Re: Champions League: Real Madrid vs Bayern Munich discussion

by Nedved Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:26 am

It was nice of CR7 as Messi was looking really down for some reason.

I prefer Marcelo playing both if he were fit, but since he isn't I guess Marcelo will most likely play at home & Coantrao away.

I am not overly worried about left flank, but Varane has to be in the center with either of the headless chickens.

Both teams have abundant attacking talent, but the decisive factor will be Defense. I think we need Casemiro to cover our defense & Alonso against Bayern, otherwise it will be tough.

Realistically Ancelloti is not gonna start Morata, may be as a sub yes.

by Zealous Sat Apr 19, 2014 8:25 am

I just want to see Morata abuse Boateng/Dante ffs Sad

Carlo pls

by halamadrid2 Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:12 am

Anyone think we should play the hybrid of 4-4-2/4-3-3 we used against Barca vs Bayern??

I know we forced Barca out wide were they are not dangerous but Robben always cuts in anyways so I don't think the flank will be overly used. Ribery on the other hand will both cut in and go wide so we should be wary of him, If DiMaria plays on that flank hopefully we can contain him. Alaba usually cuts into the middle so it would be a good idea to use someone who can use their right to attack his side. Dilemma

Am gonna go and rewatch their game vs Dortmund, wonder where it all went south, from highlights it looked like Dante being at fault for nearly all of the goals through lazy defending, think he will be more focused against us

by shadexticos Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:44 am

ronaldo back in training!
honestly, i was hoping he would be rested for the home game against bayern
i just have a feeling his presence would not be too good for us in the first leg.
we need to play as a team to beat bayern but the whole team unconsciously and even consciously start depending on ronaldo to take them through which hardly works against teams as compact as bayern, to make matters worse, a bayern coached by guardiola.

i just hope he gets rested for the first leg.

also, ancelotti will have a big problem on his hands now when it comes to choosing between di maria and isco.

isco seems to have stepped up his defending so it would all depend on whether the coach plans to play a very direct style (di maria) or keep position intelligently (isco)

Varane also needs to play.
pepe and sergio ramos especially struggle in this sort of games where the ball is played on the ground.
we need a calming presence in defense and varane is the solution.

hala madrid

by Onyx Sun Apr 20, 2014 2:02 pm

The clash between Real Madrid and Bayern Munich will quite possibly be a showcase of footballing excellence in the European game.

These sides have met on 20 previous occasions over the course of their respective histories. Despite the German team's strong reputation, Real Madrid has a favourable record against them in the Santiago Bernabéu. Of the ten matches against Bayern in the Spanish capital, the Whites have picked up seven wins, one draw and two defeats. On top of that, the last four of these encounters have all ended in victory for Real Madrid.

You have to go back 13 years to find the last time Bayern won in the Santiago Bernabéu. That was back in 2001. The following season, Helguera and Guti each found the back of the net to seal a 2-0 home win on Real Madrid's path to a Ninth European Cup win. In 2004, Zidane scored to give the Whites a 1-0 victory over the Bavarians.

Head-to-head

Real Madrid has gone 11 games unbeaten at home against German opposition. The team from Munich's last two visits to the Bernabéu also resulted in wins for Real Madrid. In 2007, a Raúl brace and a Van Nistelrooy goal were enough to earn the home side a 3-2 win. The last match between the sides in Spain occurred in 2012 and ended 2-1, with Cristiano Ronaldo scoring twice.

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:42 pm

If there is one facet of play for which Real Madrid has stood out during this year's edition of the Champions League, it is the team's ability in front of goal. Ancelotti's men have scored 32 times in the 10 matches they have played so far this season.

The average of 3.2 goals per game is the best in the history of the competition since it was rebranded as the Champions League at the beginning of the 1992/93 season.

No team has ever managed to finish a Champions League campaign with a scoring average of over three goals per game. During the 2011/12 season, Barcelona and Real Madrid got very close, with 2.9 per game.

However, neither side was able to reach the figures achieved so far by Ancelotti's team. That season the Whites scored 35 times, the highest number in the club's history, a record that could be beaten this year with four more goal.

