Ballon D'or short list

How am i underrating Iniesta

What did he do last season for Barca? what did he do for Spain that was special.

Ibra has had a better 2012, Falcao has, Messi has, Pirlo has, Benzema has, CR has, Van Persie has and many more has.

Someone please explain to what Iniesta has done in 2012 that's deserving of a top 3 nomination.

Apart from being flashy with no end product.

Without Pirlo Italy don't get to Euro final stop denying it you all know it and without Pirlo Juve don't win Serie A again stop denying it.

Without Iniesta Spain still win the Euros to even argue otherwise is a joke.

Who does Italy have to come in for Pirlo? Montolivo lmao?

Who does Juventus have to come in for Pirlo? Marrone? lmao

Who does Spain have to come in for Iniesta? Mata, Cazorla, Pedro and Navas?

Who does Barca have to come in for Iniesta? Cesc, Thiago,Tello, Pedro?

And some how Iniesta is just as important to Spain and Barca as Pirlo was to Italy and Juventus

Please let me know what Iniesta has done as individual in 2012 that makes him sooooooooooooo deserving i would really like to know.

But some how i doubt you even know the reasons.

Also did Whitestar call me a hater ? ( when i have said many times i like Barca) and a bandwagoner when i'm a Newcastle fan?

Dante wrote:Is it me or this is the first time in GL history that this annual thread has gone free of Ronaldo vs Messi bitchfight , up to page 4 ?

People understand where those two stand now, there's no need to debate about it. Ronaldo will always be in his shadow. Now we have to decide who's the 3rd best player in the world.

Diego Armando Maradona wrote:this aint the ballon dor, the ballon dor died. This is the fifa ballon dor, totally different voting structure designed to give players like messi awards they dont deserve instead of the player whom actually had the best sporting achievement

Thank god the old voting system died seeing as it always went to the most famous player of the team who won the most trophies/Euro/WC and not to the player who PLAYED the best. Like with Zidane in 98, he wasnt the best french player, it was thuram(he was actually voted the 3rd best player of the WC after Ronaldo and kahn I belive) and yet Zidane won because he was the most famous player of the french team or like in 02 when Ronaldo won it when Rivaldo had just as good of a WC as him but the difference was that Rivaldo did actually play club football that year...

Diego Armando Maradona wrote:I didnt say whether messi deserves it or not this year.

I thought you were implying that he didn't deserve it this year. 2010 is still controversial but I personally I agree with SAF and believe that (all compatriot bias aside) Diego Milito deserved it more from his Inter performances as his contribution was far more influential than Sneijder's. The man scored in 3 finals: brace in the CL final, cup final and last matchday.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:How am i underrating Iniesta

What did he do last season for Barca? what did he do for Spain that was special.

Ibra has had a better 2012, Falcao has, Messi has, Pirlo has, Benzema has, CR has, Van Persie has and many more has.

Someone please explain to what Iniesta has done in 2012 that's deserving of a top 3 nomination.

Apart from being flashy with no end product.

Without Pirlo Italy don't get to Euro final stop denying it you all know it and without Pirlo Juve don't win Serie A again stop denying it.

Without Iniesta Spain still win the Euros to even argue otherwise is a joke.

Who does Italy have to come in for Pirlo? Montolivo lmao?

Who does Juventus have to come in for Pirlo? Marrone? lmao

Who does Spain have to come in for Iniesta? Mata, Cazorla, Pedro and Navas?

Who does Barca have to come in for Iniesta? Cesc, Thiago,Tello, Pedro?

And some how Iniesta is just as important to Spain and Barca as Pirlo was to Italy and Juventus

Please let me know what Iniesta has done as individual in 2012 that makes him sooooooooooooo deserving i would really like to know.

But some how i doubt you even know the reasons.

Also did Whitestar call me a hater ? ( when i have said many times i like Barca) and a bandwagoner when i'm a Newcastle fan?

Oh I dont know, like maybe for instance.... saying that Silva played better at the Euro... maybe?

