Greatest magician ever

you should stop bringing barcelona into discussion, we are talking probably for one of the best set of players ever? if not the best..
whatever pep has done in making such a team exist is amazing, other than that we all saw that ANY coach can drive that team,
you go take that seat and you may even go on a winning streak

so who has stopped this barcelona these last years? other than mou none, none.. none.. and please dont say chelsea
fergie who supposedly is a legend and one of the ''best'' got battered in the final, would that ever happen to jose?
mou took a team that for years was being spanked by barca and eventually he organized them and maked them superior.. and im talking about head to head results..

he turned things arround on head to head results, doesnt matter how much time he needed as none has managed to beat THIS barca (not the chelsea way)

When Barca wins it is not because the manager, Pep, is a tactical genius, it is because the players are the best.

When Madrid wins, it is not because the players are the best, it is because Mourinho, the manager, is a tactical genius.

I am only now commenting in this thread despite me been openly critical of Jose Mourinho in my short time on here because I had no idea what this thread was about.Maybe next time you should be more clear what the thread is about in the title.

Well anyway yes I agree with you totally,to have so much talent and have had so much power and time to build and develop a team Jose is doing a awful job.It looks like he isn't capable of playing a imaginative,dynamic possession oriented team.One may wonder if Jose doesn't adept to football were keeping possession and playing an expansive short passing game is becoming more and more important will he get left behind and become a less desirable candidate for the top jobs?

I stand by my opinion that the worst thing Madrid did in the last 4 years is sack Pelligrini.

Idiot wrote:internally means you got no sources right?

lol had to laugh at this.

Idiot wrote:you should stop bringing barcelona into discussion, we are talking probably for one of the best set of players ever? if not the best..

And Madrid has a bunch of nobodies who would never succeed if not for Mourinho, okay.

CBarca wrote:When Barca wins it is not because the manager, Pep, is a tactical genius, it is because the players are the best.

When Madrid wins, it is not because the players are the best, it is because Mourinho, the manager, is a tactical genius.

when you rise a dog from its birth, give it food, give it company as well as teach it how to behave in life it will eventually stand up for it self and implement everything on its own depending on the way you treated him

when you buy a dog already grown up you will face undesirable consequences that you will have to convert for your own needs, you will have to be the driving force of its life in order to maintain a relationship parallel to your needs as well as the dog's.

Idiot wrote:

CBarca wrote:When Barca wins it is not because the manager, Pep, is a tactical genius, it is because the players are the best.

When Madrid wins, it is not because the players are the best, it is because Mourinho, the manager, is a tactical genius.

when you rise a dog from its birth, give it food, give it company as well as teach it how to behave in life it will eventually stand up for it self and implement everything on its own depending on the way you treated him

when you buy a dog already grown up you will face undesirable consequences that you will have to convert for your own needs, you will have to be the driving force of its life in order to maintain a relationship parallel to your needs as well as the dog's.

This makes no sense, nor does it address Cbarca's great point which highlights the double standard that most pro-mou people make regularly.

wasnt the best example but oh well ibra would do better than me xd

madrid coaches are the 2st dog and the 1nd dog represents the barca coaching seat in which is taken by club members associated with the club and run the same formula they are familiar with.
mou is riding a bunch of individuals as it was previously said, you cant team them up just like that, at least not to this barca's extent, it needs time..
so its basically unfair to compare the two coaches given their positions

its also a reason why mou gets credit for, being able to succeed with different teams in different leagues in such a small amount of time..
it is really hard..

Idiot wrote:wasnt the best example but oh well ibra would do better than me xd

madrid coaches are the 1st dog and the 2nd dog represents the barca coaching seat in which is taken by club members associated with the club and run the same formula they are familiar with.
mou is riding a bunch of individuals as it was previously said, you cant team them up just like that, at least not to this barca's extent, it needs time..
so its basically unfair to compare the two coaches given their positions

its also a reason why mou gets credit for, being able to succeed with different teams in different leagues in such a small amount of time..
it is really hard..

When I read that, it seemed to me like the 1st dog represented Barca mangers and the 2nd dog represented Madrid coaches.

Mr Nick09 wrote:

buddytaller wrote:You don't build for the future at Real Madrid, you win trophies or you face the sack so far Mourinho hasn't done badly at all, despite facing the best Barcelona in history he's managed to double the amount of trophies Madrid has won since la liga in 2003. Madrid's form this season hasn't been great but to put the blame squarely on Mourinho is just ridiculous.

what are you talking about, he won one cup and one league in 2 seasons.

