Jones cant be another Bramble.

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
All this just because your butthurt I don't rate Carroll. Sensitive much?

Yep someone is butthurt in this argument and that certainly isnt me

I love beautifulgame.

He's officially taken the role of Javierredondo

BeautifulGame wrote:

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
Then how comes Kenny Dalglish wanted to sign him so badly then?

Isnt Kenny Dalglish the same manager who bought Carroll for 35 mil? Then why refer to his judgement then who spent 35million a Peter crouch with pony tail?

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
The reason why United have been a bit suspect at the back this season is many reasons like a) the fact we haven't had a settled defensive line-up b) we're missing our captain Vidic, his organizational skills & the confidence he exudes to the backline are so important c) not enough defensive cover from our midfield.

Oh yep Carroll has similar reasons too. a) We havent had a settled attacking line up since Carroll was injured most of the time. b) We too are missing our Captain who is best creative player to supply to our forwards c) Not enough chances created yet because the team hasnt gelled yet

Yet these reasons stop Carroll being another Peter crouch so why would those excuses of Jones being another Titus Bramble.Dont u know we should judge players only in black and white.

I do agree, judge Carroll on his Newcastle form

BeautifulGame wrote:

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
Then how comes Kenny Dalglish wanted to sign him so badly then?

Isnt Kenny Dalglish the same manager who bought Carroll for 35 mil? Then why refer to his judgement then who spent 35million a Peter crouch with pony tail?

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
The reason why United have been a bit suspect at the back this season is many reasons like a) the fact we haven't had a settled defensive line-up b) we're missing our captain Vidic, his organizational skills & the confidence he exudes to the backline are so important c) not enough defensive cover from our midfield.

Oh yep Carroll has similar reasons too. a) We havent had a settled attacking line up since Carroll was injured most of the time. b) We too are missing our Captain who is best creative player to supply to our forwards c) Not enough chances created yet because the team hasnt gelled yet

Yet these reasons stop Carroll being another Peter crouch so why would those excuses of Jones being another Titus Bramble.Dont u know we should judge players only in black and white.

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
But yeah, go ahead and blame our young defender who's reading of the game, timing of tackles, technique and confidence for such a young lad has been brilliant.

Such a brilliant positioning then where was he when Basel scored their second on counter attack? Or what was he exactly doing playing stupid passes inside penalty boxes that lead to equalizer for someone with such great reading of the game?

When a young forward who already scored winners against Arsenal City Liverpool Everton and Sunderland ( two huge derbies ) despite not even completing a full PL season yet can be just another Crouch with Pony tail then i dont see why an young defender who makes silly mistakes like Jones can be another Bramble.

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
All this just because your butthurt I don't rate Carroll. Sensitive much?

Yep someone is butthurt in this argument and that certainly isnt me

He was covering for evra, who has been prone to forget he is a defender these days, that's why he was so far up the field. Vidic usually covers for Evra as well, there is nothing wrong with it and I blame Evra for that and Rio for mistiming the flight of the ball. For the second goal was a bit of naivity from Jones, but he did well to read the ball and intercept the pass. with experience, he will learn to boot the ball instead of passing it out of danger.

one prime example of how well Jones plays is the timing of a tackle he did against Norwich at the weekend. 2 Norwich attackers doubled up on Jones and one had a golden opportunity to square the ball to his team mate for a simple tap in, but Jones timed his tackle to perfection instead of rushing in and managed to get the ball.

Tell me now honestly, what does Carroll offer? he resorts LFC into playing the long ball game all the time. He is limited techically and the only thing he offers is strentgh and the ability to bring down the ball and bring in other plays into the attack.

1 goal in 7 games so far for LFC, what has he done to earn an England call up over someone like Sturridge?

RedOranje wrote:

B-Mac MUFC wrote:
Vidic will be back when we play liverpool, it will be Ferdinand and Vidic, so there will be no breakfast for Suarez, Vidic will be the one eating the breakfast

So you think Fergie's masterplan will be to put to large, aerially strong but very slow CBs up against a player who's biggest strength is his movement? Brilliant!

there is a reason Vidic is regarded as the best CB in the world....surely little old Suarez isn't the toughest opponent he's came up against

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
He was covering for evra, who has been prone to forget he is a defender these days, that's why he was so far up the field. Vidic usually covers for Evra as well, there is nothing wrong with it and I blame Evra for that and Rio for mistiming the flight of the ball. For the second goal was a bit of naivity from Jones, but he did well to read the ball and intercept the pass. with experience, he will learn to boot the ball instead of passing it out of danger.

one prime example of how well Jones plays is the timing of a tackle he did against Norwich at the weekend. 2 Norwich attackers doubled up on Jones and one had a golden opportunity to square the ball to his team mate for a simple tap in, but Jones timed his tackle to perfection instead of rushing in and managed to get the ball.

