Re: Silly season

by Doc Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:19 pm

Let's be honest, like Iniesta, I doubt Zanetti knows what his real position is :p

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:20 pm

how often does Zanetti do that? does it make that kind of run every game?

then again, Arbeloa can look on youtube as well Wink

Lass is has a poor shot, yet he has scored screamers.

by guest7 Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:28 pm

Arbeloa got a nice pass from Alonso whereas Zanetti took the ball from the defence up to 1v1 with the goalkeeper. I'm sure they are uncomparable whereas Zanetti are miles better than Arbeloa both in defence and attack.

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:32 pm

My point is that Zanetti can do nice things, but he isnt a genuine attacker.

Arebelo showed fantastic skills beating the defender with the first touch and feints, that's electric enough for me.

not comparing both, but Zanetti was very disciplined in the defending, and wouldnt bomb forward as much as Maicon used to, they would always try to keep a shape with 3 defenders at the back.

And very often, Chivu was playing left like against barca, and Zanetti was DM.

by guest7 Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:34 pm

Yea Zanetti moves up to midfield sometimes and sometimes Marcelo plays as a winger. We're talking about a versatile player so ofc he can move him forward if needed. Zanetti does attack often tho and not 1 time only, I see him as a balanced fullback. Arbeloa is more of a defensive. Zanetti can do both

by The Madrid One Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:47 pm

its more important to say that mou wants an attacking rb, right flank than 2 attacking fullbacks.

anyways its obvious thats the way hes been going since his inception as a madrid manager.

the failed attempt to bring maicon proved that.

to be able to cause buyild up play, and effectively actually attack and be agressive against barcelona, like inter was, you have to defend and distribute, and attack like a team, while changing the tempos of the game.

it is a very important concept when talking about what mou wants.

find it unnesscary to compare how inter only had 1 real attacking fullback.

we are not gonna play like them, but we will learn the basic things to do and then do it in our own style.

arbeloa cant attack for shit, and ramos cant do too good at either defending or attacking as rb against barca.

coentrao----ramos----pepe------marcelo

defensive atheltic juggernauts working together to stop barca's attack's and together in attack as well.

why do you think maicon was so highly rated last season? he was a master at both.

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:55 pm

Maicon wasnt great at defending at all, he had guys like Cambiasso and Lucio covering him, that's pretty nice to have

by The Madrid One Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:57 pm

you get the idea, maicon was the perfect rb for mou, thats why he wanted to buy him.

arbeloa?????

pshhhh

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:58 pm

yes, but you are vastly overrating him and what he used to do. Maicon had tremendous amount of protection, because he was the premier attacking outlet from the back. people were stll beating him often, we used to debate that extensively on the old forum

by The Madrid One Thu Jun 16, 2011 5:02 pm

simply put, mou really wants this rb, there are no rbs our there who fill out what he needs.

except for the dead maicon and probably dani alves.

he has to take the gamble or else his ideal defense will not be formed...

regarding the cb situation, we are gonna get a new cb next season.

as a backup when carvalho leaves, he wont sign a 3rd year, if he does even then we will buy a better bacup than albilo,l.

he always saw ramos at cb, if he turns coentrao into what he wants, then pepe and ramos will do their job.

along with carvalho.

by Onyx Thu Jun 16, 2011 6:22 pm

Sagna and Van der Wiel are other RB's.

by Babun Thu Jun 16, 2011 6:27 pm

mtfootball wrote:Sagna and Van der Wiel are other RB's.

VDW is suspect defensively. Sagna? I'd take him but would he move? Very Happy

by futbol_bill Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:01 pm

The Madrid One wrote:its more important to say that mou wants an attacking rb, right flank than 2 attacking fullbacks.

anyways its obvious thats the way hes been going since his inception as a madrid manager.

the failed attempt to bring maicon proved that.

to be able to cause buyild up play, and effectively actually attack and be agressive against barcelona, like inter was, you have to defend and distribute, and attack like a team, while changing the tempos of the game.

it is a very important concept when talking about what mou wants.

find it unnesscary to compare how inter only had 1 real attacking fullback.

we are not gonna play like them, but we will learn the basic things to do and then do it in our own style.

arbeloa cant attack for shit, and ramos cant do too good at either defending or attacking as rb against barca.

coentrao----ramos----pepe------marcelo

defensive atheltic juggernauts working together to stop barca's attack's and together in attack as well.

why do you think maicon was so highly rated last season? he was a master at both.

Really, so that's why he held Ramos back. Ramos is the attacking RB when he's with Selecciones, but he is held back with Madrid. I think it's been pretty obvious that Mou wants only one side attacking.

