Greatest magician ever

Mou fan boys alert, Please ignore them they are just clu hoppers who will be supporting a different team next year. Bandwagon trolls should be ignored. Lord Spencer you and your posts are pure class thank you for being who you are.

Mou fan boys when you her a chance pease research football per Mou at Madrid, you might discover a few things.

dí Maria is definitely not going to work as a wingback. Against smaller teams, yes, but not against bigger teams because his defensive flaws would be exposed big time.

That being said I'm generally biased against wingers playing fullback. Not a big fan of Alba either, I think he's not a winger nor a fullback. Somewhere in the middle.

His greatest weapon ahs been taken away from him this season.

His motivational factor due to the unrest in the dressing room

To say last season was in any way less than a success is idiotic to say the least
We were like a well oiled killing machine that won the league against the best Barca. 100 points and 121 goals

In a way this season I blame the players. Players who arent motivating themselves, players like Di Maria(if anyone has seen my posts I think Di Maria has fantastic potential), Benzema, Coentrao and a number of other players just havent returned with the same level as they did last year

And Mourinho picking fights everywhere is doing no good, and I blame him for that. Why pick a fight with Toril, or with Casillas or with any other player...

This season's league has been a disaster, but hopefully the players are motivated for Cup and UCL games
The best games I have seen this season have been against the bigger clubs, especially against Barca, so I do hope they decide to motivate themselves for those games

and for Perez this is an important season, if Mourinho wrecks Real's image enough, then the voters will think twice about voting him back. This season is RM Presi Elections(To run you need 80m)

Lord Spencer wrote:Wow, it is obvious why you are a big fan of Mou, both of you lack class.

Boo-hoo.

Lord Spencer wrote:* My "assumptions" regarding the Primevara are historical facts. Both clubs have the largest sets of fans currently, and both have the largest economical strength. It is not as controlled by the two as in La Liga, but they are still the top dogs. That either of them didn't win in the last 3 years is irrelevant, Valencia won the La Liga twice in a row but then RM and Barca resumed their dichotomy

There is no such league as the Primevara. You have no idea what you are talking about. And by the way, if you mean the Primeira, you are still wrong. If you’re going to come up with baseless assumptions, at least attempt to make some form of research. The Primeira has been won 30 times by clubs other than FC Porto and Benfica, whereas La Liga has been won 28 times by clubs other than Real Madrid and FC Barcelona.
It is completely relevant, seeing as how you made a stupid comment about the Primeira:

Lord Spencer wrote:Porto and Benfica have the league title locked—especially Porto—that it does not require a genius to do so, and that whoever does so should have no claims of genius thrust into him.

Made no sense whatsoever.

Lord Spencer wrote:* So basically Mou has a good eye of talent. And he can get the best of his players. What else is new, those are his greatest strengths, never said he was not a good coach. Also, Maniche was a really important player for both Porto and Pourtegal, and while the rest (except Deco and Carvalho) were not WC players, they were not scrubs either.

You are forgetting the most important part. Maniche was a really important player for FC Porto and Portugal after Jose Mourinho converted him back into a central midfielder, from a winger where he played for the past 4 years previous to his signing. Maniche never played for Portugal when he was at Benfica, but it was only after his signing with FC Porto where he was redesigned into a creative central midfielder that he got his time to shine. Funnily enough, he was listed as a midfielder for the 2004 UEFA European Championship Team of the Tournament.
So many of these players were below-average footballers. Look at Nuno Valente, who at the age of 25 was playing for Leiria, the team Jose Mourinho managed pre-FC Porto. He was good there, but when he prospered with a good supporting cast and with Jose Mourinho’s tactics, he was known as one of the best between 2002-2004. Jorge Costa was playing for Charlton, 3rd choice at FC Porto behind a 22 year old Ricardo Carvalho.
Paulo Ferreira was a good right-midfielder at Setubal, where he was hand-picked by Jose Mourinho to be the new right-back. A transformation into a more defensive player, and Paulo Ferreira excelled in his position. Ferreira was consistently great before he earned a €20M transfer to Chelsea, decent profit for FC Porto who, under the selection of Jose Mourinho, bought Paulo Ferreira for €2M. Two players that were average/decent before FC Porto, where Jose Mourinho redesigned them into premier wingbacks who were well known for bombing up the pitch.