Tell me now honestly, what does Carroll offer? he resorts LFC into playing the long ball game all the time. He is limited techically and the only thing he offers is strentgh and the ability to bring down the ball and bring in other plays into the attack.

1 goal in 7 games so far for LFC, what has he done to earn an England call up over someone like Sturridge?

LMAO.SO a CB is in midfield covering for a LB? So if he was covering for Evra then why didnt he stop the cross coming in the first place itself considering the cross was delivered from the exact left back position which he is supposedly covering?

So whats ur ridiculous excuse for Jones stupidity of making silly passes inside the penalty boxes which lead to penalty?

So if he is a technically limited and only strength is bringing down long balls how does he play as a SS behind Suarez linking attack and Midfield?Care to explain?Why u embrass yourself by commenting on Carroll's abilities and impact on Liverpool when u havent even watched him play?

BeautifulGame wrote:

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
He was covering for evra, who has been prone to forget he is a defender these days, that's why he was so far up the field. Vidic usually covers for Evra as well, there is nothing wrong with it and I blame Evra for that and Rio for mistiming the flight of the ball. For the second goal was a bit of naivity from Jones, but he did well to read the ball and intercept the pass. with experience, he will learn to boot the ball instead of passing it out of danger.

one prime example of how well Jones plays is the timing of a tackle he did against Norwich at the weekend. 2 Norwich attackers doubled up on Jones and one had a golden opportunity to square the ball to his team mate for a simple tap in, but Jones timed his tackle to perfection instead of rushing in and managed to get the ball.

Tell me now honestly, what does Carroll offer? he resorts LFC into playing the long ball game all the time. He is limited techically and the only thing he offers is strentgh and the ability to bring down the ball and bring in other plays into the attack.

1 goal in 7 games so far for LFC, what has he done to earn an England call up over someone like Sturridge?

LMAO.SO a CB is in midfield covering for a LB? So if he was covering for Evra then why didnt he stop the cross coming in the first place itself considering the cross was delivered from the exact left back position which he is supposedly covering?

So whats ur ridiculous excuse for Jones stupidity of making silly passes inside the penalty boxes which lead to penalty?

So if he is a technically limited and only strength is bringing down long balls how does he play as a SS behind Suarez linking attack and Midfield?Care to explain?Why u embrass yourself by commenting on Carroll's abilities and impact on Liverpool when u havent even watched him play?

What is he supposed to do if he see's the spot vacant? let the player go down the flank and cross the ball? Jones' stupidity was his inexperience..something that every player goes through.

Carroll is now a ss? lol great tactics lol.

Devil-Is-Red wrote:

BeautifulGame wrote:

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
He was covering for evra, who has been prone to forget he is a defender these days, that's why he was so far up the field. Vidic usually covers for Evra as well, there is nothing wrong with it and I blame Evra for that and Rio for mistiming the flight of the ball. For the second goal was a bit of naivity from Jones, but he did well to read the ball and intercept the pass. with experience, he will learn to boot the ball instead of passing it out of danger.

one prime example of how well Jones plays is the timing of a tackle he did against Norwich at the weekend. 2 Norwich attackers doubled up on Jones and one had a golden opportunity to square the ball to his team mate for a simple tap in, but Jones timed his tackle to perfection instead of rushing in and managed to get the ball.

Tell me now honestly, what does Carroll offer? he resorts LFC into playing the long ball game all the time. He is limited techically and the only thing he offers is strentgh and the ability to bring down the ball and bring in other plays into the attack.

1 goal in 7 games so far for LFC, what has he done to earn an England call up over someone like Sturridge?

LMAO.SO a CB is in midfield covering for a LB? So if he was covering for Evra then why didnt he stop the cross coming in the first place itself considering the cross was delivered from the exact left back position which he is supposedly covering?

So whats ur ridiculous excuse for Jones stupidity of making silly passes inside the penalty boxes which lead to penalty?

