3-5-2 in Europe

It pains me to have to write all of this again so i'm gonna be a little less elaborate and apologies for any typo's because i'm rushing through this one.


3-5-2 is terrible in Europe, and this is compounded by the fact we put most of our attacking plays through our wing backs who can't attack at all


Our midfield and attack don't link up, our most creative player is 40 yards behind them and long balls are resorted to when a diagonal to our wing backs isn't on. Either way it's a bad tactic.

Our defence are lapsing in concentration, this is worrying. And a back 3 is just not cutting it in Europe, that's one extra CB to pass back to instead of another attacking player who can help link the MF to the attack. It needs to be scrapped


When we switched to a back 4, the game came to life. Defensively we were no less vulnerable, Pirlo started to spray his passes about like he uses to, Quags was great in that left forward type role. I'm sure he played similarly at Udinese.


Isla.... needs to be scrapped



His first 10 times with the ball resulted in it being lost 9 times. It never improved after that either, I just gave up counting. A truely awful player


Asa and Licht don't have the attacking capabilities for a 3-5-2 in games like this. And quite frankle if we persist with a 3-5-2 in Europe we're going nowhere but home.

Agree i said it before we need to use 4-3-3.
Why?

1.Our attack has improved a lot from last season but more teams in Serie A and CL like Torino,Copenhagen and Galata now play more defensively.We saw it tonight and against Copenhagen that they always have our strikers double or triple marked.Our attackers need more space,Llorente is useful in this situations but players like Tevez need more space.Adding a 3rd striker will create enoug space near our opponents box.

2.Our midfield is one of the best in the world.We are lucky to have great players like Pirlo,Vidal,Marchisio and a wc talent like Pogba.(Hopefuly we also get Nainggolan).Im 100% sure that our midfield is good enough to stand the pressure and create many chances.We have the right players to play on a 3 man midfield.Marchisio and Vidal can hold opponents very well and Pirlo does what he was born to do.We don't need to have much extra help from the wingers.

3.Wingers.I consider them our big problem.We have tireless hardworker wingers but we must accept they don't offer to much in attack.When we play against R.M we'll be facing CR7 and Bale,our wingers should focus more on their defensive duty.This will make them even more useless in attack but playing them in a 4-3-3 will make us more solid in defense.

So by changing formation to 4-3-3 we solve two problems: We are more effective in attack against defensive opponents (small teams parking bus just to steal a few points) and we are more solid defensively against strong opponents we will face in CL.

The 3-5-2 has to go for one simple reason, not the claims you guys are theorizing but it's as simple as this:

Why start with an extra defender if you concede the first goal regardless?

There's no explanation. The 3-5-2 costs juventus an extra attacker at the benefit of: ? It's not defensive stability, not this season.

I agree with that also, but that's on the defensive side of things

offensively playing through two completely useless attackers is also criminal.

4-3-3 is a good idea but how the hell are we gonna do it with our current player roster?. In all seriousness we should consider selling marchisio ( i no he is world class and a juve legend blah blah) but we need money for wingers! we should try for nani in jan maybe sanchez too but i don't no where this money is gonna come from without player sales

We won't play 4-3-3 anytime soon because we don't have LB and we don't have wings that comeback to defend only pepe is capable of that you can't count on Vucinic on doing that and Giovinco (lol)...


3-5-2 isn't working because we don't have the player who steals balls and cuts oppositions passes aka Marchisio ever since Marchisio was injured and moved to the bench our midfield is in crises Pirlo and Pogba can't coexist. Marchisio had 96% accuracy of the passes and I forgot how many stolen balls against Chievo that speaks about it self.

Pogba is not ready for first team action every match he lacks consistency

No doubt Marchisio is missed but the fact is so many attacks are directed through our wing backs

Neither of whom can attack to a half-decent level.

Tomwin Lannister wrote:No doubt Marchisio is missed but the fact is so many attacks are directed through our wing backs

Neither of whom can attack to a half-decent level.

ofc they will last year the triangles were made from Marchisio - Vidal - Pirlo , Marchisio - Pirlo - Vucinic, Marchisio - Vidal - Vucinic.

( explained all ) :


Now Marchisio is on the bench for a kid that's full of talent and potential but not ready for first team yet, Vucinci is injured for 2 months already ..

4-3-1-2 guys. In January we HAVE to buy a proper left-back though.

4-3-1-2 is one of the worst formations to play in Europe.

If Conte wants to persist with his 3-5-2 he needs an offensive RWB, I think Cuadrado would be perfect for you guys tbh.

When I watch juve it seems that the striker or strikers (sometimes it seems that only one of the 2 is a clear striker) is very, very isolated. And there is no point of passing the ball to him all the time.. even if hes Tevez.