Lord Spencer wrote:*As for the tactical side in the Porto CL victory, it was the highlight of Mou's career. But it was not a tactical masterclass by any stretch, the biggest football aficionados wouldn't say it was. That Porto beat inferior sides to them is hardly surprising.

That UEFA Champions League victory would be the highlight of almost any manager’s career. If it were not for Greece’s victory in the 2004 European Championship, the 2004 Champions League would be seen as the greatest upset since the new millennium.
It was a total tactical master class. I don’t even understand how it could be otherwise. Jose Mourinho played the offside trap many games, yet variated to a deep defense depending on the opposition. The midfield, containing great individual footballers like Maniche, Deco, Pedro Mendes, and Costinha, worked to become a more complete midfield complementing each others’ strengths, whereas Mendes was apt at covering for Deco whereas Maniche was the creative deep playmaker and Costinha was an anchor man. The tactical rotation was spot on, with players like Carlos Alberto, Dmitri Alenichev, Derlei, Benni McCarthy, Pedro Emanuel, and Edgaras Jankauskas all interchanging and remodelling formations and tactics depending on scenarios played out by Jose Mourinho.
Because the likes of Olympique Lyonnais [who were on their third of seven straight Ligue 1 titles], Deportivo La Coruna [who finished ahead of Real Madrid in La Liga], Manchester United, and AS Monaco were so inferior to FC Porto. Obviously.

Lord Spencer wrote:* "Best by large Margins", seriously. For success in two years, he suddenly becomes the best coach. How in hell can you arrive to such a conclusion from a mere two years. And you lol and facepalm at me, seriously mate.

No, more like losing only 4 matches in 68 total Primeira matches. More like winning 2 consecutive trebles in 2 years at a new club. Who was better than him in that period? Arsene Wenger? Sir Alex Ferguson?

Lord Spencer wrote:* So, by being in the richest club, and having the strongest players with the highest salaries, and you expect Chelsea to lose the league. Hello, we are talking about the year Arsenal sold their invincible and United were still scrubs. A scrub coach would have won with that team, a scrub coach managed to go to the CL final and get 2nd with that team two years of its prime. I am not calling Rafa an inferior tactician, I obviously believe he is the better tactician (although Mou is a better coach overall), I am just refrencing a popular opinion that Mou is a better tactician than Rafa.

Results? Is that the only thing that matters as a manager? I’m talking about how he converted the team from a good one to a great one, by something that is so complex, yet so-called experts call “formation change”. You know Claude Makélelé? You know, the one who had the defensive midfield role named the ‘Makélelé role’ in homage to him by these once again, so-called experts? He’s the one who gained all the plaudits during his time in Chelsea, even though he was great at Real Madrid. Makélelé was known as a top defensive midfielder at Real Madrid during the Galacticos, but at Chelsea, Jose Mourinho added another facet to his class defensive abilities – a possession builder. After a 1-0 victory over Chelsea, Fulham manager commented on his victory. You know what he said? “Stop Makélelé, stop Chelsea”. Sounds so simple like most tactics, but in reality it is so difficult to do well, which is what the average football fan does not understand.
I don’t think anyone cares about popular opinions, seeing as how this is a debate between you and I.

Lord Spencer wrote:Sorry mate, but this argument is not garbage just because you say so. Chelsea could have played any formation and they would have fraking won. Ranieri basically set the stage for any coach to come up and succeed with that squad.
Losing to Rafa is no shame, it just shows how Mou's tactics is not his strong suit. And if being outsmarted is not failing what is failing then.

Chelsea could not have played any formation and won the Premier League. They would be pulverized if they played a 0-0-10 formation. Claudio Ranieri had spent 267.49M on transfers during his time at Chelsea, and he did not win a single trophy during his 3.5 years at the club. Whereas Jose Mourinho spent 256.6M on transfers during his time at Chelsea, and he won the League Cup twice, the Premier League twice, the FA Cup, and the Community Shield whilst reaching the Champions League final all in 3 years. That’s results.
And yes, because losing to a better tactician means that tactics are not your strong suit. Like that makes any sense.