Besides, you are contradicting yourself. If mourinho just want to win now and isnt building for the future, sacking him by season end wont actually hurt us. the cycle he started is already ending.

This season aside , that tally is pretty good considering we compete with such a great barca side, were so dominating in the league, made semis 2 years in a row after 6 consecutive top 16 exits etc

You know... everyone talks about this dominant Barca side. But they were dominant because we basically sucked for a while there. Getting kicked out of the round of 16 in CL for god knows how many years wasn't the sign of a very good team. Mou's faults aside, there's no doubt we're a better team then when he took over. I have absolutely no qualms about saying that. You put us against Barca in a 2 game tie or a final, i feel that it's a 50/50 proposition now and for the past 12 months.

My issue with mou is the expense at which he gets you results. He is rude, antagonistic and generally a terrible representative for Madrid. He keeps talking about how much he loves EPL and how great the fans are while managing madrid... can you get any more disrespectful than that? He also wears his players out, which is what has happened. We are as good as anyone on any given night. But we are too worn down by Mou's constant pressure in the locker room. Because of this, we are horrible inconsistent overall. That's why everyone says he's a 2 year coach: He wears everyone down.

I also think his tactics are predictable. They work mostly... but that's because of talent more than genius. He relies on defense and the individual brilliance of our players. He doesn't tactically out-think anyone or adjust imo.

Messiah "Aggerswagger" wrote:

Idiot wrote:wasnt the best example but oh well ibra would do better than me xd

madrid coaches are the 1st dog and the 2nd dog represents the barca coaching seat in which is taken by club members associated with the club and run the same formula they are familiar with.
mou is riding a bunch of individuals as it was previously said, you cant team them up just like that, at least not to this barca's extent, it needs time..
so its basically unfair to compare the two coaches given their positions

its also a reason why mou gets credit for, being able to succeed with different teams in different leagues in such a small amount of time..
it is really hard..

When I read that, it seemed to me like the 1st dog represented Barca mangers and the 2nd dog represented Madrid coaches.

yes, miswrote. i edited it

CBarca wrote:The best tactician in the world had a team that certainly can rival Barcelona in terms of talent in the form of Madrid and it took him years and several humiliating defeats before he could top Barca a couple times.

And even then, this season he was scared against a 10 man, defenseless Barca and drew 2-2.

Now that same team is 18 points behind Barcelona, and 7 points behind 2nd place in 3rd.

I don't see how you can say he's the best tactician in the world when he has been destroyed by Pep tactically on a fairly regular basis

You do know that Jose Mourinho had managed 3 major clubs before Real Madrid, right? That's the problem with pseudo-intellectuals - you are the exact same kind of person I described in my post.

peerIess wrote:

The Franchise wrote:However, he isnt flawless like his biggest fans seem to think so...but of course its easier to stick your head into the sand when speaking of your hero's.

Tactical genius is by far the biggest issue I have with his fans. I have never seen a supposed genius out thought as often as him. He is merely decent tactically, has some good points and has some bad points.

dismissing his greatness at FC Porto, his achievements at Chelsea, and his brilliance at Internazionale.

He is the best tactician in the world. Managers are judged like goalkeepers - their performances at critical stages are what separates the good from the great. Jose Mourinho has a catalogue of moments since 2002 that is peerless.

.

Nope, nobody is dimissing them. He had issues there too.

At Chelsea, it fell apart in his last year and he got off the sinking ship because he didnt have the capacity to save it. His tactics have failed in there to, Rafa did him in the CL.

At Inter, much of the league run was about how bad his 4312 was and how it wasnt working. Inter played uninsipred and inconsistent football.

Again, no best tactican. A good one, who has been outdone many times by superior ones.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/feature/_/id/1300924/corrigan:-mourinho's-midfield-experiment?cc=5739

Good article which is relevant to this thread.It's about how Mourinho is trying to change the way Madrid play before they play United and probably Barca in the SF of CDR.

So far it's not working though,yesterday he played a 3 man midfield with Alonso sitting and Modric and Khedira either side of him playing box to box or shuttler roles as some people prefer calling them.With the more technical and composed Ozil cutting in from the right instead of the more erratic Di Maria.

Ronaldo can now play even further forward with less defensive responsibility as Madrid will have 3 in midfield instead of 2 so they can cover the wide areas of the pitch better and give Marcelo more support in defense.

Still could be too little too late to get Madrid used to the system,yesterday even though they played this way they still got dominated by Valencia so it clearly needs much more work.He should have been adding tactical weapons to Madrids arsenal ages ago.

Should of done it in the summer, but they still have the same problems anyway with that way of playing.

Alonso has to do defensive work solo he cant do.