As for the rest... thats good and all but football isnt all about having the most famous name in the world otherwise los galacticos would have won a helluva lot more than they did...

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

Diego Armando Maradona wrote:I didnt say whether messi deserves it or not this year.

I thought you were implying that he didn't deserve it this year. 2010 is still controversial but I personally I agree with SAF and believe that (all compatriot bias aside) Diego Milito deserved it more from his Inter performances as his contribution was far more influential than Sneijder's. The man scored in 3 finals: brace in the CL final, cup final and last matchday.

If anyone deserved it from Inter that year then it was Milito. As you said he scored in the 3 finals including a brace in the CL final. And IIRC wasnt he voted the best player in Europe that year?

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:How am i underrating Iniesta

What did he do last season for Barca? what did he do for Spain that was special.

Ibra has had a better 2012, Falcao has, Messi has, Pirlo has, Benzema has, CR has, Van Persie has and many more has.

Someone please explain to what Iniesta has done in 2012 that's deserving of a top 3 nomination.

Apart from being flashy with no end product.

Without Pirlo Italy don't get to Euro final stop denying it you all know it and without Pirlo Juve don't win Serie A again stop denying it.

Without Iniesta Spain still win the Euros to even argue otherwise is a joke.

Who does Italy have to come in for Pirlo? Montolivo lmao?

Who does Juventus have to come in for Pirlo? Marrone? lmao

Who does Spain have to come in for Iniesta? Mata, Cazorla, Pedro and Navas?

Who does Barca have to come in for Iniesta? Cesc, Thiago,Tello, Pedro?

And some how Iniesta is just as important to Spain and Barca as Pirlo was to Italy and Juventus

Please let me know what Iniesta has done as individual in 2012 that makes him sooooooooooooo deserving i would really like to know.

But some how i doubt you even know the reasons.

Also did Whitestar call me a hater ? ( when i have said many times i like Barca) and a bandwagoner when i'm a Newcastle fan?

Hater yes

Bandwagoners to others

harhar11 wrote:

Diego Armando Maradona wrote:this aint the ballon dor, the ballon dor died. This is the fifa ballon dor, totally different voting structure designed to give players like messi awards they dont deserve instead of the player whom actually had the best sporting achievement

Thank god the old voting system died seeing as it always went to the most famous player of the team who won the most trophies/Euro/WC and not to the player who PLAYED the best. Like with Zidane in 98, he wasnt the best french player, it was thuram(he was actually voted the 3rd best player of the WC after Ronaldo and kahn I belive) and yet Zidane won because he was the most famous player of the french team or like in 02 when Ronaldo won it when Rivaldo had just as good of a WC as him but the difference was that Rivaldo did actually play club football that year...

no zidane did enough to deserve it that year. He also had a great season with Juve, winning serie a and making cl final. but his awards in 2000 and 2003 are not deserved.

Mole the thing with the X player is more influential for his team than Y player is that it doesn't really mean anything. Yes, Pirlo has no appropriate replacement at Juve last season, but so what? Atalanta have no appropriate replacement for German Denis, does that make him better than RVP? (obviously I'm exaggerating here to prove a point). Influence should obviously be taken into account, and it is important, but the fact that a team has no appropriate replacement for him says more about the quality of the bench than it does about the quality of the player. Just because a team is more reliant on a player doesn't make that player better.

If you could choose between getting Iniesta or Pirlo at Newcastle exactly a year ago (and assuming they wouldn't get injured the same as over the past year, since the experiences would've been different), who would you have picked?

Muzza wrote:

harhar11 wrote:

Diego Armando Maradona wrote:this aint the ballon dor, the ballon dor died. This is the fifa ballon dor, totally different voting structure designed to give players like messi awards they dont deserve instead of the player whom actually had the best sporting achievement

Thank god the old voting system died seeing as it always went to the most famous player of the team who won the most trophies/Euro/WC and not to the player who PLAYED the best. Like with Zidane in 98, he wasnt the best french player, it was thuram(he was actually voted the 3rd best player of the WC after Ronaldo and kahn I belive) and yet Zidane won because he was the most famous player of the french team or like in 02 when Ronaldo won it when Rivaldo had just as good of a WC as him but the difference was that Rivaldo did actually play club football that year...

no zidane did enough to deserve it that year. He also had a great season with Juve, winning serie a and making cl final. but his awards in 2000 and 2003 are not deserved.

