The Pogba War

The Demon of Carthage wrote:Also, if you think he won't go to France because he'd be criticized, then you certainly don't know Madrid. He'd be ripped to smithereens week in and week out with criticism. Real Madrid is the most ruthless club in the world, I'm not saying this as a fan, but more like a general observation. He'd be whistled and scapegoated at times and he won't be handed the understanding and patience he's enjoying at Juventus.

He's not being criticized in France because of his play...  he's criticized because French people are jealous of other French people's success.  It's a disease here.  Whenever a French person becomes successful, they go out of their way to turn him down.

One of the big reasons Sarkozy didn't get elected was that he was too bling for France...  beautiful wife and wealthy.  It's a no no here strangely.  Most places would celebrate a guy like that and want him to run the country BECAUSE he succeeded in life.

In Madrid, the pressure is about performance.  No problem for Pogba there.  He had the same pressure at Juve, which is the equivalent of Real Madrid in Italy.  His play has been under the microscope for years.

Luca wrote:

S wrote:

The Demon of Carthage wrote:S, I completely understand what you're trying to say. But be that as it may, 120m is too much for him.

That is for Real Madrid to decide. A player is worth what a club is willing to pay.

A player's worth and value are two different things

Pogba would have to cure cancer to be worth 120M, let's be real
Great player, very talented, very popular and young but nowhere, and I mean nowhere, near a 120M player

But I'm also speaking in real terms, not the football manager that's being played in modern football

Why should his market value matter here though ? If Madrid are happy to pay 120M for Pogba, then thats that.

Bale was also not worth 100M but none is batting an eyelid regarding the price now because he's proven his worth. Same for Dybala. He's doubled his value now actually.

I dont know why we should be even be discussing this considering Pogba is not even in his prime and still got a long way to go. Take into account inflation going forward, that price could even be looked at as reasonable depending on how he performs. He is of course not a 120M player but you're also paying for potential here.

agree with S, you have to take into account that Pogba isn't in his prime yet. Serie A is for the folks looking to retire or develop before moving on to bigger things. Think in 3 years time people will look at Pogba's fee and say it was more than worth it. Besides Madrid will get 60m for James from United.

S wrote:

Luca wrote:

S wrote:


That is for Real Madrid to decide. A player is worth what a club is willing to pay.

A player's worth and value are two different things

Pogba would have to cure cancer to be worth 120M, let's be real
Great player, very talented, very popular and young but nowhere, and I mean nowhere, near a 120M player

But I'm also speaking in real terms, not the football manager that's being played in modern football

Why should his market value matter here though ? If Madrid are happy to pay 120M for Pogba, then thats that.

Bale was also not worth 100M but none is batting an eyelid regarding the price now because he's proven his worth. Same for Dybala. He's doubled his value now actually.

I dont know why we should be even be discussing this considering Pogba is not even in his prime and still got a long way to go. Take into account inflation going forward, that price could even be looked at as reasonable depending on how he performs. He is of course not a 120M player but you're also paying for potential here.

Lots of people discussed Bale's cost actually, validly so.

Potential eh, what are we discussing here? The stock market or football players.

It's simpler than some are trying to make it. Pogba has no release clause, a big name, is marketable, and young (young = potential, we've established that). So yes, Juventus will not be held to any price and will go for max, in this case 120M.

Him being worth it is subjective and certainly cannot be ascertained at the time of his transfer but only after evaluating his time with whatever club he joins.

His value, also subjective and in my humble opinion, there is only one player who has the value of 120M and he wears #10 for Barcelona and is the greatest player of all time.

I like to say this a lot but it applies.

You are only worth what you have the leverage to negotiate, anything else is hot air and nonsense imo.

Unique wrote: if someone said to me Liverpool can have pogba or give klopp 100mil on top of the budget he has I would say give klopp the money.

I'd definitely say take Pogba

you can then sell Can and Coutinho for 100m, because Pogba does alone what those two do on the pitch combined, and then some

Luca wrote:

S wrote:

Luca wrote:


A player's worth and value are two different things

Pogba would have to cure cancer to be worth 120M, let's be real
Great player, very talented, very popular and young but nowhere, and I mean nowhere, near a 120M player

But I'm also speaking in real terms, not the football manager that's being played in modern football

Why should his market value matter here though ? If Madrid are happy to pay 120M for Pogba, then thats that.

