Re: Thoughts on Brazil

by Mr Nick09 Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:07 am

Being as good as Pele? it's not something you can predict anyway, for all we know, Hazard is going to be the greatest player of this era of football, yet he isnt as hyped as other kids of his age.

by The Franchise Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:08 am

Dont think he needs to be good as Pele or even aim for him. You cant expect players to reach that level.

Neymar is serious though. I guess I understand that some people dont like him, but if you strip away the over the top nature of the boy and look at his actual skills (not tricks, but skills) he has so much to his game.

He is Robinho, but with a strikers finishing touch.

He is a risk taker, which some wont like, but his ability to improvise and make something out of nothing is incredible.

He doesnt fit into Barca much at all, his style and current age plus our current squad, but despite that his talent is so good I wouldnt say no.

by Ganso Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:17 am

Nobody has ever compared him to pele ffs,not even in brazil

by Mr Nick09 Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:21 am

I think people are just lazy, dont watch him, and find the comparison to Robinho as a quick escape to undermine him.

by Guest Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:26 am

Ganso wrote:Nobody has ever compared him to pele ffs,not even in brazil

Eh, don't tell me, tell those people who ever made those topics, those comparisons and those posts :coffee:

by Ganso Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:28 am

It will be a wank fest by December with all the easy friendlies,he will go from robinho 2.0 to best youngster in the world and then back to robinho 2.0 when we lose against spain.he's talented and he's better than robinho,sadly people will never rate him until he moves to Europe,which is an idea I don't think he's very fond of

by Guest Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:30 am

by biggiejay Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:33 am

The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:The problem with Brasil is Dani Alves and Andre Santos. They always want to do too much and leave holes in the defense, I hate both of them.

That was never a problem when they had Roberto Carlos and Cafu, both of whom go forward as much as Alves and both way more then Andre Santos?

Maybe If Brazil kept better possession like they used to, they could be effective.

You have to go forward alot from fullback for Brazil they dont have wingers and havent had for a long tiem.

LOL

You want to compare Cafu and Roberto Carlos to 2 bums like Dani Alves and Andre Santos?
Cafu and Roberto Carlos were world class players and they knew how to attack and defend. Dani Alves and Andre Santos are good going forward but they are weak on defense. They always want to take an extra touch or try to dribble too much. You would never see Cafu or Roberto Carlos do that, what made them so great was that they played simple unlike those 2 clowns.

by Giggslegend Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:59 am

Call me biased but I really think anderson have developed into a great player now, and will even be greater in a few years.

Julio Cesar

Rafael Thiago.Silva David.Luis Fabio

Anderson Hernanes

Hulk Ganso Robinho
Neymar

Also would have players such as
Lucas (sao paulo)
Ramires
Luis Gustavo
Marcelo etc on the bench

NB! this is a WC 2014 starting lineup, if rafael, fabio and anderson is going to be regulars for a winning man utd side they should really bring that winning mentality into brazil

by Giggslegend Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:59 am

Call me biased but I really think anderson have developed into a great player now, and will even be greater in a few years.

Julio Cesar

Rafael Thiago.Silva David.Luis Fabio

Anderson Hernanes

Hulk Ganso Robinho
Neymar

Also would have players such as
Lucas (sao paulo)
Ramires
Luis Gustavo
Marcelo etc on the bench

NB! this is a WC 2014 starting lineup, if rafael, fabio and anderson is going to be regulars for a winning man utd side they should really bring that winning mentality into brazil

by rsinatra Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:03 am

sciacca wrote:
The Franchise wrote:When was that ever on the cards?

Don't know, some fans actually bragged about him being the next Pele, there were even topics on that. Don't ask me, I'm just questioning that question from the past.

You're trolling that's what Smile

. No one who has actually got the intelligence of a 5-year-old ever called Neymar the new Pelé. The media does that because it's good publicity. They did the same with Robinho a few years back ffs, and he wasn't even close to what Neymar already is at 19.

by rsinatra Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:06 am

biggiejay wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:The problem with Brasil is Dani Alves and Andre Santos. They always want to do too much and leave holes in the defense, I hate both of them.