Also, the lack of a DMF is a problem. Or atleast a ball winning CMF. When everybody is forward (also the WBs) then a counter attack is disasterous - imagine Ronaldo nad Di Maria against Pirlo and couple of CBs.

If you play 4-3-3 then the "wingers" wont probably work back enough, unless you play scrub like Pepe or somthing like that. But that would mean NO attacking threat what so ever..

Against Real Madrid we definitely have to persist with 3-5-2, but against weaker teams like Copenhagen & Galata we could surely go with a 4-3-3, even we don't have really capable players for every position.

I agree with you Tom, but the reason Conte has been using the 3-5-2 for almost 2 seasons is because Juve doesn't have actual wingers and also not a proper Left back (Chiellini doesn't add much offensively, Asamoah isn't a LB in a 4 man defense and De Ceglie and Peluso are average at best) and the 3-5-2 is the formation where Barzagli, Bonucci, Chiellini, Pirlo, Marchisio, Vidal (Juve's best players IMO) can all play in their best positions. I mean if you're trying to say that Conte and Marotta should've bought players to allow tactical alternatives I agree with you, but that's a whole different story, Conte will play 3-5-2 at least until january for these reasons, IMO.

u guys are crazy. Lich is one of the best RB in the world, period.

i dont think 4-3-3 is the way to go. 4-2-3-1 should be our formation, with a double pivot of marchisio and vidal, DROPPING pirlo. thats my 2 cents

like it or not isla WILL play, Juventus needs for him to maintain his value to sell him at a proper price

Casciavit wrote:4-3-1-2 is one of the worst formations to play in Europe.

If Conte wants to persist with his 3-5-2 he needs an offensive RWB, I think Cuadrado would be perfect for you guys tbh.

It's best suited to what we've got and it is a formation with mechanics very similar to the 3-5-2 we currently play. We can't just switch to 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 out of the blue with no players suited for those formations and the whole pre-season training being spent focused on 3-5-2.

Changing formations isn't a simple matter. There are many factors to consider.

Besides isn't 4-3-1-2 the formation Milan used in 2007 to win the Chapions Leauge ?

There is no reason we cant play a 433. Asamoah played leftback for about half an hour yesterday and was actually doing very well, both on the attacking and defending side of the ball. Hes also said hes willing to play there, as well as playingthrere very often for Ghana.

Now as for the winger problem. The problem is you guys are putting Tevez on the left and then comparing Giovinco or Vucinic to Pepe when it comes to workrate. Thing is, it doesnt matter which sides yhey have, but it would work perfectly with Tevez and Vucinic flanking Llorente. Vucinic is the same as himself from 11/12. Llorente isnt any more lazy than Matri. And Tevez and Pepe have identical workrates. So whats the problem? I say we go like this and tear shit up.

I have to laugh a little bit when people say Pogba is inconsistent and then suggest Marchisio... oh that model of consistency I don't think i even remember Marchisio playing in the second half of last season

sportsczy wrote:I have to laugh a little bit when people say Pogba is inconsistent and then suggest Marchisio... oh that model of consistency  I don't think i even remember Marchisio playing in the second half of last season

Marchisio may be inconsistent in giving assists or scoring goals but with the characteristics of his game he always and in every game helps the other 2 of the midfield have an easier job. He's no Gerrard or Lampart but he's definitely vital for this team.

There should not be a matter of comparison between Marchisio and Pogba. Both contribute differently and both should play.

sportsczy wrote:I have to laugh a little bit when people say Pogba is inconsistent and then suggest Marchisio... oh that model of consistency  I don't think i even remember Marchisio playing in the second half of last season

Not to mention Pogba has played non-stop and he's the only one in the squad that incidently,hasnt been rested at all.Everyone else have been rested for a game or two.

I like Claudio,but it really annoys me how people over here paint him as our saviour or something.If you people think Pogba is inconsistent ,then so is Marchisio.3-5-2 isnt working because there is no proper Wing-back in the squad someone who can take on your man beat your marker and be able to cross ,we dont have them,not because the 'hero' Marchisio isnt playing even if his presence was missed in different aspects of our game.He is an important part of our squad but its silly to say his absence is the only thing affecting our tactics.3-5-2 got exposed last year too against quality teams.

Andrew_p wrote:

sportsczy wrote:I have to laugh a little bit when people say Pogba is inconsistent and then suggest Marchisio... oh that model of consistency  I don't think i even remember Marchisio playing in the second half of last season

Marchisio may be inconsistent in giving assists or scoring goals but with the characteristics of his game he always and in every game helps the other 2 of the midfield have an easier job. He's no Gerrard or Lampart but he's definitely vital for this team.

There should not be a matter of comparison between Marchisio and Pogba. Both contribute differently and both should play.

I agree.Going forward ,that should be the plan anyway.But i really dont like how some posters diss one player just to make another player look good.

Pogba has been subject of some unnecessary criticism over here.