Lord Spencer wrote:*A team just being as good as its coach is simply not true. Chelsea won the CL with DM at the helm. Chelsea went to the CL final and got 2nd place with Avram Grant in the bench. And genius coach's won nothing with their teams from the start of football. A coach's influence is never greater than the influence of the players. And if being saved by Zlatan a proof of WC coaching, then Allegri is a WC coach.

I was not talking about results, but how good the team is. The team is good if they play under a good manager. Look at teams that play attractive football, then look at who their managers are. I doubt you will find a great football-playing side with a poor manager. A manager’s influence is greater than the influence of the player, seeing as how the manager can get every single player to sit on the bench and make sad faces like Iker Casillas did against Malaga.
Who said Internazionale was saved? Don’t distort my comments, because I never said that. Even if Zlatan Ibrahimovic did not score in the final match of the season, Internazionale still would have won the Serie A title. So much for being saved.

Lord Spencer wrote:Mou's best ability in his time in Inter was building the team, buying Millito and offloading Zlatan was a work of genius. He bought Snijder and yet did not give him as much job as Ibra. He made sure the team became a team to the deapest sense of the word. That is what Mou is best at, building and setting up a team.

No, Jose Mourinho’s best ability in his time at Internazionale was winning. Jose Mourinho was at Internazionale for 2 seasons, yet won every single trophy available in Italian top-tier football. He won the UEFA Champions League, a trophy Internazionale hadn’t won since 1965. Buying great players was merely the cause of his success. He was smart – acquiring Wesley Sneijder, the key to his success, Samuel Eto’o, Lucio, Diego Milito, and Thiago Motta. He did the exact same as he did at FC Porto, 7 years before.
He built the team and molded them into a team that played under his principles, which was of course the reason why they won so often. It was due to his tactics that Internazionale won the UEFA Champions League – if they tried ‘bringing the game’ to FC Barcelona they would have been destroyed, and would probably have been beaten by Bayern Munich.

[quote=”Lord Spencer”] Of course Inter's tactics were not sitting deep and hitting back. It was a classic neo cataneccio style that was not invented by Mou. That he correctly used it testament to his skill. But when did I say that Mou was garbage. He is not, he is a good coach, and among the best in the business currently. He just not the best, nor is he a tactical genius.[/quote]

Essentially, that was it. Internazionale’s tactics to a general football fan was defending deep and attacking on the counter, exploiting weaknesses in the opposition to win in numbers and to get a goal. The acquisition of Wesley Sneijder was the key to Internazionale’s system, as a trequartista with brilliant playmaking abilities was required to be alongside Diego Milito, Samuel Eto’o, and Goran Pandev.
He is the best manager in the world. And when Josep Guardiola returns to his managing duties, Jose Mourinho will be ranked second in the world.

Lord Spencer wrote:And you continue to lol when faced with the question of who is more important, the players or the manager. Frankly, no manager other than Otto Rehagle and few others could produce results with mediocre players.

The manager is more important to a club as a whole than the players, especially in an authoritative position. The manager selects the best eleven that he thinks can perform well on the field. That’s it, really. Very few managers can produce trophies with poor footballers, but there are a few that can produce results with those poor footballers. Just look at Jose Mourinho at Leiria. He brought Leiria to their highest ever league position, and in his second year he brought Leiria to 3rd place in the Primeira until February, when he joined FC Porto. Leiria dropped to 7th place from 3rd, whereas FC Porto won 11 of their first 15 matches managed by Jose Mourinho.

Before I start, I want to say my aim is not to defend Spencer as this argument has got nothing to do with me, but seeing a load of nonsense posted by the other person hurts my eyes and frankly I hope this is the last time I have dis-ignored him in order to see what he's written. I'm sure it will be.

peerIess wrote:There is no such league as the Primevara. You have no idea what you are talking about. And by the way, if you mean the Primeira, you are still wrong. If you’re going to come up with baseless assumptions, at least attempt to make some form of research. The Primeira has been won 30 times by clubs other than FC Porto and Benfica, whereas La Liga has been won 28 times by clubs other than Real Madrid and FC Barcelona.
It is completely relevant, seeing as how you made a stupid comment about the Primeira:

Grammar, spelling...blah..blah..blah...this is not a language forum. It is a football forum. Enough with the history and spelling lessons. We can all read history from history books.