Thuram deserved more than Zidane, no?

Iniesta was average in the euro nothing more and we all know of what he is capable

Muzza wrote:

Dante wrote:Is it me or this is the first time in GL history that this annual thread has gone free of Ronaldo vs Messi bitchfight , up to page 4 ?

People understand where those two stand now, there's no need to debate about it. Ronaldo will always be in his shadow. Now we have to decide who's the 3rd best player in the world.

I still can't understand this kind of comments ^ They are both totally different players in my eyes with different characteristics

Silva created more chances, scored more goals, had more assists.....

Just because he's not a Barca player it is possible for him to be good you know.

Silva was very good at the Euros and much better than Iniesta.

The only outstanding performance Iniesta gave was the group stage game against Italy apart from that Silva out performed him.

Not sure how i can be bias when we are discussing an Italian player and a Spanish player and another Spanish player.

1. I'm half spanish.

2. These players don't play for the team i support.

3. Silva plays for a club i hate

But i must be bias and because i don't agree with Iniesta being godly.


Also BC i'm just replying to the the importance argument and used that as an example of why Pirlo is much more important.

As for your question i would have chose Pirlo, we need a playmaker lol.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

Diego Armando Maradona wrote:I didnt say whether messi deserves it or not this year.

I thought you were implying that he didn't deserve it this year. 2010 is still controversial but I personally I agree with SAF and believe that (all compatriot bias aside) Diego Milito deserved it more from his Inter performances as his contribution was far more influential than Sneijder's. The man scored in 3 finals: brace in the CL final, cup final and last matchday.

I remember sneijder being more influential, at least in the champions league. Milito scored in the final but i think at least one was from a very good sneijder assist iirc. + the world cup killed any chance milito had

harhar11 wrote:

Muzza wrote:

harhar11 wrote:

Thank god the old voting system died seeing as it always went to the most famous player of the team who won the most trophies/Euro/WC and not to the player who PLAYED the best. Like with Zidane in 98, he wasnt the best french player, it was thuram(he was actually voted the 3rd best player of the WC after Ronaldo and kahn I belive) and yet Zidane won because he was the most famous player of the french team or like in 02 when Ronaldo won it when Rivaldo had just as good of a WC as him but the difference was that Rivaldo did actually play club football that year...

no zidane did enough to deserve it that year. He also had a great season with Juve, winning serie a and making cl final. but his awards in 2000 and 2003 are not deserved.

Thuram deserved more than Zidane, no?

Maybe thuram had a better WC, but zidane did too and had a good club season to back it up. Full backs simply don't win the ballon d'or and it's not about it being a popularity contest, you'd have to have a much more extraordinary season that thuram to win a ballon d'or as a full back.

Muzza wrote:

Dante wrote:Is it me or this is the first time in GL history that this annual thread has gone free of Ronaldo vs Messi bitchfight , up to page 4 ?

People understand where those two stand now, there's no need to debate about it. Ronaldo will always be in his shadow. Now we have to decide who's the 3rd best player in the world.

I see the delusion is strong in this one .....

It doesn't matter who was in the other's shadow , the Ronaldo vs Messi bitchfight is an annual GL event and it shall happen ..!

Give it time , it's only a month left

Dante wrote:

Muzza wrote:

Dante wrote:Is it me or this is the first time in GL history that this annual thread has gone free of Ronaldo vs Messi bitchfight , up to page 4 ?

People understand where those two stand now, there's no need to debate about it. Ronaldo will always be in his shadow. Now we have to decide who's the 3rd best player in the world.

I see the delusion is strong in this one .....