S wrote:

Andrew_p wrote:

sportsczy wrote:I have to laugh a little bit when people say Pogba is inconsistent and then suggest Marchisio... oh that model of consistency  I don't think i even remember Marchisio playing in the second half of last season

Marchisio may be inconsistent in giving assists or scoring goals but with the characteristics of his game he always and in every game helps the other 2 of the midfield have an easier job. He's no Gerrard or Lampart but he's definitely vital for this team.

There should not be a matter of comparison between Marchisio and Pogba. Both contribute differently and both should play.

I agree.Going forward ,that should be the plan anyway.But i really dont like how some posters diss one player just to make another player look good.

Pogba has been subject of some unnecessary criticism over here.

I understand your frustration. I've been around since the goal.com forums and I know how people can be. This is the reason why I've stopped being an active poster.

Anyway, on topic. In my opinion we are blessed to have both, and should take advantage of it instead of fighting for who's better.

I dont write much but i must put my opinion here coz i'm furious on this Juve.I know that Juve players cant keep their form for 3 yrs at top but also you cant put a display like last night.The team was without idea and i blame Conte for that.And ofcourse the teams that we play against already read the conte "tactics" ( if a can say tactics) and they sit back and counter us . I dont blame the back line i blame the whole team.I read a Marchisio (i think ) interview and he said that he is happy to see that Tevez i eager to play and has that hunger for trophies like they did past two yrs.Indirectly i think that he said that boys arent that eager to win as last years.Also someone above mentioned that CR and Di Maria will tear apart our defence on counters and that is for sure.But on the other side lets be real that this is the max that Conte can get from this team.We won 2 Scudettos and 2 Super Coppa coz the team was more eager more willing to win something and we were injury free also.Now maybe somebody will laugh but we are missing our main man (Pepe) coz his presents,his runs,his will makes other to do their best.We missed that guy last season but coz the lack of competiton it wasnt so noticable.But this year we will feel the gap that Pepe left.Forza Juventus

I don't think the 4-3-1-2 is the way to go, we need 2 man on each flank otherwise there isn't much point of switching formations


Yes, it's true we don't have any true wingers that excell in a 4-3-3. But what people seem to be forgetting, is the fact that we don't have any true wing backs. But people forget this completely

We have an energetic, one footed CM playing as LWB and a great RB being asked to be our main attacking outlet in lichtsteiner, and he's pretty awful at crossing, and not a good dribbler. But a great RB.

I'd rather play strikers as wide forwards than play 2 attackingly useless players as wing backs. Keeping in mind most plays end up with our wing backs wide of the box crossing in or cutting the ball back.


Vucinic can do pretty well on the flank, so can Quagliarella.


I'll admit that our right wing is somewhat difficult to fill without Pepe as Conte said. But a 4-3-3 with a makeshift winger is better against teams who park the bus than a 3-5-2 with 2 makeshift wingbacks who offer nothing offensively. Not to menion 2 completely isolated strikers, resulting in us playing terrible, slow, long ball football against teams we ought to be picking apart.

C.Marchisio #8 wrote:I dont write much but i must put my opinion here  coz i'm furious on this Juve.I know that Juve players cant keep their form for 3 yrs at top but also you cant put a display like last night.The team was without idea and i blame Conte for that.And ofcourse the teams that we play against already read the conte "tactics" ( if a can say tactics) and they sit back and counter us . I dont blame the back line i blame the whole team.I read a Marchisio (i think ) interview and he said that he is happy to see that Tevez i eager to play and has that hunger for trophies like they did past two yrs.Indirectly i think that he said  that boys arent that eager to win as last years.Also  someone above mentioned that CR and Di Maria will tear apart our defence on counters and that is for sure.But on the other side lets be real that this is the max that Conte can get from this team.We won 2 Scudettos and 2 Super Coppa coz the team was more eager more willing to win something and we were injury free also.Now maybe somebody will laugh but we are missing our main man (Pepe) coz his presents,his runs,his will makes other to do their best.We missed that guy last season but coz the lack of competiton it wasnt so noticable.But this year we will feel the gap that Pepe left.Forza Juventus

Not disagreeing with you but common dude we can do better than freaking Pepe.He hasnt played football for 1.5 years.If you are saying we need someone in his mold with slightly more skill ,i agree though.

This whole 'we cant play 4-3-3 without Pepe' thing sounds like a horrible excuse to me.If he really needed a RW in the team,the problem should've been addressed earlier.

sportsczy wrote:I have to laugh a little bit when people say Pogba is inconsistent and then suggest Marchisio... oh that model of consistency  I don't think i even remember Marchisio playing in the second half of last season

I am not dissing Pogba he is awesome but he can't coexist in midfield with Pirlo and he goes forward often leaveing us with no BWM or DM. Marchisio always, always is back in the defense which is his strongest side of the game and the area he covers is to damn big