That was never a problem when they had Roberto Carlos and Cafu, both of whom go forward as much as Alves and both way more then Andre Santos?

Maybe If Brazil kept better possession like they used to, they could be effective.

You have to go forward alot from fullback for Brazil they dont have wingers and havent had for a long tiem.

LOL

You want to compare Cafu and Roberto Carlos to 2 bums like Dani Alves and Andre Santos?
Cafu and Roberto Carlos were world class players and they knew how to attack and defend. Dani Alves and Andre Santos are good going forward but they are weak on defense. They always want to take an extra touch or try to dribble too much. You would never see Cafu or Roberto Carlos do that, what made them so great was that they played simple unlike those 2 clowns.

Word.

by rsinatra Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:07 am

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:yh, at some points you see only robinho, pato, ganso and neymar in attack, but they arent keeping shape of the 4222 and the movements are very poor, tactically, im not convinced by menezes.

They could play a real 433 with guys like Neymar, Hulk, damaio in attack, and the wings would look strong, but their midfield isnt good enough i feel.

The 4222 would really be perfect for them, specially with Marcelo and Alves, they have athletic CBs, strong DMs i think.

But they do need a specialist to put it in motion. Menezes made an attempt of it in the copa, we saw some of the brilliance of such system, but they werent disciplined, and looked out of depth.

This is another point btw, discipline, Dunga got that part perfectly. It doesnt matter if you want to play Joga bonito, if you have no discipline with the team defending as a whole, you will get nowhere in this era of football, it's as simple as that.

Dunga understood that concept, and even with an underwhelming group for many, he looked like a world cup winner, bar that stupid mistake from Melo, imo. The way they were defending during the copa was shameful, the team was split in two, and the forwards werent that concerned about defending.

Mentality wise, they have to come to realization with it. Reminds me of Muricy barca fanboy saying that RM is too tactical for Neymar, but barca is better. Bottom line is, Even barca wingers are crazy hard working, and if even Neymar cant commit to it, he will struggle. Everyone has to work hard nowadays.

You are the coolest madridista fan on the forum

by Red Alert Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:10 am

Besides Pato, is there anyone else rival to Neymar for the 2014 WC?

by FootballFan92 Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:25 am

-----------------------------------------Cesar-----------------------------------------------

Alves-----------------Silva------------------------------Luiz----------------------Marcelo

----------------------------------------Lucas-------------------------------------------------

----------------------Ganso------------------------Ronaldinho----------------------------

Robinho-----------------------------------------------------------------------Hulk/Bastos

----------------------------------Neymar/Nilmar?/Pato-----------------------------------

by rsinatra Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:58 pm

neymar doesn't play as a cf.. not sure he could pull it off.

@ynwa what do you mean pato being a rival? lol

by The Franchise Sat Aug 13, 2011 5:19 pm

biggiejay wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:The problem with Brasil is Dani Alves and Andre Santos. They always want to do too much and leave holes in the defense, I hate both of them.

That was never a problem when they had Roberto Carlos and Cafu, both of whom go forward as much as Alves and both way more then Andre Santos?

Maybe If Brazil kept better possession like they used to, they could be effective.

You have to go forward alot from fullback for Brazil they dont have wingers and havent had for a long tiem.

LOL

You want to compare Cafu and Roberto Carlos to 2 bums like Dani Alves and Andre Santos?
Cafu and Roberto Carlos were world class players and they knew how to attack and defend. Dani Alves and Andre Santos are good going forward but they are weak on defense. They always want to take an extra touch or try to dribble too much. You would never see Cafu or Roberto Carlos do that, what made them so great was that they played simple unlike those 2 clowns.

Excuse me, hold the phone.

We wasnt talking quality...you said they go forward too much..Roberto Carlos and Cafu went forward just as much. End of story.

Why are you putting quality into the mix?

By the way though, its not like Dani Alves and Andre Santos are the ones who consistently lose the ball and therefore the space is exploited.

They have to go forward because there is no width, if a ramdon midfielder messes up and the wings are exploited, thats not their fault.