It doesn't matter who was in the other's shadow , the Ronaldo vs Messi bitchfight is an annual GL event and it shall happen ..!

Give it time , it's only a month left

it's a bitchfight all over the world and from what i've seen the mods here are very strict on preventing this debate. unelss you go to the clean debate section, which is no fun.

Muzza wrote:it's a bitchfight all over the world and from what i've seen the mods here are very strict on preventing this debate. unelss you go to the clean debate section, which is no fun.

The problem is that the Messi vs CRonaldo bitchfight has grown old. There is actually nothing new to add to it. If you want to enjoy the pointless bitching, you might want to dig out one or the other old thread about the topic and you will find that you read exactly the same stuff again and again.

No the bitchfest didn't happen because the moudrid fanboys haven't logged on yet.

Just to mention don't turn this in Barca vs Real thread because I'll close it and start reducing warning bars

The Iniesta/Xavi vs Pirlo bitchest is much more superior

rwo power wrote:

Muzza wrote:it's a bitchfight all over the world and from what i've seen the mods here are very strict on preventing this debate. unelss you go to the clean debate section, which is no fun.

The problem is that the Messi vs CRonaldo bitchfight has grown old. There is actually nothing new to add to it. If you want to enjoy the pointless bitching, you might want to dig out one or the other old thread about the topic and you will find that you read exactly the same stuff again and again.

This is what i , originaly , thought of.

Is RWO advocating bitch fights as long as they are new and exciting

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Is RWO advocating bitch fights as long as they are new and exciting

Try me. SO FAR you still have 100%... BTT.

*sulk* Again only outfield players....

Understood

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Is RWO advocating bitch fights as long as they are new and exciting

it crossed my mind for a sec , but nah

BarrileteCosmico wrote:The Iniesta/Xavi vs Pirlo bitchest is much more superior

Definitely . Let's take it a step further from Iniesta then , who's already in the top 3 , worthy or not.

Where do people place Xavi and Pirlo in this edition of the award ? There are also some other players as well , like Falcao , Ibra and Casillas , which frankly should be in the top 10 .

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Silva created more chances, scored more goals, had more assists.....
Just because he's not a Barca player it is possible for him to be good you know.

Silva was very good at the Euros and much better than Iniesta.

The only outstanding performance Iniesta gave was the group stage game against Italy apart from that Silva out performed him.

Not sure how i can be bias when we are discussing an Italian player and a Spanish player and another Spanish player.

1. I'm half spanish.

2. These players don't play for the team i support.

3. Silva plays for a club i hate

But i must be bias and because i don't agree with Iniesta being godly.


Also BC i'm just replying to the the importance argument and used that as an example of why Pirlo is much more important.

As for your question i would have chose Pirlo, we need a playmaker lol.

Xavi was one of the players who made the most key passes and yet, after torres, he was the spanish player that was the most criticized. While Torres, with 3 goals and 1 assist to his name and statistically the best player at the tournament was the player who was the most criticized.

What I am saying is that stat = shit way of determining how important a player is to a team. Especially seeing as Iniesta is generally the player who assist the assister. Take a look at Xabi Alonsons first goal against France, Silvas goal against Italy and Torres first goal against Ireland. Iniestas role in them were equally as important as the ones that got the assist and yet that doesnt show in the stat table..

If Iniesta was only good against Italy in the first game then the only game that Silva was outstanding was against Ireland ...

Dante wrote:

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Is RWO advocating bitch fights as long as they are new and exciting

it crossed my mind for a sec , but nah

BarrileteCosmico wrote:The Iniesta/Xavi vs Pirlo bitchest is much more superior

Definitely . Let's take it a step further from Iniesta then , who's already in the top 3 , worthy or not.

Where do people place Xavi and Pirlo in this edition of the award ? There are also some other players as well , like Falcao , Ibra and Casillas , which frankly should be in the top 10 .

For last season alone? Pirlo over Xavi easily. Xavi was inconsistent and injury prone last season. So its not really a hard decision to make...