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:52 pm

Real Madrid had their first training session of the week and continued their preparations ahead of the first leg in the semifinals of the Champions League, which they will play on Wednesday against Bayern Munich in the Santiago Bernabéu (20:45). Cristiano Ronaldo and Ramos both came through the full training session, which began with Isco being wished a happy birthday.

Also taking part in the training session led by Ancelotti were Castilla's Llorente, Burgui and Pablo Felipe. Arbeloa, Jesé and Bale, who has come down with a bout of flu, were the only absentees.

by Zealous Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:53 pm

halamadrid2 wrote:Anyone think we should play the hybrid of 4-4-2/4-3-3 we used against Barca vs Bayern??

I know we forced Barca out wide were they are not dangerous but Robben always cuts in anyways so I don't think the flank will be overly used. Ribery on the other hand will both cut in and go wide so we should be wary of him, If DiMaria plays on that flank hopefully we can contain him. Alaba usually cuts into the middle so it would be a good idea to use someone who can use their right to attack his side. Dilemma

Am gonna go and rewatch their game vs Dortmund, wonder where it all went south, from highlights it looked like Dante being at fault for nearly all of the goals through lazy defending, think he will be more focused against us

I would actually recommend the opposite. We need to force Bayern to play through the centre. It's true that Robben cuts in but that open space for Rafinha/Lahm to overlap which we absolutely should not allow in this game.

I saw their recent loss against Dortmund. In that game Bayern got destroyed on the counter, BVB basically did not have a single spell of possession that lasted for extended periods. In that game they made sure that Bayern had no spaces out wide so Ribery and Robben were absolutely invisible. Reus and Aubamenyang positioned themselves as outlets on the flanks, basically what Bale and Ronaldo normally do for us so I think Pep will use the BVB game to make adjustments.

Regardless of how we approach this game we won't get the result we want and need unless we press intelligently and without fear. I think we can do that.

by halamadrid2 Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:04 pm

Well said. The pressing of our team has been suspect this season with it being done in an un synchronized fashion.

Having Lahm push up has its disadvantages though, Bale pretty much played LW against Barca. Lahm does not have the speed to track back quick enough. I think he will be asked to be conservative

I watched the Dortmund game, Dortmund were just too fast for Bayern, they sat back and played quick inteligent passes right through their midfield. I think if we play it right we can pull off a good game with a 4-4-2. DiMaria played AM when we won the ball vs Barca so in the end it looked like 4-3-1-2 when we attacked, I think he can find that kind of space again to operate

Something tells me Pep will be unltra conservative though with a midfield of kroos, Schweinie and Javi, that could back fire because all of those are really slow and Javi isn't the fastesr thinker as well

that said, please Robben have mercy on us

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:10 pm

Yeh we really need to press in a consistent and tactical manner, with intensity. But it's something we've never done, so hopefully we step up and don't end up sitting back like we have done in a lot of the big games this season.

by halamadrid2 Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:34 pm

I think it is a tactic Carlo has us do. Sometimes he forgets we are not an Italian twam but a Spanish one which can't withstand pressure for long periods of time. With so long to prepare I am confident he will make us play the way we will get the best possible result

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:37 pm

Also it would be much better if we played a highline. Whenever Alonso commits himself, there's a massive gap to run into for the other team. Playing a highline means we can press better.

Pepe and Ramos aren't good at the basics of defending, however both of them are quick, so a highline could work.

by halamadrid2 Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:49 pm

With a high line it is easy to just pass a ball between our defenders for wingers to run onto diagonally. How many times have we seen that vs Barca over the years

Maybe if we played a 4-5-1 that could work but with a 4-3-3 thats suicide especially with our attackers

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:01 pm

Bayern don't really make diagonal passes and they're not a direct team either. Robben/Ribery are more on the ball players as opposed to players who make runs. Plus Mandzukic is slow so it could work.

If we try pressing with a deep line, Bayern could end up walking past the pressure with space to run into.

Anyway everyone has to work hard, constantly close down and track back for the pressing to work and that includes Bale and Ronaldo.