Finally, stop over glorifying the past or underrated now. Dani Alves is better then Cafu was, or a at very least, its a close call.

LOL @ Roberto Carlos knew how to defend. The EXACT same arguments people use against Alves, they used on Carlos 10 years ago.

by rsinatra Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:15 pm

The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:The problem with Brasil is Dani Alves and Andre Santos. They always want to do too much and leave holes in the defense, I hate both of them.

That was never a problem when they had Roberto Carlos and Cafu, both of whom go forward as much as Alves and both way more then Andre Santos?

Maybe If Brazil kept better possession like they used to, they could be effective.

You have to go forward alot from fullback for Brazil they dont have wingers and havent had for a long tiem.

LOL

You want to compare Cafu and Roberto Carlos to 2 bums like Dani Alves and Andre Santos?
Cafu and Roberto Carlos were world class players and they knew how to attack and defend. Dani Alves and Andre Santos are good going forward but they are weak on defense. They always want to take an extra touch or try to dribble too much. You would never see Cafu or Roberto Carlos do that, what made them so great was that they played simple unlike those 2 clowns.

Excuse me, hold the phone.

We wasnt talking quality...you said they go forward too much..Roberto Carlos and Cafu went forward just as much. End of story.

Why are you putting quality into the mix?

By the way though, its not like Dani Alves and Andre Santos are the ones who consistently lose the ball and therefore the space is exploited.

They have to go forward because there is no width, if a ramdon midfielder messes up and the wings are exploited, thats not their fault.

Finally, stop over glorifying the past or underrated now. Dani Alves is better then Cafu was, or a at very least, its a close call.

LOL @ Roberto Carlos knew how to defend. The EXACT same arguments people use against Alves, they used on Carlos 10 years ago.

I agree about Roberto Carlos and that we should stop glorifying the past and belittling the current players. But do you really think Dani Alves is better than Cafu was ? How so?

And André Santos is to blame for at least one of the German goals.

by Ganso Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:24 pm

Luis Gustavo was a beast today.Must start for the nt imo.

by biggiejay Mon Aug 15, 2011 5:51 am

The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:The problem with Brasil is Dani Alves and Andre Santos. They always want to do too much and leave holes in the defense, I hate both of them.

That was never a problem when they had Roberto Carlos and Cafu, both of whom go forward as much as Alves and both way more then Andre Santos?

Maybe If Brazil kept better possession like they used to, they could be effective.

You have to go forward alot from fullback for Brazil they dont have wingers and havent had for a long tiem.

LOL

You want to compare Cafu and Roberto Carlos to 2 bums like Dani Alves and Andre Santos?
Cafu and Roberto Carlos were world class players and they knew how to attack and defend. Dani Alves and Andre Santos are good going forward but they are weak on defense. They always want to take an extra touch or try to dribble too much. You would never see Cafu or Roberto Carlos do that, what made them so great was that they played simple unlike those 2 clowns.

Excuse me, hold the phone.

We wasnt talking quality...you said they go forward too much..Roberto Carlos and Cafu went forward just as much. End of story.

Why are you putting quality into the mix?

By the way though, its not like Dani Alves and Andre Santos are the ones who consistently lose the ball and therefore the space is exploited.

They have to go forward because there is no width, if a ramdon midfielder messes up and the wings are exploited, thats not their fault.

Finally, stop over glorifying the past or underrated now. Dani Alves is better then Cafu was, or a at very least, its a close call.

LOL @ Roberto Carlos knew how to defend. The EXACT same arguments people use against Alves, they used on Carlos 10 years ago.

LOL @ Dani Alves better than Cafu Shocked

In Brasil we rate Cafu as one of the best fullbacks of all time. Cafu is a legend, theres alot of people I know that dont like Alves atleast when he plays for Brasil.I didnt say they to go forward to much go back and look what I wrote. I said they leave holes in the defense that doesnt necessarily mean to go foward to much its just that they fall a sleep on defense.If you have been watching them play during Copa America and this game against Germany you would know what I mean. I know what a fullback is suppose to do you, Brasil has always had attacking fullbacks. Dani Alves and Andre Santos lose the ball alot. They dont play simple football, they always take an extra touch or hold on to the ball for too long. Roberto Carlos isn't known for his defending but I still think hes better defensively than Alves

by Clownbaby Mon Aug 15, 2011 7:10 am

ynwa wrote:Besides Pato, is there anyone else rival to Neymar for the 2014 WC?