So if he is a technically limited and only strength is bringing down long balls how does he play as a SS behind Suarez linking attack and Midfield?Care to explain?Why u embrass yourself by commenting on Carroll's abilities and impact on Liverpool when u havent even watched him play?

What is he supposed to do if he see's the spot vacant? let the player go down the flank and cross the ball? Jones' stupidity was his inexperience..something that every player goes through.

Carroll is now a ss? lol great tactics lol.

So he was covering for a LB but he wasnt covering at LB position.U know how nonsense your excuse sounds

Ofcourse u know more tactics than a manager who won 4 league titles.Great reply now Why dont u apply for Forest manager job.I heard that job is vacant

BeautifulGame wrote:

Devil-Is-Red wrote:

BeautifulGame wrote:

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
He was covering for evra, who has been prone to forget he is a defender these days, that's why he was so far up the field. Vidic usually covers for Evra as well, there is nothing wrong with it and I blame Evra for that and Rio for mistiming the flight of the ball. For the second goal was a bit of naivity from Jones, but he did well to read the ball and intercept the pass. with experience, he will learn to boot the ball instead of passing it out of danger.

one prime example of how well Jones plays is the timing of a tackle he did against Norwich at the weekend. 2 Norwich attackers doubled up on Jones and one had a golden opportunity to square the ball to his team mate for a simple tap in, but Jones timed his tackle to perfection instead of rushing in and managed to get the ball.

Tell me now honestly, what does Carroll offer? he resorts LFC into playing the long ball game all the time. He is limited techically and the only thing he offers is strentgh and the ability to bring down the ball and bring in other plays into the attack.

1 goal in 7 games so far for LFC, what has he done to earn an England call up over someone like Sturridge?

LMAO.SO a CB is in midfield covering for a LB? So if he was covering for Evra then why didnt he stop the cross coming in the first place itself considering the cross was delivered from the exact left back position which he is supposedly covering?

So whats ur ridiculous excuse for Jones stupidity of making silly passes inside the penalty boxes which lead to penalty?

So if he is a technically limited and only strength is bringing down long balls how does he play as a SS behind Suarez linking attack and Midfield?Care to explain?Why u embrass yourself by commenting on Carroll's abilities and impact on Liverpool when u havent even watched him play?

What is he supposed to do if he see's the spot vacant? let the player go down the flank and cross the ball? Jones' stupidity was his inexperience..something that every player goes through.

Carroll is now a ss? lol great tactics lol.

So he was covering for a LB but he wasnt covering at LB position.U know how nonsense your excuse sounds

Ofcourse u know more tactics than a manager who won 4 league titles.Great reply now Why dont u apply for Forest manager job.I heard that job is vacant

If you actually watch the clip, you will see he was trying to get to the player on the left far up the field.

It's funny how some of you LFC fans are targeting Phil Jones just because I think Carroll is shit. Just get over it, you lot were robbed 35 mill for a guy, who's job it is score goals has scored only 1 in 7 games. Why can't you just admit he doesn't deserve to be called up over someone like Sturridge?

Devil-Is-Red wrote:
If you actually watch the clip, you will see he was trying to get to the player on the left far up the field.

It's funny how some of you LFC fans are targeting Phil Jones just because I think Carroll is shit. Just get over it, you lot were robbed 35 mill for a guy, who's job it is score goals has scored only 1 in 7 games. Why can't you just admit he doesn't deserve to be called up over someone like Sturridge?

If u watch the clip u will know that he was lacking positional sense for a good CB.

When a defender bought for 17 mil turns the best defense in Europe rubbish isnt shit why would Liverpool fans accept a striker who just scored the winning goal in the Derby as shit.

And its not LFC fans fault u fail to see Struddige and Carroll are different strikers and its Welbeck who Struddige is competing with.

My bafflement is how Zamora gets picked tbh.

I actually like Zamora, and I'd rather him than Crouch. I don't suspect either will be in our plans for Euro 2012 (obviously we have to qualify first, but I can't see us loosing to Montenegro), anyway.

I imagine that the strikers going to Euro 2012 will most likely be Rooney, Bent, Carroll, Welbeck and Sturridge, provided the latter two can remain in decent form throughout the season. I'd be quite happy with that, since it covers pretty much every possible forward role you can think of.

Of course this is in hope that Capello realises that Defoe and Crouch haven't got much to offer us at international level.