Lord Spencer wrote:Porto and Benfica have the league title locked—especially Porto—that it does not require a genius to do so, and that whoever does so should have no claims of genius thrust into him.

peerIess wrote:Made no sense whatsoever.

Actually it made perfect sense, you just didn't have any comeback. Pointing at La Liga's two-horse race as your "comeback" shows your invalidity.

peerIess wrote:That UEFA Champions League victory would be the highlight of almost any manager’s career. If it were not for Greece’s victory in the 2004 European Championship, the 2004 Champions League would be seen as the greatest upset since the new millennium.
It was a total tactical master class. I don’t even understand how it could be otherwise. Jose Mourinho played the offside trap many games, yet variated to a deep defense depending on the opposition. The midfield, containing great individual footballers like Maniche, Deco, Pedro Mendes, and Costinha, worked to become a more complete midfield complementing each others’ strengths, whereas Mendes was apt at covering for Deco whereas Maniche was the creative deep playmaker and Costinha was an anchor man. The tactical rotation was spot on, with players like Carlos Alberto, Dmitri Alenichev, Derlei, Benni McCarthy, Pedro Emanuel, and Edgaras Jankauskas all interchanging and remodelling formations and tactics depending on scenarios played out by Jose Mourinho.
Because the likes of Olympique Lyonnais [who were on their third of seven straight Ligue 1 titles], Deportivo La Coruna [who finished ahead of Real Madrid in La Liga], Manchester United, and AS Monaco were so inferior to FC Porto. Obviously.

Just like your idol, you seem to have very selective memory, or choose to be selective with them. Porto eased past against average opponents (yes, Monaco was average, they were just a team on form of their lives) in Champions League while edging the better teams - undeservedly - due to refereeing mistakes, twice against Deportivo (a red card for Andrade for his playful kick to international team mate Deco and a wrong offside call) as well as against Manchester United (valid goal scored by Scholes ruled offside, this would have put Manchester United through to the next round).

peerIess wrote:Results? Is that the only thing that matters as a manager? I’m talking about how he converted the team from a good one to a great one, by something that is so complex, yet so-called experts call “formation change”. You know Claude Makélelé? You know, the one who had the defensive midfield role named the ‘Makélelé role’ in homage to him by these once again, so-called experts? He’s the one who gained all the plaudits during his time in Chelsea, even though he was great at Real Madrid. Makélelé was known as a top defensive midfielder at Real Madrid during the Galacticos, but at Chelsea, Jose Mourinho added another facet to his class defensive abilities – a possession builder. After a 1-0 victory over Chelsea, Fulham manager commented on his victory. You know what he said? “Stop Makélelé, stop Chelsea”. Sounds so simple like most tactics, but in reality it is so difficult to do well, which is what the average football fan does not understand.

He won so many titles against an on-decline United and an Arsenal that hasn't won a worthy title since those times. And he could achieve all that after having spent millions, while failing to win EPL on his third spell and finally choking on his fourth year.

peerIess wrote:Chelsea could not have played any formation and won the Premier League. They would be pulverized if they played a 0-0-10 formation. Claudio Ranieri had spent 267.49M on transfers during his time at Chelsea, and he did not win a single trophy during his 3.5 years at the club. Whereas Jose Mourinho spent 256.6M on transfers during his time at Chelsea, and he won the League Cup twice, the Premier League twice, the FA Cup, and the Community Shield whilst reaching the Champions League final all in 3 years. That’s results.
And yes, because losing to a better tactician means that tactics are not your strong suit. Like that makes any sense.

