Alonso: Tackling is not a quality for a footballer

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:No surprise he thinks this, seeing as he cant tackle at all.

What? Alonso can't tackle? you are completely wrong.

Except im not, he cant tackle. He can foul alot while trying to tackle though.

Too slow, both his feet and his legs. Struggles against top quality dribblers.

Messi, Iniesta and Xavi have their way with him every single time.

Being slow =/= ability to tackle.

You cant be this dense, so ill just ignore you.

Go ask van Bommel that.

Dunno what he's smoking. He's a decent tackler, but any decent team should have a few good tacklers if they value defensive solidity.

It doesn't have to be "last resort". I've seen plenty of goals coming from midfield tackles leading to counter attacks. Hell, even forwards sometimes tackle with success.

Intresting fact. When we had Etoo, he led our team in tackles per game at some point.

Take from that what you will, but I thought it was intresting.

Exactly, I don't see what's so last resort about a forward tackling from up front. At that point it's more an ability or skill.

Xabi's a great guy and a great player, but he's just plain wrong here.

It's not a quality but there's nothing wrong with it.

Someone who can't slide tackle shouldn't be inferior to who can.

The Franchise wrote:No surprise he thinks this, seeing as he cant tackle at all.

Anyway, I understand what he is saying. Young players shouldnt be thinking tackling is one of their strong points. But its niave to think that you dont need to tackle and being able to tackle can be a huge plus.

but he can tackle.

a slide tackle is a clear quality, and what xabi said is a load of pretentious nonsense

The Franchise wrote:

Zealous wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:No surprise he thinks this, seeing as he cant tackle at all.

What? Alonso can't tackle? you are completely wrong.

Except im not, he cant tackle. He can foul alot while trying to tackle though.

Too slow, both his feet and his legs. Struggles against top quality dribblers.

Messi, Iniesta and Xavi have their way with him every single time.

Let's assume you are right and Xabi is indeed the physically incompetent player you make him out to be.

How does that prove his point wrong? If anything it proves him right because a player as successful and talented as he is got to the top without being good at tackling.

So he is right then? Tackling isnt important?

That's not what he is saying at all....

Seriously did you even read the whole thing? He says tackling is something that you still have to use but it shouldn't be something you build your game around.

How is that wrong? You can disagree but you can't say that his opinion is wrong. Seriously no one here addressed his point at all. The closest we came to a counter argument was "lol Alonso just mad".

FFS

i cant believe the amount of butt hurt coming out of the spanish NT. It's like they inhareted the barcelona personality or something

Alonso is jelly because he can't tackle...

Zealous wrote:That's not what he is saying at all....

Seriously did you even read the whole thing? He says tackling is something that you still have to use but it shouldn't be something you build your game around.

How is that wrong? You can disagree but you can't say that his opinion is wrong. Seriously no one here addressed his point at all. The closest we came to a counter argument was "lol Alonso just mad".

FFS

I understand what you're saying, however my problem is the phrase he uses, that "it isn't a quality to aspire to." A player should be looking to improve and round out their game no matter what age they are, and very few nowadays are truly brilliant tacklers, whether it be a standing or sliding tackle. For defenders and midfielders it should be part of their instruction, not dominant, but on an equal footing during tactical exercises.

If he had said that focus should not be put on producing pure defensive midfielders, then I'd have agreed, though it would hardly be a profound comment. Anything that will improve your game is something to aspire to though.

julias wrote:lmao what...so how do you get the ball back without tackling

go and tell that to Gattuso, Maldini, Nesta, Tony Adams, Sol Campbell etc...

Tackling is an art that can be admired just as much as a great pass

Out of those 5 players you mentioned, 3 are retired and the other 2 are practically on the verge of retirement.
Illustrated Alonso's point perfectly...


I think he's got a point.
Especially from where he plays, the game has become more about interceptions than steals

The Franchise wrote:

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:No surprise he thinks this, seeing as he cant tackle at all.

What? Alonso can't tackle? you are completely wrong.

Except im not, he cant tackle. He can foul alot while trying to tackle though.

Too slow, both his feet and his legs. Struggles against top quality dribblers.

Messi, Iniesta and Xavi have their way with him every single time.

Being slow =/= ability to tackle.

