National teams...

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

rsinatra wrote:but some years ago, no way argentina would be having this much trouble so early at a copa américa... i think. lol especially with the best player in the world on the pitch..

Doesn't that mean that the quality of the competition is more competitive and thus superior?

do you call last year's WC more superior than other WC's you've seen during your life? it's that old saying that when two great teams face each other, you can get pretty bad football..

Adit wrote:no its just that this copa sucks balls

just like last year's wc group stage mostly sucked... im still hoping to be convinced otherwise

I like watching the underdogs play their hearts out and humble the top dogs. I hate 0-0, 1-1, 1-0.

No

What national football might lack in quality at the moment, it makes up for it in a lot of other aspects like national pride, drama, history etc. For example, who didn't enjoy Ghana in the last World Cup? The New Zealand/Slovenia match was a poor game, but New Zealand scoring a last minute equaliser was a great moment.

The quality has declined - though this in itself is debatable - because defending and player conditioning has become more advanced. It's a natural progression.

It seems strange to think that better competition could result in the end of national team football. In fact, I'd go as far as saying that's quite absurd. From a neutral perspective, it's great seeing smaller nations giving the superpowers a tough time. The bigger nations have to improve themselves to overcome this new competition.

rsinatra wrote:

Adit wrote:no its just that this copa sucks balls

just like last year's wc group stage mostly sucked... im still hoping to be convinced otherwise

at least those teams where prepared to take part in WC.argies are far from a prepared team.

with maradona they played better football

rsinatra wrote:

Guiltybystander wrote:This is a ridiculous thread.

Just because the two killer-favorites of the Copa have been underperforming, the era of NTs is over? How do you even come to such a conclusion?

some people didn't watch last year's WC i guess..

and btw i havent come to any conclusion, i am asking questions.. read properly

I don't think it's underperforming, I think it's an increase in competitiveness, which is definitely a good thing.

you're all talking about how it's good that smaller teams are getting stronger, how it's increasing competitiveness, and it's all good. i agree, increased competitiveness can make things more fun, theoretically.

but you seem to have forgotten how many matches at the WC and some of the matches at this copa américa didnt look exciting, they were just plain boring. why? because teams have learnt to defend, with 11 men behind the ball. they dont have to be an awesome team, they just have to fill in the gaps and any team will have a hard time breaking through, especially a team that dont train as often as a club would.

GoonerJay29 wrote:What national football might lack in quality at the moment, it makes up for it in a lot of other aspects like national pride, drama, history etc. For example, who didn't enjoy Ghana in the last World Cup? The New Zealand/Slovenia match was a poor game, but New Zealand scoring a last minute equaliser was a great moment.

The quality has declined - though this in itself is debatable - because defending and player conditioning has become more advanced. It's a natural progression.

It seems strange to think that better competition could result in the end of national team football. In fact, I'd go as far as saying that's quite absurd. From a neutral perspective, it's great seeing smaller nations giving the superpowers a tough time. The bigger nations have to improve themselves to overcome this new competition.

I completely agree with you, the drama hasn't left the game, that has never been my point. The history, etc, it's all still there. What I was asking was whether the quality has declined and will it ever rise again. I don't literally believe they will just shut the NT business and all their competitions for good. Ever.

Once again, it is great to see small nations giving the big ones a tough time, when the match is good. Not when they're playing for 0-0s, for draws in general, like it happened so often last year, and it seems also to be happening this year..

Can anybody see what I mean?

I still put the WC above the Libertadores or the UCL..

It's a struggle tactically right now. NT coaching is just plain bad for the elite teams and much better for the lesser teams interestingly enough. NT scheduling is horrible...

When i was a kid, being the NT coach was what every manager strived for. The glory, even for managers, was at NT competitions. But with the advent of the champion's league, etc., that has shifted... none of the best coaches want to be involved with NT positions. For one, you don't have enough time with the players. Second, it's too political and volatile. Finally, you don't get paid as well.

The ineptitude of FIFA and the payscale issue are eroding the quality of NT play for the elite teams other than Germany. I also think Spain is just cashing in on Barca's great era... Pep is really coaching that team imo lol.

sportsczy wrote:It's a struggle tactically right now. NT coaching is just plain bad for the elite teams and much better for the lesser teams interestingly enough. NT scheduling is horrible...

When i was a kid, being the NT coach was what every manager strived for. The glory, even for managers, was at NT competitions. But with the advent of the champion's league, etc., that has shifted... none of the best coaches want to be involved with NT positions. For one, you don't have enough time with the players. Second, it's too political and volatile. Finally, you don't get paid as well.