Thoughts on Brazil - Page 5 Philippe-coutinho-correia-2010-7-19-8-42-16

by rsinatra Mon Aug 15, 2011 5:52 pm

biggiejay wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
biggiejay wrote:The problem with Brasil is Dani Alves and Andre Santos. They always want to do too much and leave holes in the defense, I hate both of them.

That was never a problem when they had Roberto Carlos and Cafu, both of whom go forward as much as Alves and both way more then Andre Santos?

Maybe If Brazil kept better possession like they used to, they could be effective.

You have to go forward alot from fullback for Brazil they dont have wingers and havent had for a long tiem.

LOL

You want to compare Cafu and Roberto Carlos to 2 bums like Dani Alves and Andre Santos?
Cafu and Roberto Carlos were world class players and they knew how to attack and defend. Dani Alves and Andre Santos are good going forward but they are weak on defense. They always want to take an extra touch or try to dribble too much. You would never see Cafu or Roberto Carlos do that, what made them so great was that they played simple unlike those 2 clowns.

Excuse me, hold the phone.

We wasnt talking quality...you said they go forward too much..Roberto Carlos and Cafu went forward just as much. End of story.

Why are you putting quality into the mix?

By the way though, its not like Dani Alves and Andre Santos are the ones who consistently lose the ball and therefore the space is exploited.

They have to go forward because there is no width, if a ramdon midfielder messes up and the wings are exploited, thats not their fault.

Finally, stop over glorifying the past or underrated now. Dani Alves is better then Cafu was, or a at very least, its a close call.

LOL @ Roberto Carlos knew how to defend. The EXACT same arguments people use against Alves, they used on Carlos 10 years ago.

LOL @ Dani Alves better than Cafu

In Brasil we rate Cafu as one of the best fullbacks of all time. Cafu is a legend, theres alot of people I know that dont like Alves atleast when he plays for Brasil.I didnt say they to go forward to much go back and look what I wrote. I said they leave holes in the defense that doesnt necessarily mean to go foward to much its just that they fall a sleep on defense.If you have been watching them play during Copa America and this game against Germany you would know what I mean. I know what a fullback is suppose to do you, Brasil has always had attacking fullbacks. Dani Alves and Andre Santos lose the ball alot. They dont play simple football, they always take an extra touch or hold on to the ball for too long. Roberto Carlos isn't known for his defending but I still think hes better defensively than Alves

I agree about the "extra touch" , André Santos always tries that, and that's why Germany scored their third goal. It's not just our fullbacks though, Pato too always tries to do something more impressive instead of just scoring, pretty or not, like Romário would. Neymar too has been guilty of some "overdribbling" in front of goal, both for Brazil and Santos. This Brazil has to learn the difference between a team playing beautiful football, and a player trying to dribble too much, being too individual and losing the ball in the end.

by Ganso Mon Aug 15, 2011 5:56 pm

new call up in 3 days,i expect new players,and i wonder who will replace Pato and Andre at the starting lineup

by rsinatra Mon Aug 15, 2011 6:00 pm

Ganso wrote:new call up in 3 days,i expect new players,and i wonder who will replace Pato and Andre at the starting lineup

Marcelo would be such a nice surprise. I hope Damião is called up.

by Gil Mon Aug 15, 2011 6:07 pm

Neymar Damiao Hulk
Hernanes Ramires
Lucas
Marcelo Luiz Silva Alves/Maicon
Julio Cesar

Would love to see that.

by rsinatra Mon Aug 15, 2011 6:13 pm

Gil wrote:
Neymar Damiao Hulk
Hernanes Ramires
Lucas
Marcelo Luiz Silva Alves/Maicon
Julio Cesar

Would love to see that.

That could be interesting, so Ramires wouldn't playing as a DM?

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