You cant be this dense, so ill just ignore you.

You can stfo. never seen such a arrogant **** in my life. so ill ignore you too.

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

Mamad wrote:

The Franchise wrote:No surprise he thinks this, seeing as he cant tackle at all.

What? Alonso can't tackle? you are completely wrong.

Except im not, he cant tackle. He can foul alot while trying to tackle though.

Too slow, both his feet and his legs. Struggles against top quality dribblers.

Messi, Iniesta and Xavi have their way with him every single time.

Being slow =/= ability to tackle.

You cant be this dense, so ill just ignore you.

You can stfo. never seen such a arrogant **** in my life. so ill ignore you too.

bloody hell guys calm the F*** down.

Amazing how decades of footballers got it wrong.
Let’s add headers and positioning to non-footballing qualities

che wrote:pepe's got like 8 fouls, alonso 21... and pepe is insane...

Not really Pepe has been very subdued this season, also Alonso has more playing time than anyone bar Casillas this season so his numbers are going to be up.

Edit: lol at people thinking Khedira is a DM, since most of you who said that never watch Madrid play go check out a heat map of Khedria and Xabi when they play together and come back and tell me who plays deeper lmao

dostoevsky wrote:

Zealous wrote:That's not what he is saying at all....

Seriously did you even read the whole thing? He says tackling is something that you still have to use but it shouldn't be something you build your game around.

How is that wrong? You can disagree but you can't say that his opinion is wrong. Seriously no one here addressed his point at all. The closest we came to a counter argument was "lol Alonso just mad".

FFS

I understand what you're saying, however my problem is the phrase he uses, that "it isn't a quality to aspire to." A player should be looking to improve and round out their game no matter what age they are, and very few nowadays are truly brilliant tacklers, whether it be a standing or sliding tackle. For defenders and midfielders it should be part of their instruction, not dominant, but on an equal footing during tactical exercises.

If he had said that focus should not be put on producing pure defensive midfielders, then I'd have agreed, though it would hardly be a profound comment. Anything that will improve your game is something to aspire to though.

This makes more sense and you definitely have a point. But you have to put what Xabi said into context of the entire interview. He was putting forward ideas on how England can mature as far as playing style without losing it's identity.

Sid Lowe makes a point that English fans sometimes bemoan the fact that some players didn't get "stuck in" whenever they get knocked out of a tournament. So in essence they are disappointed that they didn't tackle enough. Xabi is saying that it doesn't have to be that way, that if you focus on other aspects and developing a playing style then getting "stuck in" becomes an after thought.

He's just doesn't see it as an such an important part of the game like the English do, that it really shouldn't be something youth team players should consider an important part of their game and therein lies the point that most seemed to (conveniently?) miss. Not once did he say that tackling is something you will never have to use, he expressed that it shouldn't be something England should build a playing style around. This becomes clearer when you read the whole interview.

Zealous wrote:This makes more sense and you definitely have a point. But you have to put what Xabi said into context of the entire interview. He was putting forward ideas on how England can mature as far as playing style without losing it's identity.

Sid Lowe makes a point that English fans sometimes bemoan the fact that some players didn't get "stuck in" whenever they get knocked out of a tournament. So in essence they are disappointed that they didn't tackle enough. Xabi is saying that it doesn't have to be that way, that if you focus on other aspects and developing a playing style then getting "stuck in" becomes an after thought.

He's just doesn't see it as an such an important part of the game like the English do, that it really shouldn't be something youth team players should consider an important part of their game and therein lies the point that most seemed to (conveniently?) miss. Not once did he say that tackling is something you will never have to use, he expressed that it shouldn't be something England should build a playing style around. This becomes clearer when you read the whole interview.

I haven't read the entire interview, so thanks for putting it into context.

I definitely see what you mean. Criticism such as "not getting stuck in" is relevant in individual assessment, however it's rarely an indictment of the team itself. In that sense, it should be an afterthought as you said, though I'm still inclined to say that it doesn't follow that youths shouldn't be instructed in the art of tackling. It's sort of like the difference between parking the bus and catenaccio, in that having a defensive midfielder or defenders who are incredibly strong tacklers becomes a real danger to the opposition when it can be used by the coach to focus upon the strengths of the opposition and allow your own team the possession to exploit your weaknesses. England lacks the plan that allows them to do anything once they "get stuck in." If Alonso is referring to this, then I see his point, though he could have expressed himself more clearly. He's a footballer not an academic though, so I'm not going to criticise him for his use of language.