Bale was also not worth 100M but none is batting an eyelid regarding the price now because he's proven his worth. Same for Dybala. He's doubled his value now actually.

I dont know why we should be even be discussing this considering Pogba is not even in his prime and still got a long way to go. Take into account inflation going forward, that price could even be looked at as reasonable depending on how he performs. He is of course not a 120M player but you're also paying for potential here.

Lots of people discussed Bale's cost actually, validly so.

Potential eh, what are we discussing here? The stock market or football players.

It's simpler than some are trying to make it. Pogba has no release clause, a big name, is marketable, and young (young = potential, we've established that). So yes, Juventus will not be held to any price and will go for max, in this case 120M.

Him being worth it is subjective and certainly cannot be ascertained at the time of his transfer but only after evaluating his time with whatever club he joins.

His value, also subjective and in my humble opinion, there is only one player who has the value of 120M and he wears #10 for Barcelona and is the greatest player of all time.

I'm telling you, none is going bother about Pogba's price if he can regularly influence games and win matches for Madrid like Bale is doing now. Its that simple.

And people who support billion dollar corporations like Madrid shouldnt really fussed about the price calling it 'too much' or discussing player's worth as long as the club is completely happy to pay what the selling club wants.

Why is this a debate i dont even know. Not like its our money.

For the sort of cash that has been talked about, i'd carry him to his next club myself.


As long as we spend a chunk of his money on a top replacement who is no older than say 27 then i'm happy. I trust Beppe to reinvest wisely and the great man will have about 4 different plans in his head before we even agree to sell Pogba.

I'd be going nuts if we had an incompetent director but we clearly don't so i'm up for this.


However, the sell train has to stop here. Period. We use this money to start having real cracks at the CL and we build. Otherwise we'll be selling the occasional first team player every few years and end up stuck in an irritating loop.

Tomwin Lannister wrote:For the sort of cash that has been talked about, i'd carry him to his next club myself.


As long as we spend a chunk of his money on a top replacement who is no older than say 27 then i'm happy. I trust Beppe to reinvest wisely and the great man will have about 4 different plans in his head before we even agree to sell Pogba.

I'd be going nuts if we had an incompetent director but we clearly don't so i'm up for this.


However, the sell train has to stop here. Period. We use this money to start having real cracks at the CL and we build. Otherwise we'll be selling the occasional first team player every few years and end up stuck in an irritating loop.

Cannot agree more.

irritating loop you say?

Spoiler:

Tomwin Lannister wrote:For the sort of cash that has been talked about, i'd carry him to his next club myself.


As long as we spend a chunk of his money on a top replacement who is no older than say 27 then i'm happy. I trust Beppe to reinvest wisely and the great man will have about 4 different plans in his head before we even agree to sell Pogba.

I'd be going nuts if we had an incompetent director but we clearly don't so i'm up for this.


However, the sell train has to stop here. Period. We use this money to start having real cracks at the CL and we build. Otherwise we'll be selling the occasional first team player every few years and end up stuck in an irritating loop.

Agreed. The only problem I foresee is if Pogba is sold this summer it might not leave adequate time for a replacement or rather, reinvestment

People like to discuss "worth" as if it's a subjective thing lol... it's market driven.  It's whatever a buyer is willing to pay.  No more, no less.

Nobody cares about perceived value or what some random person thinks is "fair".

Keep having these discussions... first it was Neymar, then Bale, then Di Maria, then Martial and now Pogba.  Last I checked, Barca, Madrid, PSG and Man U aren't struggling for money despite spending massive amounts for these players.  If the purchase prices were crazy, you would expect these clubs to lose money and/or lose value.  In fact, the exact opposite has happened. Whatever losses these clubs take on some purchases, it is easily absorbed by the gains they make.

I don't understand why market economics is such a foreign concept.

Hapless_Hans wrote:

Unique wrote: if someone said to me Liverpool can have pogba or give klopp 100mil on top of the budget he has I would say give klopp the money.