There was a lot of money spent on Ranieri's team, a lot of average players were signed for big cash because back then Chelsea were a crap team always finishing outside of top 3 so no one would have any incentive to join them except for the high wages. What Mourinho achieved was not possible without Ranieri's work (who took Chelsea to second spot), just like what he did with Inter wasn't possible without Mancini's work (Serie A champions prior to Mourinho) as teams take years to build. But seeing your short-sightedness, I don't blame you. You care about results and nothing else and proudly slap those titles as proof to your arguments without looking at the whole picture.

peerIess wrote:I was not talking about results, but how good the team is. The team is good if they play under a good manager. Look at teams that play attractive football, then look at who their managers are. I doubt you will find a great football-playing side with a poor manager. A manager’s influence is greater than the influence of the player, seeing as how the manager can get every single player to sit on the bench and make sad faces like Iker Casillas did against Malaga.
Who said Internazionale was saved? Don’t distort my comments, because I never said that. Even if Zlatan Ibrahimovic did not score in the final match of the season, Internazionale still would have won the Serie A title. So much for being saved.

Who are you trying to fool? Edging both Serie A and Coppa Italia against Roma in his last year? We are talking about the biggest spender in Serie A against Roma who came 6th the season before and after that. That says a lot about the state of demise of Serie A back then. And Inter still just edged it against giallorossi.

peerIess wrote:The manager is more important to a club as a whole than the players, especially in an authoritative position. The manager selects the best eleven that he thinks can perform well on the field. That’s it, really. Very few managers can produce trophies with poor footballers, but there are a few that can produce results with those poor footballers. Just look at Jose Mourinho at Leiria. He brought Leiria to their highest ever league position, and in his second year he brought Leiria to 3rd place in the Primeira until February, when he joined FC Porto. Leiria dropped to 7th place from 3rd, whereas FC Porto won 11 of their first 15 matches managed by Jose Mourinho.

Again, going back to what most people have finally come to reaslise. Short-term manager. None, and I insist NONE of your arguments prove Mourinho's capability to be a long term coach. And he isn't the best right now and won't be second best when Pep starts coaching again. For me the best is SAF and will always be. Because he has given the word 'long-term' a new meaning. And that is what a football club should be about cycles and continuity, like a living organism - whom neither Mourinho nor Guardiola have achieved so far.

PS: I agree that he made fantastic signings for Inter. And that is about the only thing I agree with you.

Peace out.

Holy shit this thread has gone full retard.

The Franchise wrote:At Inter, much of the league run was about how bad his 4312 was and how it wasnt working. Inter played uninsipred and inconsistent football.

How can a team that won CL, Serie A and the Italian Cup play inconsistent and uninspired football? His 4312 was CLEARLY working ffs, any system that gets you titles is a working system

Se7en wrote:Holy shit this thread has gone full retard.

The Franchise wrote:At Inter, much of the league run was about how bad his 4312 was and how it wasnt working. Inter played uninsipred and inconsistent football.

How can a team that won CL, Serie A and the Italian Cup play inconsistent and uninspired football? His 4312 was CLEARLY working ffs, any system that gets you titles is a working system

Clearly you wasnt following the season.

When they pulled away in the league and won the CL, he changed formation.

4231.

Do your research before busting a nut.

The Franchise wrote:

Se7en wrote:Holy shit this thread has gone full retard.

The Franchise wrote:At Inter, much of the league run was about how bad his 4312 was and how it wasnt working. Inter played uninsipred and inconsistent football.

How can a team that won CL, Serie A and the Italian Cup play inconsistent and uninspired football? His 4312 was CLEARLY working ffs, any system that gets you titles is a working system

Clearly you wasnt following the season.

When they pulled away in the league and won the CL, he changed formation.

4231.

Do your research before busting a nut.

Holy shit it appears se7en has gone full retard.

TheRedStag wrote:

The Franchise wrote:

Se7en wrote:Holy shit this thread has gone full retard.



How can a team that won CL, Serie A and the Italian Cup play inconsistent and uninspired football? His 4312 was CLEARLY working ffs, any system that gets you titles is a working system

Clearly you wasnt following the season.

When they pulled away in the league and won the CL, he changed formation.

4231.

Do your research before busting a nut.

Holy shit it appears se7en has gone full retard.