Also from what I've seen of the Bayern/Dortmund game, the highline has been effective.

by halamadrid2 Mon Apr 21, 2014 4:28 pm

Gomez is slow as well and he molested us. Mandzukic being slow will not be a problem for them

Bayern played a highline vs Dortmund, they won't do it against us, they know how easy schalke made it for us by playing a high line.

are you telling me Gotze/Schweinsteiger/Kroos will not attempt a simple ball that will cut our midfield and defence in half like Barca always do, Robben will have fun running onto those. The only way it fould work is if we keep the attack, midfield and defence really close to eachother. This would mean the front three sacrifice their stamina by running up and down like gazelles. Can't see that happening unfortunately

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:07 pm

Would be surprised if Bayern didn't play a highline against us when they have in every game I've watched them this season.

If we ever want a successful pressing system, then everyone has to work hard, close down and track back consistently.

by Zealous Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:18 pm

We actually pressed extremely well in the first half in the Copa final. Pressing for 90 minutes is a ridiculous and stupid tactic anyway I believe we should only do it in the first quarter of the game and again towards the end depending on the score.

So with that in mind I would start with our usual 4-3-3 and really try to get at them offensively. Put them on the back foot and force them to react hopefully we'll be able to score a goal in this period of time.

In the second half I would switch back a 4-4-2 and counter them. Keep it tight and make sure to punish them when they eventually start playing a high line.

by Zealous Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:21 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:Would be surprised if Bayern didn't play a highline against us when they have in every game I've watched them this season.

If we ever want a successful pressing system, then everyone has to work hard, close down and track back consistently.

This actually makes Bayern's job much easier.

Lahm and Alaba will not be willing to gamble, they won't push up if Bale or Ronaldo are in the spaces behind them. If they won't push up why do you want our guys to track back and let them attack us? That just puts the pressure on us and gives their players confidence.

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:56 pm

Depends though. In some games Lahm and Alaba come inside and Robben/Ribery stay out wide, other games the fullbacks overlap.

Either way I think to be fully solid defensively, we should always have 2 banks of 4 when defending.

by Zealous Mon Apr 21, 2014 6:36 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:Depends though. In some games Lahm and Alaba come inside and Robben/Ribery stay out wide, other games the fullbacks overlap.

Either way I think to be fully solid defensively, we should always have 2 banks of 4 when defending.

Good point. I agree about the 2 banks of 4 part too, I just don't think Ronaldo should be a part of that, he is of more value on the offensive end.

by halamadrid2 Mon Apr 21, 2014 8:37 pm

Even if he tried to I don't think he would pull it off and I agree he would be much more useful for us if he stayed in their half

I don't think people realized but when we attacked vs Barca we actually played a 4-3-3 but we scored so early and decided to absorb pressure which made our formation look like a 4-4-2 because Barca were usually in posession

Bale is probably going to play the role DiMaria did and DiMaria the role Isco did. I haven't liked the lazy tracking back from Bale on his side, last time we got scored on so easily by Iniesta when Bale failed to track back. Here is hoping he has the match of his life

by Onyx Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:06 pm

If our pressing is good, then we'll pin Bayern down inside their own half/middle third and they won't get near our box. Similar to what Dortmund did.

by shadexticos Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:08 am

Sadly, none of our opinions matter.

by halamadrid2 Tue Apr 22, 2014 1:00 pm

Carlo has hinted that Ronaldo won't start on Wednesday to not risk him for the more important game next week

So we will probably see the exact same line up as the Copa final

by Zealous Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:26 pm

halamadrid2 wrote:Carlo has hinted that Ronaldo won't start on Wednesday to not risk him for the more important game next week

So we will probably see the exact same line up as the Copa final

If I had to choose one game where I wanted Cristiano I'd choose the away game because that's the game where we need to score as many goals as possible.

Having said that CR's best performances for Madrid have been at the Bernabeu.

by Onyx Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:36 pm

Cristiano Ronaldo and Gareth Bale have trained on Tuesday morning, with both thought to be fit for Wednesday’s Champions League semi-final.

The Portugal international has been out for the last three weeks with a knee complaint and a slight muscle injury.

But the Ballon d’Or winner has completed a second successive session, and is expected to start against Bayern Munich at Santiago Bernabeu later this week.

Bale meanwhile, also took a full part in Tuesday’s training after he sat out Monday with a bout of flu.

The Wales international is also expected to be a part of the European Cup clash against the Bavarian outfit.

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