The easier way to give Cristiano less defensive duty and giving Marcelo more protection is simply putting the hard working Di Maria on the left, where he played most of his career anyway.

Put Cristiano on the other side, he often gets the ball centerally anyways. Arbeloa is defence minded so that flank wont be exposed by Cristiano's lack of defensive discipline as much.

Its not perfect, the right flank would struggle..but it does anyone because Arbeloa is there, Di Maria out of form and Ozil doesnt play on the right anyway.

Alonso still cant handle the role anyway but it is what it is, its a bigger problem which was put place long time ago.

Di Maria is horrific this year. CR7 already passes reluctantly. Di Maria doesn't pass at all... and for good reason: He has the worse passing % on the team lol.

He's benched anyhow. Ozil has moved to the right and Modric is starting. Alonso does a lot for us that goes unnoticed. He's not perfect... but he's very good imo. The issue is that his midfield partner is also not the most athletic and lacks technique (Khedira). That duo is just not made for each other, although they do ok. Same goes for pepe-ramos.

If mou was really smart, he would have tried for Dembele or would buy Capoue now. That's the type of player we need in the midfield: Athletic and strong defensive-minded midfielder with good technique and passing.

But then again, we have Arbeloa and Essien as our only 2 RBs... nuf said lol.

Mou's main strength is creating team unity and motivation. He creates an "us against the world" mentality. Well, Madrid is not some underdog team or one that had a chip on its shoulder. Our history is the most successful in footy. The only reason it worked until this year was that we had a foe like Barca. Once we won La Liga and showed we were consistently on par with Barca... that motivation went away. In a weird way, Mou lost his motivational edge once we caught up to Barca. Then, he actually had to show he could manage in a normal setting... and he can't.

Mourinho needs to bring Di Maria back, your going to need him honestly.

Agree 100% with the final paragraph, that is exactly what is happening on a emotional level.

You cant play the underdog role if you just won. Madrid are not an underdog team, not for any length of time. Valdano for saw this, he spoke of this, nobody listened though I guess.

"I'm glad to see that Nick, Sports and Dani have single-handedly exposing Mourinho in this forum for his actual aptitude thus saving me time and carpal tunnel."

Problem with Di Maria and CR7 on the same pitch is that you basically have no team play on both wings... it creates problems. We already have either slow or technically challenged players in Khedira and Alonso. So if you take out team play on the wings... you basically have Ozil and Benzema shouldering the entire responsibility of helping team flow. That's not enough. Marcelo used to make up that deficit, but he's been injured. Against elite teams, Marcelo isn't even enough.

Di Maria is great as a super sub or against less talented teams. He's the ultimate scrub killer lol. He's also good when you are adopting a pressing strategy. But other than that, he doesn't really fit well because of the profiles of our other starters.

True, but I feel Di Maria's work rate is so immense he can solve alot of issues tactically in any game. You can assign him as a defensive winger to stunt an offensive fullback both pressing or getting behind the ball, you can have him work inside to add a body to the center of the pitch and you can use his immense work rate and stamina in that he can do those thing and still get out the the flank and be an attacking threat.

His loss of form is inexplicable and I think all I said above, is why I think you need him back. If he has form, even with his flaws, he can be a very useful player tactically in any game.

I actually have wanted Di Maria to become a wingback playing RB going on 2 years now... everyone laughs at me lol.

He has the qualities I think, but I think it will upset him

24-25 year old winger rarely look forward to becoming defenders I would guess.

peerIess wrote:

CBarca wrote:The best tactician in the world had a team that certainly can rival Barcelona in terms of talent in the form of Madrid and it took him years and several humiliating defeats before he could top Barca a couple times.

And even then, this season he was scared against a 10 man, defenseless Barca and drew 2-2.

Now that same team is 18 points behind Barcelona, and 7 points behind 2nd place in 3rd.

I don't see how you can say he's the best tactician in the world when he has been destroyed by Pep tactically on a fairly regular basis

You do know that Jose Mourinho had managed 3 major clubs before Real Madrid, right? That's the problem with pseudo-intellectuals - you are the exact same kind of person I described in my post.

Yes I'm aware of that.

I'm also aware that you have not responded to the content of my post at all and decided to instead go after me.

What a shame that is.

How the f*ck is Mou's winning percentage higher with us in his 2.5 years than Pep's with Barca?

Mou fan boys alert, Please ignore them they are just clu hoppers who will be supporting a different team next year. Bandwagon trolls should be ignored. Lord Spencer you and your posts are pure class thank you for being who you are.

Mou fan boys when you her a chance pease research football per Mou at Madrid, you might discover a few things.