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:10 pm

Ramos has grown undisciplined playing on the right i think, thats why.

la roja is too different to compare. We play end to end stuff, they have 70% possession... it's too easy for him to attack there

by futbol_bill Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:18 pm

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:Ramos isnt has grown undisciplined playing on the right i think, thats why.

la roja is too different to compare. We play end to end stuff, they have 70% possession... it's too easy for him to attack there

Nah don't agree. I believe he was told to stay back. If discipline was a problem, Mou wouldn't be viewing him as the CB replacement. (don't get me wrong he does need more maturity and discipline, but I don't believe this is what wrong with his offensive capabilities). I feel Mou is (and always will be) defense first. So he may go for the idea of both backs going forward BUT only one at a time. Thee problem wasn't with Ramos, it was with Marcelo. You can't hold him back. He has become another Robero Carlos - a full back who is never back!!!

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:24 pm

Ramos does behave very differently when he plays at RB and CB. even tho he can be a little rash, he sometimes looks calmer and more in control as a CB. I think he likes playing with a partner, it's something he enjoys.

Mourinho is going to have to evolve somehow as a coach here in Madrid. I dont expect him to have an ultra defensive team or to just repeat what he did with inter. He will adapt.

What i think he is doing is that he is building an ultra fast and atheltic back line that will support playing the highline.

by The Madrid One Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:26 pm

well u might not agree futboll bill, but mourinho does.

he wants a certain type of full back, in this case certain type of rb.

and hes gonna get it.

for those who talk about van der wiel and others.

those are beyond possible choices for mou.

meaning no...

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:28 pm

lol, you sound as if mourinho came out a said Coentrao will be RB. we know he is trying to sign him but everything else is conjecture.

by futbol_bill Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:28 pm

St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:Ramos does behave very differently when he plays at RB and CB. even tho he can be a little rash, he sometimes looks calmer and more in control as a CB. I think he likes playing with a partner, it's something he enjoys.

Mourinho is going to have to evolve somehow as a coach here in Madrid. I dont expect him to have an ultra defensive team or to just repeat what he did with inter. He will adapt.

What i think he is doing is that he is building an ultra fast and atheltic back line that will support playing the highline.

Nick -I'm not disputing that we get a new RB and that Ramos becomes a CB (well if I had my way, it would be a gradual transition - I still have my selecciones strategies to be concerned about).

What I was pointing out was the statement that MOU wanted both fullbacks to be more offensive is not correct. He may get there but he sure wasn't there last year.

by The Madrid One Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:30 pm

he isnt gonna buy him to be lb. or put marcelo there either.

if mou would have only wanted 1 attacking side, their wouldnt be even any discussion. but hey he even tried to bring maicon here full knowing how marcelo was gonna play. (more offensivley).

and anyways of course its conjecture, just like any transfer rumour lol.

mou is def not going for a cb, i really doubt it at this moment, and we ARE going for coentrao, and that means its to go offensively. so i dont know how it "obvious" that he only wants 1 attacking side.

by Guest Thu Jun 16, 2011 8:28 pm

GAH the general forums are infuriating, so much stupidity, I need to keep away!

Might try and isolate myself to the Madrid section

by Mr Nick09 Thu Jun 16, 2011 8:53 pm

Again? old habits i guess... Smile

by VanDeezNuts Thu Jun 16, 2011 10:59 pm

tmo i think you need to let this one play out a little further..

there is no concrete evidence that coentrao is going to play for us next year. onyl speculation. just as the maicon transfer was as good as sealed.. the fabio deal can fall through aswell.

and logic tells me if we sign a RB, its going to be a natural RB- at the very least right footed.

by I-no Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:49 am

deezydeez wrote:tmo i think you need to let this one play out a little further..

there is no concrete evidence that coentrao is going to play for us next year. onyl speculation. just as the maicon transfer was as good as sealed.. the fabio deal can fall through aswell.

and logic tells me if we sign a RB, its going to be a natural RB- at the very least right footed.

I agree with you. right footed player for right defender.

by shaven Fri Jun 17, 2011 12:03 pm

futbol_bill wrote:
St_Nick09_of_Goal wrote:Ramos isnt has grown undisciplined playing on the right i think, thats why.

la roja is too different to compare. We play end to end stuff, they have 70% possession... it's too easy for him to attack there

Nah don't agree. I believe he was told to stay back. If discipline was a problem, Mou wouldn't be viewing him as the CB replacement. (don't get me wrong he does need more maturity and discipline, but I don't believe this is what wrong with his offensive capabilities). I feel Mou is (and always will be) defense first. So he may go for the idea of both backs going forward BUT only one at a time. Thee problem wasn't with Ramos, it was with Marcelo. You can't hold him back. He has become another Robero Carlos - a full back who is never back!!!

i still believe ramos as an attacking fullback is great. and yup he was held to stay at defense under mou.

mou tactics sometimes is really questionable, he cant utilized his players. i rather get a pure Lb and bring back ramos as a attacking fullback

by Mr Nick09 Fri Jun 17, 2011 12:08 pm

When Ramos was asked to stay back, he has behaved and played better than when he was not restricted.

There is something about him playing RB that seemed to have gone wrong, im sure he can improve but playing as a CB he looks better.

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