Rofl. If anyone has gone full retard, it's The Franchise. So basicly, he just pointed out a issue with Mourinho that he fixed (4312 didnt work, so he switched to 4321)

Why bother bringing up something that even didnt effect their season and he fixed it anyway? That to me is full retard, along with this thread and it's stupid bashing on Mou (and defending, but I'm mostly reacting on how underrated Mou is right now)

dont feed the trolls se7en

Is it too much to say that Mou got once again tactically mugged and got his counters nullified

yeah he sucked donkey ass today

I think maybe we had too much of the ball vs Man Utd. We didn't really counter-attack all that much. I was expecting us to let Man Utd have the ball, but press them.

Yohan Modric wrote:I think maybe we had too much of the ball vs Man Utd. We didn't really counter-attack all that much. I was expecting us to let Man Utd have the ball, but press them.

because fergie enjoys getting countered right? that's why he was smarter this game, he sat deep and waited for us.

"We know they are going to be a tremendous counter-attacking team, we know that."

-Sir Alex

To my buddy Jose :

EVERYBODY KNOWS!!! Why don't we prepare for something different eh?

PS : Your set piece training is working alright.. Jesus.

I cant believe he allowed you to play with so little width.

But this wasnt his fault in terms of today.

This was his fault in terms of months and years ago, not putting a proper functioning offensive philosophy in place.

Relying on 1 v 2's and shots on the edge of the box looks decent enough, but it was repetitive and Man Utd did alright restricting you to those attempts from range for the most part.

No idea why he subbed Di Maria for Modric..you got even more narrow after that.

the biggest fault mou did today was playing ramos instead of albiol at cb tbh

The Franchise wrote:I cant believe how allowed you to play with so little width.

But this wasnt his fault in terms of today.

This was his fault in terms of months and years ago, not putting a proper functioning offensive philosophy in place.

Relying on 1 v 2's and shots on the edge of the box looks decent enough, but it was repetitive and Man Utd did alright restricting you to those attempts from range for the most part.

No idea why he subbed Di Maria for Modric..you got even more narrow after that.

You forgot to mention that Jose is a classical example (especially in Madrid) of one who relies on a lot of his players individual brilliance to bail him out. I'm surprised no one mentions this. Its all right in front.

Arquitecto wrote:

The Franchise wrote:I cant believe how allowed you to play with so little width.

But this wasnt his fault in terms of today.

This was his fault in terms of months and years ago, not putting a proper functioning offensive philosophy in place.

Relying on 1 v 2's and shots on the edge of the box looks decent enough, but it was repetitive and Man Utd did alright restricting you to those attempts from range for the most part.

No idea why he subbed Di Maria for Modric..you got even more narrow after that.

You forgot to mention that Jose is a classical example (especially in Madrid) of one who relies on a lot of his players individual brilliance to bail him out. I'm surprised no one mentions this. Its all right in front.

I am tired of saying it, I feel repetitive

Ferguson: "Jose Mourinho deserves respect and not what you (media) give him here. He has not won so many titles by chance.''

Replace media with GL.

Although all critique today is fair. Not a fan of his subs or tactics today.

Meh, Sir Alex is great but he has never coached outside the UK..he dont know what its like.

Respect?

The Media and us care only about what have you done lately if we are going to talk about the present...and for Madrid, not been good enough.

Dont know what people expect really.

Dumbest thread of the century

21 trophies over 10 years with 4 different clubs. What a shit manager.

More tears lol

Not once in any thread has anyone called him shit..not seriously anyway.

The Franchise wrote:More tears lol

Not once in any thread has anyone called him shit..not seriously anyway.

The things we say in jest.

Jack Daniels wrote:

"We know they are going to be a tremendous counter-attacking team, we know that."

-Sir Alex

To my buddy Jose :

EVERYBODY KNOWS!!! Why don't we prepare for something different eh?

PS : Your set piece training is working alright.. Jesus.

you can't just prepare for something different....

did pep prepare something different for inter or chelsea? he still played possession football against a team parking the bus..

Your base tactics cannot change, however player roles can change! It is easy to say oh he got it wrong, but why don't you smart asses come up with a tactic that would have workeD??

WHO would have guessed that a team with so much Pride like United would be parking the bus? it was embarrassing.