I Can't believe how people are getting so angry over his comments, he makes a fair point. As football has eveolved the physical route is now despised and villified around the football community. This is due to many factors, the stricter refereeing rules being the stand out. I think what Alonso was trying to say was that football intelligence was better than just going in for a tackle and that is fair enough.

Take Mascherano for instance. Lauded within the premiership as "one of the best midfielders in the world" according to EPL enthusiasts. He was a hard tackling, no nonsense Defensive MF, probably the of the old destroyer type dMF. He was transported to Spain and on his first game in La Liga, he looked lost and could have ben sent off. Now you ask yourself this, what happened within the space of 3 months when he went to barcelona? Did his tackling decline? No, simply put he went to a place were technique and anticipation were far more accepted than being a dogged mf. Busquets, as much as I despise him, is what the model of defensive MF should be like. He doesn't make bone crunching last minute "parker esque" tackles, nor does he give a physical approach to the game, what he does have, is amazing anticipation and reading of the game, so he is able to intercept the ball. Now look at Mascherano now, his ability to read the game has developed so much that he is comfortable in Barcelona's defence, and is probablt ther best Central defender at this moment in time. Would he have been able to convert to a central defender in the premiership? Highly unlikely. He might not hack it because he might not be physically up for it, some may say, but that is the main reason that England are behind the rest of the footballing powers and have been for 50+ years.

For me and most people in Europe interception > tackling. That is what Alonso meant. If you can anticipate the game, then there would be no need to have to perform a move that could potentially get you carded. It might not be as awe inspiring or get cheers, but it has certainly proven to be more effective. That is the context he said it in, and I agree with him tbh. The problem is in England, physicality comes before football intelligence and use of the ball, which begs to question how good would scholes had been had he plied his trade abroad in a footballing environment that stresses technique before tenacity. People can sit there and be outraged about what he is saying, but the trend in football at the moment certainly is in his favour.

Xabi: the players I try to tackle are suffering because I can't tackle

I Can't believe the reaction these Alonso has caused, he makes a fair point. As football has evolved the physical route is now despised and villified around the football community. This is due to many factors, the stricter refereeing rules being the stand out. I think what Alonso was trying to say was that football intelligence was better than just going in for a tackle and that is fair enough.

Take Mascherano for instance. Lauded within the premiership as "one of the best midfielders in the world" according to EPL enthusiasts. He was a hard tackling, no nonsense Defensive MF, probably the of the old destroyer type dMF. He was transported to Spain and on his first game in La Liga, he looked lost and could have ben sent off. Now you ask yourself this, what happened within the space of 3 months when he went to barcelona? Did his tackling decline? No, simply put he went to a place were technique and anticipation were far more accepted than being a dogged mf. Busquets, as much as I despise him, is what the model of defensive MF should be like. He doesn't make bone crunching last minute "parker esque" tackles, nor does he give a physical approach to the game, what he does have, is amazing anticipation and reading of the game, so he is able to intercept the ball. Now look at Mascherano now, his ability to read the game has developed so much that he is comfortable in Barcelona's defence, and is probablt ther best Central defender at this moment in time. Would he have been able to convert to a central defender in the premiership? Highly unlikely. He might not hack it because he might not be physically up for it, some may say, but that is the main reason that England are behind the rest of the footballing powers and have been for 50+ years.

For me and most people in Europe interception > tackling. That is what Alonso meant. If you can anticipate the game, then there would be no need to have to perform a move that could potentially get you carded. It might not be as awe inspiring or get cheers, but it has certainly proven to be more effective. That is the context he said it in, and I agree with him tbh. The problem is in England, physicality comes before football intelligence and use of the ball, which begs to question how good would scholes had been had he plied his trade abroad in a footballing environment that stresses technique before tenacity. People can sit there and be outraged about what he is saying, but the trend in football at the moment certainly is in his favour.

lol 2 1/2 years on and this still sounds stupid

Spanish footballers   

Why does people act like Football players or managers can't say stupids things