The ineptitude of FIFA and the payscale issue are eroding the quality of NT play for the elite teams other than Germany. I also think Spain is just cashing in on Barca's great era... Pep is really coaching that team imo lol.

Yes, somebody has understood my point!! Thank you!

But then, do you think that with the right administration it can rise up above club competitions again?

Adit wrote:

rsinatra wrote:

Adit wrote:no its just that this copa sucks balls

just like last year's wc group stage mostly sucked... im still hoping to be convinced otherwise

at least those teams where prepared to take part in WC.argies are far from a prepared team.

with maradona they played better football

interesting post, i mean, everyone hated maradona didnt they? then sergio took over and beat the likes of spain, etc, so everyone loved him. wtf is going on now?

i know maradona wasnt great as a coach, but at least they did win some matches and score some goals!!

rsinatra wrote:

sportsczy wrote:It's a struggle tactically right now. NT coaching is just plain bad for the elite teams and much better for the lesser teams interestingly enough. NT scheduling is horrible...

When i was a kid, being the NT coach was what every manager strived for. The glory, even for managers, was at NT competitions. But with the advent of the champion's league, etc., that has shifted... none of the best coaches want to be involved with NT positions. For one, you don't have enough time with the players. Second, it's too political and volatile. Finally, you don't get paid as well.

The ineptitude of FIFA and the payscale issue are eroding the quality of NT play for the elite teams other than Germany. I also think Spain is just cashing in on Barca's great era... Pep is really coaching that team imo lol.

Yes, somebody has understood my point!! Thank you!

But then, do you think that with the right administration it can rise up above club competitions again?

It has to start with the domestic federations being professional and competitive about hiring big time coaches. Then, the scheduling has to makes some sense lol. I think players in Europe are asked to play too much football these days. When summer roles around (most of these NT competitions are in the summer), the players on the elite teams in Europe are destroyed physically.

You have the supercups, club wc, etc... just a lot of extra competition. Game has become more physical too.

The small NT team players play far, far less at the club level and are able to get adequately prepared for NT.

In short, get the coaching and scheduling right first. I don't see the schedule decreasing at the club level unfortunately... but at least tighten up the friendlies and qualifying schedules a lot more. As a note, Germany will always have an advantage because the Bundesliga ends 30 days before anyone else. They've got it right!

As a NT coach, it's not about just selecting the best players. It's also figuring out who is physically able to compete in the summer. Sometimes you need to save some players for later rounds of a competition just so they can recover a bit...

Mentality is also a problem nowadays. Most teams don't want to lose as opposed to trying to win at all cost. The tactical mindset is much more conservative unfortunately.

rsinatra wrote:

Adit wrote:

rsinatra wrote:

Adit wrote:no its just that this copa sucks balls

just like last year's wc group stage mostly sucked... im still hoping to be convinced otherwise

at least those teams where prepared to take part in WC.argies are far from a prepared team.

with maradona they played better football

interesting post, i mean, everyone hated maradona didnt they? then sergio took over and beat the likes of spain, etc, so everyone loved him. wtf is going on now?

i know maradona wasnt great as a coach, but at least they did win some matches and score some goals!!

Argentina has a tendency to not score without Higuain. They really need his tap-ins...

I enjoyed yesteray's Colombia vs. Argetina, its not all about goals people...

Peru vs Uruguay was also a great match. Even thought i got mad for the draw, i wanted a win, it was an amazing show.

Uruguay wrote:I enjoyed yesteray's Colombia vs. Argetina, its not all about goals people...

same here,argentina x colombia was a great match,people need to stop thinking that goals=good matches

Ganso wrote:

Uruguay wrote:I enjoyed yesteray's Colombia vs. Argetina, its not all about goals people...

same here,argentina x colombia was a great match,people need to stop thinking that goals=good matches

I'm not, but no matter how good it was from the neutral point of view, Argentina did underperform, and that led to a discussion between my friend and I about the current situation with NTs in general. I have watched 0-0's that were better than 3-0's.. but that's not the case lately.. matches at the WC and other NT competitions have been quite boring, with or without goals.. read what sportsczy has been writing and you'll understand me better!

Last WC. the japan vs Denmark gamewas excellent. And many other games as well. You can see a lot of Dram in the games. The Tactical approach was prevelent in the Champions league as well. I don't count Barca trounsing Malaga or Shakhtar as excitment. And the excitment that was in the Inter games was due to the inept Leo. I don\t think Inter fans liked that.

NT's are just a waste of time.

I personally love NT football. Theres no such feeling as the one that you get when the World Cup is coming up

Jeps33178 wrote:I personally love NT football. Theres no such feeling as the one that you get when the World Cup is coming up

Definitely, a WC year is a sacred year. But the last one was really below any expectations I had.