I'd definitely say take Pogba

you can then sell Can and Coutinho for 100m, because Pogba does alone what those two do on the pitch combined, and then some

if your gonna pay 100mil for a player he needs to be bribging either 40+ goals with him or a shit load of clean sheets. he wont bring either.

The reason we are against Pogba signing is not just about money. Real doesn't have unlimited budget contrary to what people believe and if we spend 120 on one player that means we turn a blind eye towards the actual needs.

Another problem is, he is really not a 120 million player, even if you include marketing or anything, he isn't even more talented than James Rodriguez nor is he now marketable than the former. At best he should be going for 80.

Pogba coming in will destroy our cl winning midfield. He will force his way into the lineup replacing Casemiro and Kroos will be back to DM. Good times.

Really? Did Zidane bring goals and clean sheets? What the heck are you talking about

Believe it or not this is still the team game that relies heavily on tactics and strategies along with ofcourse the quality. But sadly in the commercial world we live , we should have the best player in the world or best young talent,whatever that is. 120 million is huge sum if invested properly which can be expected from the club like Juve. Last year the team which cost 70 millions was in final eliminating treble winning Barca at QF and mighty Bayern in semis.

Madrid can EASILY afford Pogba because he is so freaking popular in the world today that he will more than make up for his purchase price and wages...   even when Bale sucked for his first 2 years here (until this season), it was never a doubt that Madrid were cashing in on the purchase.  And even if he didn't pan out as a player, they would recover a lot of the cost on a resale.

It's the exact same thing with Pogba.  He's a superstar at the age of 23.

And last I checked, Madrid aren't struggling at all financially.  In fact, according to most reports, Madrid is running out of things to spend money on...  remember that the club is a non-profit and is supposed to spend the monies it has on football or football related activities.  It CANNOT hold onto its cash.  Incredibly, the club is struggling to spend... and we're talking 100s of millions of euros here. It's already budgeted in the new stadium and all the different development projects.

sportsczy wrote:Really?  Did Zidane bring goals and clean sheets?  What the heck are you talking about

your not going to say the pogba is in the same lge as zidane are you. and my point is what will he bring to madrid they don't already have. imo any player that costs 120mil or what ever it is would need to improve that team massively.

Is Martial in the same league as Pogba?  With bonuses, which are 90% going to hit, Man U paid 80 mil for Martial.

Was Bale in the same league as Pogba is today when Madrid bought him? Was James in the same league?

Etc.

Unique wrote:

sportsczy wrote:Really?  Did Zidane bring goals and clean sheets?  What the heck are you talking about

your not going to say the pogba is in the same lge as zidane are you. and my point is what will he bring to madrid they don't already have. imo any player that costs 120mil or what ever it is would need to improve that team massively.

he is a box to box midfield that brings verticality from the midfield. We have no such player lol

Bale wasn't mediocre in his first season sports. he was very good actually. it was his second season when he was abysmal.

and i'm all for buying pogba if it's zidane's call. I still think that kroos and modric are both better footballers but if zidane thinks that pogba can improve our team then i'm all for it. he's a great player.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:irritating loop you say?

Spoiler:

All I see here is a loop of perfection

WIth Pogba coming, that would mean Kroos and James will be sold. THey both can easy be sold for 60M, which will balance out with the fee for Pogba!!!!!

Gtfo with plans such as selling Kroos for dispossessgba.

You've got to laugh at Real Madrid fans, juggling with hundreds of millions of dollars every transfer window, fantasizing about selling this and that player to make room for this or that new hyped star, as if the football world is their department store.

Then they spend all season complaining about Uncle Flo.

Hapless_Hans wrote:You've got to laugh at Real Madrid fans, juggling with hundreds of millions of dollars every transfer window, fantasizing about selling this and that player to make room for this or that new hyped star, as if the football world is their department store.

Then they spend all season complaining about Uncle Flo.

I was going to type similar thing. Ever wondered why Perez is the president in the first place? Because he is the refection of the average Madrid fan. You will only find this blow up the team mentality in Madrid fans.. They deserves Perez. He completes them.